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Old 03-07-2010, 23:28
hard_to_beat
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ers-unemployed

So this is what the 'big society' means? Leave people to beg for charity? If this is the level our nation has fallen to, I'm trully ashamed

I'm not against food vouchers per se, but they should at least allow people the dignity of using them in Tesco and such. Basically, the government are saying that the poor are no longer welcome in the same shops as 'hard-working families', whatever that means.

Reminds me of this: http://www.channel4.com/programmes/u...2010/episode-9

I'm speechless, and to think millions voted for this.
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Old 03-07-2010, 23:33
blue_cobalt
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I think it is a great idea Stops the poor from spending all their benefits on booze and smoking as most of them do. Nearly every day I walk through Manchester and even see people who sell the Big Issue stood there smoking. How are they supposed to afford this when they are poor?
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Old 03-07-2010, 23:38
Mystic-Topaz
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ers-unemployed

So this is what the 'big society' means? Leave people to beg for charity? If this is the level our nation has fallen to, I'm trully ashamed

I'm not against food vouchers per se, but they should at least allow people the dignity of using them in Tesco and such. Basically, the government are saying that the poor are no longer welcome in the same shops as 'hard-working families', whatever that means.

Reminds me of this: http://www.channel4.com/programmes/u...2010/episode-9

I'm speechless, and to think millions voted for this.


Where did the article state that ?




I think it is a great idea Stops the poor from spending all their benefits on booze and smoking as most of them do. Nearly every day I walk through Manchester and even see people who sell the Big Issue stood there smoking. How are they supposed to afford this when they are poor?


Agreed !
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Old 03-07-2010, 23:40
hard_to_beat
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I think it is a great idea Stops the poor from spending all their benefits on booze and smoking as most of them do. Nearly every day I walk through Manchester and even see people who sell the Big Issue stood there smoking. How are they supposed to afford this when they are poor?
As I said, it's not the vouchers I have a problem with - I'd argue that a proportional of income support should be made up of food and energy vouchers - but the fact that, in actual fact, they are 'charity' food vouchers is very wrong.

Essentially, the government are handing over responsibility for some of the most vunerable in society to charity. I'd much rather my taxes go to feeding children in poverty than banker's bonuses, but this is what is happening.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:05
Madamfluff
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Isn't there a scheme like that for Asylum seekers, I seem to remember reading an article about Asylum seekers standing outside superrmarkets trying to sell them as the supermarkets did not give cash back which means that if they had a 20 quid voucher and only bought £15 worth of food, they did not get the fiver change back.

The same would happen with vouchers for the unemployed if the big supermarkets got involved, they wouldnt give any cash back if the value of the food was less than the value of the voucher and I bet you anything you like that Tesco and co would charge the Government £25 for every £20 voucher they accepted.

The only solution would be a swipe card a bit like the new fangled gift cards you get, and again the goverment (IE your taxes and mine) would be expected to pay the supermarkets for the kit needed to process the cards
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:11
Biffo the Bear
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Tory and Lib Dem supporters won't be happy until the elderly and vulnerable are begging for spoonfuls of gruel on the street corner, whereupon they and their rich banker friends will remind them about the benefits of selective austerity.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:19
psionic
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What business is it of the state if people spend their dole money on fags and booze or Sky TV, instead of food if they want. The fact is there aren't enough jobs and there are no doubt going to be many more unemployed soon. So are we really going to make people redundant (some of whom have paid taxes all their lives) then hand them food vouchers?
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:20
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It sound very victorian and out of place in the third richest society in the world.and considering the tories where about personal freedoms this smacks of taking the freedom of the unemployed/poor away.

Maybe the bankers who are working in newly nationalised banks be paid in food vouchers, they are the ones who caused this mess.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:28
jackyork
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How are these people who recieve the food parcel going to cook the food, if they have no money for food its highly unlikekly they have the gas or electricity to cook it
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:31
The Snakes
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It sound very victorian and out of place in the third richest society in the world.and considering the tories where about personal freedoms this smacks of taking the freedom of the unemployed/poor away.

