To depart from the nether regions of underwear, ahem, how many of you think:
1) Mrs Tishell will be seen in S6?
2) Louisa and Martin be married straight away in the new season?
3) Martin will actually leave surgery in his past and stay as the GP of Portwenn?
4) Pauline Lamb return to the village?
5) And for that matter, will we see LG's mum or her dad back on the scene?
1. I don't think Mrs. Tishell will be back. DM might not have her charged with kidnapping, but he would almost certainly feel obligated to report her to whatever authority licenses chemists. She might perhaps return after treatment and on probation, in real life, but I think in this series, her story line is done.
2. I interpret Martin Clunes' cagey-ish statements about their marriage "to start off, they'll be married, I think" and "I think they'll probably marry -- we've tried everything else" to suggest that the marriage will come earlier rather than later in the series. Whether that's a good thing or not in terms of where they are in their relationship, I don't know. They will be cohabiting, sometimes disastrously but one hopes, not predominately so.
3. I also am concerned about the legal implications of breaking his contract with Imperial. They may be willing to let him off the hook if the surgeon from Durban has worked out and wants to stay. Actually, it is quite unrealistic that after a lay-off of about five years, give or take, that he would be hired back on as head of vascular surgery in the first place. So, if that piece of magical thinking can happen, why not the same magic to the legal complications of ditching the job? I think it's entirely possible that London wont' be mentioned again, except in the same sort of dismissive couple of sentences that Pauline and Mark got in the first episode in which they didn't appear.
However, perhaps there is some middle ground WRT his surgery career -- they could get a partner for the GP practice and he could be a part-time consultant at Truro. Or something else could be worked out, if that whole issue is still relevant. And I just don't know whether it will be.
4. Pauline will not return as a series regular, and doubtful as a guest appearance. I just think that Katherine Parkinson has moved on (she's cast in something else now, I think).
5. Neither will any of the grandparents. There's a tendency in this series that once someone vanishes, theyre' pretty much gone for good.
6. Edith has served her purpose -- I don't think we'll see any more of her.
One thing that Martin Clunes often repeats is his desire to keep the series "fresh." I think that's why once a story line is worked out, the characters don't come back. There's no point in seeing Mrs. Tishell have a crush on DM anymore, b/c we know how that worked out. Similarly with Edith -- he's rejected her, and all the vamping in the world that she might try won't now make any difference and would just be repetitive.
At any rate, that's how i see things at this point.
I hope we are going to keep track of these guesses!
3. I also am concerned about the legal implications of breaking his contract with Imperial. They may be willing to let him off the hook if the surgeon from Durban has worked out and wants to stay. Actually, it is quite unrealistic that after a lay-off of about five years, give or take, that he would be hired back on as head of vascular surgery in the first place. So, if that piece of magical thinking can happen, why not the same magic to the legal complications of ditching the job? I think it's entirely possible that London wont' be mentioned again, except in the same sort of dismissive couple of sentences that Pauline and Mark got in the first episode in which they didn't appear.
However, perhaps there is some middle ground WRT his surgery career -- they could get a partner for the GP practice and he could be a part-time consultant at Truro. Or something else could be worked out, if that whole issue is still relevant. And I just don't know whether it will be.
If the powers that be at Imperial did not think he was fully capable of filling the job requirements and still was as brilliant and gifted as he once was they would have never offered him the job in the first place. They don't hire washed up old hacks to fill a job like that or 'roll the dice' on someone who is questionable in any way, they hire only the very best to fill the post of a department head at one of the most prestigious medical facilities in the world.
As to the issue being 'relevant'-it is the very foundation of the series and without it both the character and the show loses alot of its edge and strays into the realm of run of the mill romantic comedy. If they were operating under the storyline as presented in the Sky movies it would be easy to ditch the surgeon part. Dr. Martin Bamford never wanted to be an obstetrician, he always wanted to be a GP. His wife forced him into being an obstetrician so they could be rich.
If the powers that be at Imperial did not think he was fully capable of filling the job requirements and still was as brilliant and gifted as he once was they would have never offered him the job in the first place. They don't hire washed up old hacks to fill a job like that or 'roll the dice' on someone who is questionable in any way, they hire only the very best to fill the post of a department head at one of the most prestigious medical facilities in the world.
As to the issue being 'relevant'-it is the very foundation of the series and without it both the character and the show loses alot of its edge and strays into the realm of run of the mill romantic comedy. If they were operating under the storyline as presented in the Sky movies it would be easy to ditch the surgeon part. Dr. Martin Bamford never wanted to be an obstetrician, he always wanted to be a GP. His wife forced him into being an obstetrician so they could be rich.
Of course that's right, Adelie. We're certainly meant to think that they think so. I'm just saying -- as I think some other medical professionals have said here at different times -- that the process of Imperial's hiring decision, as much as we saw of it -- had a decidedly ad-hoc air about it, that doesn't seem real world realistic to me. I would think in real life they would want some retraining, some hands-on evidence that his surgical skills were not rusty, that he had kept up with developments and so on.
As for the foundation of the series being his lost surgical career --- well, for the first three series it was not in the foreground except as the reason he came down to Portwenn with his tail between his legs as Elaine so nicely put it. His desire/decision to return to surgery surfaces in S4 as a way to drive the plot, and also as a plot point in S5. To me, at least.
