[Theshane]

Originally Posted by my name is joe

I get the feeling some people won't give Adele any credit until she writes all the lyrics and all the music, plays all the instruments, designs the artwork, presses the CD, and drives the lorries to deliver it to the shops

then she'll indisputably be an artist

The inability to read on this forum is amazing at times.
Nobody is disputing 'credit'
What is being disputed is a person who writes as a team wining a solo writing award.
No one is disputing that she wrote it. No one is disputing that at all.
Just that not solo writing disqualifies you from winning a solo writing award.
No one mentioned playing instruments or producing or anything else. It is about the award.
No credit thieving, hiding or withholding.

[geordielady]

Originally Posted by my name is joe

so she got it for her part of the process, it's not that hard to understand. And if the co-writers aren't upset they got overlooked i don't see why anyone should be on their behalf

How can she get it for her part of the process as the people voting on this award would not know what she has done, only adele + her army of songwriters know how much input she had. Thats why the award can only be given to a solo songwriter.

[scrilla]

Just some personal views ... Award shows are always rubbish. Every last one of them. Have been for as long as I remember. Too much politics behind the scenes. I don't know why people expect them to even try to genuinely represent what is best.

There's nothing wrong with being a co-writer, or even a singer who never composes songs. However, there is something very wrong with an awards event that will give a 'songwriter' award to someone who composed as part of a team. Incredible! Where is the research?

Personally I would feel uncomfortable collecting an award for my work if there was a team involved in it. I would want to bring the other people involved to the stage to share the credit.

[rbautz]

Originally Posted by geordielady

The award is called songwriter not songwriters, adele winning this award has made the award pointless as its been awarded to someone who dont fit the awards criteria, maybe next year bands where mutiple band members write songs could be considered, they may as well now.

Oh, sh... happens. First day on the board an I have GL on my neck.

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by my name is joe

so she got it for her part of the process, it's not that hard to understand. And if the co-writers aren't upset they got overlooked i don't see why anyone should be on their behalf

What part of the process is hers?
Where's the list that shows who did what were?
And like I asked above is the album a mess of best of the year songwriting mixed with meh parts that Adele didn't write?
Or do all the songs flow and fit together almost as if written in a writing partnership or song writing team?

[my name is joe]

Originally Posted by geordielady

How can she get it for her part of the process as the people voting on this award would not know what she has done, only adele + her army of songwriters know how much input she had. Thats why the award can only be given to a solo songwriter.

who knows what really goes on in the studio musicians can be very sneaky like that...the swines

I don't know why her peers voted for her you'll have to tweet them all and ask if they feel duped that they didn't know she had help. Actually i wonder if PJ voted for Adele, i remember she thought 21 should win the Mercury so it's possible

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by scrilla

Just some personal views ... Award shows are always rubbish. Every last one of them. Have been for as long as I remember. Too much politics behind the scenes. I don't know why people expect them to even try to genuinely represent what is best.

There nothing wrong with being a co-writer, or even a singer who never composes songs. However, there is something very wrong with an awards event that will give a 'songwriter' award to someone who composed as part of a team. Incredible! Where is the research?

Personally I would feel uncomfortable collecting an award for my work if there was a team involved in it. I would want to bring the other people involved to the stage to share the credit.

Sir or Madam, where have you been for the last few hours?

[my name is joe]

Originally Posted by Theshane

What part of the process is hers?
Where's the list that shows who did what were?
And like I asked above is the album a mess of best of the year songwriting mixed with meh parts that Adele didn't write?
Or do all the songs flow and fit together almost as if written in a writing partnership or song writing team?

i neither know nor care, and i doubt anyone who voted did either...they just went for what they rated highest. I imagine they're all very familiar with the process of a songs conception and expect they understand it's rarely a linear process from one persons mind to the can

[geordielady]

Originally Posted by my name is joe

who knows what really goes on in the studio musicians can be very sneaky like that...the swines

I don't know why her peers voted for her you'll have to tweet them all and ask if they feel duped that they didn't know she had help. Actually i wonder if PJ voted for Adele, i remember she thought 21 should win the Mercury so it's possible

Maybe they had their arms twisted who knows. I mean its not adeles fault she has been given this award but everything aside you have to question the logic of it, all it has done is cheapen the value of the award, its an award one person should receive not a team.
If adele had written even half of 21 on her own then her getting the award would have had some merit but she has not written one single track on her own, you cant blame people for questioning it.

[rbautz]

Originally Posted by my name is joe

i neither know nor care, and i doubt anyone who voted did either...they just went for what they rated highest. I imagine they're all very familiar with the process of a songs conception and expect they understand it's rarely a linear process from one persons mind to the can

here is the link for writnh someone like you

http://www.americansongwriter.com/2012/01/the-story-behind-the-song-adele-%e2%80%9csomeone-like-you%e2%80%9d/

and for one and only

http://www.americansongwriter.com/2011/11/adele-one-and-only/

[my name is joe]

Originally Posted by geordielady

Maybe they had their arms twisted who knows. I mean its not adeles fault she has been given this award but everything aside you have to question the logic of it, all it has done is cheapen the value of the award, its an award one person should receive not a team.
If adele had written even half of 21 on her own then her getting the award would have had some merit but she has not written one single track on her own, you cant blame people for questioning it.

i'm sure the Ivor Novello people are very touched at how concerned you are about the prestige of their award and if you let them know they may promise not to cheapen it again next year...or they might inform all the musicians voting to think more carefully. That way we won't get these terrible injustices anymore and Taylor can walk home with her arms full of figurines

[scrilla]

Originally Posted by Theshane

Sir or Madam, where have you been for the last few hours?

