[bean999]

I don't know, I'd probably disagree slightly. Nothing would be better for GB Taekwondo than a gold medal. For their funding, well, for every kind of reason. You'd think they would pick the best guy.

I agree Muhammad is under ridiculous pressure, it's very unfortunate.

[Tiger Rose]

Originally Posted by bean999

Interesting article in Private Eye about this selection story. So Aaron Cook has Visa and British Airways as sponsors, who also happen to be financial backers of the BOA. Redgrave and Tanni Grey-Thompson have been huffing about this, they're corporate ambassadors for Team Visa. Meanwhile Pinsent ↑ and Cook have the same agent. So as PE summarizes the BOA are trying to obtain selection for an athlete financed by their own sponsors, with some other shared or vested interests chipping in.

So if there's a stitch-up there may be a stitch-up on both sides. In fairness to GB Taekwondo they added a Korean guy to their selection team before again picking Muhammad. Presumably he doesn't have a vested interest.

That argument is as spurious as those that GB Taekwondo have come up with. Lots of athletes have links with official Olympic sponsors.

[bean999]

Well, I've changed 180 degrees on this one. I don't accept that the team would pick the guy less likely to medal just out of spite. As for athletes sharing sponsors with the BOA, it looks like an issue if the BOA try to overturn the sport's governing body.

I think there's more to this story than the one doing the rounds atm. For example here's something a bit more balanced:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18365361

Interesting comments by Steve Peters who also works with the Cycling Team.

[Paradise_Lost]

From your link:

"We all agreed that if world ranking and success in tournaments were the only selection criteria, then Aaron would be selected as he's an outstanding athlete who could get gold at the Olympics.

"All we're saying is that there are two athletes who can achieve this. Lutalo is improving at a rate of knots and has potential which hasn't been tapped," said Peters.

One's case is based on results and achievements at the highest level. The other's case is based on speculation. Conjecture. Projections. "Potential." Why not settle it with a fight? Surely if Lutalo is the superior prospect he should win and vindicate the committee. Many knowledgeable people within the sport of Taekwondo around the world are baffled by the selection. So it's clearly not a case of hysteria fueled by ignorance. These are the dangers of Olympic selection by appointed committee.

[Tiger Rose]

Originally Posted by Paradise_Lost

From your link:



One's case is based on results and achievements at the highest level. The other's case is based on speculation. Conjecture. Projections. "Potential." Why not settle it with a fight? Surely if Lutalo is the superior prospect he should win and vindicate the committee. Many knowledgeable people within the sport of Taekwondo around the world are baffled by the selection. So it's clearly not a case of hysteria fueled by ignorance. These are the dangers of Olympic selection by appointed committee.

And a lot of the conjencture, potential call it what you will seems to be based on Muhammad's performance in training. He may well be on fire in training but again there is an inherent bias against Aaron Cook because he is not part of the programme so they are not seeing him in training all the time as they are with Muhammad.

[maninthequeue]

Originally Posted by bean999

Well, I've changed 180 degrees on this one. I don't accept that the team would pick the guy less likely to medal just out of spite. As for athletes sharing sponsors with the BOA, it looks like an issue if the BOA try to overturn the sport's governing body.

I think there's more to this story than the one doing the rounds atm. For example here's something a bit more balanced:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18365361

Interesting comments by Steve Peters who also works with the Cycling Team.

What a load of bull....t.

Until quite recent the identity on the selection panel was a mystery. The governing body had not publicised this and this despite their reliance on public money - tax payers' money. Even the BOA struggled to discover the men behind Aaron Cook's omission. What is more the selection criteria continues to remains opaque. No transparency here then. But why, I hear you ask, would GB TKD wish to keep its selection committee a secret and for the third time of asking not pick Aaron to fight at the London Olympics 2012? Could it be that it is made up of cartoon characters so hopelessly compromised on the main issue surrounding Aaron Cook?

Gary Hall, Joseph Salim, Steve Jennings, Paul Green and Dr Steve Peters are the men responsible for selecting GB TKD team and complicit in ruining a young man's chances of Olympic Glory.

Gary Hall is the British TKD's overall performance director whose methods Cook rejected.

Joseph Salim is the coach responsible for the under 80kg programme and is the personal coach of Muhammad.

Steve Jennings is married to Sarah Stevenson, a world champion, operating very much inside the GB TKD programme.

