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Jimmy Saville to be revealed as a paedophile? (Part 7)


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Old 22-01-2013, 08:04
nanscombe
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... bullied many people when he was in cycling and had no empathy for any of those he trampled over.
Isn't that also known as ambition? I'm sure there are quite a few like that in business.
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Old 22-01-2013, 09:24
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Thats rather chilling - the fact that he referred to himself as 'The Godfather' and made it clear he had plenty of contacts and could find basically anyones number, is rather telling. He was seen as a gangster type figure in the dancehall days in the 50s too - its staggering that such things could have been going on while he was on TV and thought of as some supposed national icon.

There's a photo of him wearing the same thumb ring as the character on the front cover of A Clockwork Orange, I saw mention of that elsewhere last week but I can't find it now, its like a large black and white eye.

----

I found some photos of him in robes and a mask, if anyones curious, see:-

http://i49.tinypic.com/k06l53.jpg (that one might have already been posted, I'd have to double check)
http://www.channel4.com/media/c4-new...allery_620.jpg
http://www.hebdenbridgetimes.co.uk/w...3191897410.jpg
Thanks for finding those especially the mask. I found the first and asked if someone else could find the mask so welll done Izzy.

I have to say that while everyone's experience is different, I never knew a single man who wore a kaftan in the 60s or 70s and I was an occasional 'weekend hippy' who lived in London at that time. They may have been worn in America, in films or on TV and in more recent depictions of those times but they were mostly worn by young women. If these are meant to be worn as hippy kaftans, JS does appear to favour the hooded ones. (Not all kaftans had hoods.) I don't see any connection between hippydom and JS unless he equated "Free Love" with the PIE. He looks as if he has left the 1970s behind quite some time ago in the third picture?

The mask picture is nothing to do with hippydom. It is disturbing and probably meant to be.
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Old 22-01-2013, 09:43
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Isn't that also known as ambition? I'm sure there are quite a few like that in business.
There's healthy ambition, ruthless ambition and shades in between. No one size fits all. Ambition can be good or bad depending on the personality involved.

I agree with you that there are indeed ambitious people in other walks of life. Some of them are healthier than others as I'm sure you would accept.
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Old 22-01-2013, 10:16
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Didn't Jimmy Savile turn Lance Armstrong into a ruthless cheat when he met him cycling?
I suppose it could of been fear if Savile was head of the mafia?
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Old 22-01-2013, 10:56
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Thanks for finding those especially the mask. I found the first and asked if someone else could find the mask so welll done Izzy.

I have to say that while everyone's experience is different, I never knew a single man who wore a kaftan in the 60s or 70s and I was an occasional 'weekend hippy' who lived in London at that time. They may have been worn in America, in films or on TV and in more recent depictions of those times but they were mostly worn by young women. If these are meant to be worn as hippy kaftans, JS does appear to favour the hooded ones. (Not all kaftans had hoods.) I don't see any connection between hippydom and JS unless he equated "Free Love" with the PIE. He looks as if he has left the 1970s behind quite some time ago in the third picture?

The mask picture is nothing to do with hippydom. It is disturbing and probably meant to be.
Thanks I found another photo of what looks like a similar, if not the very same, top worn when he was a fair bit younger:- http://www.channel4.com/media/images...le_g_k_MED.jpg
I'd have hated wearing something like that with the bits hanging off the hood - thats way too soppy, I'd have said as a kid lol.

Oh there's this as well:- http://www.lisa-und-georg.de/mediac/...mmy~Savile.jpg thats not quite as 'zany' though.
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Old 22-01-2013, 11:14
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I also came across this random story from 2009:-

JIM'LL FIX IT

Sometimes no specialist training is needed, just a dash of have-a-go spirit.

Last August veteran broadcaster Sir Jimmy Savile fixed it for motorists when he stepped in to direct traffic after a road accident near his penthouse home.

Sir Jimmy had been on his way to dinner in Leeds when his car narrowly avoided a collision with a Mercedes. The Merc then collided with another car head-on, and Sir Jimmy jumped out of his own vehicle.

