Luton Town vs Millwall - Jon Champion and Craig Burley (as per ESPN UK) Arsenal vs Blackburn Rovers - Des Curran and Robbie Earle Oldham Athletic vs Everton - Des Curran and Robbie Earle
EDIT: There's light hearted moments which are needed between presenters/commentators/pundits.
What isn't needed is sexual harassment & bullying which Keys & Gray were accused of
How can you bully someone if they can't hear, arent in the same room and will never hear? Unless some weasel sets you up because you're suing Rupert Murdoch. hmmm.
Besides, as you say, light hearted moments are needed but now it seems people don't want that judging by this thread.
How can you bully someone if they can't hear, arent in the same room and will never hear? Unless some weasel sets you up because you're suing Rupert Murdoch. hmmm.
Besides, as you say, light hearted moments are needed but now it seems people don't want that judging by this thread.
The events that brought the downfall of Keys & Gray were, by all accounts, only the tip of the iceberg. They were generally despised by the backroom production people for their bullying and over-bearing attitude. As Keys & Gray seemingly didn't care who they made enemies of during their ascent to the summit, why should anyone be surprised that as they fell from the top they were helped on the way by the people they had previously climbed all over?
How can you bully someone if they can't hear, arent in the same room and will never hear? Unless some weasel sets you up because you're suing Rupert Murdoch. hmmm.
Besides, as you say, light hearted moments are needed but now it seems people don't want that judging by this thread.
Bullying doesn't have to be in earshot of the person who is bullied.
Saying things behind peoples back can be just as damaging,
Sky staff celebrated their departures, that sums those lowlife pair up.
Gray and Keys on screen were second to none. Off screen was a different matter and no matter how you look at it, what they did was in-defendable, set up or not.
Matt Smith presented from Boundary Park alongside Andy Townsend and Gareth Southgate
Arsenal v Blackburn Rovers - Peter Drury Oldham Athletic v Everton - Clive Tyldesley and Andy Townsend, with Gabriel Clarke conducting post-match interviews Luton Town v Millwall - Jon Champion and Craig Burley, with Dave Beckett conducting post-match interviews (as ESPN UK) Milton Keynes Dons v Barnsley - Joe Speight
Matt (or the pundits) didn't make too much of his namesake scoring for Oldham today, I was kind of hoping they might.
Annoying how BBC have scheduled The Football League Show 10-15 minutes earlier than usual, eh? Putting The FLS in its normal timeslot would have meant it slotted in very nicely after the ITV FA Cup highlights had ended. I'll be among the no doubt reasonable number of viewers who'll be watching this Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough edit from start to finish during the show's first re-run on channel 301.
Why has everything got to be about "banter" these days?
I want a presenter to have some level of gravitas, be able to read an autocue, and be able to engage their guests in discussion, particularly those guests who lack TV experience and thus need a bit more coaxing. I'm not really that fussed if they're not cracking jokes with people.
In fact, as far as the concept of "banter" is concerned, I'd rather see and hear as little as possible on football broadcasts.
Trouble is, by it's very nature, sports broadcasting requires a lot of filling. If it was all dry it would get boring very quickly.
Matt Smith presented from Boundary Park alongside Andy Townsend and Gareth Southgate
Arsenal v Blackburn Rovers - Peter Drury Oldham Athletic v Everton - Clive Tyldesley and Andy Townsend, with Gabriel Clarke conducting post-match interviews Luton Town v Millwall - Jon Champion and Craig Burley, with Dave Beckett conducting post-match interviews (as ESPN UK) Milton Keynes Dons v Barnsley - Joe Speight
Matt (or the pundits) didn't make too much of his namesake scoring for Oldham today, I was kind of hoping they might.
Annoying how BBC have scheduled The Football League Show 10-15 minutes earlier than usual, eh? Putting The FLS in its normal timeslot would have meant it slotted in very nicely after the ITV FA Cup highlights had ended. I'll be among the no doubt reasonable number of viewers who'll be watching this Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough edit from start to finish during the show's first re-run on channel 301.
I guess the FLS scheduling is tricky with it's usual "run in" programme not on tonight.
Gray and Keys on screen were second to none. Off screen was a different matter and no matter how you look at it, what they did was in-defendable, set up or not.
They were good, in their hey-day even peerless, but there were increasing signs towards the end that it was time for a change.
Keys had got just that little bit more smug and knowing and Gray had got just that little bit more lazy and cliche-driven with his analysis.
So IMO even taking out all the unpleasantness, Sky should have been considering refreshing their coverage.
