[The Prumeister]

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

He has a younger partner. It's not just about him, or what he wants.

Does that mean because Elton's older, that David should be deprived of the chance to have a child? If Elton was taken ill and died, David would be there. It's not just age related things that can deprive a child of a parent either. Accidents, car crashes etc can do the same.

Yes - as I keep saying - death can happen at any time to anyone and is wholly unpredictable but the risk increases as you get older. They could both die tomorrow, Elton might live to be 100 - who knows? The fact remains that age does increase your risk of death - that is an undeniable fact and not just opinion.

It's not all about Elton, no - but my question remains - should there be an age cap on people being permitted to acquire children? I think there should.

As for David - well, he chose to hook up with an older partner and in those circumstances, people should accept that their chance of having kids might not happen for whatever reason.

[Saltydog1955]

Originally Posted by bbnutnut

BIB People paying a biological mother to give up her child are depriving that child of one of its parents on purpose.

How do you know Elton's child is being deprived of a parent?

For all any of us know, Zachary's mother might have contact with him. Elton and David say she's like a sister to them, so why keep her away?

[Betty Britain]

Originally Posted by missfrankiecat

Actually, I'm not sure I understand why you think gay people need longer to 'consider the pitfalls' of parenting than straight ones. I believe parenting is exactly the same for straight and gay people; sexuality is completely irrelevant to parenting capacity.

Thank you..that was my point as well

[DiamondDoll]

I remember seeing a programme where a gay singleton had adopted twin boys.
He took them to America to meet their biological mother.

Who is to say that Zachary hasn't seen and met his biological mother?

I know that the story has been discounted about a sibling for Zachary but who knows what the future might bring.

I have no concerns about the age or committment of Elton and David. A child needs love and they will provide than in bucketloads.

[Betty Britain]

Originally Posted by DiamondDoll

Elton John and David Furnish are not running away to a third world country (your words btw) and exploiting someone.
I'm 100% certain that they have a legally binding business contract with someone .

this bit is the thing that upsets me ( not your comment) that a child is " purchased" on a business contract ... Children are not a commodity to be bought and sold willy nilly... I also don't agree that everyone has a " right " to children .

[DiamondDoll]

Originally Posted by Betty Britain

this bit is the thing that upsets me ( not your comment) that a child is " purchased" on a business contract ... Children are not a commodity to be bought and sold willy nilly... I also don't agree that everyone has a " right " to children .

I'm with you there BB.
Parenthood certainly isn't a 'right'.

[Betty Britain]

Originally Posted by DiamondDoll

I'm with you there BB.
Parenthood certainly isn't a 'right'.

As far as I'm concerned .. Being a mother is the greatest thing I've ever done and I feel privileged to be a mother . I can not understand how awful it must be not to be able to be a mother .... But I do get mad at some people who believe just because they have plenty of money they have the "right" to have what they want.

[Swanandduck2]

Originally Posted by Betty Britain

As far as I'm concerned .. Being a mother is the greatest thing I've ever done and I feel privileged to be a mother . I can not understand how awful it must be not to be able to be a mother .

Well. comments like the above don't really help.

[Betty Britain]

Originally Posted by Swanandduck2

Well. comments like the above don't really help.

Comments like what...

[DiamondDoll]

Its happened.
Good luck to them.

Sir Elton John and David Furnish last night revealed their second child is a boy.
Elijah Joseph Daniel Furnish-John was born last Friday evening, weighing 8lb 4oz.
They said the arrival of their second son, who was born in Las Vegas via a surrogate mother, ‘completes our family in a most precious and perfect way’.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...#ixzz2I7UBfmjO

[bbnutnut]

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

How do you know Elton's child is being deprived of a parent?

For all any of us know, Zachary's mother might have contact with him. Elton and David say she's like a sister to them, so why keep her away?

As previously stated, I have no problem if the mother is in the child's life and hasn't just had the baby for financial gain.

I hadn't realised that Elton had said it was a friend of theirs. I read a while back that it was the same woman who was a surrogate for two of Kelsey Grammer's children. Of course, that doesn't mean she's the biological mother of any of the children. Elton's friend could have provided the egg.

I just don't think it's right to pay a woman to have a baby (her own baby) and give it up for money. I don't have a problem with surrogacy as she's not giving up her own baby.

[downtonfan]

Originally Posted by Swanandduck2

Well. comments like the above don't really help.

I'll say.

[lexi22]

Originally Posted by DiamondDoll

Its happened.
Good luck to them.

Sir Elton John and David Furnish last night revealed their second child is a boy.
Elijah Joseph Daniel Furnish-John was born last Friday evening, weighing 8lb 4oz.
They said the arrival of their second son, who was born in Las Vegas via a surrogate mother, ‘completes our family in a most precious and perfect way’.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...#ixzz2I7UBfmjO

Aw that's lovely. Good for them.

