Marguerite Daisy

fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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On a bit of an impulse today, we bought a couple of Standard Marguerite Dasies, simply because they seemed so different to the usual sort of trees we had looked at (we only wanted a very small tree, and conifers were about the only ones that fitted the bill size wise, but to be honest we've got them in the back garden so another would have been boring).

Anyway, they were on an offer if we bought two, so they now have their wee feet planted in the front garden - and very nice they look too.

However, I don't really have the foggiest idea about them - given that they have a reasonably thick trunk like stem, I have drawn the conclusion that they are pretty much a perennial? Some googling has revealed that deadheading them will encourage ongoing blooming through the summer, but that is about it as far as I can find by way of care instructions.

Will they survive winters? Is normal fertiliser OK, or is there some kind of special fertiliser for them?

Any hints or tips please :)
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  • stud u likestud u like Posts: 42,100
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    They are difficult if you forget the rules.

    They don't like to dry out but they hate wet feet. So moistening the soil helps but not a deluge as they are fussy plants and might faint on you.

    They like their spent blooms removed.

    Cut of some of the stems during the growing time so that it will get bushy and also keep the growth under control.

    Prune it in the Spring time when new growth appears but only cut a third off it or will become stressed.

    They do not like the temperature to get too cold. So you may need to protect them.
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    They are difficult if you forget the rules.

    They don't like to dry out but they hate wet feet. So moistening the soil helps but not a deluge as they are fussy plants and might faint on you.

    They like their spent blooms removed.

    Cut of some of the stems during the growing time so that it will get bushy and also keep the growth under control.

    Prune it in the Spring time when new growth appears but only cut a third off it or will become stressed.

    They do not like the temperature to get too cold. So you may need to protect them.

    Thanks :)

    Soil here is pretty well drained, so hopefully they'll be OK with that.

    What protection would be suitable for overwintering them?
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    Yes, marguerites (argyranthemums) are perennials, and I believe they're technically sub-shrubs. However, they aren't frost-hardy, and so except in very mild areas they have to be overwintered in a house or greenhouse.

    I grow them most summers and feed them with tomato fertiliser, which is high in potash and is supposed to encourage flowering. I generally throw them away in the autumn, but it is possible to keep them for another year or to overwinter cuttings.

    http://www.wildaboutgardens.org/plants/container-plant/argyranthemum-frutescens.aspx

    They do come in various yellows and pinks, but I prefer the plain single white ones.
  • stud u likestud u like Posts: 42,100
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    Thanks :)

    Soil here is pretty well drained, so hopefully they'll be OK with that.

    What protection would be suitable for overwintering them?

    They are better in pots as you can bring them indoors or winter them in a garage.

    Mine have not lasted a winter. They fainted on me.

    I buy them yearly instead as they are very fussy plants.
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Thats a bit of a bugger - I suppose I could try lifting them and overwintering them in pots in the front porch. I don't have a greenhouse, so thats my best shot I think.
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    I find mine generally look pretty tatty by the autumn and so I don't try to overwinter them, though I suppose if I did so they might spruce up a bit in the early summer. It's not too hard to overwinter a potful of cuttings, though, and that takes up less space than overwintering fully-grown plants.

    They can also be grown from seed:

    http://www.eseeds.com/p-7487-argyranthemum-frutescens-paris-white.aspx
  • mirandashellmirandashell Posts: 2,943
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    They are far too fussy for me. In my garden, a plant looks after itself or it's out!
  • jojo01jojo01 Posts: 12,370
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    Would covering them in fleece help over the winter months?
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Sigurd wrote: »
    I find mine generally look pretty tatty by the autumn and so I don't try to overwinter them, though I suppose if I did so they might spruce up a bit in the early summer. It's not too hard to overwinter a potful of cuttings, though, and that takes up less space than overwintering fully-grown plants.

    They can also be grown from seed:

    http://www.eseeds.com/p-7487-argyranthemum-frutescens-paris-white.aspx

    The ones I have bought are like wee trees though, a bit like a lollipop shape if that makes sense - the thickness of the trunk would suggest that they are at least a year old (if not more) - are these going to be the same as the wee ones?
  • CaminoCamino Posts: 13,029
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    i had two of these but as far as i can tell havent made it through the winter, no green shoots or sign of life in them at all, very sad and they are non stop flowerers
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    The ones I have bought are like wee trees though, a bit like a lollipop shape if that makes sense - the thickness of the trunk would suggest that they are at least a year old (if not more) - are these going to be the same as the wee ones?
    The standard marguerites are certainly worth keeping for another year if you can, since I should think it would have taken several years to train them into the standard form. Some advice on overwintering:
    Argyranthemum (marguerite)

    Marguerites can be overwintered in several ways, but they must be kept frost free, Ideally, don’t allow the temperature to fall below 5°C (40°F). I like to keep one or two flowering all winter by placing them in a heated greenhouse or conservatory. Otherwise, they can either be potted up individually and placed on the windowsill of a cool room, or placed under the staging in a heated conservatory or greenhouse. Alternatively, you can save space by packing several plants into a box. Lift the plants and cut back the stems before placing them in a crate topped up with just-moist compost. I successfully overwinter standards by trimming back this year's growth by about one-third and keep plants ticking over during the winter by placing them in a greenhouse with a minimum temperature of 5°C (40°F). You can also take cuttings now as insurance, kept at a minimum temperature of 7°C (45°F).
    http://www.crocus.co.uk/features/_/articles-and-advice/garden-care-tips/care-tip-archive/septembersaving-tender-perennials/articleid.1114/

    (That piece was advice for September.)

