The Jacksons' attorney William Bloss did cross examination of Dr. Gary Green. The doctor agreed financial incentive can create conflict of interest. "Regardless financial incentive, it does not take away from physician's obligation to the patient," Dr. Green explained. Bloss showed part of the Code of Ethics of American Medical Association.
a) Large incentives may create conflict of interest that can in turn compromise clinical objectivity.
AMA says: "It's important to recognize that sufficient large incentives can create an untenable position for physicians."
"Financial rewards do not obligate physicians to compromise their medical judgment," Dr. Green opined. The doctor was asked if $150,000 a month a large incentive, Dr. Green said it depends on the situation. Bloss asked how about a doctor whose house is about to go on foreclosure, $600,000 in outstanding debt, behind child support payment? "I'm sure many doctors have great deal of debt, possibly more than that, and still practice medicine in an ethical manner," Dr Green said.
Bloss showed Kai Chase's testimony, where she said she didn't see Dr. Murray as much in April, was there about 3 times a week. Dr. Green said he was not accurate when he mentioned Chase said Dr. Murray was at Carolwood in March of 2009. Dr. Green said on April 19, 2009, Dr. Metzger went to Carolwood to meet Jackson, he said Jackson asked for sleep medication. Bloss, “Do you recall Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to give him sleep aid?” Dr. Gree, “I don't recall dates, need to see the testimony.” Bloss, “If a nurse says there were no equipment at the house for Murray to inject Jackson with Propofol on Apr19 is that inconsistent?”
Dr. Green, “No.” Bloss, “Do you have information Jackson was seeking Propofol from people other than Dr. Murray?” Dr. Green, “Yes, Dr. Metzger and Cherilyn Lee.” On Apr 19, Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to find someone to give him Propofol, Bloss said. He asked if it'd be consistent with Murray there same day. “We see addicts and they go to multiple sources, I could only speculate why Jackson was seeking Propofol from more than one person. It's not inconsistent somebody seeking drugs from several sources" Dr Green said. "Particularly with that drug which wasn't easy to obtain." Bloss, “Was Dr. Murray giving Jackson Propofol on April 19th and 12th at Carolwood?” Dr. Green, “Yes.” Dr. Green said he cannot testify to the exact date because Dr. Murray kept no records to maintain it secretive. Dr. Green charges AEG $3,000 per half day of work, $6,000 for full day.
Bloss showed email from Ortega to Gongaware on Jun 14, 2009 saying ’Are you aware Jackson's doctor didn't permit him to attend rehearsals today?’ "This just shows Dr. Murray independence to advise Jackson not to attend rehearsal," Dr. Green said. Email from Gongaware: ’We want to remind him that it's AEG, not Jackson, who is paying his salary.’ Dr. Green said the best person to ask about this email is who wrote it or received it. "I believe Mr. Gongaware didn't recall this email," Dr. Green said. "Mr. Ortega said he didn't understand what it meant."
Dr. Green feels the email supports his opinion, even the part that says,’AEG, not Jackson, who is paying his salary.’ Dr. Green said in his deposition that nothing in the email supported his opinion. Dr. Green, ”Now that I responded differently is because I had additional information. One is Mr. Gongaware's testimony, and further reviewed evidence this was never communicated to Dr. Murray. The fact that it was never communicated to Dr. Murray let me believe it was not influencing," Dr. Green explained. "You need to look at the context of this email, you can't just pull out a word here or there," Dr. Green said. Bloss asked if ‘we want him to understand what's expected of him’ mentioned in the email influenced his opinion. "No, it would not sway my opinion one way or the other," Dr. Green said. He did not ask to meet with Gongaware or Phillips to try to get more information about the email and their intent.
Bloss asked about the meeting at Carolwood's house on June 16, 2009, which they called "intervention." He asked if Chase said Dr. Murray burst out of the meeting and said ‘I can't take this s**t anymore.’ "I read the testimony of Ms. Chase and that was her perception," Dr. Green said.
Mr. Gongaware had a much different account of the meeting than what Chase testified, Bloss said. Dr. Green said Chase wasn't present for the entire meeting, but Gongaware was. He would give a little more weight to Gongaware since he was present for the full meeting. "Assuming that Chase's recollection is correct, I think there are many interpretations of Dr. Murray's outburst," Dr. Green said. “It could be that Dr. Murray could be feeling pressured he was giving unethical and illegal drugs. That certainly could create pressure in Dr. Murray to make an outburst like that," Dr. Green said. "There was nothing to suggest in the meeting that Dr. Murray was in danger of losing the gig." Dr. Green said.
Dr. Green didn't receive the "Trouble at the Front" email chain until after he was involved in the case. Bloss showed Bugzee's email saying Jackson was basket case. "Only information that Jackson was not in good health on June 19," Dr Green said about it. "Dr. Murray wasn't keeping records at this time, but I believe Jackson was under his care," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed the email where Ortega said ‘now that we brought the doctor in to the fold.’ Dr. Green said this email showed Ortega was concerned with Jackson's health. He doesn't know what the director meant by ‘doctor in to the fold.’. “I think you have to put this entire thing in context and the context is that he was concerned with Mr. Jackson's health", Dr Green explained.
Dr. Green said several people raised questions about Jackson's psychological situation. Dr. Green said he believes Dr. Murray was board certified but it had lapsed in 2008. Murray does not have psychiatry training. Bloss talked about the lengthy conversation Randy Phillips had with Dr. Murray, he asked the doctor if he knew for sure what they talked about. He said no. Bloss asked about another Phillips' email. Panish laughed out loud when Dr. Green responded he recalls testimony but preferred reading again.
Judge called Panish out, he apologised. Judge ordered all the attorneys in her chambers for quick sidebar. Back in the courtroom in front of jury Panish said, “Your honour, I'd like to apologise to Dr. Green for that laugh.” The apology was accepted. Panish, “I'm sincerely sorry.” Dr. Green, “No harm, no foul.”
Bloss talked about "this doctor is extremely successful, we checked him out." Dr. Green said he thought Phillips meant that based on Kathy Jorrie's testimony regarding the check she did. "I do not see anything to change my opinion of conflict of interest in this case," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed another part of the "Trouble at the Front" email with Phillips saying ’Tim and I are going to see him tomorrow.’ Bloss asked if that statement was material to his opinion. "Only that AEG was concerned about what was going on and were doing something about it," Dr. Green said. He's not sure what Phillips meant when he asked ‘is it chemical or physiological.’ "I can only speculate." Dr Green said he was asked to analyse if this is a sports medicine case and whether or not conflict of interest led to his poor medical care.
Has Dr. Gary Green who was booked to show there was no conflict actually clearly shown why there was no contract?
Murray was Jackson's personal doctor since 2006. Jackson had paid him cash a number of times in Los Vegas, as testified by Prince. Murray was on Jackson's payroll long before AEG even had an agreement with Jackson for the shows. AEG hadn't considered a doctor being on the tour for Jackson. Jackson had initiated contact with Murray asking him in March 2009 to go on the tour, the first shipment of Propofol was on 6 Apr 2009. Yet he talks to Dr. Allan Metzger about IV sleep medication mid April. A few days later on April 19 Jackson expressed his desire for Diprivan to Cherilyn Lee.
This is about 2 months before AEG are asked to negotiate with Murray on Jacksons behalf and at least a month after Jackson was has begun having Propofol nightly.
I think Dr. Green laid it out neatly for the jury, also showing Murray flagged up the 'artist' error in the contract and Murray decided if Jackson went to rehearsals.
I see the Jury is not called till Monday afternoon, will the judge decide on AEG's motion in the morning? If he rejects the motion does that look bad for AEG?
Despite Kai Chase's evidence, and claims of Michael Jackson wasting away, according to the testimony about his weight in February 2009 he was 127lbs lighter by 9lbs than when he died.
Well Debbie Rowe was a game of two halves. One day Jackson was purely obtaining drugs only for procedures, next day she says he was seeking out drugs.
Did she ruin the family's case? She testified Dr. Metzger, Jackson's personal doctor provided her with a bag of medication for Jackson in 1992/93. Karen Faye mentioned a bag of medication she refused to carry on the tour. Rowe said she was instructed by Dr. Metzger to had over the bag of medication to Dr. Forecast who would look after Jackson. The crew doctor Dr. Finkelstein testified Dr. Allan Metzger gave him advice on treating Jackson, 2 vials of Demerol prescribed by Metzger were given to Finkelstein by Karen Faye.
On the HIStory tour, she mentioned Dr. Klein providing procedures but it is Metzger who arranges for Jackson to have Diprivan in a hotel room on two occasions.
Doesn't that confirm Jackson personally chose doctors who'd do his bidding?
More on Allan Metzger, to come...did he commit perjury at Murray's trial?
Debbie Rowe testified Dr. Allan Metzger was a good guy, yet having weaned Jackson off Demerol he arranged for Jackson to have Propofol in a hotel room.
In his testimony at Murray's criminal trial Dr. Metzger reportedly testified on Day 16, Oct 24, 2011....
He received a call from Jackson on June 12, 2008; the conversation was about sleep issues, skin issues and nutrition. Hadn't spoken to Jackson for five years previously.
In April 2009 he (Jackson) asked Dr. Metzger about IV sleep medication he mentioned 'juice' but he wasn't sure what he was asking for. It was heard Dr. Metzger told Jackson that IV sleep medication was dangerous and should not be done outside of a hospital. Dr. Metzger stated he never provided any intravenous medicine to Jackson. .... The prosecution asked Metzger "Would any amount of money persuade you to give propofol?" "No" and "Did you ever give Jackson propofol?" "No".
But according to Debbie Rowe he had arranged it in 1996/97. For free?
the 80s was a different world, so I doubt advertising Pepsi was seen as being morally 'wrong' or promoting obesity.
musicians have sold out and been accused of selling out for a long time before the pepsi ad's. the who made fun of it on their 1967 album "the who sell out"
He was wrong to suggest he hadn't had much plastic surgery, but with the Vitaligo I think 'turning White' was the only real option, otherwise he would have been left with White & Black patches, there was no option to remain Black and I have seen photo's from the mid 80s where he is wearing Black makeup to cover up the White patches, but obviously after a certain point that becomes unsustainable.
but you've just pointed out he did have an option. he didn't have to turn the rest of his skin white. however he did, and furthermore he lied about it, and his fanatical fans lied about it
What he should have done however is made it clear to everyone what disease he had, and why he was taking the treatment he was. Instead he said little and people speculated he didn't even have the disease.
I agree the relationship with Debbie Rowe was weird, but I believe the real plan was to have kids with Lisa Marie Presley. A child with MJ as dad, and Elvis as Grandad would be media gold, and contrary to popular belief, I have read that there was some proper chemistry between the two and they had lived very similar lives in terms of growing up in the spotlight.
