So what has caused Doc Martin and the show to become more prudish (I think that's exactly the right word)? Suit jacket always buttoned up, PJs buttoned up, almost no touching, much less any indication he's attracted to LG. Even the final scene in S5 didn't do it for me because I felt there was commitment, but little or no real attraction.:yawn:
MC has more control of scripts and he wants the show to go in this direction. I, personally, don't like it and in fact think if people picked up the show late they wouldn't "get" the obsession fans have with the show.
MC has more control of scripts and he wants the show to go in this direction. I, personally, don't like it and in fact think if people picked up the show late they wouldn't "get" the obsession fans have with the show.
I agree that this is largely his doing, but to what good end? Just toying with his panting superfans? a sudden onset of prudishness in his midlife? Building up the tension to keep up the interest? Whatever it is, I hope he's over it by S6.
New Park asked the other day if Louisa would propose to Doc or if Doc would propose to Louisa. I think Doc will propose to Louisa. In the States marriage is becoming much more of a middle to upper income phenomena as it is in some European countries, such as Sweden. Being upper income, Doc will want to do what his expected of someone in his economic strata while Louisa of a lower income strata probably is not as concerned, particularly if there are protections in place for James Henry. After Season 5 she should know that romantic love with the Doc is not a possibility.
New Park asked the other day if Louisa would propose to Doc or if Doc would propose to Louisa. I think Doc will propose to Louisa. In the States marriage is becoming much more of a middle to upper income phenomena as it is in some European countries, such as Sweden. Being upper income, Doc will want to do what his expected of someone in his economic strata while Louisa of a lower income strata probably is not as concerned, particularly if there are protections in place for James Henry. After Season 5 she should know that romantic love with the Doc is not a possibility.
Gosh is marriage really becoming a economic status thing or just the ceremony?
DM has already proposed to LG. I most certainly have absolutely no doubt that romantic love is possible with DM and LG. I doubt LG will settle for less and I think that after s5 DM realises that is what LG needs to stay with him. Isn't that what the "one more chance" is about? :cool:
I hope we are not going to go through the "I was wrong" scenario which was conveniently totally forgotten at the beginning of s5.
Mona, GordonSetter, & NewPark, I love reading this kind of analysis!
Would you say this is the same kind of thing we see/hear from Bert when he steps in and speaks for DM in assorted scenes or is that another kind of dramatic device? I'm referring to moments when DM makes us shout at the TV by not saying what he should be saying, and often what we assume he's really thinking way down deep beneath all of the layers.
For example, when LG wins the headmistress position again in S4, DM lays into her, tells her how wrong she is for doing this, and in the next instant as DM stalks away, Bert says, "Congratulations." Also in S4 when DM is about to leave for London and wants to talk to LG about "practicalities" and they end up in a shouting match outside the school gates, Bert interrupts with the baby shower idea and says to LG, "We do care." Even more blatantly, in S5 at AJ's funeral, DM is fuming about the late arrival of the hearse, and Bert says, "That woman meant everything to you." Would you say in these moments Bert is speaking for DM's inner self or are his comments meant to show a contrast between what should be said vs what is said?
I have to say that I don't really "like" Bert as a character. He strikes me as rather shifty, always cutting corners, not above engaging in dodgy enterprises or practices. He's possessive of Al, careless about money, etc., etc., incompetent in most of his endeavors, sometimes a little foolish, as in his infatuation with Marigold. He's rather an anti-hero.
But, he really is the antithesis of DM, who is, as GordonSetter has pointed out, a man of "heroic" virtues, upright, moral, fastidious, repressed.
So it's probably not coincidence that it's left to this antithetical character to display the warmth and humanity that DM is shown as lacking, or unable to access. Typical is the warm welcome he waves to LG in S4E2,
The “chorus” idea is that a character in the series provides our protagonist – DM – with special insight or knowledge that he needs at a critical point in the story. The fishmonger’s message fits that concept perfectly. We’d have to go back and watch other episodes with this idea in mind, but I’ll bet there are many examples of Portwennians, in their simple, small town way, doing this kind of thing. More knowledgeable forum members can provide suggestions, I’m sure. Of course, these insights meet with DM’s distain, and are usually played for a laugh - but are spot on in terms of what he really needs to know or consider. And it is more than just saying to someone else what DM ought to be saying to them, as LG or Bert sometimes do. It is a bit deeper than that. I also agree with NewPark that Bert is a bit of a problem character – he is just so all over the map. Lovable one minute, scheming the next.