You may be right -- they may still be discussing whether he or they will go off to London, or Martin will commute to London for a period, or other options. And I have no opinion at all as to whether I want him to resume his surgical career in any fashion -- I'm just trying to guess as to what the show-runners have in view. And could well be wrong.
Hey, I just went to the docmartinstore.com, and they've updated their site too! But, even though the letter about the show is different, it still says that their getting ready to film Series 5. You can sign up to receive their newsletter, and you have to log in. Looks like merchandise is still the same.
Having just rewatched S4E1 with Biff, I feel very certain that the Buddha in DM's surgery was given to him by Edith. Notice that as soon as she sees it, she immediately goes to it, picks it up, holds it gently and mentions it goes back 20 years. DM's face is one of affectionate remembrance.
We learn in S4 that DM has an exceptional capacity to meditate; he heals his hemophilia by doing so. I believe it's a talent he used before, when he was a developing surgeon. He very well meditated then, to visualize the surgery, the patient, the operation, and become the master of the operating theatre he apparently quickly evolved into.
Since he was dating Edith back then, she would have known and probably seen him meditating, perhaps in their shared living space. It would have been a very pertinent in-joke to give him the Buddha, in reference to that meditation. It was a sentimental artifact of their relationship and his old lover, perhaps his only lover, and he always kept it. In the car, as he is moving away, then, we see it representing his old love for Edith, apparently winning out over his newer love for LG and their soon to be child. Until LG enters a crisis situation.
Also, in this episode, we hear Bert referring to an old sheep he used to own, while he is waiting to be seen by the doctor. We can only assume that by now he has lost his home, his land and his sheep which he had in the first season and must refer to the sheep in the past tense. Thus, nothing holds him back from becoming bankrupt next season. And, if Bert lost all of that between S1 and S4, we can certainly agree with Al that he is completely and utterly hopeless in organizing his finances.
I wonder if he sold all that as the capital for setting up the restaurant? He must have needed some serious money to get started.
Last, as a physician, I have no idea where the medical advisor was for this episode. He must have been drunk out of his gourd reading the script and watching it filmed. It's literally impossible to do surgery on a patient with confirming their medical situation; that is so far-fetched it is simply too hard to believe. Let alone, we had to add in that after DM had his hand apparently stitched up by a competent nurse, it's immediately bleeding through into his bandage, showing the stitches hadn't held. Seriously, nothing irritates a real doc more than seeing that sort of fake and lame medical mishap. Edith and the nurse are shown to be even more incompetent than Dr. Dibbs! At least she wasn't going to unnecessarily operate on someone!
To depart from the nether regions of underwear, ahem, how many of you think:
1) Mrs Tishell will be seen in S6?
2) Louisa and Martin be married straight away in the new season?
3) Martin will actually leave surgery in his past and stay as the GP of Portwenn?
4) Pauline Lamb return to the village?
5) And for that matter, will we see LG's mum or her dad back on the scene?
Great questions, Rob! I must say there is a disparity between what I want to happen and what I think will happen. Here goes:
1. I don't think Mrs. T will be back, but I want her back as the Doc's receptionist. Remember, we're in Portwenn!
2. It sounds like the wedding will happen early in the series, but, instead, I want them to wait to first show some mutual understanding and the progression in the relationship.
3. I think they'll have some kind of "go" at London or elsewhere, but return to Portwenn. I'm happy with whatever they decide as long as its truly mutual.
4. I want Pauline back (miss her spunk and Al is so lonely), but don't think she'll return. Would be ironic if she came back as his nurse, the area midwife, or even his practice manager!
5. I don't think we'll see either of Louisa's parents, but I would like to see Eleanor back. Interesting if they were both back together and dating or cohabiting, some kind of mirror image of the Doc and Louisa.
Bottom line, I'm all in. I want EVERYONE back, including Stuart (and Anthony), Mark, Roger, Caroline, Mrs. Wilson, Danny, Chris, Aunt Joan (don't know how they do this?!?, Edith at the Doc's hospital, Peter Cronk, and the Doc's horrible parents. A very full village, a very full S6 - necessitating, of course, S7! :D:D
Having just rewatched S4E1 with Biff, I feel very certain that the Buddha in DM's surgery was given to him by Edith. Notice that as soon as she sees it, she immediately goes to it, picks it up, holds it gently and mentions it goes back 20 years. DM's face is one of affectionate remembrance.
We learn in S4 that DM has an exceptional capacity to meditate; he heals his hemophilia by doing so. I believe it's a talent he used before, when he was a developing surgeon. He very well meditated then, to visualize the surgery, the patient, the operation, and become the master of the operating theatre he apparently quickly evolved into.
Since he was dating Edith back then, she would have known and probably seen him meditating, perhaps in their shared living space. It would have been a very pertinent in-joke to give him the Buddha, in reference to that meditation. It was a sentimental artifact of their relationship and his old lover, perhaps his only lover, and he always kept it. In the car, as he is moving away, then, we see it representing his old love for Edith, apparently winning out over his newer love for LG and their soon to be child. Until LG enters a crisis situation.
