Bottas at Monza was particularly boring as he just drove in a straight line and the guy in front effectively cleared his route as they unsuccessfully tried to defend the inside. Multiple times.
If they even bothered to defend at all. The modern way is not to race everyone but just those cars the strategists say are the ones you are directly competing with on pace and in the championship. Let the faster cars cruise past so as not to lose time or burn your tires which could hurt your overall result.
If they even bothered to defend at all. The modern way is not to race everyone but just those cars the strategists say are the ones you are directly competing with on pace and in the championship. Let the faster cars cruise past so as not to lose time or burn your tires which could hurt your overall result.
Not that I'm defending what f1 is at the moment, but watch a race from the 80s and you see a very similar style of racing.
Keeping some sense of perspective, it was definitely a poor race compared to what we've become accustomed to, but if you went back a few years I reckon that would still have been one of the better ones. I think it is a reminder that the show is consistently a lot better today than it was 10-15 years ago.
I think these days though one of the problems is that when you've got a fast car out of position the "carving through the field" isn't anywhere nearly as interesting as it used to be because the DRS makes things so easy. Bottas at Monza was particularly boring as he just drove in a straight line and the guy in front effectively cleared his route as they unsuccessfully tried to defend the inside. Multiple times.
Likewise I don't think it was particularly interesting watching Rosberg's progress, albeit at least a couple of the moves were done from a reasonable distance back.
Agree. I know with the problems with overtaking in the past and they wanted to change things but you kinda miss the challenge/frustrations of a Coulthard 2001 Monaco or what not when it was harder to finish in the points let alone podiums if you were at the back of the grid. I was watching some of the 2003 races last week in some spare time and you got Justin Wilson fast starting his Minardi and for a lot of races was mid pack battling/holding up cars combined for at least a stint and it was in some ways more intersting than this surrender all attitude.
For all my early enthuasism of DRS and what not, it is waining a bit. If they have to have some boost thing, actually thinking out allowed - I liked the A1GP days have X number of boosts that can be used anytime in a race.
Yeah, they've been showing Aussie V8s all season, either live or delayed, schedule permitting. Watching it in HD has been a revelation after years of Motors. I wasn't sure what they'd do with Bathurst schedule wise, as such I wasn't overly surprised/disappointed when they missed the start. Thankfully good ol' Motors was there for that!
totally agree, it could have done with a few bumps or a crash.
races when all they do is drive round and round with nothing happening is so boring. when that happens they will lose viewers/fans...
While I argued here that crashes are 'part of the show' when they happen, I don't think motorsport is for you if you a think a race without crashes makes it boring...
Keeping some sense of perspective, it was definitely a poor race compared to what we've become accustomed to, but if you went back a few years I reckon that would still have been one of the better ones. I think it is a reminder that the show is consistently a lot better today than it was 10-15 years ago.
Those were my thoughts too. 10 year ago that race would have been considered pretty good!
For all my early enthuasism of DRS and what not, it is waining a bit. If they have to have some boost thing, actually thinking out allowed - I liked the A1GP days have X number of boosts that can be used anytime in a race.
Ugh, somehow that would feel even more artificial and arcade game like to me. How about having DRS slam shut as soon as the cars are alongside - it would have achieved its aim by that point by allowing the possibility of an overtake, rather than allow any extra advantage through the rest of the move.
I've watched plenty of races from the 80s and they're extremely dull IMO.
80s TV coverage was usually follow the leader or follow the local driver.
I have fond memories of watching from the trackside and it was a golden age of racing. A eurorail card and summers spent bumming around the racetracks from Paul Ricard to Austria, Hockenheim, Spa, Zandvoort and Monza.
It didn't help of course that the "wrong" tyres were taken for Sochi, which led to a safe race, which is one sense is a blessing after last week, but did lead to to a rather boring race.
Next Year when softer tyres are taken we will be able to judge how much of this years race was due to the tyre and how much due to the track.
According to Pirelli the Low degredation was more due to the track surface & that the super-soft's would still have suffered next to no degredation.
Ted Kravitz also mentioned something on the notebook about how the tarmac was unusually smooth because of the way it was laid & that it could be another year or 2 before the surface wears in & becomes more abrasive.
I think the biggest problem wasn't so much the lack of degredation but the fact that nobody was completely sure about what the tyres were going to do, So you had drivers managing the tyres when they didn't really need to. There was also the very high fuel consumption which had people backing off a bit.
I think that if they all knew 100% the tyres would last no problem & if fuel was less of an issue & they all pushed hard all race it may have been more interesting, But watching the various OnBoard feeds it was clear that beyond the 1st 6-7 laps (Which were actually very entertaining) everyone was taking it fairly steady on fuel/tyres.
Reminded me a bit of Monaco 2012 where there was a chance of rain late in the race & nobody wanted to have to stop for another set of dry's in-case the rain came so after the 1st stop they all went into cruise mode managing the tyres when it reality they didn't really need to as the rain didn't come.
80s TV coverage was usually follow the leader or follow the local driver.