New Park asked the other day if Louisa would propose to Doc or if Doc would propose to Louisa. I think Doc will propose to Louisa. In the States marriage is becoming much more of a middle to upper income phenomena as it is in some European countries, such as Sweden. Being upper income, Doc will want to do what his expected of someone in his economic strata while Louisa of a lower income strata probably is not as concerned, particularly if there are protections in place for James Henry. After Season 5 she should know that romantic love with the Doc is not a possibility.
Do you really think romantic love is not a possibility? He speaks to her in a different tone of voice to her than he speaks to everyone else. He got testy with her @ the hotel, but for the most part he spoke to her with a lower softer tone than he uses in other parts of his life. His tone with Aunt Ruth is unique, too. Maybe it's just me, but I found some of their scenes in the bedroom quite sensual. The first bedroom scene was Nappy Cream! But after that he was always soft and low. But I might be seeing something that's not there - only my wishful thinking.
MC has more control of scripts and he wants the show to go in this direction. I, personally, don't like it and in fact think if people picked up the show late they wouldn't "get" the obsession fans have with the show.
I agree that this is largely his doing, but to what good end? Just toying with his panting superfans? a sudden onset of prudishness in his midlife? Building up the tension to keep up the interest? Whatever it is, I hope he's over it by S6.
Me too! However, we've often heard MC say that Phillipa is the brains behind (I can't remember exactly what he said)! Oh, wait a minute, now this is all beginning to make sense! It's all Phillipa's fault! :eek:
New Park asked the other day if Louisa would propose to Doc or if Doc would propose to Louisa. I think Doc will propose to Louisa. In the States marriage is becoming much more of a middle to upper income phenomena as it is in some European countries, such as Sweden. Being upper income, Doc will want to do what his expected of someone in his economic strata while Louisa of a lower income strata probably is not as concerned, particularly if there are protections in place for James Henry. After Season 5 she should know that romantic love with the Doc is not a possibility.
Do you really think romantic love is not a possibility? He speaks to her in a different tone of voice to her than he speaks to everyone else. He got testy with her @ the hotel, but for the most part he spoke to her with a lower softer tone than he uses in other parts of his life. His tone with Aunt Ruth is unique, too. Maybe it's just me, but I found some of their scenes in the bedroom quite sensual. The first bedroom scene was Nappy Cream! But after that he was always soft and low. But I might be seeing something that's not there - only my wishful thinking.
I know that LG comes from a broken home and what we would technically term the “lower class” – but she so presents as middle class, it is hard for me to think of her any other way. The phenomenon of marriage becoming the purview of the middle and upper classes correlates, at least in the US, with education levels and a greater awareness of the impact that unstable relationships have on children. Not sure how that is viewed in Great Britain. But if it is viewed the same way, that would be a strong motivator for both DM and LG to consider marriage, as they are so completely committed to JH’s welfare. But there is oodles of evidence that these two are really in love and will marry, in truth, for romantic reasons as well.
Yes, but PC Penhale said he had to have them completed And turned in by a certain date. Or else they'll pick out a name for the baby, like Wilberforce. :eek::D
Well, DM could have filled them out, and then have them ready for LG to sign before they are turned in.
Does he bring them to PC Penhale? Seems like there'd be a national agency he'd mail them to instead, but I have no idea how England works that way.
If he filled them out and handed them to Penhale, LG has to stop by and sign them, I guess. I think DM did fill them out to show LG he was considerate of her wishes; that was the point. Once she sees that she can sign them.
So what has caused Doc Martin and the show to become more prudish (I think that's exactly the right word)? Suit jacket always buttoned up, PJs buttoned up, almost no touching, much less any indication he's attracted to LG. Even the final scene in S5 didn't do it for me because I felt there was commitment, but little or no real attraction.:yawn:
Wow, as they walked down the path holding hands, smiling, content with each other, I saw a LOT of attraction myself.
