[grahamlthompson]

Originally Posted by Satellite John

This is an excellent thread. But has put me off buying a Youview box, at least for the time being.

Kind of the whole idea. Shows you what the so called pro-reviews are really worth. Every one so far has assumed the pvr capabilities are not worth checking just looking at the new catch up capability. I reckon until Youview let the real experts add there expertise to make the box what it should have been in the first place, it will always be a dumbed down box to the lowest common hardware capability, in this case Youviews codeing.

[adgloride]

Another thing I was thinking of was the update process for new firmware. If the update is online only what are the chances of being able to get custom firmware on it.

[Martin Liddle]

Originally Posted by adgloride

If the update is online only what are the chances of being able to get custom firmware on it.

The specification includes update via USB but the firmware is much more securely protected than on the HDR-FOX T2 so the initial verdict seems to be that it would be difficult.

[Dancc]

Subtitles works fine on playback of recordings, for the person that asked.

Originally Posted by Martin Liddle

The specification includes update via USB but the firmware is much more securely protected than on the HDR-FOX T2 so the initial verdict seems to be that it would be difficult.

Oh I do hope someone with the technical know-how manages to find a way in. The custom firmware releases for the HDR-FOX T2 were superb but this Youview needs it more.

I might be willing to contribute financially to such a project.

[gomezz]

Why waste effort trying to mod a box that is patently so unsuitable when there are others which are so much more hacker-friendly?

[Dancc]

Originally Posted by gomezz

Why waste effort trying to mod a box that is patently so unsuitable when there are others which are so much more hacker-friendly?

Personally I want on demand through my TV but don't want cable or satellite. The only disappointment I have with Youview is the PVR functionality has taken a step back.

Mind you the HDR-FOX T2 did offer iPlayer. Humax could have signed deals with ITV, C4 and C5 to offer their services in the same way through that box.

Catchup does work a lot better through Youview though. And actually I had no adverts at all before a programme I watched via 4OD last night, very few adverts during and no buffering at all. The picture quality was also very good.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by Ezra Pound

I don't think anyone has reported the DTR-T1000 doing this, I think people are assuming (Possibly Wrongly) that it will perform the same as it's lookalike HDR Fox T2, See #24 link Here

Any kind of auto tune cannot get the right answer for my parents. They receive from both Emley Moor and the Holmfirth relay from it. Let's consider the options:

* Holmfirth gives a stronger signal, so choosing the strongest would pick that. But their aeriel is pointed at Emley Moor (they want the COM muxes) and Holmfirth while stronger is prone to breakup in bad weather due to off axis reception. So a "strongest signal" algorithm would make the wrong choice.

* Postcode based algorithm would also make the wrong choice as their official transmitter is Holmfirth. Postcode based might even miss out the Emley Moor COM muxes altogether.

* SI (transmitter ID) based algorithm can't tell the difference, because main transmitters and relays have the same SI (which is pathetic, they should all be unique).

So no algorithm currently known for auto tune can get the correct answer at my parents. Thus they need manual tuning, no matter how smart the box thinks it is.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by Dancc

Oh I do hope someone with the technical know-how manages to find a way in. The custom firmware releases for the HDR-FOX T2 were superb but this Youview needs it more.

Custom firmware is unlikely to be able to fix core features like lack of padding, recording into folders etc. That's down to how the main application works. Custom firmware augments what is already there, it can't replace it.

[Colin_London]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

Any kind of auto tune cannot get the right answer for my parents. They receive from both Emley Moor and the Holmfirth relay from it. Let's consider the options:

* Holmfirth gives a stronger signal, so choosing the strongest would pick that. But their aeriel is pointed at Emley Moor (they want the COM muxes) and Holmfirth while stronger is prone to breakup in bad weather due to off axis reception. So a "strongest signal" algorithm would make the wrong choice.

* Postcode based algorithm would also make the wrong choice as their official transmitter is Holmfirth. Postcode based might even miss out the Emley Moor COM muxes altogether.

* SI (transmitter ID) based algorithm can't tell the difference, because main transmitters and relays have the same SI (which is pathetic, they should all be unique).

So no algorithm currently known for auto tune can get the correct answer at my parents. Thus they need manual tuning, no matter how smart the box thinks it is.

Off axis reception may have a higher error rate and the relay signal rejected on that basis.

[tom558]

Originally Posted by Dancc

Subtitles works fine on playback of recordings, for the person that asked.