Also, in this episode, we hear Bert referring to an old sheep he used to own, while he is waiting to be seen by the doctor. We can only assume that by now he has lost his home, his land and his sheep which he had in the first season and must refer to the sheep in the past tense. Thus, nothing holds him back from becoming bankrupt next season. And, if Bert lost all of that between S1 and S4, we can certainly agree with Al that he is completely and utterly hopeless in organizing his finances.
I wonder if he sold all that as the capital for setting up the restaurant? He must have needed some serious money to get started.
Last, as a physician, I have no idea where the medical advisor was for this episode. He must have been drunk out of his gourd reading the script and watching it filmed. It's literally impossible to do surgery on a patient with confirming their medical situation; that is so far-fetched it is simply too hard to believe. Let alone, we had to add in that after DM had his hand apparently stitched up by a competent nurse, it's immediately bleeding through into his bandage, showing the stitches hadn't held. Seriously, nothing irritates a real doc more than seeing that sort of fake and lame medical mishap. Edith and the nurse are shown to be even more incompetent than Dr. Dibbs! At least she wasn't going to unnecessarily operate on someone!
What I think that we see DM doing in S4 as a way to conquer his blood phobia is pretty straightforward cognitive-behavioral techniques that are in general use, in fact considered best practice, to treat phobias -- he's using a process of desensitization that has some elements of guided imagery, plus step by step exposure to facing his fears and staying in the moment with them until his panic subsides. Dr. Milligan has nicely sent him a DVD with instructions. Generally, the person starts by making a list of stimuli ranging from barely tolerable to those he thinks will absolutely send him over the edge, and then they work up the ladder, facing each stimuili in increasing order of dread, until they can tolerate the very worst they can initially imagine, and then some. Over-training is very important, and relapse is likely unless the protocol is followed.
(Things may have changed since I was trained and in practice a decade ago, but I don't think they have much.)
DM never mentioned marriage in S5 but did mention a christening going so far as to scheduling the rite. I am wondering if there would be a combination of both marriage and christening, although LG seemed to make it clear she did not want to marry him, and now that S6 is about to start and they have calmed down since the kidnapping incident, can they both talk rationally about how to go forth?
Oh, NewPark, thanks for bringing it up. I had added a sentence about in William and Mary which on re-reading did not apply.
My question briefly to poorrichard54 was:. . .putting aside your personal views but only as it pertains to DM/LG. . . .Now he scheduled the christening of JH without consulting LG - I have always felt that DM was not a religious man, but when it comes to marriage and christening rites he is right there as a devout person and wants these ceremonies to be done proper in a church of God.
Again, thank you, poorrichard54's answer has always stuck in my mind to the point where I had marked it down for future reference.
What I think that we see DM doing in S4 as a way to conquer his blood phobia is pretty straightforward cognitive-behavioral techniques that are in general use, in fact considered best practice, to treat phobias -- he's using a process of desensitization that has some elements of guided imagery, plus step by step exposure to facing his fears and staying in the moment with them until his panic subsides. Dr. Milligan has nicely sent him a DVD with instructions. Generally, the person starts by making a list of stimuli ranging from barely tolerable to those he thinks will absolutely send him over the edge, and then they work up the ladder, facing each stimuili in increasing order of dread, until they can tolerate the very worst they can initially imagine, and then some. Over-training is very important, and relapse is likely unless the protocol is followed.
(Things may have changed since I was trained and in practice a decade ago, but I don't think they have much.)
Not quite, NewPark. It's obvious DM is spending a lot of time meditating over that DVD, visualizing his ability to do surgery and be comfortable with the blood, and then attempting to actually do it outside his mind. We see him setting up to listen to that DVD more than once. We are made to understand he is often listening to it. That's meditation of a sort; a type of guided imagery.
There it is, Marchrand. Thanks for reminding us -- it is a wonderful post, though long.
(I see you deleted your entry before I replied. Thank goodness for a rational explanation of why I couldn't quote it.)
I think PoorRichard's long (very long) reply does apply to what we've been talking about -- as in will they marry, and when.
That is a great post by PoorRichard. Thank you Marchrand for reminding us of it and NewPark for providing the link. I think he/she makes a great case for why they will marry in series 6, and I agree with it. I think (hope?) that BP realizes they have taken the will-they/won't-they plot line as far as they can - as MC has said about other story lines and characters. It is time they took that step, IMO. The only way to avoid the marriage, in my belief, is for the show to lose Louisa's character. In the past I have thought they may so that. However, after re-reading some of MC's remarks about CC, I don't think he would want to do the show without her at this point.
Not quite, NewPark. It's obvious DM is spending a lot of time meditating over that DVD, visualizing his ability to do surgery and be comfortable with the blood, and then attempting to actually do it outside his mind. We see him setting up to listen to that DVD more than once. We are made to understand he is often listening to it. That's meditation of a sort; a type of guided imagery.
I think we are stressing different things. You cannot actually deal with a phobia without real life exposure to what provokes that anxiety. The practice that is taught is staying in the moment with your fear, noticing them, observing your different physiological reactions, a kind of mindfulness meditation on what is happening, until the anxiety subsides, which it almost always does, after a period of time, if the desensitization is proceeding properly, along the aforesaid "ladder."
