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Old 05-02-2013, 22:42
craggers
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You need a slow ep just to bring things back down, have a breather and then ramp it up again!
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:46
mr muggles
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Gosh some people's brains are working over time on this!
You should see the thesis's/dissertations I've seen written in the soap section
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:48
T.K. Mazin
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Also, interesting that Jessica and Arby have seemingly united. At least it seems like that's what will happen now.
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:48
T.K. Mazin
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You should see the thesis's/dissertations I've seen written in the soap section
Lol, you can't touch Mona .
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:51
mr muggles
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Lol, you can't touch Mona .
you knew!
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:52
EIwood
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wrong thread.
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Old 05-02-2013, 22:59
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I agree, it was a bit of a slow episode. But we did learn a few things about the conspiracy, which is always good. There's nothing worse than watching an episode of some show where you learn nothing about the mystery at hand and have to wait another week. I also liked that the writers dipped more into the mythology of the comic as at times it has felt like a pure MacGuffin. Hopefully, things will pick up with the final two episodes.

*Awaits Gatehouse's review*
We got to know a few more things but I have to say that this episode left more confused than ever. Last week I thought we were going somewhere but this week my therories have fallen apart.

The person Becky has called doesn't seem to be her dad at all but more someone on the inside or an unrelated third part searching for the manuscript. When she says "Tell me what's going on, are they infecting people now?" it was pretty clear that it wasn't her dad, or at least didn't seem so.

Milner. She only appears when it pleases her. Why did she give a phone to them and doesn't answer their calls? Her conversation with Ian was another confusing matter. Ian told her that he was with Jessica Hyde, then the following dialogue ensues:
Milner: "You lost the mansucript"
Ian: "How do you know?"
Milner: "I'm a spy"....".the person who took stil has it"..."Jessica will be the one who finds it"
I assume she knows Grant still has the important parts and Jessica would be coming back to him to get it, so why hasn't she sent someone after him yet to retrieve it yet?

Arby asking Letts "Where is Jessica Hyde?" and Letts giving him her whereabouts details. Well, if they know where she is all the time, why haven't they killed her yet? Why the interest in keeping her alive?

Still on Jessica, the way she kissed Ian was disturbingly robotic. She and Arby might have more in common than we know.

I'm watching again on 4+1 to see if I missed any details and I'm getting more and more confused. I just hope they don't give a pretentious ending with cr@p explanations or no explanations at all. I've watched quite a lot of dramas with promising beginnings, intriguing middle and really bad endings recently and I'm hoping this won't be the same.
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:07
miss buzzybee
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Yes I think Arby and Jessica are linked, maybe they are brother and sister!

Becky is still suspect maybe she knows the guy in the lab?
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:13
Gatehouse
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I just watched this again. She rings back about 7 seconds after the first call ends, which is quite quick but not impossibly so, especially if she started reacting as soon as Jessica's name was mentioned. Similarly there's an unknown amount of time between the phone calls and her arriving at the chapel. I don't think the timing is intended as a clue.

You're right about the skinhead being at the house. I doubt he's in cahoots with Milner, though, given that she killed him, without it achieving much. I think he was with one of the other women.

If Becky, then it would make some sense that he was following her to keep an eye on her, and for backup. She could have told him where they were. Presumably someone was watching her, as they knew to ring the phone booth as she passed at the end of ep2. He may have barged into the church alone because he expected her to help control the others. Although his motives would be obscure. He could have just waited to see if Becky shouted for help, or contacted him some other way.

It would also make some sense if he was in cahoots with Jessica Hyde. She could have left someone to keep an eye on the other three while she went off with Grant. His motive for barging in when he did would be to discover why they made the unexpected change of location. He may have thought they'd cooperate more because he and they are both on Jessica's side.

I doubt he was Network. Foolish if so to go in alone (especially as he could have caught Milner by waiting). It could represent a new faction, but similar comments apply. And it would be a faction too many. I do hope he's explained. Now he's dead he may not be.

Well The Network "have most of MI5", remember-Milner is one of the few "clean" ones left. As such I saw skinhead as somewhere between MI5 and Network, most likely Network, just the same as all the people watching Ian's family this week. Milner knew he was there, and had most likely known he-and the gang-were there before they called her. Just as she knows Ian's family is being watched, and by who.

Skinhead really is not important, memorable although his brief appearance was, he's just another one of the minions working for "them". We've been constantly told "you don't realise how big this is, do you?" Most of the media, police, Secret Services, and a large chunk of government is under control. They have plenty of footsloggers working for them.


All told, I possibly trust Milner slightly more after this week. She's shady, sure, but only in the way that a Le Carre character would/should be. "I'm a spy", as she deadpans
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:16
Gatehouse
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Ahh ok, I stand corrected.