Paul Green is a former international TKD athlete once coached by Gary Hall.

Dr Steven Peters is a non-executive director responsible for assembling the methods which Gary Hall has implemented.

No impartiality in this ivory tower then.

Since deciding to opt out of the so-called "elite training program" Aaron effectively though unintentionally gave two fingers to the coaching methods and dislocated the noses of GB TKD officialdom. Aaron trains in a home-made gym in his parents' back garden and assemble his own support team. As a result Cook won nine of the last 12 under 80kg world series TKD tournaments to become the world number one.

Even the Conservative Party would be embarrassed by this appalling cronyism.

[bean999]

↑ maninthequeue, you're right Aaron Cook is outside GB Taekwondo, but you haven't said how this is possible.

He's on his own because of the sponsorship he's managed to attract, which allows him to train at home with his own team. It also has him subject to some direction from his sponsors, who want a return for their investment. In other words he's essentially a professional athlete in an amateur sport.

To me this is the interesting point. If Aaron Cook went to the Olympics he wouldn't be representing GB Taekwondo (or the taxpayer), or the British Olympic team as a whole, but essentially himself and his sponsors (some of whom he shares with the BOA). I think it's a relevant question who picks the team; the governing body or the athlete himself together with his sponsors and connected parties.

[grassmarket]

Originally Posted by bean999

↑ maninthequeue, you're right Aaron Cook is outside GB Taekwondo, but you haven't said how this is possible.

He's on his own because of the sponsorship he's managed to attract, which allows him to train at home with his own team. It also has him subject to some direction from his sponsors, who want a return for their investment. In other words he's essentially a professional athlete in an amateur sport.

So what you are saying is that as a result of his success he is better at fund-raising than the others? In the same way that Manchester United raise more money than Grimsby Town?

[Tiger Rose]

Originally Posted by bean999

↑ maninthequeue, you're right Aaron Cook is outside GB Taekwondo, but you haven't said how this is possible.

He's on his own because of the sponsorship he's managed to attract, which allows him to train at home with his own team. It also has him subject to some direction from his sponsors, who want a return for their investment. In other words he's essentially a professional athlete in an amateur sport.

To me this is the interesting point. If Aaron Cook went to the Olympics he wouldn't be representing GB Taekwondo (or the taxpayer), or the British Olympic team as a whole, but essentially himself and his sponsors (some of whom he shares with the BOA). I think it's a relevant question who picks the team; the governing body or the athlete himself together with his sponsors and connected parties.

Well according to this article muhammad is now being used in 1 of the sponsors videos at the Team GB preparation camp - puts this silly theory to bed I think.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...sociation.html

And just because an athlete has sponsorship it doesn't meant they're not representing Team GB - will Jess Ennis, Becky Adlington, Mo Farah, Zara Phillips & all the other high profile athletes with sponsorship still be representing Team GB in your opinion?

And thankfully the distinction between amateur & professional athletes has long gone at the Olympics. Even the 'amateur' boxers are funded & train full time nowadays.

[maninthequeue]

Originally Posted by bean999

↑ maninthequeue, you're right Aaron Cook is outside GB Taekwondo, but you haven't said how this is possible.

He's on his own because of the sponsorship he's managed to attract, which allows him to train at home with his own team. It also has him subject to some direction from his sponsors, who want a return for their investment. In other words he's essentially a professional athlete in an amateur sport.

To me this is the interesting point. If Aaron Cook went to the Olympics he wouldn't be representing GB Taekwondo (or the taxpayer), or the British Olympic team as a whole, but essentially himself and his sponsors (some of whom he shares with the BOA). I think it's a relevant question who picks the team; the governing body or the athlete himself together with his sponsors and connected parties.

Answer: It should ALWAYS be the athlete with the best chance of winning a medal. Period. To not select The World #1, and select the Worlds #59 instead is like saying Sierra Leone (FIFA Ranked #59) stand a greater chance of winning the next Football World Cup than Spain or Lukas Lacko (Slovakia) (Tennis ATP #59) stands a greater chance of winning Wimbledon than Novak Djokovic; etc.

[alanwarwic]

Originally Posted by maninthequeue

..... As a result Cook won nine of the last 12 under 80kg world series TKD tournaments to become the world number one.

Even the Conservative Party would be embarrassed by this appalling cronyism.