Lots of speculation as to why it didn't happen, from Lisa Marie just not being willing to go through with, or I think its more likely MJ was infertile (as its likely he used a sperm donor for the kids he eventually got)
i think it's pretty obvious LM was just a beard for him, in particular to try and deflect speculation about child abuse with young boys. maybe i'm very good at being able to tell when a man is gay or not, but it's something i noticed a long long time ago and a few of his hardcore fans have stated similar things. if you watch non scripted videos of him interacting with people, you will see how differently he acts towards males as opposed to females, in particular young males. it's very different to how a hetrosexual male would act
Day 72 19 Aug 2013 Jackson’s vs AEG Extracted from tweets by ABC7 Court News.
Katherine Jackson is not present in court. There is only afternoon session today for the jurors.
The attorneys met in the morning to discuss future witnesses.
AEG expert on Medical Conflict of Interest Dr. Gary Green is back on the stand. Jacksons' attorney William Bloss will resume cross examination.
Dr. Green said over the weekend he reviewed his testimony from Friday, reviewed materials provided earlier and met with AEG attorneys. Dr. Green was asked about the phone call between Randy Phillips and Dr. Murray. Dr. Green recalled Phillips testimony that he did not have full recollection of the specific contents of the phone call. Dr. Green testified there was no evidence Phillips put any pressure on Dr. Murray during the call, he had not seen any evidence Phillips put pressure on Dr. Murray.
Bloss showed the email chain “Trouble at the Front” and the meeting on 20 June 2009. Dr. Green said there was a little dispute as to what really happened at the meeting, he had no way of resolving which way was true. Again Dr. Green said there appeared not to be any evidence Dr. Murray was pressured. Even if Phillips threatened to cancel the shows Dr. Green said that it was ultimately up to Dr. Murray to make decisions in the best interest of his patient and he didn't.
Bloss compared the different definitions of Conflict of Interest produced by Dr. Green and Dr. Matheson. Dr. Green said the definition produced by Dr. Matheson was reasonable but not the only one. Asked if financial interest is the most powerful corroding force in a conflict of interest Dr. Green said in his experience he’s seen physicians do all sort of things for reasons other than financial. He said he's not aware there's a way to rate the most powerful conflict of interest. He believes financial interest can create conflict.
Dr. Green was shown the MLB's policy on assessment and management of concussion on ballplayers. The MLB has to review team physician's actions before an athlete is allowed to return to play. Dr. Green said his position is more of an administrative position with MLB, he doesn't see the patients. Asked if the reason team does do not have unilateral power to have athlete return to play is because of potential conflict of interest, Dr. Green responded the reason is because it’s about a competition, to ensure no team had a competitive advantage.
Dr. Murray's financial status did not matter at all in Dr. Green’s opinion. Dr. Green agreed Detective Martinez testified he suspected financial motive for Murray to violate Hippocratic oath. Dr. Green explained, "Not knowing Dr. Murray and not hearing his testimony, I cannot say with certainty why Dr. Murray committed this crime." Dr. Green testified he had never seen a three-way relationship between a physician, a patient and a third party like this. It was his understanding AEG Live was going to advance money to Dr. Murray on behalf of Michael Jackson. Dr. Green agreed Dr. Murray's contract termination could be done by Jackson and multiple ways by AEG Live unilateral.
In re-cross Dr Green said he was retained in the case to consider his expertise in sports medicine and conflict of interest. He was also asked to review Dr. Matheson's testimony. Dr Green attended almost all of Dr Matheson's deposition. He said he wanted to hear him saying his opinion as opposed to reading it on paper. The expert said if he had agreed with Dr. Matheson's opinion, he'd have communicated it to AEG. Dr. Green said there have been cases where he gave opinion that the attorneys ended up not using in their cases.
Dr. Green said one of the ‘conflict of interest’ definitions he was shown was guidance to physicians only not third parties or patients. Stebbins Bina asked about the article: "Patients must be informed of financial incentives that could impact the level or type of care they receive." Dr Green said the statement further proves his opinion. The expert said not only was Jackson informed of the financial incentives, he created them. Dr. Green said the email Phillips wrote showed they were very concerned about Jackson's health, proved his opinion that parties shared same interest. The expert said the fact that Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" proves the doctor was independent.
Dr. Green testified that, as a competent adult, you can't make anyone go see a doctor. He said Dr. Klein had seen Jackson about 30 times between March and June and in no case he mentioned psychological problems. Dr Green said he reviewed testimony Murray was off on Sundays, 19 Apr 2009 when Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to find a doctor to give him Propofol was a Sunday.
In re-cross, Bloss asked if $150,000 a month is large incentive, is it not? Dr. Green said in general, yes. It was more than he makes at Pepperdine as the team's physician, "By a lot." But he pointed out it's not his only job. Bloss asked when Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" if Phillips said anything. Dr. Green said no. The expert said he didn’t know whether Phillips & Murray in their phone call on 20 Jun 2009 discussed drug use, medical treatment or any other topics. He only knew what Phillips testified.
Dr. Green was excused. And the day’s session ended.
It's being reported Katherine Jackson wants to amend her lawsuit.
Meanwhile AEG Live is seeking a dismissal of the case, claiming the plaintiffs haven’t shown enough evidence to send the case to the jury. Their motion is to be heard on 5 Sep so all the lawyers are present.
An unsigned independent contractor agreement drafted by AEG has become a central document in the case. It spells out the terms of Murray's employment.
On Tuesday, AEG's witness, human resources consultant Rhoma Young, reviewed AEG's policies for retaining both independent contractors and employees. She described the agreement as unusual because it involved three parties.
"It was AEG acting on behalf of Michael Jackson to get his request honored. He wanted his personal physician to go with him," Young said.
Katherine Jackson is not in court today. It is said she won't come back until after Labor Day, she's working on Michael Jackson's birthday celebration.
Today’s witness is Rhoma Young, a Human Resources consultant. Who’s been in the business for almost 40 years. She has worked with Facebook, Microsoft, IBM, LinkedIn, Roche, UC Med Centers, private hospitals, Kaiser, Chevron. In the music industry, Young said she worked with the Symphony, Ballet and Opera in the Bay area. Young said she was asked to look at the practices and policies of AEG Live, their independent contractors and testimony to see if consistent. She was questioned by Jessica Stebbins Bina attorney for AEG.
Young reviewed an extensive list of documents in this case. She's worked in this case close to 200 hours. Her hourly rate for research is $350 per hour and $450 an hour for testimony and deposition. Young said her bill is close to $70,000 as recent as yesterday. In court, she said she testified 95 times, or maybe more. She said she tried to testify half and half for plaintiffs and defendants and has refused work when the balance is off. "I'm not an advocate," Young said. "Because I testify for both sides, I can't contradict myself. My reputation is about being balanced."
Young has helped companies hiring employees. Young said an employee is an individual hired by a company. Generally there's a defined way to find the employees, the screening process, layers of screening to determine who's more qualified and who is not. She stated there's a supervisor, job title, set of expectation, training, how they are paid, employee benefits, insurance, have deductions and benefits, such as taxes, insurance, unemployment insurance, disability insurance, etc, Young explained.
Young explained independent contractors are usually sourced through different method and different way. The expert said you can get personal referral or look for professional organizations to find independent contractors. There's no application, you talk about price, timing, scheduling, license and there's contract prior to beginning of work. There's no payroll taxes deducted from pay of independent contractors, the expert said.
In order to obtain a medical license, Young said the doctor submits to a fingerprint scan, which goes thru Department of Justice. They also go thru very thorough education background. The State of California does not check financial background of applicants to issue medical licenses, Young said.
Young said in looking at the content of Dr. Murray's contract, she said it's consistent with an independent contractor agreement. This is AEG acting on behalf, helping Jackson getting the doctor he wanted to go on tour. Bina asked who she understood asked for Dr. Murray to be hired. "Michael Jackson," she responded. Her understanding is AEG was to advance funds for other personal staff on behalf of Jackson at his request ultimately to be paid back by Jackson. "My understanding these choices were being made by Jackson. The children chose Kai Chase, but the choices were ultimately Jackson's," Young testified.
"For independent contractors, in my opinion, you don't do background check or criminal check," Young said. "You have a different set of knowledge, referrals," she said. You may ask them to provide necessary licenses, their own insurances. She said it may all be included in the agreement. In an interview, the questions have to be job-related, Young said. Bina asked,”Can you ask about how many children someone has?” Young’s response, “ No!”
Young said AEG does basic checks for employees, such as is the person eligible to work, do they have driver's license if needed for the job. Background check is much less frequently done for independent contractors than it is for employees. Independent contractors give you different kinds of assurances when they are self-insured, Young explained. Bina, “Do you agree or disagree that a credit check was job related for Jackson's physician?” Young, “I absolutely do not agree.” Young said as far as she knows in healthcare credit checks are not carried out. She checked places hiring, saw no reference as credit check as a requirement. "It's not common, it's not frequent, in fact it's very rare," Young testified about credit check in the healthcare industry. Young said 97% of healthcare companies did not conduct any credit check. And that included more than just physicians, she said.
She disagrees that Dr. Murray's job was high risk or sensitive. High risk is when a person performing the work has more likelihood of fatality or injury to the worker, Young explained. The family’s HR expert Ms. Seawright was accused of ignoring basic HR standards, such as when she said when she said there's no difference between independent contractor and employees.
Bina finished her direct examination. Jacksons' attorney, Brian Panish, did cross examination.
Young confirmed she has not worked with concert promoters or specializes in the music business. Panish asked if she has ever seen a 3-way party involving a doctor, patient and someone else. "I've worked with some clinics and going thru personnel files I saw some 3-way agreements," Young said. There were some independent contractor situation and 3 party agreements, she explained. Young said she's never hired a physician on behalf of anyone. She has helped in the process but was not the person to have the last say. Young has not looked at Nevada's medical license requirements prior to issuing a medical license.
Young did not dispute AEG could've made Dr. Murray sign a authorisation for background check. Young explained there's a draft, in writing, of template for dealing with independent contractors. She said she could consider that a policy. Young agreed it does not say what they should check out before the employment and does not say check references, prior to employment. Young said. "As far as I know, there are no criteria in writing before hiring an independent contractor. I look for effectiveness not correctness when doing my audits," Young said. Panish asked what AEG Live did to check Dr. Murray's license. Young said Kathy Jorrie searched the doctor's medical license. Panish pointed out that insurance was never provided to AEG. "And the agreement was never completed," Young responded.
Young said she does not consider physician's job dangerous, industry considers the danger to the person doing the job not 3rd party. Panish asked if one example of dangerous profession is crocodile's keeper, wild animal holders. She said yes. "Crocodiles are dangerous creatures," Young testified. "Have you trained a crocodile before?" Panish asked. "Not recently," she responded, and added, "I've been cross examined by one." Everyone started laughing. Young is donating the trial testimony money to the American Cancer Society. Panish said if he keeps her tomorrow there will be more money to ACS. Defence attorney objected. Everyone laughed again.
Young said in her deposition that she has no idea how Randy Phillips determined Dr. Murray was extremely successful. Young explained she's familiar with State of California's criteria to issue licenses to physician, but she's not an expert in physician hiring. Panish asked if 10 mins is thorough, detailed background check on someone. Young said it could be, even Seawright said it only takes 5 mins.