The 81-year-old began directing traffic around the wreckage. When the emergency services arrived, a police officer gave him a hi-vis jacket and told him to keep up the good work. Those years fronting road safety campaigns perhaps came in handy.
with a photo of him wearing the police jacket:- http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/image...0_44936128.jpg

The police just left him to it? surely they'd have been better taking over themselves? did JS promise to return the jacket later? its a criminal offence to wear police uniform and pass yourself off as a police officer when your not and that clearly is an official piece of police uniform, labelled 'Police'? hmmm, seems a little random to me. I guess it was maybe one of his policemen chums who gave him it?.
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Old 22-01-2013, 11:50
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I realised I forgot to include the link to the story, sorry. Here:- http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8140167.stm (its the last segment near the bottom of the page.). Keep up the good work indeed ok that was nice trying to help direct traffic in that particular instance and all but all the same(!). I bet JS enjoyed feeling he had some perceived extra authority there for a short while too...even if just symbolically.
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Old 22-01-2013, 12:14
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The Express story is full of holes - most obviously that it's not about abuse, it's focus is 'Satanism' of the hysterical fundamentalist or Hollywood variety (see the Satanic abuse stories of the 80S/90s ).
Only Savile is alleged to have abused her, and that would require all the other participants to have been facilitators, stooges in an enormous ruse to enable him - when he's not shown any need to disguise his predeliction both earlier and later. That, or they are supposed to be engaged in a 'genuine' Satanic event, in spite of the comical outbursts and Savile still holding a Cigar while wearing a mask. An event modelled on completely fictitious ideas of what one would look like.
The claimant concludes that her parents (who they say consented) were 'well known Satanists' - once again directing the focus of the piece not towards sexual abuse but alleged 'un-christian' activities. Savile appears in the story only to make it more lurid - and it's highly doubtful they'd have run the piece if he hadn't featured.
From what I understood, it was the writer who said Savile used a mask, not the "victim" and the whole ritual seemed to me more a staged act to scare her. A sadistic thing. Not that I believe in the story.

About "ritual abuse", I used to be of the same opinion of you. I'm not sure Wikipedia is the best source of info and so of the cases in the article remain "inconclusive". There seemed to be a "moral panic" about day care institutions in the 80's and early 90's that undermined the whole idea, especially in the US.

Then I watched this German documentary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUzQ7aqFyiU

(It is in five parts. Terrible stuff)

And I'm not sure if I don't believe it anymore. The problem with "ritual abuse" is that the idea was hijacked by christians fundamentalists and conspiracy theorists, who thinks the world is controlled by Illuminati/Masons/Satan Worshippers/Jews colluded with the Catholic Church, etc. If there is "ritual abuse" these people are not helping.
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Old 22-01-2013, 13:32
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Isn't that also known as ambition? I'm sure there are quite a few like that in business.
I would never have thought of Armstrong as a sociopath before until I saw his interview with Oprah. He seemed strangely cold and detached and cut off from his feelings.....it actually reminded me of some of Savile's more belligerent interviews.

That, combined with the stories of him bullying and trampling over numerous friends and colleagues makes me suspicious that he may be some form of sociopath or narcissist.

Incidentally, Oprah actually dropped the word 'sociopath' into the interview at one point in relation to him.
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Old 22-01-2013, 14:45
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I realised I forgot to include the link to the story, sorry. Here:- http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8140167.stm (its the last segment near the bottom of the page.). Keep up the good work indeed ok that was nice trying to help direct traffic in that particular instance and all but all the same(!). I bet JS enjoyed feeling he had some perceived extra authority there for a short while too...even if just symbolically.
He would have loved it I'm sure. It just shows how we weaved his magic spell while blowing smokescreen rings around others. (Joke - sort of.) "Carry On Jim."
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Old 22-01-2013, 15:17
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Thanks I found another photo of what looks like a similar, if not the very same, top worn when he was a fair bit younger:- http://www.channel4.com/media/images...le_g_k_MED.jpg
I'd have hated wearing something like that with the bits hanging off the hood - thats way too soppy, I'd have said as a kid lol.

Oh there's this as well:- http://www.lisa-und-georg.de/mediac/...mmy~Savile.jpg thats not quite as 'zany' though.

The black and green Kaftans was part of the textiles auction of his bits when he died.

Page 5 Black Kaftan Item 215 sold for 170

Page 6 Green Kaftan with accompanying photograph of JS on Top of the Pops item 261 sold for 120

You may have to C&P the link into your browser.

http://www.dnfa.com/search.asp?view=keyword&auction=13560&keyword=||&lotno=&noperpage=20&cat=&pg=80&orderby=&noofresults=171&catname=Textiles
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Old 22-01-2013, 15:17
jamtamara
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From what I understood, it was the writer who said Savile used a mask, not the "victim" and the whole ritual seemed to me more a staged act to scare her. A sadistic thing. Not that I believe in the story.

About "ritual abuse", I used to be of the same opinion of you. I'm not sure Wikipedia is the best source of info and so of the cases in the article remain "inconclusive". There seemed to be a "moral panic" about day care institutions in the 80's and early 90's that undermined the whole idea, especially in the US.