It's actually very interesting (to me at least). The person is specifically taught NOT to relax, not to use distracting techniques, but to expose himself to his anxiety and learn by experience that these physiological reactions can be tolerated and will subside.
But I think we may be having a difference in terms -- when I think about meditation, I think about a mindfulness practice, where the object is really to empty your mind, or observe thoughts and let them go. (often accompanied by breathing practices and a "mantra." ) I've never been able to get into that but lots of people swear by it. But I don't think of guided imagery or visualization by the name of meditation. Am happy to be enlightened about it, though.
To depart from the nether regions of underwear, ahem, how many of you think:
1) Mrs Tishell will be seen in S6?
2) Louisa and Martin be married straight away in the new season?
3) Martin will actually leave surgery in his past and stay as the GP of Portwenn?
4) Pauline Lamb return to the village?
5) And for that matter, will we see LG's mum or her dad back on the scene?
What I want:
1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes
4. Yes
5. No
What may actually happen:
1. I still say yes, even though I'm still worried by the ITV press release that specifically mentions the return of Bert, Al, Morwenna, and Penhale, with no mention of Mrs T. Several people have said it may be halfway into the series. That could be the trick. In the Behind the Scenes stuff filmed during and after filming of S5 E8, Selina Cadell seemed pretty certain she'd be back for the next series.
2. Yes. I'm basing this not only on what I've been wanting to happen since I saw the end of S5 but also on MC's comments. IMO, they need to simply get 'er done, so to speak, get that danged wedding out of the way so they can move on with S6.
3. This one's tricky. I so hope they move away from the London or no London plotline that's been dragging on forever (well, for S4 & 5). I'm just sick to death of it and have a feeling, if they want to move this sucker forward, MC/PB/BP will see that too. I suspect that for now this will be settled. He'll remain in PW as GP. That's not to say that at the end of this series, or at the end of S7, or at the end of whatever series we're all watching while we sit drooling in retirement homes this isn't the way it's all finally wrapped up and brought to a tidy end. The family drives off in the sunset toward London.
4. No. I wish Pauline would come back, if only for a one-off, but logic tells me it won't happen.
5. No. Louise Jameson recently said she won't be in S6. No idea about dear old dad, but I don't think we'll ever see him again.
There it is, Marchrand. Thanks for reminding us -- it is a wonderful post, though long.
(I see you deleted your entry before I replied. Thank goodness for a rational explanation of why I couldn't quote it.)
I think PoorRichard's long (very long) reply does apply to what we've been talking about -- as in will they marry, and when.
Wow! Thanks Marchrand and NewPark for bringing that all up again. Great reading that long post a second time. I really miss PoorRichard and hope she is ok - her last post was that her cat had died and I have been quite worried that we never heard from her after that.
I have taken MC at his word that a wedding would be very early in S6, and re-reading that post gives me good reasons why it could happen that way. One thing that I don't think she mentioned (unless I missed it) was how Martin immediately offered to marry Louisa when he found out she was pregnant. I think the moral compass that Martin and Louisa both seem to have sends them in one of two directions. Either they go their separate ways and co-parent James from afar or they marry and have a traditional family. I think they are both traditional people and not a couple who would raise their son in a committed relationship without being married. The relationship in S5 was all pretty temporary. They were living in the same house to co-parent their infant son, but he was on the verge of leaving soon. When Louisa made the decision to go with him to London I think it may have signaled a change in their relationship, but before they could even think about what it would mean they had two of their inevitable Portwenn interruptions: Buddy jumping on the bed and her mother's arrival (which I liken to a nuclear bomb :eek:).
I wonder how many of us remember the famous On the Waterfront scene when Marlon Brando says that to his brother, who has made him take a dive in a prize-fight.
So in S4E3, we have Joe saying to his brother: "You could have been a contender."
Which makes me wonder how many other iconic film references are scattered throughout the series. I'm not in any sense a film buff, so can't really tell, though I have seen a reference in a review of the series to the effect that they do make allusions to other films.
I wonder how many of us remember the famous On the Waterfront scene when Marlon Brando says that to his brother, who has made him take a dive in a prize-fight.
So in S4E3, we have Joe saying to his brother: "You could have been a contender."
Which makes me wonder how many other iconic film references are scattered throughout the series. I'm not in any sense a film buff, so can't really tell, though I have seen a reference in a review of the series to the effect that they do make allusions to other films.
I commented earlier that the phrase DM uses in talking with Uncle Jimmy about his sexuality - 'not that there is anything wrong with that' - is a phrase from a Seinfeld episode.
And I wondered if DMs comments about 'the cupboard under the stairs' was a reference to Harry Potter.
Wow! Thanks Marchrand and NewPark for bringing that all up again. Great reading that long post a second time. I really miss PoorRichard and hope she is ok - her last post was that her cat had died and I have been quite worried that we never heard from her after that.