In re-direct, Bina showed "Disclosure and Authorization to Conduct Background Check." It says "Credit history may be requested, but only where such information is substantially related to the duties and responsibilities of the position to which you're applying." Young said she thinks the salary discussion alone proves that's what Jackson wanted at the time.
In re-cross, Young said there was an agreement that called for the engagement of Dr. Murray. Panish, “If AEG came to you in 2009 and asked if they should hire a doctor on behalf of 3rd party, you would've said no?” Young, “I don't know.” In a deposition she said, "No, there's not a chance I'd advise that," laughing out loud.
Bina asked if the reason she said that was because she's not a lawyer. She said yes, she doesn't advise on contracts.
During both Rohma Young's and Dr. Gary Green's testimony they said Michael Jackson selected/hired Conrad Murray, Ms Young also said Jackson set the fee for Jackson. The attorney for the family didn't challenge those claims.
It was Paul Gongaware who said Jackson wanted Murray and set the fee, are the family hoping the jury believe Gongaware is a liar? As Michael Amir Williams was supposedly with Jackson at the time why didn't the family call him as a witness?
A man who worked security for Michael Jackson testified Wednesday that he introduced the singer to Conrad Murray, the doctor who later administered the fatal dose of the anesthetic propofol to the singer more than two years later.
Jeffrey Adams testified he was "positive" the first time Jackson and Murray met was in February 2007. Adams' video deposition, given under oath, was played to jurors in the wrongful death lawsuit filed by Jackson's mother and three children against concert promoter and producer ...
Adams testified he didn't work for Jackson, he 'orchestrated' Jackson's staff. He stated he'd known Murray socially since the 1990's and was Adam's doctor in Las Vegas. Adams said because Murray looked after him & his father Adams offered his services to Murray and went to live with the doctor to provide security and travel with him.
Adams' relationship with the singer was a bit confusing. He said he worked security at special events for Jackson, but also said he "didn't officially work for Michael, I orchestrated his staff
Today video depositions by 3 individuals were shown to the jury, Jeffrey Adams a security guard, Dr. Stephen Gordon, cosmetic surgeon and Dr. David Jeffrey Adams, anesthesiologist.
The first video deposition was of Jeffrey Adams, as the tweets and his testimony is confusing I’ve rearranged the order, to hopefully make matters clearer.
Since the early 1990’s Jeffrey Adams has worked in security, first at a school. In 1999 he moved to Las Vegas where he provided security at Burlington Coat Factory monitoring CCTV preventing losses for 4 years at the same time he provided security at Neiman Marcus, he left in 2007. After Adams said he worked as personal security for an attorney in Las Vegas. In 2004 he set up his own security company called, “Knockout Security”.
Adams testified he met Dr. Murray in early 1990s through a mutual friend. Asked what his first impression of the doctor was, Adams said, ‘Tall, cardiologist. He told me he was a cardiologist. That's about it.’ From the time Adams met Dr. Murray to when he moved to Las Vegas, he saw the doctor 3-4 times at barbecues in Los Angeles. Adams became a patient of Dr. Murray in Las Vegas, and so did Adams' father. Asked if he was still a patient of Murray, Adams answered, “Oh, he's locked up now. No, not now.”
Adams informed the court he did not officially work for Jackson, he orchestrated Jackson’s staff. Adams was described as orchestrating security for Jackson in December of 2006. Adams said his friend, Basheier Muhammad, who was Jackson’s security, called him offering work. He did periodic work for Jackson."Mr. Muhammad called me one evening in 2007, I want to say maybe February...” It was in early 2007, as he recalled. "He said that Jackson's children were sick and needed to go to the hospital and that Jackson didn't want to take them to public hospital," he said. Adams explained it was due to the fact that they didn't have anything to cover their faces. Adams told Muhammad he would reach out to his doctor, Dr. Murray, and see if he would be willing to come over and take a look at them. Jackson wanted resume of Murray, if he could be trusted. "I said he's been my doctor, he's my friend, he definitely can be trusted."
Within 10 minutes Adams contacted Murray and told him he needed a huge favour from him, had a high profile client, couldn't give name but once Murray got there he'd know who was. Adams asked if Murray could check out the children since they couldn't go to regular hospital. Dr. Murray told Adams that he would go at least to assess the situation. The doctor went that night, Adams wasn't there. Next day Adams asked Mr. Muhammad if Murray showed up. He said yes, but never discussed anything further. "Other than Michael thanking me for bringing him over to see the children, that was the only conversation we had," Adams testified. Adams said Jackson told him "I want to thank you very much, he was a very professional doctor, and I appreciate it." Adams said he wasn't going to ask for a resume because Murray was doing a favour. Adams testified he would come over at the house (Jackson’s ?) and see Dr. Murray there sometimes after that. But he doesn't know how the relationship went. He did not feel Dr. Murray tried to hide his interactions with Jackson. Adams said he only saw Joe Jackson and Randy Jackson come to the house one time while he was there.
Adams learned through TV reports that Jackson had died. The next day Adams called Dr. Murray and asked him was it true what he was hearing. Murray said yes. Adams asked Murray if he was ok and needed him, and Murray said yes. Adams said Dr. Murray told him he needed help because Jackson had passed. "It was discussed what happened, what was he going to do from there" Adams recalled. He doesn't remember if Murray told cause of Jackson's death. Dr. Murray told Adams he would need a lawyer. "I told him he had taken care of my father for me and that I'd be by his side in this situation until it was completed," Adams recalled. Adams testified he travelled with Dr. Conrad Murray everywhere. "I wasn't paid as his security, but I was his security," he said. "It was just understood that I'd be. There was no contract or anything of that nature or a job."
"I made statements, you know, but he never discussed with me how Michael passed," Adams recalled. "He never clarified anything with me." We lived together, we had an apartment together, we did everything together," Adams said. "We went to eat together, we went to movies together, we went to criminal proceedings, meetings lawyers, we took walks together,” Adams testified. He also travelled with Dr. Murray to Las Vegas, Houston, San Diego, Philadelphia, Boston, Miami. Adams said Dr. Murray's pastor in Houston was also his patient, as well as a number of other pastors and people he went to church with. Adams stayed in Dr. Murray's office when he was in Vegas and Houston seeing patients.
Adams went everywhere with Dr. Murray from the day after Jackson’s death to Murray's criminal conviction. Adams was with the doctor in his unofficial position during the criminal trial. The last time Adams spoke with Dr. Murray was the day he was convicted. Adams said Dr. Murray never described what kind of treatment he was engaged in with Jackson.
The next AEG witness on video was Dr. Stephen Gordon, plastic surgeon from Las Vegas. He performed procedures on Jackson in 2002, ’03 & ’07. Dr. Gordon detailed his education background and experience. He is board certified in general surgery and plastic surgery. He said his records are electronically saved, Jackson was filed as "Michael Jefferson". The doctor said Jackson chose to use the name to protect his privacy. Dr. Gordon saw Jackson professionally 3 times, never socially, spoke on phone maybe twice
Dr. Gordon met the singer after receiving a call directly from him, seeking an appointment. Gordon said he initially thought it was someone messing with him, but Jackson gave him a callback number and he was convinced. "It was a very pleasant sort of flattering experience," Gordon said. The doctor said Jackson told him he really wanted to see him. Jackson went to his office on Oct. 2, 2002 for the first procedure, which was done after hours. Jackson got some collagen injections. The injections were both in Jackson's face, some near his nose and he got Botox on at least one of his lower eyelids. He got anaesthesia. Gordon said having a patient get anaesthesia for those types of procedures wasn't typical. "He expressed a significant needle phobia."
It was a short procedure, about 10 minutes and Gordon said it wasn't a notable visit and nothing out of the ordinary happened. Gordon’s medical records indicated Jackson returned two days later, but the doctor didn’t have any notes of what was done. The anaesthesiologist had notes that a 45-minute procedure was done, but the doctor doesn’t remember what happened. Gordon said it’s possible the procedure was a touch-up from the previous one, or the anaesthesiology chart was for another patient. “I knew I’d have a little trouble explaining this to you,” Gordon told AEG Live defence lawyer Marvin Putnam on the video.
While Gordon’s records were unclear, the attorneys agreed to read a note to the jury that a procedure did happen on Oct. 2, 2002. Gordon testified that he had trouble getting paid for the October procedures. He described Jackson as a “phantom” and difficult to reach. The doctor also said Jackson appeared more familiar with anaesthesia than other patients, and referred to Propofol as “milk. Most people really don’t relate to it like that.” He noted he just overheard the conversation with the anaesthesiologist.
In July 2003, Jackson returned for another procedure. This time he asked Gordon to cut a “foreign body” out of his abdomen. Gordon removed scar tissue, but said he didn’t find anything inorganic in Jackson’s abdomen. Jackson had a wound, but it had healed. The doctor said as Jackson was leaving, he asked for a shot of Demerol “for the road.” Gordon said he was surprised by the request. Gordon said he wasn’t going to give it to Jackson, but asked him how much he wanted, 300mg the singer replied. Gordon said that is a high dose and he refused to give it to Jackson. The singer didn’t argue, but did say he could handle it. “I got the impression that he had favours like this done for him before,” Gordon said of Jackson’s request for Demerol. He didn’t see the singer again for another four years.
The next time Jackson came to Dr. Gordon’s office, Conrad Murray was with him. Murray presented himself as Jackson’s doctor and “spokesperson to some extent,” Gordon said. Gordon found the visit odd. He said Jackson acted like he hadn’t been there before, and he had never had a patient bring their own doctor to a visit. Murray had driven Jackson to the office and sat through the procedure. Jackson received a cosmetic injection, but didn’t get Propofol. Gordon said he didn’t give Jackson any pain medication after that visit. His impression was Murray was taking care of Jackson’s needs, he said. “There was nothing usual or customary about what he was doing, at all,” Gordon said of the 2007 visit. He never heard from Jackson again.
The third and final video deposition was that of anaesthesiologist Dr. David Jeffrey Adams, who gave Jackson Propofol 4 times during dental procedures in Las Vegas. Adams testified Jackson never specifically requested the drug. The doctor said he and Jackson never specifically discussed Propofol. Dr. Adams didn’t charge Jackson for his services, but told the singer that he wanted him to refer other patients to him. Dr. Adams said Jackson appeared thin, but healthy.
The first time Dr. Adams met Jackson, he said he noticed the singer had a large tongue. He was worried that could be a problem. Sure enough, Jackson’s tongue blocked his airway during each of the four procedures, Dr. Adams said. He was able to quickly remedy it. Moving Michael Jackson’s chin would open up his airway and restore his breathing, Dr. Adams said. Dr. Adams recounted meeting Conrad Murray. The cardiologist called him on a Sunday afternoon in March (2009?), asked him to come to his office.
Jackson accompanied Murray to meet with Dr. Adams. Despite being extremely hot, Jackson was wearing a suit coat and scarf, he recalled. Dr. Adams was getting ready for church when Murray called, and he went to the cardiologist’s office thinking Jackson needed medical care. Instead, Dr. Adams said Jackson talked to him for about 90 minutes about his life, his practice, and other topics. Murray had left the room. Dr. Adams said he was anxious to find out what was going on, but Jackson and Murray conferred in another room. Adams finally told them he had to leave, and they asked him to hold on.