That selection panel was very embarrassing. Abstaining was no doubt a survival method of those compromised.

One can't help but think of some infamous president Bush words as to what came later.

[bean999]

Ah well, I can see I'm not going to change anybody's mind, although that's not really the point, just airing an opinion.

Another thing that occurs to me is wrong with this picture atm, if Aaron Cooke was being slighted out of sheer spite, so the story goes... that's not supported by his selection for the European champs last month at his preferred weight, and requesting Muhammad go up a weight division (ie so they could select both of them). In the end they both won gold, which also suggests the wild discrepancy in their rankings is a bit misleading.

[maninthequeue]

Originally Posted by bean999

Ah well, I can see I'm not going to change anybody's mind, although that's not really the point, just airing an opinion.

Another thing that occurs to me is wrong with this picture atm, if Aaron Cooke was being slighted out of sheer spite, so the story goes... that's not supported by his selection for the European champs last month at his preferred weight, and requesting Muhammad go up a weight division (ie so they could select both of them). In the end they both won gold, which also suggests the wild discrepancy in their rankings is a bit misleading.

But that's because for the European championships Aaron Cook qualified for the event because he was the highest ranked GB TKD fighter at that weight via tournament contests, hence Team GB TKD had no say over whom their representative was at that event in stark contrast to the Olympic Games ....

Thankfully, this story is not going away quietly:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/oly...-fighting.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...on-appeal.html

[alanwarwic]

Originally Posted by bean999

In the end they both won gold, which also suggests the wild discrepancy in their rankings is a bit misleading.

It was a non Olympic weight so no one of any rank turned up.
They were all getting beat where it mattered.

"The Spanish language website MasTaekwondo published a story in February, sourced to un-named British taekwondo sources, that said Cook was likely to be overlooked for the Olympics because of his decision to train alone."

"Claudio Aranda, claims to have received the information from the British sources at a conference the previous August in Mercia."

[Inspiration]

Aaron has been forced to abandon his appeal as he has run out of legal funds.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18644286

[Tiger Rose]

Feel absolutely gutted for Aaron. This could have been the pinnacle of his career & potentially life changing unlike that other person whose omission from Team GB is getting acres of media coverage.

I hope he continues in the sport & if he finds an Irish granny or whatever and decides to fight for them in the future I wouldnt blame him one bit the way he has been treated.

I also hope some changes come out of this - in future not one penny of funding should go to a sport unless it has open & transparant selection procedures.

[Videostar]

Originally Posted by TheFridge

Just read the the person who has been selected ahead of him his World number 93

Brilliant isn't it, we've actually found a sports governing body thats even worse than Football's.

[bean999]

Sorry guys, not trying to be difficult, but partly because I'm suspicious of media campaigns and partly seeing some recent selection controversies in other sports I still don't buy this story.

One thing that I've noticed is that the Olympics in a funny way is not about the individual athlete. The Olympics is set up between the IOC and its member organisations. Standards are set by a sport's international governing body, the national governing bodies apply those standards with their own criteria, those criteria are subject to review by the international body and the national Olympic committee (in the UK the BOA). The governing body submits their team to the BOA which queries them/ratifies them, and they send the team lists to the IOC.

In other words the Olympics is not an 'Open' event. For example half the best sprinters and distance runners in the world won't be there (Americans/Jamaicans/Kenyans) because of the way the Olympics are structured.

That's a kind of underlying issue for me, because there are some athletes who through sponsors are virtually independent contractors. Generally though most fully professional sports are not represented at the Olympics. Most Olympic sports are semi-pro or virtually amateur. Where athletes are paid, they're funded, ie they're dependant on their governing body.

Anyway Aaron is one of the more financially independent athletes, but even he needs to operate within the general framework. Critically for him the BOA which began by batting on his behalf, then withdrew its support:

The move has been investigated by the BOA and, while they feel selectors acted properly, they were disappointed by the way the issue has been handled. "There are two world-class athletes directly impacted by this nomination," read a statement issued by the BOA. "That said, after a thorough review, the panel is now sufficiently satisfied that the agreed selection procedures have been followed, and it is on that basis we are ratifying the nomination." ~ bbc

[Tiger Rose]

The thing is with all the other selection 'controversies' there is some logic behind them even if you don't agree with the decisions made. But there appears to be no logic involved in Cook's non selection which is why so much noise has been made about this one.