Oh, and Grant is a suspiciously talented artist. Something a little more child-like would have been more plausible, and still allowed them to keep the plot device of him being able to recreate the pages of the manuscript from memory.
His surname does begin with "L"...he's rabbit!!! Anti-ageing genetic modification? Nah, maybe not...
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:30
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I don't think Arby and Jessica are related, maybe just brought up together/by the same people to be some type of assassins or whatever they are.

I'm guessing that Becky's infected with Deals since she's been taking those pills, perhaps whoever she's in contact with is giving her them and she needs to show them the manuscript in return?
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:36
VicsMum
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I don't think Arby and Jessica are related, maybe just brought up together/by the same people to be some type of assassins or whatever they are.

I'm guessing that Becky's infected with Deals since she's been taking those pills, perhaps whoever she's in contact with is giving her them and she needs to show them the manuscript in return?
Interesting thought!

Anyway, blog's up:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-rad...a-episode-four
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:38
VicsMum
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His surname does begin with "L"...he's rabbit!!! Anti-ageing genetic modification? Nah, maybe not...
I wouldn't discard that theory, who knows?
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:38
Gatehouse
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Also, interesting that Jessica and Arby have seemingly united. At least it seems like that's what will happen now.
Reckon it's what Raisin Boy wants at any rate! But to what end? For the first time in a while, the question "where is Jessica Hyde" seemed to be a simple, straight one. Note that Letts and Assistant knew exactly where she was-do they always? And that Arby would have killed anyone else he found there-but the gang got out with seconds to spare. The fates clearly have a different end in mind for them..


They've definitely reigned in this side of the story this week, yet they've taken a huge step forwards in their role. Suddenly the one who is clear thinking seems to be Arby..he's like an alcoholic after the mists have cleared. But I have no idea where he's going with this, other than the fact that he's read the manuscript-and I expect Jessica features in it as well as him.

He was looking rather smug, as if he has the knowledge that Jessica so desperately wants-but he seems to want to help her. He was meant to kill her-but he didn't, and has turned against his handlers. Letts had to give up a lot to him to escape with his life.


Whilst Arby is exploring his new-found feelings, our Jess appears to be having something of a major malfunction..was it just me or could I hear fuses blowing during the scene with Ian?!? She still seems to be playing something of a Machiavellian role-she gets Ian to call Milner. Other than that, she just seems to be going totally Bladerunner still to me! She's constantly trying to explore human emotions as if she isn't human...see Coldplay scene



Speculative Becky Theory follows:

Spoiler
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:39
drykid
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You need a slow ep just to bring things back down, have a breather and then ramp it up again!
Well that approach makes sense within an episode (or a film for that matter) i.e. having a slower section to give a breather inbetween the more exciting sections of the episode. But having a entirely slow episode in between two fast-paced ones isn't really the same thing, since you'd hope that after seven days away the viewer will have got their breath back, no matter how exciting the previous week's episode was...
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:48
VicsMum
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Note that Letts and Assistant knew exactly where she was-do they always?
Exactly what I said in my previous post Gatehouse, glad someone picked this up too.

And up to this week I thought Donaldson was a good one until he wanted to exchange the info about the Russian flu for money. Unless there's something else about his persona (possibly) he's just an idiot wanting revenge.
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:50
Gatehouse
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Ok so thinking on...Arby and Jessica last week, especially Arby's blinks of disbelief...Jessica at no point fearing for her life at the hands of Arby, Arby this week at no point fearing for his life at the end of Jessica's gun...


"Hi Sis, It's me, your long lost bro!" seems a bit too ruddy corny. But something along those lines-I think it's more about isolation and the need to identify with a kindred spirit. So Jessica's father, being a Eugenics-crazy mutator, who was "effectively" Arby's father as well as being literally Jessica's father, has screwed with his daughter in experiments as well as his consignments from Eastern Europe. If Lett's words about how much he was lacking in compassion are to believed that is.
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:51
picklesandginge
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Reading through the blog comments and I've come up with a theory...(that probably isn't in any way correct).

Spoiler
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:53
Gatehouse
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Exactly what I said in my previous post Gatehouse, glad someone picked this up too.

And up to this week I thought Donaldson was a good one until he wanted to exchange the info about the Russian flu for money. Unless there's something else about his persona (possibly) he's just an idiot wanting revenge.
I don't get why Dugdale was tipped off to go to him by now-dead-journo if he isn't a force for good. I think he wants serious revenge, and he's got what he wants from Dugdale-ruthlessness is a universal characteristic amongst all players here, the stakes are too high for it not to be. He probably sees Dugdale as a weak link-hell, they do have him by the short and curlies, don't they?


And yes, am agreeing with a lot of what you say in general! I didn't copy, I was just ranting without reading
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Old 05-02-2013, 23:57
Gatehouse
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Reading through the blog comments and I've come up with a theory...(that probably isn't in any way correct).