    Incidentally, it's quite early to have put them outside. They've come from being grown inside in high temperatures and sheltered from the elements, and they may suffer from being put straight outside into the wind, rain and (quite possibly) frost. It would have been better to have hardened them off before planting them outside, and I think it would still be wise to take them inside at night, particularly if low temperatures are forecast. A more normal time for putting tender plants outside would be late May or early June. You could be lucky, though.
  • GetMeOuttaHereGetMeOuttaHere Posts: 17,357
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    Camino wrote: »
    i had two of these but as far as i can tell havent made it through the winter, no green shoots or sign of life in them at all, very sad and they are non stop flowerers

    They do take time to show new growth, be patient. Are they in pots or the ground? I had a couple a few years ago, had them in pots and they died over winter, my neighbour put hers in the ground and it survived.
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Ah, so my complete lack of gardening knowhow shows itself again :o The only thing I can hope is that the mild weather that we tend to get here actually stays with us. They are reasonably sheltered in terms of wind etc thanks to the fact that most of my garden is set low (you step down from the path into the garden.

    I think I'll see how they fare through the summer, then put them in a couple of nice earthenware pots for winter so that I can winter them in the front porch (heated, but never really gets all that warm, but equally never gets all that cold) - if they survive that, I'll out them out in their pots as patio plants next year.

    Meantime, I can be looking at suitable small ornamental trees to fill the borders when I take these out. Any suggestions?

    Now, being really cheeky (you love me really?), I bought 80 mixed gladioli bulbs, and 50 double freesia bulbs yesterday - any special planting instructions for these before I go an wallop them in the ground with all the finesse of a baby elephant? :o
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    They do take time to show new growth, be patient. Are they in pots or the ground? I had a couple a few years ago, had them in pots and they died over winter, my neighbour put hers in the ground and it survived.

    Did she leave them out all winter? Any protection?
  • CaminoCamino Posts: 13,029
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    They do take time to show new growth, be patient. Are they in pots or the ground? I had a couple a few years ago, had them in pots and they died over winter, my neighbour put hers in the ground and it survived.

    they are in pots on the patio and i did protect them in the coldest weather, i will just leave them and see what happens i really i hope they are ok but they look shocking at the mo :( they are about 3 years old
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Well, winter came and barely getting a day off work between August and January, I didn't get a chance to do anything with my standard Marguerites - they now look positively dead, with not a scrap of green on them at all, so I reckon they have had it. My mum however, advises that they will most likely come bouncing back - does this sound right, or should I just whip them out now and get on with looking for a replacement?
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    The Burncoose Nursery website says of argyranthemums (marguerites): "Half hardy - Plant can withstand temperatures down to 0°C (32°F)." I doubt if there's anywhere in the UK that didn't experience temperatures much lower than that during November and December, so I strongly suspect, FC, that your plants will be dead.

    People sometimes confuse Argyranthemum frutescens with chrysanthemums, and in fact the old name for argyranthemum was Chrysanthemum frutescens, but they're nowhere near as hardy as true chrysanthemums.

    However, it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that your plants might still show some signs of life in the next few months, so you might be as well to wait for a bit before you decide to chuck them out. It's not a great time for planting anything else anyway.
  • tomharry2tomharry2 Posts: 4,666
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    They will not survive a british winter in the garage or in the garden.

    Your only hope is a heated glass house. Not worth the hasle.

    if they sold it to you as a perennial in the UK, youve been had.
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    Supposedly they'll survive mild winters outside in Cornwall, but I should think that even there the past two winters would have killed them.
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Ah well, looks like they have most likely had it then. They were only bought on the strength that they were a bit different and tall enough to fill the spaces. Ideally, I would like some kind of hardy, standard fuschia - but don't know if such a thing exists.

    I'll tidy up around them for now, and give them a wee haircut so they don't look just as bad, and give them a few weeks to see what happens - once proven dead, I'll have to hit the garden centre

    Thanks :)
  • SigurdSigurd Posts: 26,610
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    From a page on fuchsias:
    How do I overwinter a standard?

    First point – although many hardy fuchsia varieties make good standards, no standard is hardy. ALL standards no matter what the variety need to be kept in during the winter at a minimum of 5ºC, this is because you must not let the plant die back.
    http://www.findthatfuchsia.info/tips.htm#how%20do%20i%20grow%20a%20standard%20fuchsia

    If you want a hardy standard or half standard tree or shrub, you'd need to go for something else. I don't know much about such things, but a few possibilities are bay tree, cotoneaster or rose, though no doubt there are quite a few others.
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Thanks Sigurd - need to do some homework then. It appears that my Japanese Acer has bit the dust too over the winter :(
  • fat controllerfat controller Posts: 13,757
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    Well, having just been out to take the dead heads off my hydrangeas, and generally tidy up, I can confirm that the Marguerites are stone dead - all dried out and brittle, so there was no point leaving them where they were - they're now in the recycling bag :(

    The good news is that my Acer has some wee buds on it, so it now appears to have survived :)
  • soda syphonsoda syphon Posts: 276
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    Thanks Sigurd - need to do some homework then. It appears that my Japanese Acer has bit the dust too over the winter :(

    Don't give up on your Japanese acer yet, round here (north Midlands) the lowest temp got down to -15 degrees centigrade and Im sure all my Japanese acers have survived.
  • Joni MJoni M Posts: 70,225
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    Well, having just been out to take the dead heads off my hydrangeas, and generally tidy up, I can confirm that the Marguerites are stone dead - all dried out and brittle, so there was no point leaving them where they were - they're now in the recycling bag :(

    The good news is that my Acer has some wee buds on it, so it now appears to have survived :)

    Yay :) What a nice birthday present, hope you're having a good one. xxxxx

    I always lurk on the 'gardening threads' and have received some valuable advice so cheers folks.
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