Jackson and Murray came back into the room after a few more minutes. Murray looked upset by that point. Jackson asked Adams to accompany him on the “This Is It” tour, which took Dr. Adams by surprise. The anaesthesiologist said he couldn’t understand why he would be needed. Neither Jackson nor Murray ever mentioned Propofol. Dr. Adams said Jackson would only tell him he wanted him to help him rest. Adams said Jackson didn’t want an immediate answer. The anaesthesiologist agreed to think about it, and traded calls and texts with Murray. He was willing to go on the tour. Dr. Adams wanted $100,000 a month, and a three-year contract to accompany Jackson on the tour. He said he never heard back.
On the day Jackson died, Dr. Adams said he texted Murray his condolences. He never heard anything back from the cardiologist.
And there the day ended. The court is not in session again till next Tuesday. May have more details later of Day 74.
ABC7's Eye Witness video report of Dr. Gordon & Dr. Adams testimony, includes clips from their depositions. Gordon testified, Murray was taken care of Jackson's day to day care, they had a very close relationship and Murray made it very clear he was Jackson's personal physician.
To be honest, it pretty much confirms what AEG and their witnesses have been claiming all along. It'll be interesting to see if AEG pick up on this and try to use it.
MJ's comments about his parents are pretty scathing, but I'm most surprised about his comments re: Kenny Ortega. Kenny has pretty much defended MJ since his death, so those comments are a bit of a kick in the teeth for him. If MJ had issues with Kenny, he should have taken them up with him, not moaned to his doctor about it!:rolleyes:
The problem is Murray probably isn't regarded as a credible witness, considering his criminal record. Neither side seemed eager to have him as a witness.
The evidence from the doctors on Day 74 show Murray was working for Jackson from 2007, on one occasion Murray is said to have paid for the procedure Jackson had. If Dr. Adams testimony is believed by the jury it's clear Jackson was the one deciding which doctor he would take on tour.
Murray & Adams have had previous interactions. Murray told the LAPD he watched Adams give Jackson Propofol in March/Paril 2009 but Adams denied this.
The last time he saw Michael Jackson was in December 2008. Michael Jackson died in June 2009. Further, Mr. Agwara advised the first time Dr. Adams was linked to this case he lost business referrals; therefore, the potential for financial and professional hardship is great.
Yet at this trial Adams says he met with Jackson & Murray in late March or early April 2009.
Day 74 21 Aug 2013 (Part 2a) Extracted from tweets by ABC7 Court News
Additional testimony of Dr. Stephen Gordon, plastic surgeon from Las Vegas. He said if the surgery is major, the patient is always under general anaesthesia. Only for minor things it's local anaesthesia. Botox is generally done under local or no anaesthesia, Dr. Gordon said. Filler usually has a local anaesthetic component of some sort. Dr. Gordon said he does not tell the anaesthesiologist how much drug to give.
On Jackson’s first visit 2 Oct 2002 to Dr. Gordon he came with 2 or 3 people entourage. Once Jackson got into building, the entourage left. Gordon said his ex-wife and anaesthesiologist, Dr. Virgil, were in the office. He said Dr. Virgil was there because Jackson gave an indication he may want something done. The doctor testified he doesn't recall exactly what Jackson wanted done, but it was some adjustment of some sort on his face. He said Jackson requested to go under general anaesthesia, was very specific as to what he wanted. Jackson was there probably a couple of hours. Dr Gordon wrote on the chart that he examined the patient, Jackson, and he was found to be in good health, no obvious contraindication to surgery. Propofol was used in the induction of anaesthesia in 2002, isoflurane, nitrous oxide and oxygen. Doctor also used Lidocaine to numb the skin. Under allergies, there are a few medications listed. Demerol and morphine cause nausea, it says.
The next appointment was 4 Oct, 2002. Dr. Gordon said he does not remember this visit. The surgery was from 8:25 to 8:55, longer than the first one. Propofol was used again as anesthesia. Dr. Gordon said he knew he'd have trouble explaining it. "I can't even tell you exactly what we did." There's anaesthesia record but not surgery record. Dr. Gordon said he knew this would be difficult to explain. The doctor said this record could be for another person. "I'm a little embarrassed to admit that, but it could be another patient," he said. Kathryn Cahan (family attorney) said in court the parties stipulated there was no procedure done that day.
"Michael was a little bit of a whiner, having an IV started and about, you know, having Propofol injection," Dr. Gordon recalled. "Well, he gave me the impression that he was used to telling doctors what he wanted them to do," Dr. Gordon said. “….The doctor explained what gave him that impression, “Well, just his specificity about what he wanted and where he wanted it and how much he wanted, how he wanted it done.” Dr. Gordon testified Jackson was familiar with Propofol and that's what he wanted to go to sleep.
Next Jackson visit was on July 30, 2003. It was a procedure to explant foreign body from abdomen area. Jackson had claimed he had fallen and had sustained an injury to his abdominal area. He believed that there was still some glass or some other foreign body in his abdomen. He said it was painful, wanted removed. The surgery was under general anaesthesia, the anaesthesiologist used Fentanyl since Jackson reported getting nauseated with morphine and Demerol.
Dr. Gordon testified, “There wasn't any glass, there wasn't any metal, there wasn't any wood. There wasn't anything that was inorganic. So as far as I could tell, it was a negative exploration." Dr. Gordon performed this exploratory procedure and Botox on Jackson. Regarding Jackson requesting a shot of Demerol for the road, Dr. Gordon said Jackson told him 'That's ok, I've done this before, it's fine'. "He said 300 mg was not excessive for him," Dr. Gordon testified. "He wasn't sufficiently nauseated that kept him from asking for it."
The doctor said Jackson reached out to see him but he was out of town and referred him to someone else. Dr. Gordon said it may have been a hand injury. Dr. Gordon referred him to Dr. Stephen Weiland. There were 3 contacts between 2003-07. Every time was hard to find a vein in Jackson, Dr. Gordon said. "Just absence of usable veins." It usually implies vein damage, he said. He doesn't remember seeing track marks on Jackson's arms. He said it's unusual not to find vein in males.
In 2007 Dr. Gordon spoke with Conrad Murray. He said Jackson was doing a show or something and wanted some more fillers on his face. It was on May 14, 2007, Dr. Murray arrived with Jackson at Dr. Gordon's office. "He walked in with Jackson, introduced himself and were there for Juvederm," he said. Dr. Murray wrote a personal check for $1,300 to Dr. Gordon for Jackson's procedure. Murray was present during the procedure. Dr. Gordon said he had never seen a personal physician pay for the treatment of a patient. They had a very close relationship and Conrad made it very clear that he was taking care of Jackson’s needs. "They might have been there for quite a while that day, fussing with the appearance," Dr. Gordon said. “He required a fair amount of codling," Dr. Gordon said. "At least he wanted to do under local anaesthesia, which was a progress." Dr. Gordon said he wasn't sure if Jackson didn't remember being there before or pretending to not remember. He said there wasn't really a doctor/patient because Dr. Murray was kind of the intermediary. The doctor said Jackson looked healthy in 2007, didn't change much in his appearance.
Dr. Gordon was kind of skeptical of Dr. Murray. Dr. Gordon said he never heard of cardiologist Dr. Conrad Murray before, and he knows several other cardiologists in Las Vegas. "He'd have me believe he had successful invasive cardiology practice in Las Vegas and Houston," Dr. Gordon said. "But if it he was that successful, why would he be someones personal physician?" Dr. Gordon questioned. "It seemed something he was telling me wasn't true" Dr Gordon said. "It's fair to say the whole situation was very odd and didn't add up. I felt that a successful cardiologist doesn't go around being somebody's personal physician and speaking for them," Dr. Gordon testified.
Day 74 21 Aug 2013 (Part 3a) Extracted from tweets by ABC7 Court News
More details of Dr. David Adams testimony, an anaesthesiologist in Las Vegas. He administered Propofol to Jackson 4 times. In June 2008 Dr. Mark Tadrissi said he had a VIP patient coming in for a few procedures and if he was interested in doing anaesthesia. Dr. Adams scheduled a physical exam and the procedure happened a week later. "I realized the magnitude of who I was working with, I wanted to make sure he was healthy and there wouldn't be any problems" Dr Adams said. Dr. Tradissi scheduled the physical with Jackson. "They were cosmetic implants, dental implants, had a root canal," Dr. Adams said. "I never discuss really the drugs I'm going to use with the doctor," Dr. Adams said. Propofol is still the drug of choice.
Dr. Adams said Jackson was going to have a procedure and didn't want to know about it or feel anything. Dr. Tradissi introduced Jackson to him. "He said he had them (anaesthesia) before and he didn't have any problems. He seemed thin, pale, but otherwise no medical problems," Dr. Adams said. "I don't believe they weighed him." The entourage and bodyguards were never in the room when Jackson was being examined. It was just Dr. Adams and Jackson. He checked his chest, lungs and looked inside the mouth. Jackson was said to look, "Thin but muscular, healthy. Just pale." Jackson had an abnormally large tongue.
The artist said he wasn't taking any medication, only vitamins. Temperature was steady at 97F and stable all the way thru. 100 by 60 blood pressure. Procedure took about 2 hours. Dr. Adams gave Jackson Propofol. "I want to get this procedure done as soon as possible because of the unprotected airway. I'm not trying to put him to sleep, I just want him not to remember," Dr Adams said. Dr Tradissi gave him anaesthetic like Lidocaine as well. Dr. Adams said the amounts of Propofol he gave was the lowest he gives to patients. About 2 hours after the procedure, Jackson called to let Dr. Adams know he was ok. He said he was surprise Jackson himself called. Jackson said he was going to buy the house the sultan used to live. Dr. Adams said Jackson was very pleasant, polite, personable and very quiet. Dr. Adams said he didn't bill Jackson for any of the 4 procedures.
The second procedure was a month later, also at Dr. Tradissi. Dr. Adams said it was pretty much the same procedure as before. Dr. Adams said Jackson was perfectly happy with what had happened. First procedure was to take impression of dental. Second procedure was 3 Jun 08. Third procedure was on 18 Jun 08. Dr. Odabashian performed root canal.
The 4th procedure Dr. Adams performed was with oral surgeon Carlos Letilier. It was for screwing the 2 implants into Jackson's jaw. In the previous 3 procedures, Jackson asked not to give him narcotics. He just said he had a problem with them in the past, Dr. Adams didn't give him any, as requested. After the procedure was over Jackson asked for something for the pain. , the non-narcotic pain reliever Toradol was mentioned but Jackson said it wasn’t going to work and requested something stronger. Dr. Adams ended up giving Jackson Versed a morphine for the pain.
Dr. Adams met Murray in late March, early April 2009. This was at Dr. Murray's office. "Michael and Dr. Murray got out of the car, I got out of my car, we introduced ourselves to each other. I told Michael how ridiculous he looked because he had a scarf and he was all dressed in black and it was 1000 degrees outside. Usually he had a very relaxed look, maybe even pyjamas, but this time he had on a suit coat, a scarf, a hat.” Michael explained why he was doing the shows, “He says the only reason I'm doing this tour is because I want to prove to my kids that I'm the best entertainer in the world, and I'm not doing it for any other reason." Dr. Adams said he was wondering why Jackson wanted to talk to him.
