[jhlb]

I only use the Panny's inbuilt freeview in the morning to watch BBC News. I am getting a "No Service" message regularly - black screen.
Changing channels and back again solves the problem for a few minutes only.
I have checked all co-ax plugs and the aerial.
Rowridge transmitter; Full retune after all 3 DCO stages.

No such problems in the evenings using Humax Freeview box.
Panasonic is a 37" plasma - 4years old.
NO Service now 8 times this morning in 30 minutes. No such messages yesterday.
What is going on??
J

[chrisy]

Have you monitored the signal quality meter for the problem channels? Tried a different receiver on the same aerial?

[chrisjr]

Is the aerial connected via the Humax? If so and you only get problems when the Humax is in standby check the Power Saving in standby setting.

On my 9150 it's in Preferences - Miscellaneous Settings
On my Fox HDR-T2 its in Settings - System - Power Management

This setting turns off the amp that splits the aerial between the Humax's tuners and the aerial out socket. So normally hardly any signal gets through. Though if the signal is high enough sufficient may leak through for the TV to work part of the time.

The other possibility is the lead from Humax to TV is poor and either screwing the signal up or getting interference from nearby leads.

[jhlb]

Thank you for your replies.....

The problem channels are BBC news and parliament and my Humax works well on the same aerial.

Although the aerial goes through the Humax, all cables are new and made from "satellite" quality double shielded co-ax with new plugs fitted.
I will check the Humax settings but do not see a problem there as I have been using in in the present set up for over 4years. The problem arose only in the last 2 weeks.
Re-checked all cables and co-ax plugs again yesterday and did a full re-tune of the Panny.
No-one suspects the Panny internal tuner then?

J

[chrisjr]

Is it just those two or all the BBC channels? As your area has gone through DSO then all the BBC channels, except the HD ones, are on the same mux. So a reception problem with that mux ought to affect every channel. Unusual for just a couple of channels on a mux to have problems.

One thing to check. Make sure the Panasonic is receiving the correct UHF channels for Rowridge. There is a possibility it could be seeing signals from another transmitter with a weaker signal. The Humax may have latched on to the main Rowridge signals and be getting a "better" version of the BBC mux.

Channels numbers are here
http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/postcodec...meridian/main/

Mind you with Rowridge being at the lower end of the band the Panasonic should see it first during an auto tune and allocate those channels to the normal channel numbers first. But you never know, no harm checking.

Perhaps doing a full factory reset back to the default settings might help, just in case there is something funny going on with the tuning memory. Clearing out the tuning memory before doing a fresh retune can sometimes solve odd reception issues. Even trying the old trick of auto tuning with the aerial unplugged can sometimes help as that should also clear the tuning memory ready for you to retune with the aerial back in.

And talking of the aerial. Just as a test try plugging the aerial direct to the Panasonic bypassing the Humax completely. Always a chance there is something wrong with either the lead between the two or the Humax itself.

[jhlb]

@ chrisjr
Thank you for your further comments.
It's difficult to see which channels are affected as when I change from bbc news to another channel - all is ok, (except for parliament), then when I change back - the bbc news is back too.
When I retuned for DSO, I used manual tuning thus only getting the 5 channels I need from Rowridge.
Notably, today, I had the Panny on bbc news for 1 1/2 hours with no problems.

Will try your other two suggestions should the problem re-occur.
J

[SimonBlackham]

Rowridge is transmitting on both H and V and appears to give them as different TIDs in the NIT (1043 and 104C - perhaps a hangover from the period when they were being transmitted on the two different Rowridge aerials? - V tests on the new Aerial?)

This can lead to copies of all the BBCA MUX channels in the 800 range - the symptom I get is that I cannot get the red button on BBC1 and if I go to the red button from BBC2 or News 24 - then go to 301 and return it will go to a BBC1 in the 800s - currently the second extra copy on 824.

Some of the copies in the 800s (there are up to 4 of each BBC channel) flash off and on and are unwatcheable. The Matsui box upstairs shows the channels on different TIDs and BBC1 is almost always on a different one from all others. The box automatically re-tunes so the problem recurs - and I can never get the red button from BBC1.
I have switched the aerial to a vertically polarized log-periodic to get better COM reception - but the problem persists. It must be something to do with split NIT and/or the alternative TID confusing the box. There are other possible but unlikely explanations - like the frequencies are slightly different and don't exactly match the NIT leading the box to 'hunt' the frequency.