I have fond memories of watching from the trackside and it was a golden age of racing. A eurorail card and summers spent bumming around the racetracks from Paul Ricard to Austria, Hockenheim, Spa, Zandvoort and Monza.
It's fun watching FOM Fan and Stef defend the indefensible...
We get it guys, you like to have contrary opinions, but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade and anyone who actually thinks that Russian GP was a decent spectacle or a race worth defending I'd have a massive question as to what they wanted out of motorsport, because Motor RACING it wasn't.
You had 3 laps of action but once Magnussen was back passed Vergne...that was all she wrote, racing wise and anyone who enjoyed it from then on must think Free Practice sessions are the highlight of the weekend and the rest of the weekend is spoilt by throwing the cars in competition with each other and not getting to see them lap on their own working through their own programme.
http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/ A useful resource for you kids who want to know how the BBC covered F1 in the 80s and early 90s.
Such nostalgia, excellent to see that, will probably spend hours on it and brings back so many memories as a kid growing up in the 60s and early 70s.
Remember to search for Grand Prix.
In the 70s we had a lot of coverage of motor sport in Grandstand and the great 'World Championship Motor Racing' programme with Raymond Baxter. Now he was a presenter that would shame the ones we have today.
We also used to have that in our Saturday morning cinema show just after the Lone Ranger and before the western and robin hood film
We did not have yellow markers then, but we did use to ring with coloured biro pens around the prog in radio times. Wish Id kept those old radio and tv times.
Next we will be talking about how they used to have an actual whole section dedicated to F1 on BBC Sports Personality of the Year - interviews with drivers and I can even remember a car being driven into the studio one year...ah history.
According to Pirelli the Low degredation was more due to the track surface & that the super-soft's would still have suffered next to no degredation.
Ted Kravitz also mentioned something on the notebook about how the tarmac was unusually smooth because of the way it was laid & that it could be another year or 2 before the surface wears in & becomes more abrasive.
I think the biggest problem wasn't so much the lack of degredation but the fact that nobody was completely sure about what the tyres were going to do, So you had drivers managing the tyres when they didn't really need to. There was also the very high fuel consumption which had people backing off a bit.
I think that if they all knew 100% the tyres would last no problem & if fuel was less of an issue & they all pushed hard all race it may have been more interesting, But watching the various OnBoard feeds it was clear that beyond the 1st 6-7 laps (Which were actually very entertaining) everyone was taking it fairly steady on fuel/tyres.
Reminded me a bit of Monaco 2012 where there was a chance of rain late in the race & nobody wanted to have to stop for another set of dry's in-case the rain came so after the 1st stop they all went into cruise mode managing the tyres when it reality they didn't really need to as the rain didn't come.
Point taken.
It shall still be interesting to see if next year(s) is a bit more exciting.
By the way how was it laid differently to other tracks, I would be interested to know.
Glad that BBC Genome is now available, I've been waiting a good while for this (it was announced years ago and has been available internally for a good while). Just randomly looking at all sorts, particularly rallying stuff, this on Friday 24/10/1997 stood out so far:
19.30 : Motormonth
In this edition of the motorsport roundup, Steve Rider is at the London Motor Show to see Mark Higgins collect the 1997 British Rally championship trophy. Deborah Tee travels to Los Angeles for the last PPG CART race of the year and finds out if the new California Speedway is as fast as racing driver Mark Blundell claims. Last in the current series.
Producer Ken Burton : Series producer
MarkWilkin Stereo.......................
I never knew CART got onto the BBC, even just as a feature on this show. Sadly I can't imagine a show like this being made by the BBC now... Also that night, Red Dwarf at 2100, Shooting Stars at 2130 and Have I Got News for You at 2200... BBC2's schedule was rather better/interesting in the late 90s than now!
EDIT: Just looking through the episodes of 'Motormonth', it seems good ol' D.I. Blundell had a regular video diary covering his CART season. I guess this helped to see him get his ITV Pundit role?
Glad that BBC Genome is now available, I've been waiting a good while for this (it was announced years ago and has been available internally for a good while). Just randomly looking at all sorts, particularly rallying stuff, this on Friday 24/10/1997 stood out so far:
I never knew CART got onto the BBC, even just as a feature on this show. Sadly I can't imagine a show like this being made by the BBC now... Also that night, Red Dwarf at 2100, Shooting Stars at 2130 and Have I Got News for You at 2200... BBC2's schedule was rather better/interesting in the late 90s than now!
EDIT: Just looking through the episodes of 'Motormonth', it seems good ol' D.I. Blundell had a regular video diary covering his CART season. I guess this helped to see him get his ITV Pundit role?
Comments
Not that I'm defending what f1 is at the moment, but watch a race from the 80s and you see a very similar style of racing.
Agree. I know with the problems with overtaking in the past and they wanted to change things but you kinda miss the challenge/frustrations of a Coulthard 2001 Monaco or what not when it was harder to finish in the points let alone podiums if you were at the back of the grid. I was watching some of the 2003 races last week in some spare time and you got Justin Wilson fast starting his Minardi and for a lot of races was mid pack battling/holding up cars combined for at least a stint and it was in some ways more intersting than this surrender all attitude.