He explained Dr. Murray excused himself and Jackson talked to him like an interview. "And he was telling me a little bit about him and how he felt and his family and different entertainers, we talked about an hour and a half." Dr. Adams said Jackson told him he wanted to build a children's hospital. He talked about his family, kids, everything. "We talked about Steven Spielberg, Bono, the tour. He didn't have good things to say about those people either." Dr. Adams described how Murray returned and was in the back of the office for 15 minutes talking to Jackson. "I go back to the office, Jackson and Murray walk back in and Murray really looked like he had just lost his best friend," Dr. Adams said. That's when Jackson tells Adams he'd like him to go on tour with him. "And do what? I don't sing, I really can't dance so to do what?" he told Jackson.
"I'd like for you to help me get rest," Dr. Adams said Michael told him. "Every once in a while I need an IV, and he said I just need you to help me get my rest. I'm thinking the guy's having a heart attack and they're asking me about going on tour. I couldn't even begin to fathom that,” said Adams. He had no idea what Jackson meant by helping him get his rest. Adams said he told them he didn't have license to practice in England. The doctor said Murray was truly upset with Jackson's request. “I never discussed Propofol with Dr. Murray or Michael Jackson," Dr. Adams testified. Dr. Adams said they didn't know how long the tour was going to last, they thought it might go to other countries after London. Adams was left to think about it. Dr. Adams said he texted Dr. Murray back asking what was going on and there was no response and no further communications at that point.
Jackson never asked Dr. Adams to do anything he thought was medically inappropriate? Dr. Adams said he never saw needle marks on Jackson's arms. "Very difficult veins to stick to," he said "Very muscular arms, very small veins." Sometimes Dr. Adams had to try 2-3 times to get an IV started, he said.
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The Jacksons' attorney William Bloss did cross examination of Dr. Gary Green. The doctor agreed financial incentive can create conflict of interest. "Regardless financial incentive, it does not take away from physician's obligation to the patient," Dr. Green explained. Bloss showed part of the Code of Ethics of American Medical Association.
AMA says: "It's important to recognize that sufficient large incentives can create an untenable position for physicians."
"Financial rewards do not obligate physicians to compromise their medical judgment," Dr. Green opined. The doctor was asked if $150,000 a month a large incentive, Dr. Green said it depends on the situation. Bloss asked how about a doctor whose house is about to go on foreclosure, $600,000 in outstanding debt, behind child support payment? "I'm sure many doctors have great deal of debt, possibly more than that, and still practice medicine in an ethical manner," Dr Green said.
Bloss showed Kai Chase's testimony, where she said she didn't see Dr. Murray as much in April, was there about 3 times a week. Dr. Green said he was not accurate when he mentioned Chase said Dr. Murray was at Carolwood in March of 2009. Dr. Green said on April 19, 2009, Dr. Metzger went to Carolwood to meet Jackson, he said Jackson asked for sleep medication. Bloss, “Do you recall Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to give him sleep aid?” Dr. Gree, “I don't recall dates, need to see the testimony.” Bloss, “If a nurse says there were no equipment at the house for Murray to inject Jackson with Propofol on Apr19 is that inconsistent?”
Dr. Green, “No.” Bloss, “Do you have information Jackson was seeking Propofol from people other than Dr. Murray?” Dr. Green, “Yes, Dr. Metzger and Cherilyn Lee.” On Apr 19, Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to find someone to give him Propofol, Bloss said. He asked if it'd be consistent with Murray there same day. “We see addicts and they go to multiple sources, I could only speculate why Jackson was seeking Propofol from more than one person. It's not inconsistent somebody seeking drugs from several sources" Dr Green said. "Particularly with that drug which wasn't easy to obtain." Bloss, “Was Dr. Murray giving Jackson Propofol on April 19th and 12th at Carolwood?” Dr. Green, “Yes.” Dr. Green said he cannot testify to the exact date because Dr. Murray kept no records to maintain it secretive. Dr. Green charges AEG $3,000 per half day of work, $6,000 for full day.
Bloss showed email from Ortega to Gongaware on Jun 14, 2009 saying ’Are you aware Jackson's doctor didn't permit him to attend rehearsals today?’ "This just shows Dr. Murray independence to advise Jackson not to attend rehearsal," Dr. Green said. Email from Gongaware: ’We want to remind him that it's AEG, not Jackson, who is paying his salary.’ Dr. Green said the best person to ask about this email is who wrote it or received it. "I believe Mr. Gongaware didn't recall this email," Dr. Green said. "Mr. Ortega said he didn't understand what it meant."
Dr. Green feels the email supports his opinion, even the part that says,’AEG, not Jackson, who is paying his salary.’ Dr. Green said in his deposition that nothing in the email supported his opinion. Dr. Green, ”Now that I responded differently is because I had additional information. One is Mr. Gongaware's testimony, and further reviewed evidence this was never communicated to Dr. Murray. The fact that it was never communicated to Dr. Murray let me believe it was not influencing," Dr. Green explained. "You need to look at the context of this email, you can't just pull out a word here or there," Dr. Green said. Bloss asked if ‘we want him to understand what's expected of him’ mentioned in the email influenced his opinion. "No, it would not sway my opinion one way or the other," Dr. Green said. He did not ask to meet with Gongaware or Phillips to try to get more information about the email and their intent.
Bloss asked about the meeting at Carolwood's house on June 16, 2009, which they called "intervention." He asked if Chase said Dr. Murray burst out of the meeting and said ‘I can't take this s**t anymore.’ "I read the testimony of Ms. Chase and that was her perception," Dr. Green said.
Mr. Gongaware had a much different account of the meeting than what Chase testified, Bloss said. Dr. Green said Chase wasn't present for the entire meeting, but Gongaware was. He would give a little more weight to Gongaware since he was present for the full meeting. "Assuming that Chase's recollection is correct, I think there are many interpretations of Dr. Murray's outburst," Dr. Green said. “It could be that Dr. Murray could be feeling pressured he was giving unethical and illegal drugs. That certainly could create pressure in Dr. Murray to make an outburst like that," Dr. Green said. "There was nothing to suggest in the meeting that Dr. Murray was in danger of losing the gig." Dr. Green said.
Dr. Green didn't receive the "Trouble at the Front" email chain until after he was involved in the case. Bloss showed Bugzee's email saying Jackson was basket case. "Only information that Jackson was not in good health on June 19," Dr Green said about it. "Dr. Murray wasn't keeping records at this time, but I believe Jackson was under his care," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed the email where Ortega said ‘now that we brought the doctor in to the fold.’ Dr. Green said this email showed Ortega was concerned with Jackson's health. He doesn't know what the director meant by ‘doctor in to the fold.’. “I think you have to put this entire thing in context and the context is that he was concerned with Mr. Jackson's health", Dr Green explained.
Dr. Green said several people raised questions about Jackson's psychological situation. Dr. Green said he believes Dr. Murray was board certified but it had lapsed in 2008. Murray does not have psychiatry training. Bloss talked about the lengthy conversation Randy Phillips had with Dr. Murray, he asked the doctor if he knew for sure what they talked about. He said no. Bloss asked about another Phillips' email. Panish laughed out loud when Dr. Green responded he recalls testimony but preferred reading again.
Judge called Panish out, he apologised. Judge ordered all the attorneys in her chambers for quick sidebar. Back in the courtroom in front of jury Panish said, “Your honour, I'd like to apologise to Dr. Green for that laugh.” The apology was accepted. Panish, “I'm sincerely sorry.” Dr. Green, “No harm, no foul.”
Bloss talked about "this doctor is extremely successful, we checked him out." Dr. Green said he thought Phillips meant that based on Kathy Jorrie's testimony regarding the check she did. "I do not see anything to change my opinion of conflict of interest in this case," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed another part of the "Trouble at the Front" email with Phillips saying ’Tim and I are going to see him tomorrow.’ Bloss asked if that statement was material to his opinion. "Only that AEG was concerned about what was going on and were doing something about it," Dr. Green said. He's not sure what Phillips meant when he asked ‘is it chemical or physiological.’ "I can only speculate." Dr Green said he was asked to analyse if this is a sports medicine case and whether or not conflict of interest led to his poor medical care.
Judge adjourned trial for the weekend.
Murray was Jackson's personal doctor since 2006. Jackson had paid him cash a number of times in Los Vegas, as testified by Prince. Murray was on Jackson's payroll long before AEG even had an agreement with Jackson for the shows. AEG hadn't considered a doctor being on the tour for Jackson. Jackson had initiated contact with Murray asking him in March 2009 to go on the tour, the first shipment of Propofol was on 6 Apr 2009. Yet he talks to Dr. Allan Metzger about IV sleep medication mid April. A few days later on April 19 Jackson expressed his desire for Diprivan to Cherilyn Lee.
This is about 2 months before AEG are asked to negotiate with Murray on Jacksons behalf and at least a month after Jackson was has begun having Propofol nightly.
I think Dr. Green laid it out neatly for the jury, also showing Murray flagged up the 'artist' error in the contract and Murray decided if Jackson went to rehearsals.
I see the Jury is not called till Monday afternoon, will the judge decide on AEG's motion in the morning? If he rejects the motion does that look bad for AEG?
Well Debbie Rowe was a game of two halves. One day Jackson was purely obtaining drugs only for procedures, next day she says he was seeking out drugs.
Did she ruin the family's case? She testified Dr. Metzger, Jackson's personal doctor provided her with a bag of medication for Jackson in 1992/93. Karen Faye mentioned a bag of medication she refused to carry on the tour. Rowe said she was instructed by Dr. Metzger to had over the bag of medication to Dr. Forecast who would look after Jackson. The crew doctor Dr. Finkelstein testified Dr. Allan Metzger gave him advice on treating Jackson, 2 vials of Demerol prescribed by Metzger were given to Finkelstein by Karen Faye.
On the HIStory tour, she mentioned Dr. Klein providing procedures but it is Metzger who arranges for Jackson to have Diprivan in a hotel room on two occasions.
Doesn't that confirm Jackson personally chose doctors who'd do his bidding?
More on Allan Metzger, to come...did he commit perjury at Murray's trial?
In his testimony at Murray's criminal trial Dr. Metzger reportedly testified on Day 16, Oct 24, 2011....
But according to Debbie Rowe he had arranged it in 1996/97. For free?
musicians have sold out and been accused of selling out for a long time before the pepsi ad's. the who made fun of it on their 1967 album "the who sell out"
but you've just pointed out he did have an option. he didn't have to turn the rest of his skin white. however he did, and furthermore he lied about it, and his fanatical fans lied about it
i think it's pretty obvious LM was just a beard for him, in particular to try and deflect speculation about child abuse with young boys. maybe i'm very good at being able to tell when a man is gay or not, but it's something i noticed a long long time ago and a few of his hardcore fans have stated similar things. if you watch non scripted videos of him interacting with people, you will see how differently he acts towards males as opposed to females, in particular young males. it's very different to how a hetrosexual male would act
Katherine Jackson is not present in court. There is only afternoon session today for the jurors.