(Sir ) I was out visiting my mum.



I was reading this 'army of songwriters' phrase repeatedly and thought I'd have a look and see...

It appears that on 21, out of eleven tracks, there is one cover version, nine tracks written by Adele and one other person and one track written by Adele and two others.

However on 19, out of the twelve tracks Adele wrote six tracks alone, wrote four tracks with one other writer and wrote one track as part of a team, with one cover version.

These are the ones credited to her alone: Daydreamer, Best for Last, Crazy for You, First Love, My Same, Hometown Glory

So cleary she has a track record as a solo songwriter but giving her such an award for for 21 would be misleading.

[my name is joe]

Originally Posted by scrilla

(Sir ) I was out visiting my mum.



I was reading this 'army of songwriters' phrase repeatedly and thought I'd have a look and see...

It appears that on 21, out of eleven tracks, there is one cover version, nine tracks written by Adele and one other person and one track written by Adele and two others.

However on 19, out of the twelve tracks Adele wrote six tracks alone, wrote four tracks with one other writer and wrote one track as part of a team, with one cover version.

These are the ones credited to her alone: Daydreamer, Best for Last, Crazy for You, First Love, My Same, Hometown Glory

So cleary she has a track record as a solo songwriter but giving her such an award for for 21 would be misleading.

not much of an army though

[Hav_mor91]

Originally Posted by geordielady

Maybe they had their arms twisted who knows. I mean its not adeles fault she has been given this award but everything aside you have to question the logic of it, all it has done is cheapen the value of the award, its an award one person should receive not a team.
If adele had written even half of 21 on her own then her getting the award would have had some merit but she has not written one single track on her own, you cant blame people for questioning it.

Lily Allen won it in 2010 was never such a fuss then oh wait she hadn't sold 20+ million albums and is considered cool so i am questioning's peoples reasons wholeheartedly

[yellowlabbie]

Originally Posted by Hav_mor91

Lily Allen won it in 2010 was never such a fuss then oh wait she hadn't sold 20+ million albums and is considered cool so i am questioning's peoples reasons wholeheartedly

I don't need to question people's reasons, it is obvious they dislike her and will go to any lengths to discredit her and just because she sometimes beats their favourites.

I love Kate Bush and would never 'slag her off'. PJ, on the other hand, I find boring and dreary but, yet again, I would never slag her off. I understand that some think she is great, that is their choice as music is an individual choice.

I find it extremely sad that some people keep coming back, day after day, month after month just to try and discredit Adele. It does them no favours, it just makes them sound bitter and jealolus,

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by yellowlabbie

I don't need to question people's reasons, it is obvious they dislike her and will go to any lengths to discredit her and just because she sometimes beats their favourites.

I love Kate Bush and would never 'slag her off'. PJ, on the other hand, I find boring and dreary but, yet again, I would never slag her off. I understand that some think she is great, that is their choice as music is an individual choice.

I find it extremely sad that some people keep coming back, day after day, month after month just to try and discredit Adele. It does them no favours, it just makes them sound bitter and jealolus,

I find it amazing people see discrediting when there was none and it was repeatedly pointed out that there was no discrediting.
No dispute about her cowriting or singing or anything.
Just a dispute about awarding a solo award to part of a group effort.
Or is there a secret code that was hidden in what were typing that I cannot find?
I find it extremely sad that people can imagine things that were not typed even after having had it pointed out several times that they were not typed.
Why not imagine a whole forum in your head where everyone agrees and doesnt dispute anything?

[Smudged]

Originally Posted by Theshane

I find it amazing people see discrediting when there was none and it was repeatedly pointed out that there was no discrediting.
No dispute about her cowriting or singing or anything.
Just a dispute about awarding a solo award to part of a group effort.
Or is there a secret code that was hidden in what were typing that I cannot find?
I find it extremely sad that people can imagine things that were not typed even after having had it pointed out several times that they were not typed.
Why not imagine a whole forum in your head where everyone agrees and doesnt dispute anything?

Exactly. Strange behaviour from some Adele fans imo. Like they can't accept other people's opinions and take everyting as a personal attack on Adele. I've seen four or five different Adele fans in the last few days feeling the need to tell someone that their opinion isn't fact .