Spoiler


It's as good as any other theory, interesting! Although I don't think that's why Jessica wants the manuscript-I think in that regard, it's what it says on the tin.
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Old 06-02-2013, 00:01
Gatehouse
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I wouldn't discard that theory, who knows?
His moment with the gun was great, but his true strength this ep was being a rock for Alice. What a guy.


I think Alice's casual blowing of the hair out of her eye before shooting Monroe was possibly the coolest Chicks With Guns moment since Chicks Who Love Guns in Jackie Brown
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Old 06-02-2013, 00:01
VicsMum
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I don't get why Dugdale was tipped off to go to him by now-dead-journo if he isn't a force for good. I think he wants serious revenge, and he's got what he wants from Dugdale-ruthlessness is a universal characteristic amongst all players here, the stakes are too high for it not to be. He probably sees Dugdale as a weak link-hell, they do have him by the short and curlies, don't they?


And yes, am agreeing with a lot of what you say in general! I didn't copy, I was just ranting without reading


Hmmm, Donaldson is still a bit of a question mark for me, don't know what to make of him, tbh.

Oh, and I agree with a lot of what you say too
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Old 06-02-2013, 00:03
T.K. Mazin
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We got to know a few more things but I have to say that this episode left more confused than ever. Last week I thought we were going somewhere but this week my therories have fallen apart.

The person Becky has called doesn't seem to be her dad at all but more someone on the inside or an unrelated third part searching for the manuscript. When she says "Tell me what's going on, are they infecting people now?" it was pretty clear that it wasn't her dad, or at least didn't seem so.

Milner. She only appears when it pleases her. Why did she give a phone to them and doesn't answer their calls? Her conversation with Ian was another confusing matter. Ian told her that he was with Jessica Hyde, then the following dialogue ensues:
Milner: "You lost the mansucript"
Ian: "How do you know?"
Milner: "I'm a spy"....".the person who took stil has it"..."Jessica will be the one who finds it"
I assume she knows Grant still has the important parts and Jessica would be coming back to him to get it, so why hasn't she sent someone after him yet to retrieve it yet?

Arby asking Letts "Where is Jessica Hyde?" and Letts giving him her whereabouts details. Well, if they know where she is all the time, why haven't they killed her yet? Why the interest in keeping her alive?

Still on Jessica, the way she kissed Ian was disturbingly robotic. She and Arby might have more in common than we know.

I'm watching again on 4+1 to see if I missed any details and I'm getting more and more confused. I just hope they don't give a pretentious ending with cr@p explanations or no explanations at all. I've watched quite a lot of dramas with promising beginnings, intriguing middle and really bad endings recently and I'm hoping this won't be the same.
I guess we can't accuse it of being too predictable I guess . I agree, it was confusing on parts, which is never a bad thing IMO .

Regarding Becky, I think you're right - there is a third party who oppose the Network and are trying to bring them down by getting hold of the manuscript. My guess is, the gang and this third party will unite in their effort to stop the Network. Becky will either come clean about this third party or Wilson will become suspicious of her (due to her lies about his father) and work it out. We know that Becky is due to meet a contact from this third party, so I think the stage has been set for a confrontation between our heroes and Becky's employers.

Regarding Milner and her elusive behaviour, I think she doesn't want to risk blowing her cover to the Network, so she's trying keep her involvement minimum as possible.
Also, the following line: "The person who took it still has it." was a reference to Arby I believe, not Grant. Milner meant that Arby hadn't handed the manuscript over to his bosses yet, meaning Jessica will be able to track him down and take the manuscipt back off him. Though, that's easier said than done with Arby .
As you know, The episode ends with Jessica and Arby confronting each other, so the stage has been set for Jessica to take the manuscript back off him .

Yes, I asked the same questions as you. That scene between Letts and Arby scene was very confusing. How could Letts know where Jessica was? Why haven't they killed her if they already knew? Why tell Arby to track down Jessica if they already knew her whereabouts? I hope they explain this.

Yes, Jessica is one bloody creepy woman . I felt sorry for Ian, having a gun held to his head, then forced to kiss that robot woman . What the hell was going through her head?
If it's the writers' attempt to create a love triangle, then I'm gonna have to say they have miserably failed. It's the most weird love triangle EVER. Besides, I think there are bigger things going on... like the Network's scheme to commit genocide. Maybe Becky, Jessica and Ian should focus on that. Sometimes it feels like Wilson is the only one who wants to solve the mystery of Mr Rabbit's identity lol.

Anyway, good post .
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Old 06-02-2013, 00:09
Gatehouse
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Hmmm, Donaldson is still a bit of a question mark for me, don't know what to make of him, tbh.

Oh, and I agree with a lot of what you say too
As ever, take your cue from the music. That would imply his role is either to bring light relief, or utter bewilderment (of Dugdale, usually)..but
Spoiler


He's my Mad Hatter
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Old 06-02-2013, 00:16
Alrightmate
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A couple of interesting bits from a couple of posts from that Guardian blog....

Spoiler
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