And as part of that change has led us to Gary Neville, easily the finest analyst around, and Keys and Gray are in no way short of work these days, then it is win-win as far as I am concerned.
Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough - Alistair Mann Tranmere Rovers v Shrewsbury Town (Friday) - Kevin Keatings Bristol Rovers v Wycombe Wanderers - Mark Clemmit (reporting)
Championship round-ups - Dave Beckett, Paul Walker and Mark Scott League One round-ups - Dan Mason, Mick Conway and Paul Walker League Two round-ups - Dave Beckett, Dan Mason, Mick Conway, Mark Scott and Tony Lockwood
I guess the FLS scheduling is tricky with it's usual "run in" programme not on tonight.
You are right and the scheduling conflict would not have been a product of BBC Sport or ITV Sport but rather than respective broadcasters' schedulers. And while ideally the highlights shows wouldn't clash, I don't believe the omens should be on either the BBC or ITV schedulers to get together to avoid a clash. It would have been nice if they didn't overlap though.
Just sitting through the end of BBCi's looped highlights of the World Cup Skiing as I type this, that Palace v Middlesbrough edit will be on again in a moment!
They were good, in their hey-day even peerless, but there were increasing signs towards the end that it was time for a change.
Keys had got just that little bit more smug and knowing and Gray had got just that little bit more lazy and cliche-driven with his analysis.
So IMO even taking out all the unpleasantness, Sky should have been considering refreshing their coverage.
And as part of that change has led us to Gary Neville, easily the finest analyst around, and Keys and Gray are in no way short of work these days, then it is win-win as far as I am concerned.
It possibly needed a change but then again having Keys on every match didnt help with Gray for that matter. They could have put Keys on Sundays and Champions League with Ed doing the Saturday and Monday games?
With Gray they should have only had him on 1 match at the weekend? But no all gone and ready for the new breed!
They were good, in their hey-day even peerless, but there were increasing signs towards the end that it was time for a change.
Keys had got just that little bit more smug and knowing and Gray had got just that little bit more lazy and cliche-driven with his analysis.
So IMO even taking out all the unpleasantness, Sky should have been considering refreshing their coverage.
And as part of that change has led us to Gary Neville, easily the finest analyst around, and Keys and Gray are in no way short of work these days, then it is win-win as far as I am concerned.
It's worked out well in the long term.
However, for the first few months after they left it was like a free-for-all audition at Sky. On screen wise, I think if Sky had that time again they'd do things a bit differently. It came across as very sloppy at the time.
FA Cup-Chelsea v Brentford (ITV)
Presenter: Matt Smith with Martin Allen and Ian Wright
Commentators: Sam Matterface and Andy Townsend
Reporter: Tom Skippings
Nice to see Sam Matterface doing a big itv1 game. I caught a few minutes of one of this ACoN commentaries and thought he had greatly improved since I'd last heard him on tv.
He must have listened when I tweeted him saying something along the lines of 'when you're on tv there's no need to talk non stop, sometimes you can let the pictures do the talking, you're a great commentator, I love you on talkSPORT, don't spoil things'
Still needs more improvement but doing great today, he's definitely heading in the right direction.
Chelsea v Brentford - Sam Matterface & Andy Townsend Manchester City v Leeds Utd - Martin Tyler & Stewart Robson Huddersfield Town v Wigan Athletic - Clive Tyldesley & Jim Beglin
World Feed
Chelsea v Brentford Dan O'Hagan & Nigel Winterburn Huddersfield Town v Wigan Athletic - Gary Taphouse & Tony Dorigo
Nice to see Sam Matterface doing a big itv1 game. I caught a few minutes of one of this ACoN commentaries and thought he had greatly improved since I'd last heard him on tv.
He must have listened when I tweeted him saying something along the lines of 'when you're on tv there's no need to talk non stop, sometimes you can let the pictures do the talking, you're a great commentator, I love you on talkSPORT, don't spoil things'
Still needs more improvement but doing great today, he's definitely heading in the right direction.
Agreed - I thought he had a very strong tournament at the Africa Cup of Nations and based on that I think he deserves his chance to commentate on a game for ITV. He's having a good game so far. Nice to see Matt Smith in the presenting chair for a live ITV game for the second time this week too.
This is the first time I've ever heard a commentary from Sam Matterface - so much so, in fact, that when I switched it on I wondered why Bill Leslie was commentating on ITV.