New Park asked the other day if Louisa would propose to Doc or if Doc would propose to Louisa. I think Doc will propose to Louisa. In the States marriage is becoming much more of a middle to upper income phenomena as it is in some European countries, such as Sweden. Being upper income, Doc will want to do what his expected of someone in his economic strata while Louisa of a lower income strata probably is not as concerned, particularly if there are protections in place for James Henry. After Season 5 she should know that romantic love with the Doc is not a possibility.
Romantic love with the Doc is not possible? He has his moments....he's just not typical.
If Series 6 is the last one which novel would you like BP to make for a future program. I think MC did mention in an interview that J.P.Dunleavy (think that is the author) would be worth considering. Haven't read anything by this author, any thoughts!
If Series 6 is the last one which novel would you like BP to make for a future program. I think MC did mention in an interview that J.P.Dunleavy (think that is the author) would be worth considering. Haven't read anything by this author, any thoughts!
Hmmmm. Best known for, I think, Ginger Man, which has a hero who is a relatively young man. Kind of racy,
But I'll have to give some thought to novels with characters he might play.
The “chorus” idea is that a character in the series provides our protagonist – DM – with special insight or knowledge that he needs at a critical point in the story. The fishmonger’s message fits that concept perfectly. We’d have to go back and watch other episodes with this idea in mind, but I’ll bet there are many examples of Portwennians, in their simple, small town way, doing this kind of thing. More knowledgeable forum members can provide suggestions, I’m sure. Of course, these insights meet with DM’s distain, and are usually played for a laugh - but are spot on in terms of what he really needs to know or consider. And it is more than just saying to someone else what DM ought to be saying to them, as LG or Bert sometimes do. It is a bit deeper than that. I also agree with NewPark that Bert is a bit of a problem character – he is just so all over the map. Lovable one minute, scheming the next.
I can think of a funny time - when DM is outside his house with Edith, and the group of girls walks by. One of them says "Use a condom this time". It's not as profound as what the fishmonger says, but I think it's funny.
The group of wandering girls has sometimes been compared to a Greek Chorus by critics.
Well, DM could have filled them out, and then have them ready for LG to sign before they are turned in. Does he bring them to PC Penhale? Seems like there'd be a national agency he'd mail them to instead, but I have no idea how England works that way.If he filled them out and handed them to Penhale, LG has to stop by and sign them, I guess. I think DM did fill them out to show LG he was considerate of her wishes; that was the point. Once she sees that she can sign them.
There is an Ofice of the Registrar for Births, Marriages and Deaths in each area. The process is absolutely nothing to do with the police.
I don't know if this is still the case, but in our wonderful free, democractic society, a marriage in the Roman Catholic church requires the physical presence of a Registrar, whereas a marriage in the Cof E does not; (established Church and all that.) Still, women do have the vote so I guess that we should be thankful for something:D:D
I agree that this is largely his doing, but to what good end? Just toying with his panting superfans? a sudden onset of prudishness in his midlife? Building up the tension to keep up the interest? Whatever it is, I hope he's over it by S6.
Perhaps, now that MC is not filming this Spring, he has found time to review S5 and see why his idea of the colder, lack of affection doc (towards LG) didn't quite go over with the fans and he will thaw out in S6 and at last give us what we have been patiently waiting for, or else he and the writers will have to go into seclusion at the conclusion of S6E8!! As a footnote, if there is a bedroom scene, just give us a tasteful, loving scene with LG. That's all we ask for, to make his love for Louisa visually believable to us.
What is gone from S5 is the rolling, good feeling episodes of the first three series IMO and even by a stretch of my imagination some of S4.
Perhaps, now that MC is not filming this Spring, he has found time to review S5 and see why his idea of the colder, lack of affection doc (towards LG) didn't quite go over with the fans and he will thaw out in S6 and at last give us what we have been patiently waiting for, or else he and the writers will have to go into seclusion at the conclusion of S6E8!! As a footnote, if there is a bedroom scene, just give us a tasteful, loving scene with LG. That's all we ask for, to make his love for Louisa visually believable to us.