Then I watched this German documentary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUzQ7aqFyiU

(It is in five parts. Terrible stuff)


And I'm not sure if I don't believe it anymore. The problem with "ritual abuse" is that the idea was hijacked by christians fundamentalists and conspiracy theorists, who thinks the world is controlled by Illuminati/Masons/Satan Worshippers/Jews colluded with the Catholic Church, etc. If there is "ritual abuse" these people are not helping.
Why anyone would disbelieve after that says more about them...

I didn't want to watch it and i think that is part of the problem. No-one, except those who gratify themselves at the expense of toddlers upwards, wants to believe it.

Even if there is any doubt, there should be all consideration given to the children involved.
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Old 22-01-2013, 19:33
IzzyS
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He would have loved it I'm sure. It just shows how we weaved his magic spell while blowing smokescreen rings around others. (Joke - sort of.) "Carry On Jim."
No kidding - while many members of the public may have questioned him due to his 'eccentricities', others including those in authority held him in fairly high regard as a 'good egg' or even some pillar of the community for helping out at Leeds General Infirmary, I'd imagine.
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Old 22-01-2013, 20:34
IzzyS
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From what I understood, it was the writer who said Savile used a mask, not the "victim" and the whole ritual seemed to me more a staged act to scare her. A sadistic thing. Not that I believe in the story.

About "ritual abuse", I used to be of the same opinion of you. I'm not sure Wikipedia is the best source of info and so of the cases in the article remain "inconclusive". There seemed to be a "moral panic" about day care institutions in the 80's and early 90's that undermined the whole idea, especially in the US.

Then I watched this German documentary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUzQ7aqFyiU

(It is in five parts. Terrible stuff)

And I'm not sure if I don't believe it anymore. The problem with "ritual abuse" is that the idea was hijacked by christians fundamentalists and conspiracy theorists, who thinks the world is controlled by Illuminati/Masons/Satan Worshippers/Jews colluded with the Catholic Church, etc. If there is "ritual abuse" these people are not helping.
Regarding Wikipedia, the way I look at it is its information is as good as the sources provided. Really Wikipedia is just a place (a massive notice board of sorts or obviously an electronic encyclopedia) for posting things - its up to the person who makes the entry to provide sources or a bibliography to back up whats written. I've heard people say not to take everything you read there as fact but that applies to any website - anyone could type anything really, the proof is in the legitimacy of such sources (or as its referred to on the site 'References').

I've heard one or two people hint that they think everything on Wikipedia is nonsense or overly exaggerated, which makes me wonder if they read inaccurate information on another website, would they be more likely to believe it but if they read truthful information via Wikipedia, they'd take it with a grain of salt? it seems a little daft.

I guess the question of which site (if any) is specifically the best source of information on a given subject is slightly different though but I just wanted to throw that out there (sorry for going perhaps a bit off topic there).

The black and green Kaftans was part of the textiles auction of his bits when he died.

Page 5 Black Kaftan Item 215 sold for 170

Page 6 Green Kaftan with accompanying photograph of JS on Top of the Pops item 261 sold for 120

You may have to C&P the link into your browser.

http://www.dnfa.com/search.asp?view=keyword&auction=13560&keyword=||&lotno=&noperpage=20&cat=&pg=80&orderby=&noofresults=171&catname=Textiles
So they were - I hadn't seen the auction lots before. This item creeps me out a bit:- http://www.dnfa.com/search.asp?view=...eid=445466-664
the photo
and this:- http://www.dnfa.com/search.asp?view=...eid=445466-813
[Broadmoor Special Hospital] A View From black tracksuit top, embroidered with the Broadmoor Hospital logo

Made for the Control & Restraint training programme.
*cringe*

I also noticed this:- http://www.dnfa.com/search.asp?view=...3560&lotno=467 &uniqueid=445466-773

A black and yellow woollen scarf, with 'MENSA' and a logo knitted at the ends, approx. 195cm long (excluding the fringes)

Sir Jimmy had a high IQ and became a member of MENSA in 1977. He completed the IQ test at Broadmoor, locking himself into a room to complete it.

Provenance: From the estate of Sir Jimmy Savile. OBE, KCSG, LLD (1926-2011)

ADDITION TO THIS LOT:
Together with a MENSA tie
Thats a bit more information about the link to MENSA, since someone asked about that recently I think.
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Old 22-01-2013, 20:54
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From what I understood, it was the writer who said Savile used a mask, not the "victim" and the whole ritual seemed to me more a staged act to scare her. A sadistic thing. Not that I believe in the story.
The alleged victim is the sole source of the story, all the details must have come from them, unless the (conspiracy fond) express are even more underhanded & salacious.