The attorneys met in the morning to discuss future witnesses.
AEG expert on Medical Conflict of Interest Dr. Gary Green is back on the stand. Jacksons' attorney William Bloss will resume cross examination.
Dr. Green said over the weekend he reviewed his testimony from Friday, reviewed materials provided earlier and met with AEG attorneys. Dr. Green was asked about the phone call between Randy Phillips and Dr. Murray. Dr. Green recalled Phillips testimony that he did not have full recollection of the specific contents of the phone call. Dr. Green testified there was no evidence Phillips put any pressure on Dr. Murray during the call, he had not seen any evidence Phillips put pressure on Dr. Murray.
Bloss showed the email chain “Trouble at the Front” and the meeting on 20 June 2009. Dr. Green said there was a little dispute as to what really happened at the meeting, he had no way of resolving which way was true. Again Dr. Green said there appeared not to be any evidence Dr. Murray was pressured. Even if Phillips threatened to cancel the shows Dr. Green said that it was ultimately up to Dr. Murray to make decisions in the best interest of his patient and he didn't.
Bloss compared the different definitions of Conflict of Interest produced by Dr. Green and Dr. Matheson. Dr. Green said the definition produced by Dr. Matheson was reasonable but not the only one. Asked if financial interest is the most powerful corroding force in a conflict of interest Dr. Green said in his experience he’s seen physicians do all sort of things for reasons other than financial. He said he's not aware there's a way to rate the most powerful conflict of interest. He believes financial interest can create conflict.
Dr. Green was shown the MLB's policy on assessment and management of concussion on ballplayers. The MLB has to review team physician's actions before an athlete is allowed to return to play. Dr. Green said his position is more of an administrative position with MLB, he doesn't see the patients. Asked if the reason team does do not have unilateral power to have athlete return to play is because of potential conflict of interest, Dr. Green responded the reason is because it’s about a competition, to ensure no team had a competitive advantage.
Dr. Murray's financial status did not matter at all in Dr. Green’s opinion. Dr. Green agreed Detective Martinez testified he suspected financial motive for Murray to violate Hippocratic oath. Dr. Green explained, "Not knowing Dr. Murray and not hearing his testimony, I cannot say with certainty why Dr. Murray committed this crime." Dr. Green testified he had never seen a three-way relationship between a physician, a patient and a third party like this. It was his understanding AEG Live was going to advance money to Dr. Murray on behalf of Michael Jackson. Dr. Green agreed Dr. Murray's contract termination could be done by Jackson and multiple ways by AEG Live unilateral.
In re-cross Dr Green said he was retained in the case to consider his expertise in sports medicine and conflict of interest. He was also asked to review Dr. Matheson's testimony. Dr Green attended almost all of Dr Matheson's deposition. He said he wanted to hear him saying his opinion as opposed to reading it on paper. The expert said if he had agreed with Dr. Matheson's opinion, he'd have communicated it to AEG. Dr. Green said there have been cases where he gave opinion that the attorneys ended up not using in their cases.
Dr. Green said one of the ‘conflict of interest’ definitions he was shown was guidance to physicians only not third parties or patients. Stebbins Bina asked about the article: "Patients must be informed of financial incentives that could impact the level or type of care they receive." Dr Green said the statement further proves his opinion. The expert said not only was Jackson informed of the financial incentives, he created them. Dr. Green said the email Phillips wrote showed they were very concerned about Jackson's health, proved his opinion that parties shared same interest. The expert said the fact that Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" proves the doctor was independent.
Dr. Green testified that, as a competent adult, you can't make anyone go see a doctor. He said Dr. Klein had seen Jackson about 30 times between March and June and in no case he mentioned psychological problems. Dr Green said he reviewed testimony Murray was off on Sundays, 19 Apr 2009 when Jackson asked Cherilyn Lee to find a doctor to give him Propofol was a Sunday.
In re-cross, Bloss asked if $150,000 a month is large incentive, is it not? Dr. Green said in general, yes. It was more than he makes at Pepperdine as the team's physician, "By a lot." But he pointed out it's not his only job. Bloss asked when Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" if Phillips said anything. Dr. Green said no. The expert said he didn’t know whether Phillips & Murray in their phone call on 20 Jun 2009 discussed drug use, medical treatment or any other topics. He only knew what Phillips testified.
Dr. Green was excused. And the day’s session ended.
Meanwhile AEG Live is seeking a dismissal of the case, claiming the plaintiffs haven’t shown enough evidence to send the case to the jury. Their motion is to be heard on 5 Sep so all the lawyers are present.
Katherine Jackson is not in court today. It is said she won't come back until after Labor Day, she's working on Michael Jackson's birthday celebration.
Today’s witness is Rhoma Young, a Human Resources consultant. Who’s been in the business for almost 40 years. She has worked with Facebook, Microsoft, IBM, LinkedIn, Roche, UC Med Centers, private hospitals, Kaiser, Chevron. In the music industry, Young said she worked with the Symphony, Ballet and Opera in the Bay area. Young said she was asked to look at the practices and policies of AEG Live, their independent contractors and testimony to see if consistent. She was questioned by Jessica Stebbins Bina attorney for AEG.
Young reviewed an extensive list of documents in this case. She's worked in this case close to 200 hours. Her hourly rate for research is $350 per hour and $450 an hour for testimony and deposition. Young said her bill is close to $70,000 as recent as yesterday. In court, she said she testified 95 times, or maybe more. She said she tried to testify half and half for plaintiffs and defendants and has refused work when the balance is off. "I'm not an advocate," Young said. "Because I testify for both sides, I can't contradict myself. My reputation is about being balanced."
Young has helped companies hiring employees. Young said an employee is an individual hired by a company. Generally there's a defined way to find the employees, the screening process, layers of screening to determine who's more qualified and who is not. She stated there's a supervisor, job title, set of expectation, training, how they are paid, employee benefits, insurance, have deductions and benefits, such as taxes, insurance, unemployment insurance, disability insurance, etc, Young explained.
Young explained independent contractors are usually sourced through different method and different way. The expert said you can get personal referral or look for professional organizations to find independent contractors. There's no application, you talk about price, timing, scheduling, license and there's contract prior to beginning of work. There's no payroll taxes deducted from pay of independent contractors, the expert said.
In order to obtain a medical license, Young said the doctor submits to a fingerprint scan, which goes thru Department of Justice. They also go thru very thorough education background. The State of California does not check financial background of applicants to issue medical licenses, Young said.
Young said in looking at the content of Dr. Murray's contract, she said it's consistent with an independent contractor agreement. This is AEG acting on behalf, helping Jackson getting the doctor he wanted to go on tour. Bina asked who she understood asked for Dr. Murray to be hired. "Michael Jackson," she responded. Her understanding is AEG was to advance funds for other personal staff on behalf of Jackson at his request ultimately to be paid back by Jackson. "My understanding these choices were being made by Jackson. The children chose Kai Chase, but the choices were ultimately Jackson's," Young testified.
"For independent contractors, in my opinion, you don't do background check or criminal check," Young said. "You have a different set of knowledge, referrals," she said. You may ask them to provide necessary licenses, their own insurances. She said it may all be included in the agreement. In an interview, the questions have to be job-related, Young said. Bina asked,”Can you ask about how many children someone has?” Young’s response, “ No!”
Young said AEG does basic checks for employees, such as is the person eligible to work, do they have driver's license if needed for the job. Background check is much less frequently done for independent contractors than it is for employees. Independent contractors give you different kinds of assurances when they are self-insured, Young explained. Bina, “Do you agree or disagree that a credit check was job related for Jackson's physician?” Young, “I absolutely do not agree.” Young said as far as she knows in healthcare credit checks are not carried out. She checked places hiring, saw no reference as credit check as a requirement. "It's not common, it's not frequent, in fact it's very rare," Young testified about credit check in the healthcare industry. Young said 97% of healthcare companies did not conduct any credit check. And that included more than just physicians, she said.
She disagrees that Dr. Murray's job was high risk or sensitive. High risk is when a person performing the work has more likelihood of fatality or injury to the worker, Young explained. The family’s HR expert Ms. Seawright was accused of ignoring basic HR standards, such as when she said when she said there's no difference between independent contractor and employees.
Bina finished her direct examination. Jacksons' attorney, Brian Panish, did cross examination.
Young confirmed she has not worked with concert promoters or specializes in the music business. Panish asked if she has ever seen a 3-way party involving a doctor, patient and someone else. "I've worked with some clinics and going thru personnel files I saw some 3-way agreements," Young said. There were some independent contractor situation and 3 party agreements, she explained. Young said she's never hired a physician on behalf of anyone. She has helped in the process but was not the person to have the last say. Young has not looked at Nevada's medical license requirements prior to issuing a medical license.
Young did not dispute AEG could've made Dr. Murray sign a authorisation for background check. Young explained there's a draft, in writing, of template for dealing with independent contractors. She said she could consider that a policy. Young agreed it does not say what they should check out before the employment and does not say check references, prior to employment. Young said. "As far as I know, there are no criteria in writing before hiring an independent contractor. I look for effectiveness not correctness when doing my audits," Young said. Panish asked what AEG Live did to check Dr. Murray's license. Young said Kathy Jorrie searched the doctor's medical license. Panish pointed out that insurance was never provided to AEG. "And the agreement was never completed," Young responded.
Young said she does not consider physician's job dangerous, industry considers the danger to the person doing the job not 3rd party. Panish asked if one example of dangerous profession is crocodile's keeper, wild animal holders. She said yes. "Crocodiles are dangerous creatures," Young testified. "Have you trained a crocodile before?" Panish asked. "Not recently," she responded, and added, "I've been cross examined by one." Everyone started laughing. Young is donating the trial testimony money to the American Cancer Society. Panish said if he keeps her tomorrow there will be more money to ACS. Defence attorney objected. Everyone laughed again.
Young said in her deposition that she has no idea how Randy Phillips determined Dr. Murray was extremely successful. Young explained she's familiar with State of California's criteria to issue licenses to physician, but she's not an expert in physician hiring. Panish asked if 10 mins is thorough, detailed background check on someone. Young said it could be, even Seawright said it only takes 5 mins.
In re-direct, Bina showed "Disclosure and Authorization to Conduct Background Check." It says "Credit history may be requested, but only where such information is substantially related to the duties and responsibilities of the position to which you're applying." Young said she thinks the salary discussion alone proves that's what Jackson wanted at the time.
In re-cross, Young said there was an agreement that called for the engagement of Dr. Murray. Panish, “If AEG came to you in 2009 and asked if they should hire a doctor on behalf of 3rd party, you would've said no?” Young, “I don't know.” In a deposition she said, "No, there's not a chance I'd advise that," laughing out loud.
Bina asked if the reason she said that was because she's not a lawyer. She said yes, she doesn't advise on contracts.
Young is excused. The session ends for the day.
