[hungover]

Originally Posted by Batwing

So while Apple's claim was technically correct I agree with the decision to get rid of it so as to not confuse the novice or average computer user, though 'm not too crazy about the wording of the new one either.

It is evident that the main problem here is that Apple applies different meaning to words even in the same paragraph depending on what lie they are trying to spin.

They used to slag off windows and go on claim that there were 114000 viruses on windows and none on OSX.

So when it came to windows they referred to all windows malware as viruses but didn't apply the same definition to OSX malware.

They do the same with PC, they are happy for ipads to be referred to as PCs when they are gushing about market penetration/adoption, and then make a distinction between MACs and PCs (without excluding other *NIX variants) when they want to slag off windows

IMO all of this is designed to fool the potential customer.

[wildphantom!]

I've just downloaded the new Mountain Lion Preview 4 and it comes with the Mountain Lions' Security Update system which does daily checks on security.

1. Daily Checks for required security updates

2. The ability to install required security updates automatically or after restarting your Mac

3. A more secure connection to Apple's update servers.

This includes Apple's new Gatekeeper in Mountain Lion.

Apple seems to be taking security a step further with OS X ML and not just staying with the old system but actively improving it for all users in the new OS.

[Batwing]

Originally Posted by DotNetWill

What like a pigeon? I think most, esp whoever,hey, know you can't run an ,exe* on OSX. I think the point is more how would the virus transmit itself without you have some kind malware.

If you're referring to you can send a doc/pdf/a.n other file to a Windows that may contain some kind of exploit I would say that's something different. Because you have to perform that action.

I was responding to someone else and what they specifically said. My response was correct.

Originally Posted by DotNetWill

*A very naive statement, for example mono can produce .exes that run on OSX.

Circumventing the norm is not the point though. Please read what I was responding to.

[Batwing]

Originally Posted by hungover

It is evident that the main problem here is that Apple applies different meaning to words even in the same paragraph depending on what lie they are trying to spin.

Their previous claim was not a 'lie."

Originally Posted by hungover

They used to slag off windows and go on claim that there were 114000 viruses on windows and none on OSX.

I don't know where you got those numbers but once again they are correct. There is no currently known virus out there for Macs.

Originally Posted by hungover

So when it came to windows they referred to all windows malware as viruses but didn't apply the same definition to OSX malware.

Their previous claim only addressed viruses. Viruses is not synonymous with malware. A virus is simply a type of malware.

Originally Posted by hungover

They do the same with PC, they are happy for ipads to be referred to as PCs when they are gushing about market penetration/adoption, and then make a distinction between MACs and PCs (without excluding other *NIX variants) when they want to slag off windows

Sorry but you lost me on the last part.

Originally Posted by hungover

IMO all of this is designed to fool the potential customer.

I've already said that I wasn't a fan of their previous statement, even though it was technically true, and I am not a fan of the new statement, if it is the way I have read it through others since I have not checked it. That said Apple is certainly not the only company in the industry that suffers from occasional lapses in marketing wisdom or oversight. I still think they are the best, over all, in that regard.

[Batwing]

Originally Posted by wildphantom!

I've just downloaded the new Mountain Lion Preview 4 and it comes with the Mountain Lions' Security Update system which does daily checks on security.

1. Daily Checks for required security updates

2. The ability to install required security updates automatically or after restarting your Mac

3. A more secure connection to Apple's update servers.

This includes Apple's new Gatekeeper in Mountain Lion.

Apple seems to be taking security a step further with OS X ML and not just staying with the old system but actively improving it for all users in the new OS.

Yes, the Gatekeeper system should help dramatically, especially for the average or typical user. I suspect Microsoft will also be following Apple in that regard.

[hungover]

Originally Posted by Batwing

Their previous claim was not a 'lie."



I don't know where you got those numbers but once again they are correct. There is no currently known virus out there for Macs.



Their previous claim only addressed viruses. Viruses is not synonymous with malware. A virus is simply a type of malware.



Sorry but you lost me on the last part.



I've already said that I wasn't a fan of their previous statement, even though it was technically true, and I am not a fan of the new statement, if it is the way I have read it through others since I have not checked it. That said Apple is certainly not the only company in the industry that suffers from occasional lapses in marketing wisdom or oversight. I still think they are the best, over all, in that regard.

hi batwing, the 114000 figure was lifted by apple from research by sophos. Apple used it on their website and adverts.

You seem to have missed my point. The Sophos report makes it clear that the figure is for malware in general and not specifically virsuses. Apple lumped all windows malware under the umbrella term virus but use the term virus in its exact term when (not) referring to MAC malware. The fact that the use of the terms are changed from one sentance to the proceeding one is proof positive that they are trying to trick people.