What is gone from S5 is the rolling, good feeling episodes of the first three series IMO and even by a stretch of my imagination some of S4.
Fingers crossed, Marchrand. Exactly what I am hoping for too.
Wow, as they walked down the path holding hands, smiling, content with each other, I saw a LOT of attraction myself.
To me that was the most romantic scene..the look on his face..brilliant acting. In S5 after they move back to the surgery I think they are trying to show us how difficult it is when people are set in their ways and they take on big life changes, but it is puzzling that they never show us much effort at affection.
There is an Ofice of the Registrar for Births, Marriages and Deaths in each area. The process is absolutely nothing to do with the police.
I don't know if this is still the case, but in our wonderful free, democractic society, a marriage in the Roman Catholic church requires the physical presence of a Registrar, whereas a marriage in the Cof E does not; (established Church and all that.) Still, women do have the vote so I guess that we should be thankful for something:D:D
Louisa is what, now around 40 years old? I wonder why she still wears that ponytail all the time.
Last night it came to me that that may be an outward sign of where her emotions stagnated. They say that when someone starts abusing drugs/alcohol that's where their emotional development stops. It's not that extreme for LG, who is of course a very functional member of society.
BUT, if she was a ponytail wearing ten years old when her mom left, and was deeply traumatized by that abandonment, I wonder if that is why she's stayed with that haircut all these years and did not develop a more mature womanly style. Perhaps not consciously, but as a deep emotional stagnancy, she is stuck at 10 years old in some ways, deeply wishing for a mother. We saw clear evidence of this in S5 with her need for her problematic, irresponsible, selfish mother in her life.
I almost think if she gives up that ponytail, it would be good for her emotionally and in her relationship with DM. Just some early morning thoughts.
I can think of a funny time - when DM is outside his house with Edith, and the group of girls walks by. One of them says "Use a condom this time". It's not as profound as what the fishmonger says, but I think it's funny.
The group of wandering girls has sometimes been compared to a Greek Chorus by critics.
Oh, I think the critics were way off base--the wandering girls do not advance the plot or help any character understand themselves or the situation. They are obnoxious irritants to the villagers, usually making fun of people. They are definitely not insightful beings spreading wisdom or profundity.
Oh, I think the critics were way off base--the wandering girls do not advance the plot or help any character understand themselves or the situation. They are obnoxious irritants to the villagers, usually making fun of people. They are definitely not insightful beings spreading wisdom or profundity.
But, they are a part of the landscape of PW. They have been roaming up and down the streets since S1, and it is interesting to me how at that young age they are interested in not only their own age group goings on, but the villagers in general.
But, they are a part of the landscape of PW. They have been roaming up and down the streets since S1, and it is interesting to me how at that young age they are interested in not only their own age group goings on, but the villagers in general.
Yes...and where there are girls..there are boys. However, we only got to see the wandering group of boys once in S2, they yelled out to Louisa "alright Miss!" when she persuaded Martin to help her at the school fair. I'd like to see the wandering boys more often. I like seeing young good looking lads on the show. All those boys that got stung by the fish were cute. Also, prison cook Mick, extremely handsome and I wish he had stuck around. Younger characters on the show may draw a wider audience. Can't have all old people.
But, they are a part of the landscape of PW. They have been roaming up and down the streets since S1, and it is interesting to me how at that young age they are interested in not only their own age group goings on, but the villagers in general.
Well, wandering alone doesn't make a Greek Chorus. They are more a type of nosy, gossipy high school type clique to me.
Comments
Gosh is marriage really becoming a economic status thing or just the ceremony?
DM has already proposed to LG. I most certainly have absolutely no doubt that romantic love is possible with DM and LG. I doubt LG will settle for less and I think that after s5 DM realises that is what LG needs to stay with him. Isn't that what the "one more chance" is about? :cool:
I hope we are not going to go through the "I was wrong" scenario which was conveniently totally forgotten at the beginning of s5.