Wrexham V Gainsborough Trinity (FA Trophy Semi Final 1st leg)
S4C - Dylan Ebenezer hosting from the Glyndŵr University Racecourse Stadium with Dai Davies and John Hartson. Commentary is from Nic Parry and Malcolm Allen. English language commentary is from Bryn Tomos and Waynne Phillips
As S4C has turned up on Virgin I was able to watch this, though with the English commentary as my schoolboy Welsh isn't up to much. I like how Tomos and Phillips were doing the English commentary on the red button as the other time I encounter them is on Wales matches on Sky, when of course they do Welsh commentary on the red button. Tomos forever stuck behind the red button.
Despite only knowing about one word in twenty, I could watch Dylan Ebenezer all day, he must be the most cheerful man on television. A beaming smile throughout. He makes Pete Graves look like Jack Dee.
No it wasn't. It was just on 'Sportsnight' with John Motson doing the commentary!!
Indeed, in those days there was only one live FA Cup match a round and Luton vs Millwall was played on a Wednesday in any case as Luton were playing a replay on the scheduled weekend. 1985 really was an unbelievably awful year for football, it's unimiginable these days to see all that upleasantness in such quick succession. In Fever Pitch Nick Hornby says that Heysel was coming "as certain as Christmas".
I want a presenter to have some level of gravitas, be able to read an autocue, and be able to engage their guests in discussion, particularly those guests who lack TV experience and thus need a bit more coaxing. I'm not really that fussed if they're not cracking jokes with people.
In fact, as far as the concept of "banter" is concerned, I'd rather see and hear as little as possible on football broadcasts.
Well, there are two types of banter, aren't there, the worst example of the wrong kind of banter is the "Love the tie, Ally!" school of broadcasting that made Des Lynam's last few years on ITV so unwatchable, where gags take priority. There as that bit on the first ever Premiership on ITV where Ally picked his Goals of the Day and Tel was obliged to say they were rubbish and laugh at Ally, not suggest any other ones, just banter for banter's sake. I would suggest that Soccer Saturday is often in danger of going down that route.
What you want is a presenter who can do his job with a bit of wit but actually get the discussion going. I think the likes of Chiles are good at that - or he was on the Beeb anyway - because he knew it was all pretty trivial but asked proper questions, same with Des in his pomp on the Beeb. I like both Chamberlin and Jones, they are both very proficient presenters, without being bland like Manish Bhasin or many of the Sky Sports News drones.
I certainly prefer them to Richard Keys, Des Lynam (him again) said he always found it hard to warm to Keys because he always seemed to give over the impression he knew something he wasn't going to tell you, and I agree with that. And he used to be a right arse at times, I was looking back at this thread a while back and found the moment where he slagged off Steve Bennett at great length for falling ill and there being a delay while they found another fourth official, taking it as a personal affront. I used to hate that kind of thing.
Of course, when Keys did that digging-his-own-grave interview, he said the reason they were being so laddish and doing so much "banter" was to put Matt Muray at ease.
Matt (or the pundits) didn't make too much of his namesake scoring for Oldham today, I was kind of hoping they might.
I remember when Macclesfield used to have a goalkeeper called Steve Wilson and Steve Wilson once commentated on one of their FA Cup matches, and when he did a great save, he said, "Well, he may have the same name as your commentator, but I wouldn't be able to do that". And Alan Mullery once did a Macclesfield game on Soccer Special and said, "Steve Wilson in the Macclesfield goal, he's not commentating for the BBC tonight!"
You are right and the scheduling conflict would not have been a product of BBC Sport or ITV Sport but rather than respective broadcasters' schedulers. And while ideally the highlights shows wouldn't clash, I don't believe the omens should be on either the BBC or ITV schedulers to get together to avoid a clash. It would have been nice if they didn't overlap though.
Of course, sod's law ITV's Saturday highlights show was the earliest it had been all season, especially as they 'd only gone off air with their live match just after eight. A surprisngly lengthy ITV highlights show last night, actually, 75 minutes for only four games.
Agreed - I thought he had a very strong tournament at the Africa Cup of Nations and based on that I think he deserves his chance to commentate on a game for ITV. He's having a good game so far. Nice to see Matt Smith in the presenting chair for a live ITV game for the second time this week too.
Yes, surprised to hear Matterface but I've enjoyed hearing him, as mentioned he still talks a bit too much but he speaks sense and seemed to get a good relationship going with Townsend, and certainly a nice change from the overwrought Drury.
Comments
Sky Sports 1 HD - Scott Minto with Gaizka Mendieta.