Whilst it is TRUE that there are no known Mac viruses (proper) there have also been no reports of viruses (proper) infecting windows 7 in the wild. Apple still refer to viruses on windows 7.

thus I remain convinced that apple are intentionally telling lies in order to sell us their products.

My poorly explained point about MACs or PC was that apple do something similar. Windows pc is very concise and clear. PC could be taken to mean windows or Unix, or indeed mac. Again apple varies it's meanings.

[cnbcwatcher]

There is an upside to this - I can't be unbearably smug any more when talking about my Macbook and trying to get people to switch

[Maxatoria]

Another reason Apple fans should feel proud http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-18595347

an extra 30% on their cost of booking a hotel via a mac so its no wonder you dont need to write viruses to get Apple fans money

[DariaM]

Originally Posted by hungover

It is evident that the main problem here is that Apple applies different meaning to words even in the same paragraph depending on what lie they are trying to spin.

They used to slag off windows and go on claim that there were 114000 viruses on windows and none on OSX.

So when it came to windows they referred to all windows malware as viruses but didn't apply the same definition to OSX malware.

They do the same with PC, they are happy for ipads to be referred to as PCs when they are gushing about market penetration/adoption, and then make a distinction between MACs and PCs (without excluding other *NIX variants) when they want to slag off windows

IMO all of this is designed to fool the potential customer.

Customers were already fooled.... through playing games on Windows based systems when in their youth, by using Windows based systems at School, then Windows Systems within College and University, and then at Work.

No critical awareness of more robust systems, and blind acceptance of Windows.

I sympathise with those computer users who have Windows and Microsoft hardwired into their psyche.

[hungover]

Originally Posted by DariaM

Customers were already fooled.... through playing games on Windows based systems when in their youth, by using Windows based systems at School, then Windows Systems within College and University, and then at Work.

No critical awareness of more robust systems, and blind acceptance of Windows.

I sympathise with those computer users who have Windows and Microsoft hardwired into their psyche.

I am not a windows apologist. MS have done some pretty crappy things in the past but I fail to see what point you are making.

Nor can I see how relevant it is to the current debate, namely the debunking of the Apple myth that MACs are inherently secure. if however you are able to find evidence that MS claims that there are no windows malware you will have a valid point

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by Maxatoria

Another reason Apple fans should feel proud http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-18595347

an extra 30% on their cost of booking a hotel via a mac so its no wonder you dont need to write viruses to get Apple fans money

I wasn't sure what to make of that! And how would they know that the person booking the hotel on a Mac actually owned one? They could be PC users using a friend's Mac

[DotNetWill]

Originally Posted by DariaM

Customers were already fooled.... through playing games on Windows based systems when in their youth, by using Windows based systems at School, then Windows Systems within College and University, and then at Work.

No critical awareness of more robust systems, and blind acceptance of Windows.

I sympathise with those computer users who have Windows and Microsoft hardwired into their psyche.

The reason MS is used in the work place and education is because as an "enterprise" OS that can be centrally managed, perform user auth/management, provide audit trails etc it is second to none. MS hasn't always produced the best consumer but when it comes to enterprise they deliver everything from awesome SLAs to manageability.

Most people couldn't give a flying hoop what OS they use they just want something cheap and works like they expect and that is where Windows again shines the consumer space.

Some people really need to leave their dogma at the door and look at the world from a pragmatic point of view.

[Maxatoria]

i suppose it could be fun to spec up an all apple replacement to a world wide setup running microsoft programs and xxx hardware over 25-30 thousand machines but i'd imagine it would probably need to be delivered either in a pub or hospital to the board as they'd either need stiff drinks or their hearts restarting

and before anyone says oh just use the current hardware and slap on OSX its against the EULA so couldn't be done as it has to be genuine blessed by the spirit of jobs apple hardware

[hungover]

But, even apples are made with pcs running windows

[Maxatoria]

Originally Posted by hungover

But, even apples are made with pcs running windows

nope they're custom built hardware that just happens to run windows as well which actually helps the sales as people can dual boot

[whoever,hey]

Originally Posted by Maxatoria

nope they're custom built hardware that just happens to run windows as well which actually helps the sales as people can dual boot

They might be custom built, but they are still PCs.