It was Paul Gongaware who said Jackson wanted Murray and set the fee, are the family hoping the jury believe Gongaware is a liar? As Michael Amir Williams was supposedly with Jackson at the time why didn't the family call him as a witness?
Adams testified he didn't work for Jackson, he 'orchestrated' Jackson's staff. He stated he'd known Murray socially since the 1990's and was Adam's doctor in Las Vegas. Adams said because Murray looked after him & his father Adams offered his services to Murray and went to live with the doctor to provide security and travel with him.
Adams' relationship with the singer was a bit confusing. He said he worked security at special events for Jackson, but also said he "didn't officially work for Michael, I orchestrated his staff
Crazed Jackson fans?
Today video depositions by 3 individuals were shown to the jury, Jeffrey Adams a security guard, Dr. Stephen Gordon, cosmetic surgeon and Dr. David Jeffrey Adams, anesthesiologist.
The first video deposition was of Jeffrey Adams, as the tweets and his testimony is confusing I’ve rearranged the order, to hopefully make matters clearer.
Since the early 1990’s Jeffrey Adams has worked in security, first at a school. In 1999 he moved to Las Vegas where he provided security at Burlington Coat Factory monitoring CCTV preventing losses for 4 years at the same time he provided security at Neiman Marcus, he left in 2007. After Adams said he worked as personal security for an attorney in Las Vegas. In 2004 he set up his own security company called, “Knockout Security”.
Adams testified he met Dr. Murray in early 1990s through a mutual friend. Asked what his first impression of the doctor was, Adams said, ‘Tall, cardiologist. He told me he was a cardiologist. That's about it.’ From the time Adams met Dr. Murray to when he moved to Las Vegas, he saw the doctor 3-4 times at barbecues in Los Angeles. Adams became a patient of Dr. Murray in Las Vegas, and so did Adams' father. Asked if he was still a patient of Murray, Adams answered, “Oh, he's locked up now. No, not now.”
Adams informed the court he did not officially work for Jackson, he orchestrated Jackson’s staff. Adams was described as orchestrating security for Jackson in December of 2006. Adams said his friend, Basheier Muhammad, who was Jackson’s security, called him offering work. He did periodic work for Jackson."Mr. Muhammad called me one evening in 2007, I want to say maybe February...” It was in early 2007, as he recalled. "He said that Jackson's children were sick and needed to go to the hospital and that Jackson didn't want to take them to public hospital," he said. Adams explained it was due to the fact that they didn't have anything to cover their faces. Adams told Muhammad he would reach out to his doctor, Dr. Murray, and see if he would be willing to come over and take a look at them. Jackson wanted resume of Murray, if he could be trusted. "I said he's been my doctor, he's my friend, he definitely can be trusted."
Within 10 minutes Adams contacted Murray and told him he needed a huge favour from him, had a high profile client, couldn't give name but once Murray got there he'd know who was. Adams asked if Murray could check out the children since they couldn't go to regular hospital. Dr. Murray told Adams that he would go at least to assess the situation. The doctor went that night, Adams wasn't there. Next day Adams asked Mr. Muhammad if Murray showed up. He said yes, but never discussed anything further. "Other than Michael thanking me for bringing him over to see the children, that was the only conversation we had," Adams testified. Adams said Jackson told him "I want to thank you very much, he was a very professional doctor, and I appreciate it." Adams said he wasn't going to ask for a resume because Murray was doing a favour. Adams testified he would come over at the house (Jackson’s ?) and see Dr. Murray there sometimes after that. But he doesn't know how the relationship went. He did not feel Dr. Murray tried to hide his interactions with Jackson. Adams said he only saw Joe Jackson and Randy Jackson come to the house one time while he was there.
Adams learned through TV reports that Jackson had died. The next day Adams called Dr. Murray and asked him was it true what he was hearing. Murray said yes. Adams asked Murray if he was ok and needed him, and Murray said yes. Adams said Dr. Murray told him he needed help because Jackson had passed. "It was discussed what happened, what was he going to do from there" Adams recalled. He doesn't remember if Murray told cause of Jackson's death. Dr. Murray told Adams he would need a lawyer. "I told him he had taken care of my father for me and that I'd be by his side in this situation until it was completed," Adams recalled. Adams testified he travelled with Dr. Conrad Murray everywhere. "I wasn't paid as his security, but I was his security," he said. "It was just understood that I'd be. There was no contract or anything of that nature or a job."
"I made statements, you know, but he never discussed with me how Michael passed," Adams recalled. "He never clarified anything with me." We lived together, we had an apartment together, we did everything together," Adams said. "We went to eat together, we went to movies together, we went to criminal proceedings, meetings lawyers, we took walks together,” Adams testified. He also travelled with Dr. Murray to Las Vegas, Houston, San Diego, Philadelphia, Boston, Miami. Adams said Dr. Murray's pastor in Houston was also his patient, as well as a number of other pastors and people he went to church with. Adams stayed in Dr. Murray's office when he was in Vegas and Houston seeing patients.
Adams went everywhere with Dr. Murray from the day after Jackson’s death to Murray's criminal conviction. Adams was with the doctor in his unofficial position during the criminal trial. The last time Adams spoke with Dr. Murray was the day he was convicted. Adams said Dr. Murray never described what kind of treatment he was engaged in with Jackson.
Adams video deposition ended.
The next AEG witness on video was Dr. Stephen Gordon, plastic surgeon from Las Vegas. He performed procedures on Jackson in 2002, ’03 & ’07. Dr. Gordon detailed his education background and experience. He is board certified in general surgery and plastic surgery. He said his records are electronically saved, Jackson was filed as "Michael Jefferson". The doctor said Jackson chose to use the name to protect his privacy. Dr. Gordon saw Jackson professionally 3 times, never socially, spoke on phone maybe twice
Dr. Gordon met the singer after receiving a call directly from him, seeking an appointment. Gordon said he initially thought it was someone messing with him, but Jackson gave him a callback number and he was convinced. "It was a very pleasant sort of flattering experience," Gordon said. The doctor said Jackson told him he really wanted to see him. Jackson went to his office on Oct. 2, 2002 for the first procedure, which was done after hours. Jackson got some collagen injections. The injections were both in Jackson's face, some near his nose and he got Botox on at least one of his lower eyelids. He got anaesthesia. Gordon said having a patient get anaesthesia for those types of procedures wasn't typical. "He expressed a significant needle phobia."
It was a short procedure, about 10 minutes and Gordon said it wasn't a notable visit and nothing out of the ordinary happened. Gordon’s medical records indicated Jackson returned two days later, but the doctor didn’t have any notes of what was done. The anaesthesiologist had notes that a 45-minute procedure was done, but the doctor doesn’t remember what happened. Gordon said it’s possible the procedure was a touch-up from the previous one, or the anaesthesiology chart was for another patient. “I knew I’d have a little trouble explaining this to you,” Gordon told AEG Live defence lawyer Marvin Putnam on the video.
While Gordon’s records were unclear, the attorneys agreed to read a note to the jury that a procedure did happen on Oct. 2, 2002. Gordon testified that he had trouble getting paid for the October procedures. He described Jackson as a “phantom” and difficult to reach. The doctor also said Jackson appeared more familiar with anaesthesia than other patients, and referred to Propofol as “milk. Most people really don’t relate to it like that.” He noted he just overheard the conversation with the anaesthesiologist.
In July 2003, Jackson returned for another procedure. This time he asked Gordon to cut a “foreign body” out of his abdomen. Gordon removed scar tissue, but said he didn’t find anything inorganic in Jackson’s abdomen. Jackson had a wound, but it had healed. The doctor said as Jackson was leaving, he asked for a shot of Demerol “for the road.” Gordon said he was surprised by the request. Gordon said he wasn’t going to give it to Jackson, but asked him how much he wanted, 300mg the singer replied. Gordon said that is a high dose and he refused to give it to Jackson. The singer didn’t argue, but did say he could handle it. “I got the impression that he had favours like this done for him before,” Gordon said of Jackson’s request for Demerol. He didn’t see the singer again for another four years.
The next time Jackson came to Dr. Gordon’s office, Conrad Murray was with him. Murray presented himself as Jackson’s doctor and “spokesperson to some extent,” Gordon said. Gordon found the visit odd. He said Jackson acted like he hadn’t been there before, and he had never had a patient bring their own doctor to a visit. Murray had driven Jackson to the office and sat through the procedure. Jackson received a cosmetic injection, but didn’t get Propofol. Gordon said he didn’t give Jackson any pain medication after that visit. His impression was Murray was taking care of Jackson’s needs, he said. “There was nothing usual or customary about what he was doing, at all,” Gordon said of the 2007 visit. He never heard from Jackson again.
The third and final video deposition was that of anaesthesiologist Dr. David Jeffrey Adams, who gave Jackson Propofol 4 times during dental procedures in Las Vegas. Adams testified Jackson never specifically requested the drug. The doctor said he and Jackson never specifically discussed Propofol. Dr. Adams didn’t charge Jackson for his services, but told the singer that he wanted him to refer other patients to him. Dr. Adams said Jackson appeared thin, but healthy.
The first time Dr. Adams met Jackson, he said he noticed the singer had a large tongue. He was worried that could be a problem. Sure enough, Jackson’s tongue blocked his airway during each of the four procedures, Dr. Adams said. He was able to quickly remedy it. Moving Michael Jackson’s chin would open up his airway and restore his breathing, Dr. Adams said. Dr. Adams recounted meeting Conrad Murray. The cardiologist called him on a Sunday afternoon in March (2009?), asked him to come to his office.
Jackson accompanied Murray to meet with Dr. Adams. Despite being extremely hot, Jackson was wearing a suit coat and scarf, he recalled. Dr. Adams was getting ready for church when Murray called, and he went to the cardiologist’s office thinking Jackson needed medical care. Instead, Dr. Adams said Jackson talked to him for about 90 minutes about his life, his practice, and other topics. Murray had left the room. Dr. Adams said he was anxious to find out what was going on, but Jackson and Murray conferred in another room. Adams finally told them he had to leave, and they asked him to hold on.
Jackson and Murray came back into the room after a few more minutes. Murray looked upset by that point. Jackson asked Adams to accompany him on the “This Is It” tour, which took Dr. Adams by surprise. The anaesthesiologist said he couldn’t understand why he would be needed. Neither Jackson nor Murray ever mentioned Propofol. Dr. Adams said Jackson would only tell him he wanted him to help him rest. Adams said Jackson didn’t want an immediate answer. The anaesthesiologist agreed to think about it, and traded calls and texts with Murray. He was willing to go on the tour. Dr. Adams wanted $100,000 a month, and a three-year contract to accompany Jackson on the tour. He said he never heard back.
On the day Jackson died, Dr. Adams said he texted Murray his condolences. He never heard anything back from the cardiologist.
And there the day ended. The court is not in session again till next Tuesday. May have more details later of Day 74.
Surely this kills Katherine Jackson's case against AEG?