The “chorus” idea is that a character in the series provides our protagonist – DM – with special insight or knowledge that he needs at a critical point in the story. The fishmonger’s message fits that concept perfectly. We’d have to go back and watch other episodes with this idea in mind, but I’ll bet there are many examples of Portwennians, in their simple, small town way, doing this kind of thing. More knowledgeable forum members can provide suggestions, I’m sure. Of course, these insights meet with DM’s distain, and are usually played for a laugh - but are spot on in terms of what he really needs to know or consider. And it is more than just saying to someone else what DM ought to be saying to them, as LG or Bert sometimes do. It is a bit deeper than that. I also agree with NewPark that Bert is a bit of a problem character – he is just so all over the map. Lovable one minute, scheming the next.
Do you really think romantic love is not a possibility? He speaks to her in a different tone of voice to her than he speaks to everyone else. He got testy with her @ the hotel, but for the most part he spoke to her with a lower softer tone than he uses in other parts of his life. His tone with Aunt Ruth is unique, too. Maybe it's just me, but I found some of their scenes in the bedroom quite sensual. The first bedroom scene was Nappy Cream! But after that he was always soft and low. But I might be seeing something that's not there - only my wishful thinking.
I know that LG comes from a broken home and what we would technically term the “lower class” – but she so presents as middle class, it is hard for me to think of her any other way. The phenomenon of marriage becoming the purview of the middle and upper classes correlates, at least in the US, with education levels and a greater awareness of the impact that unstable relationships have on children. Not sure how that is viewed in Great Britain. But if it is viewed the same way, that would be a strong motivator for both DM and LG to consider marriage, as they are so completely committed to JH’s welfare. But there is oodles of evidence that these two are really in love and will marry, in truth, for romantic reasons as well.
Well, DM could have filled them out, and then have them ready for LG to sign before they are turned in.
Does he bring them to PC Penhale? Seems like there'd be a national agency he'd mail them to instead, but I have no idea how England works that way.
If he filled them out and handed them to Penhale, LG has to stop by and sign them, I guess. I think DM did fill them out to show LG he was considerate of her wishes; that was the point. Once she sees that she can sign them.
Romantic love with the Doc is not possible? He has his moments....he's just not typical.
Hmmmm. Best known for, I think, Ginger Man, which has a hero who is a relatively young man. Kind of racy,
But I'll have to give some thought to novels with characters he might play.
I can think of a funny time - when DM is outside his house with Edith, and the group of girls walks by. One of them says "Use a condom this time". It's not as profound as what the fishmonger says, but I think it's funny.
The group of wandering girls has sometimes been compared to a Greek Chorus by critics.
There is an Ofice of the Registrar for Births, Marriages and Deaths in each area. The process is absolutely nothing to do with the police.
I don't know if this is still the case, but in our wonderful free, democractic society, a marriage in the Roman Catholic church requires the physical presence of a Registrar, whereas a marriage in the Cof E does not; (established Church and all that.) Still, women do have the vote so I guess that we should be thankful for something:D:D
Fingers crossed, Marchrand. Exactly what I am hoping for too.
You go girl!
Last night it came to me that that may be an outward sign of where her emotions stagnated. They say that when someone starts abusing drugs/alcohol that's where their emotional development stops. It's not that extreme for LG, who is of course a very functional member of society.
BUT, if she was a ponytail wearing ten years old when her mom left, and was deeply traumatized by that abandonment, I wonder if that is why she's stayed with that haircut all these years and did not develop a more mature womanly style. Perhaps not consciously, but as a deep emotional stagnancy, she is stuck at 10 years old in some ways, deeply wishing for a mother. We saw clear evidence of this in S5 with her need for her problematic, irresponsible, selfish mother in her life.
I almost think if she gives up that ponytail, it would be good for her emotionally and in her relationship with DM. Just some early morning thoughts.
Oh, I think the critics were way off base--the wandering girls do not advance the plot or help any character understand themselves or the situation. They are obnoxious irritants to the villagers, usually making fun of people. They are definitely not insightful beings spreading wisdom or profundity.
But, they are a part of the landscape of PW. They have been roaming up and down the streets since S1, and it is interesting to me how at that young age they are interested in not only their own age group goings on, but the villagers in general.
Well, wandering alone doesn't make a Greek Chorus. They are more a type of nosy, gossipy high school type clique to me.