Oh I do hope someone with the technical know-how manages to find a way in. The custom firmware releases for the HDR-FOX T2 were superb but this Youview needs it more.

I might be willing to contribute financially to such a project.

Ref the subtitles thanks for trying it for me,would have been utterly amazed had they not worked.
Don't know what that guy,on another tech forum,not DS, was on about then

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by Colin_London

Off axis reception may have a higher error rate and the relay signal rejected on that basis.

Maybe, maybe not. The Emley Moor signal at my parents is actually a reflection off the far side of the valley, they don't have direct line of sight. So the error rate on Emley Moor is higher than would normally be expected, and on good weather days the Holmfirth error rate may be lower.

It's been interesting watching aeriels move after switchover on my parents' road. More and more of them are being turned round to point at the far side of the valley to get the Emley Moor relfection. It's only 4 miles away so signal strength is pretty high even after a fairly diffuse reflection.

[whoever,hey]

Originally Posted by Dancc

Personally I want on demand through my TV but don't want cable or satellite. The only disappointment I have with Youview is the PVR functionality has taken a step back.

Mind you the HDR-FOX T2 did offer iPlayer. Humax could have signed deals with ITV, C4 and C5 to offer their services in the same way through that box.

Catchup does work a lot better through Youview though. And actually I had no adverts at all before a programme I watched via 4OD last night, very few adverts during and no buffering at all. The picture quality was also very good.

Between my HDR-FOX T2, PS3 and Sony Bravia TV i have all on demand channels

But yes it would be nice on a single box.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by whoever,hey

Between my HDR-FOX T2, PS3 and Sony Bravia TV i have all on demand channels

But yes it would be nice on a single box.

That is indeed what is wrong. Leaving the market to implement the on demand services for various broadcasters results in this unplanned hodge podge of different availability on different devices. I support the aim of YouView to fix that and bring it all together. It's just such a terrible shame what we have ended up with as an implementation.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by grahamlthompson

There is a new one reported tonight. Composite video out does not include the menu overlays. As a result using a rf analogue video distribution system can't really use any sort of remote AV ir repeater system based on any existing system. Magic eyes, Video senders etc.

I've just remembered that my brother's Virgin cable box is like this. RGB SCART and composite video out only contain the video, they're intended for archiving to a VCR or DVD recorder.

[Clusterbombed]

Having lived with the box for a week now, I've got used to the quirks and got used to doing things differently.

With a 2minute+ start-up time, I've taken to not even switching it on if I've only got 15-20 minutes to eat breakfast & have coffee before work, merely using the TV instead. When coming home, switching it on before going to get changed & make a coffee means I don't even notice that it takes a while to boot up.

I agree with the poster who said the menu system looks good. It's just badly laid out, but again I'm getting used to it.

The fast forward and rewind is so smooth that I'm not missing the skip buttons, which I used heavily on my 9200T. Although I still can't get used to the number buttons being at the bottom of the remote and the video buttons being at the top!

The recording schedule menu, which i noted showed programmes twice if they were on Series Record, seems to have sorted itself. I suspect the programme is only listed once after the initial programme in the Series Record is recorded. Quirky!

I'd had the box five days before I noticed that the LED display on the front of the box shows the name of the programme you're watching, if it's a recorded one. The elapsed time, though, isn't very clear because of this.

Fast forwarding through an iPlayer programme is as easy as doing it with a hard drive recording. I made the mistake at one point of pressing the 'close' button to get rid of the Info box on an iPlayer programme. Unfortunately this didn't close the info bar, it closed the entire iPlayer!

The on-screen signs noting the start of a recording are discrete. On my old 9200T, the screen would blank for a second & the on-screen announcement would appear in the centre of the screen. On this, the message appears briefly at the top of the screen with no interruption in picture.

All in all, I'm not missing my 9200T as much as I initially thought I would be. In saying that, with the Olympics on I'm not using the box heavily at the moment other than to watch live tv. The jury is still out, although I'm leaning a bit more favourably towards the box than I was initially.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by Clusterbombed

The fast forward and rewind is so smooth that I'm not missing the skip buttons, which I used heavily on my 9200T.

I'd had the box five days before I noticed that the LED display on the front of the box shows the name of the programme you're watching, if it's a recorded one. The elapsed time, though, isn't very clear because of this.

The on-screen signs noting the start of a recording are discrete. On my old 9200T, the screen would blank for a second & the on-screen announcement would appear in the centre of the screen. On this, the message appears briefly at the top of the screen with no interruption in picture.