I'm not sure Wikipedia is the best source of info and so of the cases in the article remain "inconclusive". There seemed to be a "moral panic" about day care institutions in the 80's and early 90's that undermined the whole idea, especially in the US.
The Wikipedia link is simply a quick collection of actual cases from the period (they can all be independently googled, it would have been a thankless trawl doing so individually!). I remember the hysteria of the period well, and how several 'investigators' promoting the idea of literal satanic practices - including police - had Evangelical connections. There were Evangelical groups touring universities and plugging their claims of satanic influences in pop music and television, finding 'evidence' everywhere. Their claims found their way into the conspiracy culture that emerged since, and they re-emerge whenever it there's an opportunity to piggyback on events from school shootings to child abuse.

Then I watched this German documentary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUzQ7aqFyiU

(It is in five parts. Terrible stuff)

And I'm not sure if I don't believe it anymore. The problem with "ritual abuse" is that the idea was hijacked by christians fundamentalists and conspiracy theorists, who thinks the world is controlled by Illuminati/Masons/Satan Worshippers/Jews colluded with the Catholic Church, etc. If there is "ritual abuse" these people are not helping.
Yes, particularly in Europe there have been cases with these elements (and others without any abuse element like the 'Solar Temple' cult deaths) - but they are markedly distinct from the express story. There's no doubt they are paedophiles first, the rest is a distraction.
The express story doesn't wash because (as with the hysterical evangelical claims before) the focus is not that abuse took place, but that 'Satanism' is real and being practiced in full technicolor glory at the end of every street.
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Old 22-01-2013, 21:40
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Kesgrave Hall School: Police reopen 1992 investigation
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-suffolk-21142786
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Old 22-01-2013, 21:48
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I wondered what the context was behind the photo of JS wearing that mask (where it was taken, if he was giving a speech or some such?) - I found the page it came from but it doesn't say, the only caption being

Radio DJ Jimmy Savile in the 1960s. From his initial job in the coal mines, to DJ'ing for Radio 1 to presenting TV's Jim'll Fix It, Sir Jimmy Savile was the consumate showman. (Getty)
http://www.channel4.com/news/sir-jim...-photo-gallery

The photo gallery dates from 2011, so prior to the scandal. Oh well, guess im just nosy... don't mind me
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Old 22-01-2013, 21:59
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Lancashire Police charge Stuart Hall with raping 22-year-old woman in 1976 & 14 offences of indecent assault on 10 girls between 1967-1986
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Old 22-01-2013, 22:02
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Lancashire Police charge Stuart Hall with raping 22-year-old woman in 1976 & 14 offences of indecent assault on 10 girls between 1967-1986
More on the story from ITV here.


Stuart Hall charged with rape and indecent assault

Last updated Tue 22 Jan 2013

Former radio and television presenter Stuart Hall was arrested this morning and has been charged with one offence of rape and 14 offences of indecent assault.

The indecent assault offences are alleged to have been committed between 1967 and 1986 and to involve 10 girls aged between nine and 16-years-old.

The rape is alleged to have been committed in 1976 against a 22 year old woman.
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Old 22-01-2013, 22:33
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Police statement, although no extra info.
http://www.lancashire.police.uk/news...decent-assault
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Old 23-01-2013, 00:42
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"Internal Catholic church records released Monday show that 15 years before the clergy sex abuse scandal came to light, Mahony and a top advisor discussed ways to conceal the molestation of children from law enforcement."

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lano...-attorney.html
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Old 23-01-2013, 11:03
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I wondered what the context was behind the photo of JS wearing that mask (where it was taken, if he was giving a speech or some such?) - I found the page it came from but it doesn't say, the only caption being



http://www.channel4.com/news/sir-jim...-photo-gallery

The photo gallery dates from 2011, so prior to the scandal. Oh well, guess im just nosy... don't mind me
Photo has been cropped....
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Old 23-01-2013, 11:15
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So it was. Whats with the frilly sleeve/hand? peculiar...I also note the keyword 'adults only' although it also says 'one man only' (in relation to the shot?) - so again what event was this? perhaps we don't want to know. Maybe the keywords are purely in relation to the photo itself - that probably would creep out kids
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Old 23-01-2013, 14:13
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I believe in Savile we are uncovering the Marc Dutroux of England, the procurer of children for the elite networks, and if the info about Heath proves correct, then quite possibly for snuff also.
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Old 23-01-2013, 14:46
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More on the story from ITV here.
"Ho ho, what a knockout!"
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