MJ's comments about his parents are pretty scathing, but I'm most surprised about his comments re: Kenny Ortega. Kenny has pretty much defended MJ since his death, so those comments are a bit of a kick in the teeth for him. If MJ had issues with Kenny, he should have taken them up with him, not moaned to his doctor about it!:rolleyes:
The evidence from the doctors on Day 74 show Murray was working for Jackson from 2007, on one occasion Murray is said to have paid for the procedure Jackson had. If Dr. Adams testimony is believed by the jury it's clear Jackson was the one deciding which doctor he would take on tour.
Murray & Adams have had previous interactions. Murray told the LAPD he watched Adams give Jackson Propofol in March/Paril 2009 but Adams denied this.
Adams didn't want to appear as a witness for Murray in his trial and said the last time he saw Jackson was December 2008.
Yet at this trial Adams says he met with Jackson & Murray in late March or early April 2009.
Additional testimony of Dr. Stephen Gordon, plastic surgeon from Las Vegas. He said if the surgery is major, the patient is always under general anaesthesia. Only for minor things it's local anaesthesia. Botox is generally done under local or no anaesthesia, Dr. Gordon said. Filler usually has a local anaesthetic component of some sort. Dr. Gordon said he does not tell the anaesthesiologist how much drug to give.
On Jackson’s first visit 2 Oct 2002 to Dr. Gordon he came with 2 or 3 people entourage. Once Jackson got into building, the entourage left. Gordon said his ex-wife and anaesthesiologist, Dr. Virgil, were in the office. He said Dr. Virgil was there because Jackson gave an indication he may want something done. The doctor testified he doesn't recall exactly what Jackson wanted done, but it was some adjustment of some sort on his face. He said Jackson requested to go under general anaesthesia, was very specific as to what he wanted. Jackson was there probably a couple of hours. Dr Gordon wrote on the chart that he examined the patient, Jackson, and he was found to be in good health, no obvious contraindication to surgery. Propofol was used in the induction of anaesthesia in 2002, isoflurane, nitrous oxide and oxygen. Doctor also used Lidocaine to numb the skin. Under allergies, there are a few medications listed. Demerol and morphine cause nausea, it says.
The next appointment was 4 Oct, 2002. Dr. Gordon said he does not remember this visit. The surgery was from 8:25 to 8:55, longer than the first one. Propofol was used again as anesthesia. Dr. Gordon said he knew he'd have trouble explaining it. "I can't even tell you exactly what we did." There's anaesthesia record but not surgery record. Dr. Gordon said he knew this would be difficult to explain. The doctor said this record could be for another person. "I'm a little embarrassed to admit that, but it could be another patient," he said. Kathryn Cahan (family attorney) said in court the parties stipulated there was no procedure done that day.
"Michael was a little bit of a whiner, having an IV started and about, you know, having Propofol injection," Dr. Gordon recalled. "Well, he gave me the impression that he was used to telling doctors what he wanted them to do," Dr. Gordon said. “….The doctor explained what gave him that impression, “Well, just his specificity about what he wanted and where he wanted it and how much he wanted, how he wanted it done.” Dr. Gordon testified Jackson was familiar with Propofol and that's what he wanted to go to sleep.
Next Jackson visit was on July 30, 2003. It was a procedure to explant foreign body from abdomen area. Jackson had claimed he had fallen and had sustained an injury to his abdominal area. He believed that there was still some glass or some other foreign body in his abdomen. He said it was painful, wanted removed. The surgery was under general anaesthesia, the anaesthesiologist used Fentanyl since Jackson reported getting nauseated with morphine and Demerol.
Dr. Gordon testified, “There wasn't any glass, there wasn't any metal, there wasn't any wood. There wasn't anything that was inorganic. So as far as I could tell, it was a negative exploration." Dr. Gordon performed this exploratory procedure and Botox on Jackson. Regarding Jackson requesting a shot of Demerol for the road, Dr. Gordon said Jackson told him 'That's ok, I've done this before, it's fine'. "He said 300 mg was not excessive for him," Dr. Gordon testified. "He wasn't sufficiently nauseated that kept him from asking for it."
The doctor said Jackson reached out to see him but he was out of town and referred him to someone else. Dr. Gordon said it may have been a hand injury. Dr. Gordon referred him to Dr. Stephen Weiland. There were 3 contacts between 2003-07. Every time was hard to find a vein in Jackson, Dr. Gordon said. "Just absence of usable veins." It usually implies vein damage, he said. He doesn't remember seeing track marks on Jackson's arms. He said it's unusual not to find vein in males.
In 2007 Dr. Gordon spoke with Conrad Murray. He said Jackson was doing a show or something and wanted some more fillers on his face. It was on May 14, 2007, Dr. Murray arrived with Jackson at Dr. Gordon's office. "He walked in with Jackson, introduced himself and were there for Juvederm," he said. Dr. Murray wrote a personal check for $1,300 to Dr. Gordon for Jackson's procedure. Murray was present during the procedure. Dr. Gordon said he had never seen a personal physician pay for the treatment of a patient. They had a very close relationship and Conrad made it very clear that he was taking care of Jackson’s needs. "They might have been there for quite a while that day, fussing with the appearance," Dr. Gordon said. “He required a fair amount of codling," Dr. Gordon said. "At least he wanted to do under local anaesthesia, which was a progress." Dr. Gordon said he wasn't sure if Jackson didn't remember being there before or pretending to not remember. He said there wasn't really a doctor/patient because Dr. Murray was kind of the intermediary. The doctor said Jackson looked healthy in 2007, didn't change much in his appearance.
Dr. Gordon was kind of skeptical of Dr. Murray. Dr. Gordon said he never heard of cardiologist Dr. Conrad Murray before, and he knows several other cardiologists in Las Vegas. "He'd have me believe he had successful invasive cardiology practice in Las Vegas and Houston," Dr. Gordon said. "But if it he was that successful, why would he be someones personal physician?" Dr. Gordon questioned. "It seemed something he was telling me wasn't true" Dr Gordon said. "It's fair to say the whole situation was very odd and didn't add up. I felt that a successful cardiologist doesn't go around being somebody's personal physician and speaking for them," Dr. Gordon testified.
More details of Dr. David Adams testimony, an anaesthesiologist in Las Vegas. He administered Propofol to Jackson 4 times. In June 2008 Dr. Mark Tadrissi said he had a VIP patient coming in for a few procedures and if he was interested in doing anaesthesia. Dr. Adams scheduled a physical exam and the procedure happened a week later. "I realized the magnitude of who I was working with, I wanted to make sure he was healthy and there wouldn't be any problems" Dr Adams said. Dr. Tradissi scheduled the physical with Jackson. "They were cosmetic implants, dental implants, had a root canal," Dr. Adams said. "I never discuss really the drugs I'm going to use with the doctor," Dr. Adams said. Propofol is still the drug of choice.
Dr. Adams said Jackson was going to have a procedure and didn't want to know about it or feel anything. Dr. Tradissi introduced Jackson to him. "He said he had them (anaesthesia) before and he didn't have any problems. He seemed thin, pale, but otherwise no medical problems," Dr. Adams said. "I don't believe they weighed him." The entourage and bodyguards were never in the room when Jackson was being examined. It was just Dr. Adams and Jackson. He checked his chest, lungs and looked inside the mouth. Jackson was said to look, "Thin but muscular, healthy. Just pale." Jackson had an abnormally large tongue.
The artist said he wasn't taking any medication, only vitamins. Temperature was steady at 97F and stable all the way thru. 100 by 60 blood pressure. Procedure took about 2 hours. Dr. Adams gave Jackson Propofol. "I want to get this procedure done as soon as possible because of the unprotected airway. I'm not trying to put him to sleep, I just want him not to remember," Dr Adams said. Dr Tradissi gave him anaesthetic like Lidocaine as well. Dr. Adams said the amounts of Propofol he gave was the lowest he gives to patients. About 2 hours after the procedure, Jackson called to let Dr. Adams know he was ok. He said he was surprise Jackson himself called. Jackson said he was going to buy the house the sultan used to live. Dr. Adams said Jackson was very pleasant, polite, personable and very quiet. Dr. Adams said he didn't bill Jackson for any of the 4 procedures.
The second procedure was a month later, also at Dr. Tradissi. Dr. Adams said it was pretty much the same procedure as before. Dr. Adams said Jackson was perfectly happy with what had happened. First procedure was to take impression of dental. Second procedure was 3 Jun 08. Third procedure was on 18 Jun 08. Dr. Odabashian performed root canal.
The 4th procedure Dr. Adams performed was with oral surgeon Carlos Letilier. It was for screwing the 2 implants into Jackson's jaw. In the previous 3 procedures, Jackson asked not to give him narcotics. He just said he had a problem with them in the past, Dr. Adams didn't give him any, as requested. After the procedure was over Jackson asked for something for the pain. , the non-narcotic pain reliever Toradol was mentioned but Jackson said it wasn’t going to work and requested something stronger. Dr. Adams ended up giving Jackson Versed a morphine for the pain.
Dr. Adams met Murray in late March, early April 2009. This was at Dr. Murray's office. "Michael and Dr. Murray got out of the car, I got out of my car, we introduced ourselves to each other. I told Michael how ridiculous he looked because he had a scarf and he was all dressed in black and it was 1000 degrees outside. Usually he had a very relaxed look, maybe even pyjamas, but this time he had on a suit coat, a scarf, a hat.” Michael explained why he was doing the shows, “He says the only reason I'm doing this tour is because I want to prove to my kids that I'm the best entertainer in the world, and I'm not doing it for any other reason." Dr. Adams said he was wondering why Jackson wanted to talk to him.
He explained Dr. Murray excused himself and Jackson talked to him like an interview. "And he was telling me a little bit about him and how he felt and his family and different entertainers, we talked about an hour and a half." Dr. Adams said Jackson told him he wanted to build a children's hospital. He talked about his family, kids, everything. "We talked about Steven Spielberg, Bono, the tour. He didn't have good things to say about those people either." Dr. Adams described how Murray returned and was in the back of the office for 15 minutes talking to Jackson. "I go back to the office, Jackson and Murray walk back in and Murray really looked like he had just lost his best friend," Dr. Adams said. That's when Jackson tells Adams he'd like him to go on tour with him. "And do what? I don't sing, I really can't dance so to do what?" he told Jackson.
"I'd like for you to help me get rest," Dr. Adams said Michael told him. "Every once in a while I need an IV, and he said I just need you to help me get my rest. I'm thinking the guy's having a heart attack and they're asking me about going on tour. I couldn't even begin to fathom that,” said Adams. He had no idea what Jackson meant by helping him get his rest. Adams said he told them he didn't have license to practice in England. The doctor said Murray was truly upset with Jackson's request. “I never discussed Propofol with Dr. Murray or Michael Jackson," Dr. Adams testified. Dr. Adams said they didn't know how long the tour was going to last, they thought it might go to other countries after London. Adams was left to think about it. Dr. Adams said he texted Dr. Murray back asking what was going on and there was no response and no further communications at that point.
Jackson never asked Dr. Adams to do anything he thought was medically inappropriate? Dr. Adams said he never saw needle marks on Jackson's arms. "Very difficult veins to stick to," he said "Very muscular arms, very small veins." Sometimes Dr. Adams had to try 2-3 times to get an IV started, he said.
And that concluded his video deposition.