All of the above items are the same as on the Humax HDR Fox T2. So I don't really regard them as anything special on the DTR-T1000.

I feel the issue is muddied because you have changed from a 9200T which is an obsolete box of a previous generation. Some of the things you are impressed by are just normal behaviour for current boxes.

[Clusterbombed]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

I feel the issue is muddied because you have changed from a 9200T which is an obsolete box of a previous generation. Some of the things you are impressed by are just normal behaviour for current boxes.

Possibly, but as I said in the original post my first impression was that I was taking a step back!

[Clem]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

That is indeed what is wrong. Leaving the market to implement the on demand services for various broadcasters results in this unplanned hodge podge of different availability on different devices. I support the aim of YouView to fix that and bring it all together. It's just such a terrible shame what we have ended up with as an implementation.

Yes, annoying. My Sony TV has iPlayer and Demand5, but no ITVPlayer or 4OD. The Sony's iPlayer implementation seems spot-on (never used the C5 offering) so for me, the big omission is 4OD -- I can't recall the last time I watched something on ITV. That all said, I agree -- had there been a common standard so that all internet-ready TVs offered the same catch-up services as Youview, we'd never be here.

Sigh.


Clem

[Luis Essex]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

I've just remembered that my brother's Virgin cable box is like this. RGB SCART and composite video out only contain the video, they're intended for archiving to a VCR or DVD recorder.

In the days of Video Cassette Recorders this was standard with the RGB scart, plus the audio volume could not be changed on the RGB scart.

[grahamlthompson]

Originally Posted by Luis Essex

In the days of Video Cassette recorders this was standard with the RGB scart, plus the audio volume could not be changed on the RGB scart.

VCR's did not normally have RGB scart connections (only 1 was ever made as far as I know), pretty pointless as the recording system records composite analogue video in poor quality. Even the improved S-Video (Hi 8) records the two components of composite (luminance and chrominance) seperately. Connversion to RGB is still pretty pointless.

Interesting to know what vcr you ever had with RGB out Over the years I have had a lot of vcrs, two are still wotking (One is S-VHS), not one has RGB out.

Generally the TV scart is volume controlled and the vcr/decoder scart is not.

RGB only became common with digital sources as it's the system used to deliver the picture information (component actually). For example computers like the Commodore Amiga and later Freeview digital TV.


Comparing the new box with an ancient vcr is totally pointless. Every other Humax pvr from the 8000T to the HDR FOX T2 lets you view the overlays remotely. Youview haven't a clue

[grahamlthompson]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

I've just remembered that my brother's Virgin cable box is like this. RGB SCART and composite video out only contain the video, they're intended for archiving to a VCR or DVD recorder.

If you are archiving to VCR/DVD recorder (yuck) simply don't bring up a menu or epg while doing so. The system used by Sky-HD and Sky+ boxes since the year dot.

[OwenSmith]

Originally Posted by grahamlthompson

If you are archiving to VCR/DVD recorder (yuck) simply don't bring up a menu or epg while doing so. The system used by Sky-HD and Sky+ boxes since the year dot.

I'm simply stating that YouView boxes are not unique in having no menu overlays on the SCART output, since my brother's Virgin box is the same (menus only on HDMI). That's not to say I agree with it, though I can see benefits in that the menus only need to be implemented in HD and can use graphics that wouldn't work in SD.

[2Bdecided]

Originally Posted by Clusterbombed

Fast forwarding through an iPlayer programme is as easy as doing it with a hard drive recording.

Was I doing something wrong then? I found one set of buttons did a one minute skip, and the other did a ten minute skip. Better than some other implementations, but still nothing like fast forwarding a recording on the hard drive - i.e. I didn't find a fast forward that let you watch a faster moving version of the video you were skipping.

Cheers,
David.

[grahamlthompson]

Originally Posted by Luis Essex

In the days of Video Cassette Recorders this was standard with the RGB scart, plus the audio volume could not be changed on the RGB scart.

Intrigued as to how you could ever use a vcr that did not output the menus on it's outputs ?

[grahamlthompson]

Originally Posted by OwenSmith

I'm simply stating that YouView boxes are not unique in having no menu overlays on the SCART output, since my brother's Virgin box is the same (menus only on HDMI). That's not to say I agree with it, though I can see benefits in that the menus only need to be implemented in HD and can use graphics that wouldn't work in SD.

I have a virgin SD box that only has scart, just like a vcr or dvdr with only analogue outputs it has to output the menus otherwise it would be unusable.