I have taken MC at his word that a wedding would be very early in S6, and re-reading that post gives me good reasons why it could happen that way. One thing that I don't think she mentioned (unless I missed it) was how Martin immediately offered to marry Louisa when he found out she was pregnant. I think the moral compass that Martin and Louisa both seem to have sends them in one of two directions. Either they go their separate ways and co-parent James from afar or they marry and have a traditional family. I think they are both traditional people and not a couple who would raise their son in a committed relationship without being married. The relationship in S5 was all pretty temporary. They were living in the same house to co-parent their infant son, but he was on the verge of leaving soon. When Louisa made the decision to go with him to London I think it may have signaled a change in their relationship, but before they could even think about what it would mean they had two of their inevitable Portwenn interruptions: Buddy jumping on the bed and her mother's arrival (which I liken to a nuclear bomb :eek:).
Thanks for this link, for those of us new to the forum this was very interesting reading.
It is interesting that even a minister sees their relationship as being built on some morality even though it is outside the confines of religious practice. Other than Uncle Jimmy in the restaurant and one reference Louisa makes to the (London) 'school not liking this' - overall the village is very accepting of the situation between DM and LG. Perhaps it is just part of the go with the flow attitude that Bert refers to. It is as though the village expects and so accepts the pregnancy and cohabitation. Recall that there is a scene after the birth when they are going to the village shops and Mrs T makes some very nasty comments and the shopkeeper calls her on it.
As for the wedding question - I certainly hope there is a wedding as the relationship of DM to JH and LG is his lifeline. As mentioned, JH is not legally an Ellingham and this question needs to be resolved for the good of the storyline. DM has purged himself of some demons at the castle and those need a complete burial. A complete and legal relationship to Louisa and in particular to the baby is a life-saving necessary step for DM.
I wonder how many of us remember the famous On the Waterfront scene when Marlon Brando says that to his brother, who has made him take a dive in a prize-fight.
So in S4E3, we have Joe saying to his brother: "You could have been a contender."
Which makes me wonder how many other iconic film references are scattered throughout the series. I'm not in any sense a film buff, so can't really tell, though I have seen a reference in a review of the series to the effect that they do make allusions to other films.
RE: Not that there is anything wrong with that S4E2
"The Outing" is the 57th episode of the sitcom Seinfeld. It is the 17th episode of the fourth season, and first aired on February 11, 1993.
The line "...Not that there's anything wrong with that", as a reference to homosexuality, has become a popular catchphrase among fans.
Jason Alexander (George) maintains that it is the most popular to originate from the series
Love this quote from an article I found in the media section of the new version of DocMartinonline "Martin Clunes Entertainer Extraordinarie."
There is a sad little boy living inside Doc Martin who doesn't know how to give or receive love; that is what has been revealed in the plot and Martin Clunes' acting as the lead character, Dr. Martin Ellingham. There is a neediness in his portrayal of Doc Martin that is as endearing as it is troublesome. It is why Louisa Glasson's character is attracted to him yet repelled. Louisa is in the daily company of little boys in her job as a teacher. She doesn't want an adult relationship with the little boy, but she is physically attracted to Martin. That is one tiny fragment of the many well written conflicts within the story line.
Reminds me of the Martin Clunes quote in an article in the New Zealand Listener (when he was down under filming "The Man who Lost his Head" that DM is "isolated, a terribly fragile house of cards." He adds something like, he made himself up at a young age in order to shut out emotional abuse from others.
Love this quote from an article I found in the media section of the new version of DocMartinonline "Martin Clunes Entertainer Extraordinarie."
There is a sad little boy living inside Doc Martin who doesn't know how to give or receive love; that is what has been revealed in the plot and Martin Clunes' acting as the lead character, Dr. Martin Ellingham. There is a neediness in his portrayal of Doc Martin that is as endearing as it is troublesome. It is why Louisa Glasson's character is attracted to him yet repelled. Louisa is in the daily company of little boys in her job as a teacher. She doesn't want an adult relationship with the little boy, but she is physically attracted to Martin. That is one tiny fragment of the many well written conflicts within the story line.
Reminds me of the Martin Clunes quote in an article in the New Zealand Listener (when he was down under filming "The Man who Lost his Head" that DM is "isolated, a terribly fragile house of cards." He adds something like, he made himself up at a young age in order to shut out emotional abuse from others.
If you read about Martin Clunes' childhood there are distinct parallels with a certain GP.
My wife is reading "Kinsey and Me" by Sue Grafton. She reveals similar things about herself and her fictional detective Kinsey Millhone.
For an actor, or writer, to be able to draw on those experiences must be both empowering and scary.
If you read about Martin Clunes' childhood there are distinct parallels with a certain GP.
My wife is reading "Kinsey and Me" by Sue Grafton. She reveals similar things about herself and her fictional detective Kinsey Millhone.
For an actor, or writer, to be able to draw on those experiences must be both empowering and scary.
Robspace54 - thanks for the heads up on Sue Grafton. I have all of her books through U but was a bit disappointed in the last couple. Not sure who changed Kinsey, Sue, or me. The time frame of nearly 30 years does allow a bit of that on all fronts so maybe each of us changed.
Comments
Daniel Craig
Martin Clunes
BTW, hope that Daniel Craig does NOT go ahead with his plan to get his ears pinned back!
1. I don't think Mrs. Tishell will be back. DM might not have her charged with kidnapping, but he would almost certainly feel obligated to report her to whatever authority licenses chemists. She might perhaps return after treatment and on probation, in real life, but I think in this series, her story line is done.