Maybe the bankers who are working in newly nationalised banks be paid in food vouchers, they are the ones who caused this mess.
Personal freedoms come with personal responsibilities. People have a responsibility to keep themselves relevent in today's world. To keep learning new skills, and make plans for the future, factoring in different possibilities. Not to just mindlessly turn up at their job every day and act astonished when one day they have no job to go to.

The days of "money for nothing" are long gone. There is no upside to supporting people from cradle to grave no matter what they do with their lives.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:35
mad_dude
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Personal freedoms come with personal responsibilities. People have a responsibility to keep themselves relevent in today's world. To keep learning new skills, and make plans for the future, factoring in different possibilities. Not to just mindlessly turn up at their job every day and act astonished when one day they have no job to go to.

The days of "money for nothing" are long gone. There is no upside to supporting people from cradle to grave no matter what they do with their lives.
And we as a society have a responcibility to treat people with dignity and food aid doesnt do that. We are not the third world.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:40
stud u like
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How are these people who recieve the food parcel going to cook the food, if they have no money for food its highly unlikekly they have the gas or electricity to cook it
Food parcels usually mean mouldy sandwiches that they give to the poor in America.
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:45
BillyNidNod
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Theyll only spend money on drink and cigs so i think its a good idea .Let them prioritise as you cant expect luxuries on benefits
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Old 04-07-2010, 00:48
mad_dude
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Theyll only spend money on drink and cigs so i think its a good idea .Let them prioritise as you cant expect luxuries on benefits
Considering only about 25% of the population smoke that means three quarters of benefit claimants do not smoke. Ignoring that a packet of 200 cigarettes would also cost more than someone would recieve in JSA.
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Old 04-07-2010, 01:18
Vanilla Velvet
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Those in favour of this should remember that they themselves could become unemployed especially with the job cuts we know are coming and may end up having to feel the shame of receiving food vouchers going in to Tescos and having the whole of the shop know that you are unemployed and poor.

This is disgusting. People who have no money because they are unemployed should not be made to feel degraded. Do these people running our country know what its like to become unemployed and the embarrassment some feel receiving JSL and other benefits? Not everyone is cheating the system. What about tax avoiders.

During these draconian cuts many people are going to loose their jobs, homes, friends will turn against them, struggle with less money, fathers may commit suicide which usually happens during such times.

Wish the government would leave the poor alone give them some dignity and remove any idea of giving food vouchers to the poor. They should be ashamed of themselves how many more of these draconian ideas are they going to dish out the poor, housing benefits cut, IB reviews, DLA investigations what more do they want off the poor - why are they made to feel like the guilty people in this society by politicians and the media when the bankers have got off Scott free and dare we mention the politicians expense scandals.

This is going too far now. I am really disgusted by it all and very sick of it all, itís just so depressing and unfair anyone involved in this is cold hearted and mean. I think of vouchers and I see images of labelling people, a status, and people ripe for ridicule and discrimination. This would be so cruel for many who canít help the fact they have become unemployed and poor. If there is any one from the government reading this please think again this is so wrong and ill conceived.
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Old 04-07-2010, 01:31
Biffo the Bear
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Those in favour of this should remember that they themselves could become unemployed especially with the job cuts we know are coming and may end up having to feel the shame of receiving food vouchers going in to Tescos and having the whole of the shop know that you are unemployed and poor.

This is disgusting. People who have no money because they are unemployed should not be made to feel degraded. Do these people running our country know what its like to become unemployed and the embarrassment some feel receiving JSL and other benefits? Not everyone is cheating the system. What about tax avoiders.

During these draconian cuts many people are going to loose their jobs, homes, friends will turn against them, struggle with less money, fathers may commit suicide which usually happens during such times.