Commentary - Kevin Keatings & Gerry Armstrong
World Feed - Duncan Bishop & Pete Jenson
Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough
World Feed - Alistair Mann
World Feed - Patrick Tarroni & Richard Whittle
PSV Einhoven v Utrecht
World Feed - Jonathan Beck
Luton Town vs Millwall - Jon Champion and Craig Burley (as per ESPN UK)
Arsenal vs Blackburn Rovers - Des Curran and Robbie Earle
Oldham Athletic vs Everton - Des Curran and Robbie Earle
How can you bully someone if they can't hear, arent in the same room and will never hear? Unless some weasel sets you up because you're suing Rupert Murdoch. hmmm.
Besides, as you say, light hearted moments are needed but now it seems people don't want that judging by this thread.
The events that brought the downfall of Keys & Gray were, by all accounts, only the tip of the iceberg. They were generally despised by the backroom production people for their bullying and over-bearing attitude. As Keys & Gray seemingly didn't care who they made enemies of during their ascent to the summit, why should anyone be surprised that as they fell from the top they were helped on the way by the people they had previously climbed all over?
Bullying doesn't have to be in earshot of the person who is bullied.
Saying things behind peoples back can be just as damaging,
Sky staff celebrated their departures, that sums those lowlife pair up.
A Just Giving page has been set up for the BHF in his honour, many messages for, recognisable names are on
https://t.co/rRlHKNTS
I hope no one minds me posting this. £500 is from Premier Sports so much respect to them.
FA Cup Fifth Round Highlights
Matt Smith presented from Boundary Park alongside Andy Townsend and Gareth Southgate
Arsenal v Blackburn Rovers - Peter Drury
Oldham Athletic v Everton - Clive Tyldesley and Andy Townsend, with Gabriel Clarke conducting post-match interviews
Luton Town v Millwall - Jon Champion and Craig Burley, with Dave Beckett conducting post-match interviews (as ESPN UK)
Milton Keynes Dons v Barnsley - Joe Speight
Matt (or the pundits) didn't make too much of his namesake scoring for Oldham today, I was kind of hoping they might.
Annoying how BBC have scheduled The Football League Show 10-15 minutes earlier than usual, eh? Putting The FLS in its normal timeslot would have meant it slotted in very nicely after the ITV FA Cup highlights had ended. I'll be among the no doubt reasonable number of viewers who'll be watching this Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough edit from start to finish during the show's first re-run on channel 301.
Trouble is, by it's very nature, sports broadcasting requires a lot of filling. If it was all dry it would get boring very quickly.
I guess the FLS scheduling is tricky with it's usual "run in" programme not on tonight.
They were good, in their hey-day even peerless, but there were increasing signs towards the end that it was time for a change.
Keys had got just that little bit more smug and knowing and Gray had got just that little bit more lazy and cliche-driven with his analysis.
So IMO even taking out all the unpleasantness, Sky should have been considering refreshing their coverage.
And as part of that change has led us to Gary Neville, easily the finest analyst around, and Keys and Gray are in no way short of work these days, then it is win-win as far as I am concerned.
The Football League Show
Manish Bhasin presented alongside Leroy Rosenior
Crystal Palace v Middlesbrough - Alistair Mann
Tranmere Rovers v Shrewsbury Town (Friday) - Kevin Keatings
Bristol Rovers v Wycombe Wanderers - Mark Clemmit (reporting)
Championship round-ups - Dave Beckett, Paul Walker and Mark Scott
League One round-ups - Dan Mason, Mick Conway and Paul Walker
League Two round-ups - Dave Beckett, Dan Mason, Mick Conway, Mark Scott and Tony Lockwood
You are right and the scheduling conflict would not have been a product of BBC Sport or ITV Sport but rather than respective broadcasters' schedulers. And while ideally the highlights shows wouldn't clash, I don't believe the omens should be on either the BBC or ITV schedulers to get together to avoid a clash. It would have been nice if they didn't overlap though.
Just sitting through the end of BBCi's looped highlights of the World Cup Skiing as I type this, that Palace v Middlesbrough edit will be on again in a moment!
It possibly needed a change but then again having Keys on every match didnt help with Gray for that matter. They could have put Keys on Sundays and Champions League with Ed doing the Saturday and Monday games?
With Gray they should have only had him on 1 match at the weekend? But no all gone and ready for the new breed!
It's worked out well in the long term.
However, for the first few months after they left it was like a free-for-all audition at Sky. On screen wise, I think if Sky had that time again they'd do things a bit differently. It came across as very sloppy at the time.