For all my early enthuasism of DRS and what not, it is waining a bit. If they have to have some boost thing, actually thinking out allowed - I liked the A1GP days have X number of boosts that can be used anytime in a race.
Yeah, they've been showing Aussie V8s all season, either live or delayed, schedule permitting. Watching it in HD has been a revelation after years of Motors. I wasn't sure what they'd do with Bathurst schedule wise, as such I wasn't overly surprised/disappointed when they missed the start. Thankfully good ol' Motors was there for that!
While I argued here that crashes are 'part of the show' when they happen, I don't think motorsport is for you if you a think a race without crashes makes it boring...
Those were my thoughts too. 10 year ago that race would have been considered pretty good!
Ugh, somehow that would feel even more artificial and arcade game like to me. How about having DRS slam shut as soon as the cars are alongside - it would have achieved its aim by that point by allowing the possibility of an overtake, rather than allow any extra advantage through the rest of the move.
80s TV coverage was usually follow the leader or follow the local driver.
I have fond memories of watching from the trackside and it was a golden age of racing. A eurorail card and summers spent bumming around the racetracks from Paul Ricard to Austria, Hockenheim, Spa, Zandvoort and Monza.
Ted Kravitz also mentioned something on the notebook about how the tarmac was unusually smooth because of the way it was laid & that it could be another year or 2 before the surface wears in & becomes more abrasive.
I think the biggest problem wasn't so much the lack of degredation but the fact that nobody was completely sure about what the tyres were going to do, So you had drivers managing the tyres when they didn't really need to. There was also the very high fuel consumption which had people backing off a bit.
I think that if they all knew 100% the tyres would last no problem & if fuel was less of an issue & they all pushed hard all race it may have been more interesting, But watching the various OnBoard feeds it was clear that beyond the 1st 6-7 laps (Which were actually very entertaining) everyone was taking it fairly steady on fuel/tyres.
Reminded me a bit of Monaco 2012 where there was a chance of rain late in the race & nobody wanted to have to stop for another set of dry's in-case the rain came so after the 1st stop they all went into cruise mode managing the tyres when it reality they didn't really need to as the rain didn't come.
Yep...them were the days alright.
Jp
We get it guys, you like to have contrary opinions, but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade and anyone who actually thinks that Russian GP was a decent spectacle or a race worth defending I'd have a massive question as to what they wanted out of motorsport, because Motor RACING it wasn't.
You had 3 laps of action but once Magnussen was back passed Vergne...that was all she wrote, racing wise and anyone who enjoyed it from then on must think Free Practice sessions are the highlight of the weekend and the rest of the weekend is spoilt by throwing the cars in competition with each other and not getting to see them lap on their own working through their own programme.
Worst. Race. Ever*
(*this season ; ) )
They didn't take the F1 seriously then apart from the British Grand Prix.
Such nostalgia, excellent to see that, will probably spend hours on it and brings back so many memories as a kid growing up in the 60s and early 70s.
Remember to search for Grand Prix.
In the 70s we had a lot of coverage of motor sport in Grandstand and the great 'World Championship Motor Racing' programme with Raymond Baxter. Now he was a presenter that would shame the ones we have today.
We also used to have that in our Saturday morning cinema show just after the Lone Ranger and before the western and robin hood film
We did not have yellow markers then, but we did use to ring with coloured biro pens around the prog in radio times. Wish Id kept those old radio and tv times.
Found this, probably watched but too long ago to remember, was 13 then.
The Grand Prix Night of the Stars, BBC One London, 15 July 1976 20.00
http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/7e5cb716cd714677bebbaf1bd070c973
Be great to see that.
Slightly off topic but Genome, why not Radio times archive? Weird.
I'll dig out my two boxes worth of F1 tapes - see if it looks any more intresting!
Point taken.
It shall still be interesting to see if next year(s) is a bit more exciting.
By the way how was it laid differently to other tracks, I would be interested to know.
I never knew CART got onto the BBC, even just as a feature on this show. Sadly I can't imagine a show like this being made by the BBC now... Also that night, Red Dwarf at 2100, Shooting Stars at 2130 and Have I Got News for You at 2200... BBC2's schedule was rather better/interesting in the late 90s than now!
EDIT: Just looking through the episodes of 'Motormonth', it seems good ol' D.I. Blundell had a regular video diary covering his CART season. I guess this helped to see him get his ITV Pundit role?
EDIT2: In the September episode they previewed the Bathurst 1000! http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/cb209fed6de0422fba70513fad877712
Cart highlights used to be on channel 5 in the 200x's
Yeah, I know. ITV showed it in the early 90s. I just never knew the BBC ever had any coverage of it.
The BBC showed the two races at Rockingham in full.
http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/schedules/bbctwo/england/2001-09-23
http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/schedules/bbctwo/england/2002-09-15
"Presented by Suzi Perry and Mark Blundell"
"Presented by Charlie Cox and Johnny Herbert"
Some recognisable names there!
Now I really wish that site had a "play" button!