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by Maxatoria

i suppose it could be fun to spec up an all apple replacement to a world wide setup running microsoft programs and xxx hardware over 25-30 thousand machines but i'd imagine it would probably need to be delivered either in a pub or hospital to the board as they'd either need stiff drinks or their hearts restarting

and before anyone says oh just use the current hardware and slap on OSX its against the EULA so couldn't be done as it has to be genuine blessed by the spirit of jobs apple hardware

I do dream about it sometimes Is every new Mac blessed by the spirit of Jobs in the iCloud? Or will the men in black turtlenecks visit your house if they discover you put OSX on a PC?

[hungover]

Originally Posted by Maxatoria

nope they're custom built hardware that just happens to run windows as well which actually helps the sales as people can dual boot

???

Ok I should have qualified my statement by dropping the p from PC, so he is what I should have posted.

Even Apples are made with computers running Windows


By which I mean that Foxconn use Windows on the production floor and not MACs to built Apple devices.

Not sure why you assume that they would be dual boot.

[hungover]

Originally Posted by cnbcwatcher

Or will the men in black turtlenecks visit your house if they discover you put OSX on a PC?

Are you crazy? Apple design their own chips which are made with magic and optimised to be way faster than anything that you would find on a pc with intel inside

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by hungover

Are you crazy? Apple design their own chips which are made with magic and optimised to be way faster than anything that you would find on a pc with intel inside

So I won't get an unexpected visit from the men in black turtlenecks if I do anything I shouldn't?

[hungover]

Originally Posted by cnbcwatcher

So I won't get an unexpected visit from the men in black turtlenecks if I do anything I shouldn't?

How would they know?

(theoretically) You have 2 options, either a hard install, often referred to as hackintosh, or a Virtual install that leave you running OSx within your preferred OS. http://screamable.com/how-to-install...rtual-box.html

Not something I have ever done, I have only ever installed VM versions of linux, not sure how many driver issues you will have if you follow the real or dual boot version. I guess you will lack things like the multitouch tracking pad

Technically you will be breaking their ToCs, I have no idea what the legal ramifications are.

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by hungover

How would they know?

(theoretically) You have 2 options, either a hard install, often referred to as hackintosh, or a Virtual install that leave you running OSx within your preferred OS. http://screamable.com/how-to-install...rtual-box.html

Not something I have ever done, I have only ever installed VM versions of linux, not sure how many driver issues you will have if you follow the real or dual boot version. I guess you will lack things like the multitouch tracking pad

Technically you will be breaking their ToCs, I have no idea what the legal ramifications are.

That's a very good question. I doubt they're watching from the iCloud, but you never know Guess I should turn the webcam off. I've heard of Hackintoshes.

[s2k]

Originally Posted by cnbcwatcher

That's a very good question. I doubt they're watching from the iCloud, but you never know Guess I should turn the webcam off. I've heard of Hackintoshes.

Apple put something in the EULA that basically says their OS is only licensed for installation on compatible Apple-branded hardware. I believe they also forbid any kind of virtualization of the non-server version of the OS.

What that means in real life...well they wouldn't be happy about it... and certainly wouldn't support you in any kind of problem your having...but given the kind of people that build hackintoshes I cant see that being an issue.

Originally Posted by Maxatoria

nope they're custom built hardware that just happens to run windows as well which actually helps the sales as people can dual boot

Not really the case anymore. Nowadays its pretty much all standard components from AMD, Intel, Nvidia etc with the odd bit of custom firmware here and there. Long gone are the days when a mac was really unique in comparison to the Windows PC. Dont get me wrong those days were pretty unpleasant with lots of nasty custom standards, connectors and interfaces but they were certainly a different type of beast back then to what they are now.

[MartinPickering]

My computer comprises a "micro ATX case", with
Gigabyte GA-H55M-UD2H motherboard
2 internal 1TB Hard Drives,
4GB SDRAM,
i5 760 quad core CPU,
Firewire and USB cards,
Gigabit Ethernet,
DVD-RW dual layer "Lightscribe" optical drive
nVidia 8400 GS graphics card.
mini PCI-E to PCI-E x1 wireless adapter
BCM94322MC AirPort Extreme Wireless 802.11n card
Running "Snow Leopard" MacOSX
No "Windows"
No "AV software"

I wouldn't call it blazingly fast but it's OK.

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by s2k

Apple put something in the EULA that basically says their OS is only licensed for installation on compatible Apple-branded hardware. I believe they also forbid any kind of virtualization of the non-server version of the OS.

What that means in real life...well they wouldn't be happy about it... and certainly wouldn't support you in any kind of problem your having...but given the kind of people that build hackintoshes I cant see that being an issue.

I certainly wouldn't take a hackintosh to the Apple Store for repair! They'd have a cow in there There's no substitute for the real thing though I guess I'm just a typical not-so-smug-anymore Mac fangirl.