Matt Smith with Martin Allen and Ian Wright.
Commentators: Sam Matterface and Andy Townsend.
Presenter: Matt Smith with Martin Allen and Ian Wright
Commentators: Sam Matterface and Andy Townsend
Reporter: Tom Skippings
He must have listened when I tweeted him saying something along the lines of 'when you're on tv there's no need to talk non stop, sometimes you can let the pictures do the talking, you're a great commentator, I love you on talkSPORT, don't spoil things'
Still needs more improvement but doing great today, he's definitely heading in the right direction.
Then ITV scrape the barrel in the commentary box.
Richard Keys with Glenn Hoddle & Trevor Francis.
Chelsea v Brentford - Sam Matterface & Andy Townsend
Manchester City v Leeds Utd - Martin Tyler & Stewart Robson
Huddersfield Town v Wigan Athletic - Clive Tyldesley & Jim Beglin
World Feed
Chelsea v Brentford Dan O'Hagan & Nigel Winterburn
Huddersfield Town v Wigan Athletic - Gary Taphouse & Tony Dorigo
Agreed - I thought he had a very strong tournament at the Africa Cup of Nations and based on that I think he deserves his chance to commentate on a game for ITV. He's having a good game so far. Nice to see Matt Smith in the presenting chair for a live ITV game for the second time this week too.
Notably, he's married (I think) to lovely Natalie Sawyer from Sky Sports....and she's a massive Brentford fan.
As S4C has turned up on Virgin I was able to watch this, though with the English commentary as my schoolboy Welsh isn't up to much. I like how Tomos and Phillips were doing the English commentary on the red button as the other time I encounter them is on Wales matches on Sky, when of course they do Welsh commentary on the red button. Tomos forever stuck behind the red button.
Despite only knowing about one word in twenty, I could watch Dylan Ebenezer all day, he must be the most cheerful man on television. A beaming smile throughout. He makes Pete Graves look like Jack Dee.
Indeed, in those days there was only one live FA Cup match a round and Luton vs Millwall was played on a Wednesday in any case as Luton were playing a replay on the scheduled weekend. 1985 really was an unbelievably awful year for football, it's unimiginable these days to see all that upleasantness in such quick succession. In Fever Pitch Nick Hornby says that Heysel was coming "as certain as Christmas".
Well, there are two types of banter, aren't there, the worst example of the wrong kind of banter is the "Love the tie, Ally!" school of broadcasting that made Des Lynam's last few years on ITV so unwatchable, where gags take priority. There as that bit on the first ever Premiership on ITV where Ally picked his Goals of the Day and Tel was obliged to say they were rubbish and laugh at Ally, not suggest any other ones, just banter for banter's sake. I would suggest that Soccer Saturday is often in danger of going down that route.
What you want is a presenter who can do his job with a bit of wit but actually get the discussion going. I think the likes of Chiles are good at that - or he was on the Beeb anyway - because he knew it was all pretty trivial but asked proper questions, same with Des in his pomp on the Beeb. I like both Chamberlin and Jones, they are both very proficient presenters, without being bland like Manish Bhasin or many of the Sky Sports News drones.
I certainly prefer them to Richard Keys, Des Lynam (him again) said he always found it hard to warm to Keys because he always seemed to give over the impression he knew something he wasn't going to tell you, and I agree with that. And he used to be a right arse at times, I was looking back at this thread a while back and found the moment where he slagged off Steve Bennett at great length for falling ill and there being a delay while they found another fourth official, taking it as a personal affront. I used to hate that kind of thing.
Of course, when Keys did that digging-his-own-grave interview, he said the reason they were being so laddish and doing so much "banter" was to put Matt Muray at ease.
I remember when Macclesfield used to have a goalkeeper called Steve Wilson and Steve Wilson once commentated on one of their FA Cup matches, and when he did a great save, he said, "Well, he may have the same name as your commentator, but I wouldn't be able to do that". And Alan Mullery once did a Macclesfield game on Soccer Special and said, "Steve Wilson in the Macclesfield goal, he's not commentating for the BBC tonight!"
Of course, sod's law ITV's Saturday highlights show was the earliest it had been all season, especially as they 'd only gone off air with their live match just after eight. A surprisngly lengthy ITV highlights show last night, actually, 75 minutes for only four games.
Yes, surprised to hear Matterface but I've enjoyed hearing him, as mentioned he still talks a bit too much but he speaks sense and seemed to get a good relationship going with Townsend, and certainly a nice change from the overwrought Drury.