Wish the government would leave the poor alone give them some dignity and remove any idea of giving food vouchers to the poor. They should be ashamed of themselves how many more of these draconian ideas are they going to dish out the poor, housing benefits cut, IB reviews, DLA investigations what more do they want off the poor - why are they made to feel like the guilty people in this society by politicians and the media when the bankers have got off Scott free and dare we mention the politicians expense scandals.

This is going too far now. I am really disgusted by it all and very sick of it all, itís just so depressing and unfair anyone involved in this is cold hearted and mean. I think of vouchers and I see images of labelling people, a status, and people ripe for ridicule and discrimination. This would be so cruel for many who canít help the fact they have become unemployed and poor. If there is any one from the government reading this please think again this is so wrong and ill conceived.
Very good post, but unfortunately the Tories and Lib Dems don't care. They've got their ministerial cars and perks for doing three days a week in London. They'll be enjoying the austerity they preach far more than anyone else.
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Old 04-07-2010, 01:35
the.watson
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Beggars can't be choosers.
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Old 04-07-2010, 02:01
Aneechik
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I'm sure people don't read the stories they're moaning about.

This scheme is intended to provide an alternative for people that apply for crisis loans but don't get them, who would currently leave the Jobcentre empty handed and presumably unable to eat.

It in no way is intended to replace any aspect of the current system, it actually supplements it in an area which is currently lacking - how shockingly outrageous
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Old 04-07-2010, 02:03
PrincessPerfect
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I'm sure people don't read the stories they're moaning about.

This scheme is intended to provide an alternative for people that apply for crisis loans but don't get them, who would currently leave the Jobcentre empty handed and presumably unable to eat.

It in no way is intended to replace any aspect of the current system, it actually supplements it in an area which is currently lacking - how shockingly outrageous
Agreed.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:05
The Snakes
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Wish the government would leave the poor alone give them some dignity and remove any idea of giving food vouchers to the poor. They should be ashamed of themselves how many more of these draconian ideas are they going to dish out the poor, housing benefits cut, IB reviews, DLA investigations what more do they want off the poor - why are they made to feel like the guilty people in this society by politicians and the media when the bankers have got off Scott free and dare we mention the politicians expense scandals.
Do you really think the poor should be "left alone" by the government? Think about what that means. No benefits. No public housing. No nothing.

As for the politicians and bankers, do you ever consider what this country would be like if everyone except for the unemployed pissed off and went to live somewhere else? I can tell you what it'd be like. Like the poorest countries in Africa. People would be starving to death in the streets, because the people that ran things wouldn't be there anymore, and the people left wouldn't have a clue how to do things.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:07
The Snakes
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There needs to be a clear delineation between those unemployed people that have paid into the system and have led responsible lives, and those that have spent the boom years scrounging when there were plenty of jobs available for those that wanted them. I have no problem at all with the former recieving benefits.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:31
Carmen Queasy
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If it's going to benefit people who literally can't pay for food from being refused a crisis loan, then there's no problem, is there?

There is Fuel Direct for people who can't pay their utility bills.

There's this for people who can't afford food.

Although I don't agree with living to a basic quality of life (food, water, house and utilities), if worse comes to worse at least this allows people to remain healthy and stops those who want a loan for a night out or their latest hit from getting one.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:32
OLD HIPPY GUY
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coming soon to a city near you, the workhouse, BASTARDS,
keep pushing that's all I will say, do they seriously think people are just going to lie down and take this shit,...really?

there is trouble brewing,
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Old 04-07-2010, 07:44
BarryW1
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Very sensible idea indeed.

I fail to see how someone who smokes heavily, subscribes to Sky and watches it on a 42" tv can possibly be described as poor. Yet only too often this is how those on benefits live These are the kind of thing they should work to obtain. Cutting back away from cash benefits will help force the lazy back to work.
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:00
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I know a transvestite get a crisis loan just to travel up to London to seek sexual gratification with a prostitute who specialises in asphyxiation.
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