2. I interpret Martin Clunes' cagey-ish statements about their marriage "to start off, they'll be married, I think" and "I think they'll probably marry -- we've tried everything else" to suggest that the marriage will come earlier rather than later in the series. Whether that's a good thing or not in terms of where they are in their relationship, I don't know. They will be cohabiting, sometimes disastrously but one hopes, not predominately so.
3. I also am concerned about the legal implications of breaking his contract with Imperial. They may be willing to let him off the hook if the surgeon from Durban has worked out and wants to stay. Actually, it is quite unrealistic that after a lay-off of about five years, give or take, that he would be hired back on as head of vascular surgery in the first place. So, if that piece of magical thinking can happen, why not the same magic to the legal complications of ditching the job? I think it's entirely possible that London wont' be mentioned again, except in the same sort of dismissive couple of sentences that Pauline and Mark got in the first episode in which they didn't appear.
However, perhaps there is some middle ground WRT his surgery career -- they could get a partner for the GP practice and he could be a part-time consultant at Truro. Or something else could be worked out, if that whole issue is still relevant. And I just don't know whether it will be.
4. Pauline will not return as a series regular, and doubtful as a guest appearance. I just think that Katherine Parkinson has moved on (she's cast in something else now, I think).
5. Neither will any of the grandparents. There's a tendency in this series that once someone vanishes, theyre' pretty much gone for good.
6. Edith has served her purpose -- I don't think we'll see any more of her.
One thing that Martin Clunes often repeats is his desire to keep the series "fresh." I think that's why once a story line is worked out, the characters don't come back. There's no point in seeing Mrs. Tishell have a crush on DM anymore, b/c we know how that worked out. Similarly with Edith -- he's rejected her, and all the vamping in the world that she might try won't now make any difference and would just be repetitive.
At any rate, that's how i see things at this point.
I hope we are going to keep track of these guesses!
If the powers that be at Imperial did not think he was fully capable of filling the job requirements and still was as brilliant and gifted as he once was they would have never offered him the job in the first place. They don't hire washed up old hacks to fill a job like that or 'roll the dice' on someone who is questionable in any way, they hire only the very best to fill the post of a department head at one of the most prestigious medical facilities in the world.
As to the issue being 'relevant'-it is the very foundation of the series and without it both the character and the show loses alot of its edge and strays into the realm of run of the mill romantic comedy. If they were operating under the storyline as presented in the Sky movies it would be easy to ditch the surgeon part. Dr. Martin Bamford never wanted to be an obstetrician, he always wanted to be a GP. His wife forced him into being an obstetrician so they could be rich.
Of course that's right, Adelie. We're certainly meant to think that they think so. I'm just saying -- as I think some other medical professionals have said here at different times -- that the process of Imperial's hiring decision, as much as we saw of it -- had a decidedly ad-hoc air about it, that doesn't seem real world realistic to me. I would think in real life they would want some retraining, some hands-on evidence that his surgical skills were not rusty, that he had kept up with developments and so on.
As for the foundation of the series being his lost surgical career --- well, for the first three series it was not in the foreground except as the reason he came down to Portwenn with his tail between his legs as Elaine so nicely put it. His desire/decision to return to surgery surfaces in S4 as a way to drive the plot, and also as a plot point in S5. To me, at least.
You may be right -- they may still be discussing whether he or they will go off to London, or Martin will commute to London for a period, or other options. And I have no opinion at all as to whether I want him to resume his surgical career in any fashion -- I'm just trying to guess as to what the show-runners have in view. And could well be wrong.
Having just rewatched S4E1 with Biff, I feel very certain that the Buddha in DM's surgery was given to him by Edith. Notice that as soon as she sees it, she immediately goes to it, picks it up, holds it gently and mentions it goes back 20 years. DM's face is one of affectionate remembrance.
We learn in S4 that DM has an exceptional capacity to meditate; he heals his hemophilia by doing so. I believe it's a talent he used before, when he was a developing surgeon. He very well meditated then, to visualize the surgery, the patient, the operation, and become the master of the operating theatre he apparently quickly evolved into.
Since he was dating Edith back then, she would have known and probably seen him meditating, perhaps in their shared living space. It would have been a very pertinent in-joke to give him the Buddha, in reference to that meditation. It was a sentimental artifact of their relationship and his old lover, perhaps his only lover, and he always kept it. In the car, as he is moving away, then, we see it representing his old love for Edith, apparently winning out over his newer love for LG and their soon to be child. Until LG enters a crisis situation.
Also, in this episode, we hear Bert referring to an old sheep he used to own, while he is waiting to be seen by the doctor. We can only assume that by now he has lost his home, his land and his sheep which he had in the first season and must refer to the sheep in the past tense. Thus, nothing holds him back from becoming bankrupt next season. And, if Bert lost all of that between S1 and S4, we can certainly agree with Al that he is completely and utterly hopeless in organizing his finances.
I wonder if he sold all that as the capital for setting up the restaurant? He must have needed some serious money to get started.