[konebyvax]

Originally Posted by Theshane

I find it amazing people see discrediting when there was none and it was repeatedly pointed out that there was no discrediting.
No dispute about her cowriting or singing or anything.
Just a dispute about awarding a solo award to part of a group effort.
Or is there a secret code that was hidden in what were typing that I cannot find?
I find it extremely sad that people can imagine things that were not typed even after having had it pointed out several times that they were not typed.
Why not imagine a whole forum in your head where everyone agrees and doesnt dispute anything?

You do seem a bit obsessed with her though, Shane Genuinely haven't checked but I would wager the vast majority of your posts on DS in the last 24/48 hours would be Adele related. No? Why would someone you profess to not exactly care for take up so much of your DS time? Genuine question as I'm genuinely curious. It's not like you are going to change any fan's mind, is it? At least I admit I'm obsessed with her. But, you see, I really like her.

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by konebyvax

You do seem a bit obsessed with her though, Shane Genuinely haven't checked but I would wager the vast majority of your posts on DS in the last 24/48 hours would be Adele related. No? Why would someone you profess to not exactly care for take up so much of your DS time? Genuine question as I'm genuinely curious. It's not like you are going to change any fan's mind, is it? At least I admit I'm obsessed with her. But, you see, I really like her.

I posted and someone responded. So I responded to that and someone responded and so it goes.
Thats how a discussion thread works.

[Hav_mor91]

Originally Posted by Smudged

Exactly. Strange behaviour from some Adele fans imo. Like they can't accept other people's opinions and take everyting as a personal attack on Adele. I've seen four or five different Adele fans in the last few days feeling the need to tell someone that their opinion isn't fact .

And vice versa i find it quite odd that through out this convo people have criticised Adeles win an praised that of their favourite Pj whilst failing to mention Kate so its obvious how people can feel that Adele could win anything deservingly to some but to the majority be hugely discredited and bashed for it regardless.

And thats some not all i have no issue with you hating Adele its your Prerogative all music is subjective (if on the fringes and having sold two copies )

[konebyvax]

Originally Posted by Theshane

I posted and someone responded. So I responded to that and someone responded and so it goes.
Thats how a discussion thread works.

Just for the record, you don't accept you have an Adele Obsession? It doesn't mean you like her, by the way.

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by konebyvax

Just for the record, you don't accept you have an Adele Obsession? It doesn't mean you like her, by the way.

I have an obession with folk not being able to tell the difference between a singular and a plural.
Songwriter and songwriters.

No one was slagging Adele off last night. Just pointing out that the award she got she should have got.
No one, as far as I can recal, tried to take any credit away from her or slag her.
Just that as part of a writing group or team she shouldn't have won a solo award. Especailly when Kate and Polly did write on their own.
I even suggested that the fault may lie with the Ivors for either cocking up or incorrectly naming their award.

[konebyvax]

Originally Posted by Theshane

I have an obession with folk not being able to tell the difference between a singular and a plural.
Songwriter and songwriters.

No one was slagging Adele off last night. Just pointing out that the award she got she should have got.
No one, as far as I can recal, tried to take any credit away from her or slag her.
Just that as part of a writing group or team she shouldn't have won a solo award. Especailly when Kate and Polly did write on their own.
I even suggested that the fault may lie with the Ivors for either cocking up or incorrectly naming their award.

So you rate Adele as an artist but think the Ivors just got it wrong this time? And what %tage of your total posts on DS would you think are about Adele?

[my name is joe]

Originally Posted by Theshane

I have an obession with folk not being able to tell the difference between a singular and a plural.
Songwriter and songwriters.

No one was slagging Adele off last night. Just pointing out that the award she got she should have got.
No one, as far as I can recal, tried to take any credit away from her or slag her.
Just that as part of a writing group or team she shouldn't have won a solo award. Especailly when Kate and Polly did write on their own.
I even suggested that the fault may lie with the Ivors for either cocking up or incorrectly naming their award.

perhaps they decided the part Adele contributed was of a higher quality than the larger part the other 2 wrote. We can't go down the path of thinking that the more a person writes of a song the better their songwriting is. A song wholly written by one person is as likely to be crap as one written by 3.

so repeating myself here, maybe they gave her the award for her songwriting skills, not the writing of the whole songs. I have no idea to what degree they're aware of who wrote which bit but if some posters on here can be fully informed about that (& they seem to think they are)i don't see why they shouldn't have been

http://www.bmi.com/musicworld/entry/..._always_matter

[Theshane]

Originally Posted by konebyvax

So you rate Adele as an artist but think the Ivors just got it wrong this time? And what %tage of your total posts on DS would you think are about Adele?

That wasn't what I said.
I said they got it wrong by giving a songwriter award to someone who didn't write solo but as a group.
And I didn't say I rate her. I just didn't dispute she cowrote and sang on her album.
As for percentage, who cares, more than 1 less than a 100, approx.

And the real point of this thread isn't really about Adele. Its about how the award was given out.
Dozier wouldn't have picked up a solo writing award when working with Holland I and Holland II would he?
The Oscars wouldn't have awarded one of the Sherman Brothers for Best Song.
The NTA's wouldn't award Ant and not Dec.
(feel free to insert your own person from a group or partnership wining a solo award when they arent solo)