We only get the problem on one STB - the BTvbox and an iDTV are OK (the main set is HD so no problem anyway) - all daisy-chained from the one VP aerial.

This problem may be recorded somewhere as a split-NIT problem on your receiver?

Just checked upstairs and noticed that the CID and TID of BBC1 are the same (1043 or 104C) - all other channels have the same CID on both TIDs. The copy of BBC1 on 824 has a red button.


Apparently there is to be a Rowridge re-tune event in a week or two (others have seen it mentioned but I haven't seen it - maybe something to do with Winterbourne Stickland on May 13th) and maybe it is to correct this problem?
If they just 'corrected' the NIT then a percentage of receivers would lose the MUXA channels if they are using the TID to be dropped?


I would suggest that you let the receiver do an automatic tune then delete the channels you don't want - my Panasonic has a list and you can delete them easily from a list... and maintain your tuning using 'add channels'

Geeky bit...
this actually 'unreferences' them so although it will keep them tuned it won't pester you with them - it also means that you can do an 'add channels' and they will remain 'deleted' - although it will retune all the channels. I have moved the HD channels to their 'correct' places (+BBC HD to 999 and 301 to 998) - and these positionings are maintained through 'add channels' too.

[jhlb]

No problems each day since 2nd May and then this morning I had the same "no service" message - started at 10:00 and happened every 2 minutes after resetting the channels as before.
I have put the aerial lead directly to the TV now and done another manual re-tune on all 5 Rowridge channels - AFTER deleting all the channels that were in the TV's store first, (did this by auto retune with aerial unplugged).
Signal strengh is indicated at MAX by the TV.
J

[Heinz]

Originally Posted by jhlb

No problems each day since 2nd May and then this morning I had the same "no service" message - started at 10:00 and happened every 2 minutes after resetting the channels as before.

Signal strengh is indicated at MAX by the TV

How far are you from Rowridge?

[jhlb]

12.2 miles NNE of Rowridge.
I have been using digital equipment for over 6 years with no problems until recently.
J

[nomis86uk]

Hi

Have you ever found a resolution to this problem?

My neighbour has just started to get the same problem. All BBC channels display "no service" after a few minutes. Changing channels and then back again brings the picture back instantly, but it'll go again in a matter of minutes.

I've performed a full reset of the tv, done a manual tune to the Mendip transmitter, and the signal at the aerial is perfect, I've ran a new fly lead direct from the aerial to the tv with solid connections and it's still there.

Sounds like the same fault to me, but I'm stumped, hoping you found a fix?

Cheers

[joshua_welby]

Originally Posted by nomis86uk

Hi

Have you ever found a resolution to this problem?

My neighbour has just started to get the same problem. All BBC channels display "no service" after a few minutes. Changing channels and then back again brings the picture back instantly, but it'll go again in a matter of minutes.

I've performed a full reset of the tv, done a manual tune to the Mendip transmitter, and the signal at the aerial is perfect, I've ran a new fly lead direct from the aerial to the tv with solid connections and it's still there.

Sounds like the same fault to me, but I'm stumped, hoping you found a fix?

Cheers

How old is your Freeview equipment?

It sounds like you might have a split NIT problem, my very old box does this, my Freeview box is from 2005, so no surprises there

[nomis86uk]

Originally Posted by joshua_welby

How old is your Freeview equipment?

It sounds like you might have a split NIT problem, my very old box does this, my Freeview box is from 2005, so no surprises there

It's the built in tuner in the Panasonic, not sure how old it is without checking next door but I'd guess around 3 or 4 years old judging by the design. Can you explain what the blinking heck a split NIT is? I'm a satellite engineer, I could line up a dish by eye but manual retunes and picture and sound settings is about as far as I go with tvs

[rc.uk]

I've started having this exact same problem this evening. I was watching BBC News and it kept going black and dispaying 'no service'. However, upon checking the signal strength and quality, both are 10/10. Switching to another BBC channel doesn't do anything, but switching to a completely different multiplex and back again brings back the picture on BBC channels. It only seems to affect BBC channels, as I've had ITV1 on for ages now and it's fine.

My TV is a Panasonic TX-L26X10B and is about 4 years old if memory serves me right, and it's tuned to Winter Hill.

Is this something that's curable, or will I have to get a new TV?