Last, as a physician, I have no idea where the medical advisor was for this episode. He must have been drunk out of his gourd reading the script and watching it filmed. It's literally impossible to do surgery on a patient with confirming their medical situation; that is so far-fetched it is simply too hard to believe. Let alone, we had to add in that after DM had his hand apparently stitched up by a competent nurse, it's immediately bleeding through into his bandage, showing the stitches hadn't held. Seriously, nothing irritates a real doc more than seeing that sort of fake and lame medical mishap. Edith and the nurse are shown to be even more incompetent than Dr. Dibbs! At least she wasn't going to unnecessarily operate on someone!
Great questions, Rob! I must say there is a disparity between what I want to happen and what I think will happen. Here goes:
1. I don't think Mrs. T will be back, but I want her back as the Doc's receptionist. Remember, we're in Portwenn!
2. It sounds like the wedding will happen early in the series, but, instead, I want them to wait to first show some mutual understanding and the progression in the relationship.
3. I think they'll have some kind of "go" at London or elsewhere, but return to Portwenn. I'm happy with whatever they decide as long as its truly mutual.
4. I want Pauline back (miss her spunk and Al is so lonely), but don't think she'll return. Would be ironic if she came back as his nurse, the area midwife, or even his practice manager!
5. I don't think we'll see either of Louisa's parents, but I would like to see Eleanor back. Interesting if they were both back together and dating or cohabiting, some kind of mirror image of the Doc and Louisa.
Bottom line, I'm all in. I want EVERYONE back, including Stuart (and Anthony), Mark, Roger, Caroline, Mrs. Wilson, Danny, Chris, Aunt Joan (don't know how they do this?!?, Edith at the Doc's hospital, Peter Cronk, and the Doc's horrible parents. A very full village, a very full S6 - necessitating, of course, S7!
What I think that we see DM doing in S4 as a way to conquer his blood phobia is pretty straightforward cognitive-behavioral techniques that are in general use, in fact considered best practice, to treat phobias -- he's using a process of desensitization that has some elements of guided imagery, plus step by step exposure to facing his fears and staying in the moment with them until his panic subsides. Dr. Milligan has nicely sent him a DVD with instructions. Generally, the person starts by making a list of stimuli ranging from barely tolerable to those he thinks will absolutely send him over the edge, and then they work up the ladder, facing each stimuili in increasing order of dread, until they can tolerate the very worst they can initially imagine, and then some. Over-training is very important, and relapse is likely unless the protocol is followed.
(Things may have changed since I was trained and in practice a decade ago, but I don't think they have much.)
Oh good! Now I know what to ask for for my birthday. Thanks!
There it is, Marchrand. Thanks for reminding us -- it is a wonderful post, though long.
(I see you deleted your entry before I replied. Thank goodness for a rational explanation of why I couldn't quote it.)
I think PoorRichard's long (very long) reply does apply to what we've been talking about -- as in will they marry, and when.
My question briefly to poorrichard54 was:. . .putting aside your personal views but only as it pertains to DM/LG. . . .Now he scheduled the christening of JH without consulting LG - I have always felt that DM was not a religious man, but when it comes to marriage and christening rites he is right there as a devout person and wants these ceremonies to be done proper in a church of God.
Again, thank you, poorrichard54's answer has always stuck in my mind to the point where I had marked it down for future reference.
Not quite, NewPark. It's obvious DM is spending a lot of time meditating over that DVD, visualizing his ability to do surgery and be comfortable with the blood, and then attempting to actually do it outside his mind. We see him setting up to listen to that DVD more than once. We are made to understand he is often listening to it. That's meditation of a sort; a type of guided imagery.
That is a great post by PoorRichard. Thank you Marchrand for reminding us of it and NewPark for providing the link. I think he/she makes a great case for why they will marry in series 6, and I agree with it. I think (hope?) that BP realizes they have taken the will-they/won't-they plot line as far as they can - as MC has said about other story lines and characters. It is time they took that step, IMO. The only way to avoid the marriage, in my belief, is for the show to lose Louisa's character. In the past I have thought they may so that. However, after re-reading some of MC's remarks about CC, I don't think he would want to do the show without her at this point.
I think we are stressing different things. You cannot actually deal with a phobia without real life exposure to what provokes that anxiety. The practice that is taught is staying in the moment with your fear, noticing them, observing your different physiological reactions, a kind of mindfulness meditation on what is happening, until the anxiety subsides, which it almost always does, after a period of time, if the desensitization is proceeding properly, along the aforesaid "ladder."
It's actually very interesting (to me at least). The person is specifically taught NOT to relax, not to use distracting techniques, but to expose himself to his anxiety and learn by experience that these physiological reactions can be tolerated and will subside.
But I think we may be having a difference in terms -- when I think about meditation, I think about a mindfulness practice, where the object is really to empty your mind, or observe thoughts and let them go. (often accompanied by breathing practices and a "mantra." ) I've never been able to get into that but lots of people swear by it. But I don't think of guided imagery or visualization by the name of meditation. Am happy to be enlightened about it, though.
What I want:
1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes
4. Yes
5. No
What may actually happen:
1. I still say yes, even though I'm still worried by the ITV press release that specifically mentions the return of Bert, Al, Morwenna, and Penhale, with no mention of Mrs T. Several people have said it may be halfway into the series. That could be the trick. In the Behind the Scenes stuff filmed during and after filming of S5 E8, Selina Cadell seemed pretty certain she'd be back for the next series.