[momma11]

Why is age to be considered a barrier for raising children ? ( within reason of course). my husband and I have the permanent care of our 2 grandsons aged 4 and 2 , it's exhausting and I worry about what will happen to them if something happens to us, but as social services said , these things can happen to anyone at any age.
We take care of ourselves , more so since our grandsons came on the scene, because we have this obligation to be as healthy as possible so we can be there for them as long as possible, with the support of our extended family.Surely it's best for children to be raised lovingly within their own family, whether traditional or not , rather than be lost in the system ?

[-Batman-]

this is plain wrong
kids should have a mum and dad not 2 daddies

[momma11]

Originally Posted by -Batman-

this is plain wrong
kids should have a mum and dad not 2 daddies

children should be with parents who love and care for them , 2 daddies or not , if it works then what is the problem ?

[-Batman-]

Originally Posted by momma11

children should be with parents who love and care for them , 2 daddies or not , if it works then what is the problem ?

its wrong and not meant to be
the poor child will be traumatised and be bullied for it

[Saltydog1955]

Originally Posted by -Batman-

its wrong and not meant to be
the poor child will be traumatised and be bullied for it

With respect I think you're living in the past.

Families today are very different to what they were 50 years ago. Two parents, one parent, two parents of the same sex, parents of different ethnicities.....takes all sorts to make a parental world these days. Elton himself has said he thinks Zachary may find it difficult in school because he has two dads - and before you say that proves your point, kids can get taunted at school for all kinds of things - being too fat, too thin, spotty, 'Ginger', glasses....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...ng-mother.html

I'm sure he'll be able to send him to the best schools where his unconventional family won't be an issue.

[lexi22]

Originally Posted by momma11

Why is age to be considered a barrier for raising children ? ( within reason of course). my husband and I have the permanent care of our 2 grandsons aged 4 and 2 , it's exhausting and I worry about what will happen to them if something happens to us, but as social services said , these things can happen to anyone at any age.
We take care of ourselves , more so since our grandsons came on the scene, because we have this obligation to be as healthy as possible so we can be there for them as long as possible, with the support of our extended family.Surely it's best for children to be raised lovingly within their own family, whether traditional or not , rather than be lost in the system ?

What a lovely, caring and sensible post. It's about the quality of care that counts, not the ages - or sex for that matter - of those doing the caring. And as you say, the 'something could happen' angle is random and no respector of age.

[lexi22]

Originally Posted by -Batman-

its wrong and not meant to be
the poor child will be traumatised and be bullied for it

I think you're the one showing signs of trauma here. To believe that a child will be traumatised and bullied because of the sex of its parents - in 2013 - is really just you revealing your own prejudices.

[momma11]

Originally Posted by lexi22

What a lovely, caring and sensible post. It's about the quality of care that counts, not the ages - or sex for that matter - of those doing the caring. And as you say, the 'something could happen' angle is random and no respector of age.

Thank you lexi , I appreciate your comments as this is a matter I feel quite strongly about.
Thanks again

[Saltydog1955]

It's been finally confirmed by Elton himself. The new baby's name is Elijah.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-21044890

Health and happiness to them all.

[momma11]

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

It's been finally confirmed by Elton himself. The new baby's name is Elijah.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-21044890

Health and happiness to them all.

Hear Hear !
Best wishes to them all

[designer84]

Congratulations to them both. I am often puzzled why some people seem to think that because someone is gay, it means they can't be a parent or that they are somehow less suitable, or even that they have no desire to be parents. Sexuality doesn't determine the type of parent you are and it certainly doesn't diminish the ability to care for a child just because you are gay. It's 2013 and the "it's just wrong" views are so dated and narrow minded... A child that has a loving, caring home with a parent or parents that love them dearly is what matters. I know a gay couple with kids. The dad has nothing to do with them as he can't be bothered. The kids are raised by their two mums. They are from a previous marriage that one of the women had. The kids even told the Dad that they don't need him in their lives if he can't make an effort with them. The kids are stable and fine. They don't get bullied. I am gay and it doesn't mean I shouldn't or don't want kids. I love my niece and step nephews dearly. I would love to be a dad. Some people may say I am selfish, to that I would say that wanting to reproduce is in our blood and the desire to have a child should not be stunted purely because I like men.

It's about time that some people realised that what they say about gay parents is actually hurtful and that gay people are just as capable as everyone else... What we get up to in the bedroom means nothing when it comes to raising kids

[loonattic]

Originally Posted by -Batman-

this is plain wrong
kids should have a mum and dad not 2 daddies

quite right.its wrong and ridiculous.