[joshua_welby]

Originally Posted by nomis86uk

It's the built in tuner in the Panasonic, not sure how old it is without checking next door but I'd guess around 3 or 4 years old judging by the design. Can you explain what the blinking heck a split NIT is? I'm a satellite engineer, I could line up a dish by eye but manual retunes and picture and sound settings is about as far as I go with tvs

The Split NIT problem is when the Freeview equipment changes slowly or not regognise some Freeview channels because a few years ago they split the NIT,
NIT stands for Network Information Table this is the information that is sent from the Transmitters (Muxes - for tech savy people) to the Freeview equipment to send to the EPG
- the software on the Freeview equipment - it used to be sent all in one part but now it is sent in two parts - hence the split and why we are calling it split
- it is all to technical for most people including me, as I am not sure about all the equipment inside the transmitter buildings, I have seen a new one inside of course,
but no photos were allowed and they would not show me round most of it, just the bits around the entrance

The inside of the TVs have changed since the CRT days

Analogue TVs - CRT
Analogue Tuner - limited range of UHF channels - now turned off in most parts of the country

Flat Screens - LCD/LED/OLED/Plasma
Analogue AND Digital Tuners - full or semi full range of UHF channels
Software Inside for all sorts of Menus and Functions
MHEG5 Software for Red Button services and Captions on the screen telling you that a channel will launch soon or telling you to retune your TV, etc

[joshua_welby]

Originally Posted by rc.uk

I've started having this exact same problem this evening. I was watching BBC News and it kept going black and dispaying 'no service'. However, upon checking the signal strength and quality, both are 10/10. Switching to another BBC channel doesn't do anything, but switching to a completely different multiplex and back again brings back the picture on BBC channels. It only seems to affect BBC channels, as I've had ITV1 on for ages now and it's fine.

My TV is a Panasonic TX-L26X10B and is about 4 years old if memory serves me right, and it's tuned to Winter Hill.

Is this something that's curable, or will I have to get a new TV?

You have the same problem as mine

Phone up Panasonic Techincal/Customer Support and see what they say

You could always get a new Freeview HD box/recorder and plug it into a the TV if you do not want to buy a new TV

[lbear]

have you ruled out the possibility of signal overload?

[rc.uk]

Originally Posted by joshua_welby

You have the same problem as mine

Phone up Panasonic Techincal/Customer Support and see what they say

You could always get a new Freeview HD box/recorder and plug it into a the TV if you do not want to buy a new TV

Thanks for those suggestions. I'll give it a mull over. Ideally I want to avoid extra boxes and especially ones which wake up during the night, as this TV's in a bedroom. It might be time for me to upgrade it anyway, as much more interactive TVs are available these days, which can do much more than the Panasonic.

Originally Posted by lbear

have you ruled out the possibility of signal overload?

Unquestionably not signal overload. I've had this aerial since 2007 (i.e. longer than the TV itself) and none of my equipment has ever exhibited any signs of either too little or too much signal. My old aerial (an anti-ghosting grid) was indeed unsuitable but since the newer one was installed everything's been perfect until tonight, and we went through DSO in 2009.

[jhlb]

I have not seen the no service message for some time now. I guess it was to do with DSO???
J

[AngusMast]

Three people with this problem since yesterday? Could be due to BBC Mux reconfiguration.

A 'shipping condition' reset would be my course of action, and if that doesn't sort it, phone Panasonic.

[Mark C]

Originally Posted by AngusMast

Three people with this problem since yesterday? Could be due to BBC Mux reconfiguration.

A 'shipping condition' reset would be my course of action, and if that doesn't sort it, phone Panasonic.

Other forums are reporting the same problem. It's almost certainly the reconfiguration of BBC Mux 1 back to the pre Olympics config. Run a reset, and rescan.

[Richard.]

I had this problem, for the first time, yesterday evening, and it only affected BBC1 and BBC2, as far as I could tell.
Is it only Panasonic TV s which are affected?
Fortunately, I was able to watch BBC1 through Sky.

[jhlb]

I spoke too soon in Post #19. My TV had No Service message again at 09:01.
I note that if I disconnect the aerial the message is "No signal" which is rather different.
J

[Mark C]

Originally Posted by jhlb

I spoke too soon in Post #19. My TV had No Service message again at 09:01.
I note that if I disconnect the aerial the message is "No signal" which is rather different.
J

Have you reset, and run a rescan yet ?

[rc.uk]

Originally Posted by Mark C

Have you reset, and run a rescan yet ?

I have, several times... sadly makes no difference whatsoever