2. Yes. I'm basing this not only on what I've been wanting to happen since I saw the end of S5 but also on MC's comments. IMO, they need to simply get 'er done, so to speak, get that danged wedding out of the way so they can move on with S6.
3. This one's tricky. I so hope they move away from the London or no London plotline that's been dragging on forever (well, for S4 & 5). I'm just sick to death of it and have a feeling, if they want to move this sucker forward, MC/PB/BP will see that too. I suspect that for now this will be settled. He'll remain in PW as GP. That's not to say that at the end of this series, or at the end of S7, or at the end of whatever series we're all watching while we sit drooling in retirement homes this isn't the way it's all finally wrapped up and brought to a tidy end. The family drives off in the sunset toward London.
4. No. I wish Pauline would come back, if only for a one-off, but logic tells me it won't happen.
5. No. Louise Jameson recently said she won't be in S6. No idea about dear old dad, but I don't think we'll ever see him again.
Wow! Thanks Marchrand and NewPark for bringing that all up again. Great reading that long post a second time. I really miss PoorRichard and hope she is ok - her last post was that her cat had died and I have been quite worried that we never heard from her after that.
I have taken MC at his word that a wedding would be very early in S6, and re-reading that post gives me good reasons why it could happen that way. One thing that I don't think she mentioned (unless I missed it) was how Martin immediately offered to marry Louisa when he found out she was pregnant. I think the moral compass that Martin and Louisa both seem to have sends them in one of two directions. Either they go their separate ways and co-parent James from afar or they marry and have a traditional family. I think they are both traditional people and not a couple who would raise their son in a committed relationship without being married. The relationship in S5 was all pretty temporary. They were living in the same house to co-parent their infant son, but he was on the verge of leaving soon. When Louisa made the decision to go with him to London I think it may have signaled a change in their relationship, but before they could even think about what it would mean they had two of their inevitable Portwenn interruptions: Buddy jumping on the bed and her mother's arrival (which I liken to a nuclear bomb :eek:).
So in S4E3, we have Joe saying to his brother: "You could have been a contender."
Which makes me wonder how many other iconic film references are scattered throughout the series. I'm not in any sense a film buff, so can't really tell, though I have seen a reference in a review of the series to the effect that they do make allusions to other films.
I commented earlier that the phrase DM uses in talking with Uncle Jimmy about his sexuality - 'not that there is anything wrong with that' - is a phrase from a Seinfeld episode.
And I wondered if DMs comments about 'the cupboard under the stairs' was a reference to Harry Potter.
Thanks for this link, for those of us new to the forum this was very interesting reading.
It is interesting that even a minister sees their relationship as being built on some morality even though it is outside the confines of religious practice. Other than Uncle Jimmy in the restaurant and one reference Louisa makes to the (London) 'school not liking this' - overall the village is very accepting of the situation between DM and LG. Perhaps it is just part of the go with the flow attitude that Bert refers to. It is as though the village expects and so accepts the pregnancy and cohabitation. Recall that there is a scene after the birth when they are going to the village shops and Mrs T makes some very nasty comments and the shopkeeper calls her on it.
As for the wedding question - I certainly hope there is a wedding as the relationship of DM to JH and LG is his lifeline. As mentioned, JH is not legally an Ellingham and this question needs to be resolved for the good of the storyline. DM has purged himself of some demons at the castle and those need a complete burial. A complete and legal relationship to Louisa and in particular to the baby is a life-saving necessary step for DM.
RE: Not that there is anything wrong with that S4E2
"The Outing" is the 57th episode of the sitcom Seinfeld. It is the 17th episode of the fourth season, and first aired on February 11, 1993.
The line "...Not that there's anything wrong with that", as a reference to homosexuality, has become a popular catchphrase among fans.
Jason Alexander (George) maintains that it is the most popular to originate from the series
This is from Wikipedia
There is a sad little boy living inside Doc Martin who doesn't know how to give or receive love; that is what has been revealed in the plot and Martin Clunes' acting as the lead character, Dr. Martin Ellingham. There is a neediness in his portrayal of Doc Martin that is as endearing as it is troublesome. It is why Louisa Glasson's character is attracted to him yet repelled. Louisa is in the daily company of little boys in her job as a teacher. She doesn't want an adult relationship with the little boy, but she is physically attracted to Martin. That is one tiny fragment of the many well written conflicts within the story line.
Article Source: http://EzineArticles.com/4050170
Reminds me of the Martin Clunes quote in an article in the New Zealand Listener (when he was down under filming "The Man who Lost his Head" that DM is "isolated, a terribly fragile house of cards." He adds something like, he made himself up at a young age in order to shut out emotional abuse from others.
If you read about Martin Clunes' childhood there are distinct parallels with a certain GP.
My wife is reading "Kinsey and Me" by Sue Grafton. She reveals similar things about herself and her fictional detective Kinsey Millhone.
For an actor, or writer, to be able to draw on those experiences must be both empowering and scary.
Robspace54 - thanks for the heads up on Sue Grafton. I have all of her books through U but was a bit disappointed in the last couple. Not sure who changed Kinsey, Sue, or me. The time frame of nearly 30 years does allow a bit of that on all fronts so maybe each of us changed.