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Why Freeview Boxes do not have a DAB Tuner inside them?


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Old 10-02-2013, 13:43
davetech
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Freeview in my opinion is Dead, although it so call newer technology it does not offer the quality or choice, either because of compression because of lack of band space!

DAB is also outdated, it often provides poor sound, and because many (stations) operate on 1 Band, if the band goes offline, you can loose several stations, least with many local FM and AM Bands they where transmitted local.

I now only think, satellite and fibre optic/broadband have a future, it can offer more but maybe not for less, as cost keep on going up,
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Old 10-02-2013, 14:06
kev
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Freeview in my opinion is Dead, although it so call newer technology it does not offer the quality or choice, either because of compression because of lack of band space!
New compression technologies are coming on stream all the time - however with the ever increasing demand for mobile spectrum this is going to be a band for the main channels - niche services will end up being limited to satellite (although SD is "full"* on the Sky platform so expansion thre is limited too) and IPTV

DAB is also outdated, it often provides poor sound, and because many (stations) operate on 1 Band, if the band goes offline, you can loose several stations, least with many local FM and AM Bands they where transmitted local.
Ignoring the sound argument (it's one of those that goes around in circles) the "1 band" you refer to is actually a "Multiplex" - DVB-T (Freeview), DVB-S (Sky/Freesat), DVB-C (Virgin), DAB and all other Digital broadcasts platforms operate the same way. The only reason this is more noticeable with DAB is because each multiplex carries 1:4 or 1:3 of all available services so making one multiplex going off air more noticeable than the 1:6 on Freeview or 1:100 on Sky. In many cases when you loose one FM service you loose the rest as they all come from the same transmitter anyway. DAB is actually more resilient for this - when the local transmitter goes off air the main transmitter carries on offering some poor, but usable reception. When FM goes off there is nothing left.
I now only think, satellite and fibre optic/broadband have a future, it can offer more but maybe not for less, as cost keep on going up,
And when you lose broadband you don't lose just one radio station you loose all your music, video, tv stations, radio stations For niche content and video on demand IPTV works well, less sure it's really going to scale to being able to operate the main channels, particularly in a state of a national/local emergency.

* Full in the way the original Sky boxes can't hold any more channels in memory, the satellites have plenty of capacity (IIRC there is about space for another 20 transponders at 28.2'E (once a satellite is there to broadcast on them) and it's simple enough to add a second satellite at 31.5'E for instance.
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Old 12-02-2013, 00:00
scruffpot
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My gym uses the TV's for music, playing the radio stations.
However it always seems to be stuck on heart, magic or smooth.... Yup that's the demographics of people who go to my gym...
Drives me insane, however I don't like kiss or capital either, so when people are not looking I switch it to 6 music.
Personally this may seem a stupid idea, but, get rid of dab (I did think it was great when i came out and I have a dab radio), and create just radios that can only pick up freeview radio instead.

However I will be trying to breathe life back into my old Psion wavefinder at some point soon.
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Old 12-02-2013, 02:27
jj20x
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Personally this may seem a stupid idea, but, get rid of dab (I did think it was great when i came out and I have a dab radio), and create just radios that can only pick up freeview radio instead.
There are no radios designed for freeview radio, it's harder to receive in vehicles and doesn't offer any real advantage. Radio on freeview has several low quality mono streams, just as DAB does. If we are ever going to shut down DAB, shut it down for DAB+.
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Old 15-02-2013, 13:10
LeeBoy19
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There are no radios designed for freeview radio, it's harder to receive in vehicles and doesn't offer any real advantage. Radio on freeview has several low quality mono streams, just as DAB does. If we are ever going to shut down DAB, shut it down for DAB+.
And some higher bit rate streams too.
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Old 15-02-2013, 13:12
LeeBoy19
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I guess one of the reasons not many DAB tuners are incorporated could be because a lot of the stations would merely duplicate the stations already on DTT. So the extra number of stations gained might be quite small in some geographic areas.
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Old 15-02-2013, 13:26
jj20x
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I guess one of the reasons not many DAB tuners are incorporated could be because a lot of the stations would merely duplicate the stations already on DTT. So the extra number of stations gained might be quite small in some geographic areas.
To be honest, the most likely reason is cost. The second most likely reason being the need for a separate aerial feed for DAB. Using the UHF feed is, at best, sub optimal.
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Old 15-02-2013, 13:44
Nigel Goodwin
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I guess one of the reasons not many DAB tuners are incorporated could be because a lot of the stations would merely duplicate the stations already on DTT. So the extra number of stations gained might be quite small in some geographic areas.
More to the point, why on earth would you want a DAB tuner in a Freeview box? - any such crazy idea wouldn't sell (too expensive and too few people would want one), and the company would go bust.
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Old 15-02-2013, 13:56
figrin_dan
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No, Goodmans are still running!
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Old 15-02-2013, 14:16
jj20x
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No, Goodmans are still running!
Goodmans is just a trade name currently owned by Chengdu Geeya Technology in China.
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Old 15-02-2013, 15:12
Nigel Goodwin
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Goodmans is just a trade name currently owned by Chengdu Geeya Technology in China.
Goodmans only made speakers anyway - all electronics with the Goodmans name were just badged.
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Old 16-02-2013, 18:19
jj20x
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Goodmans only made speakers anyway - all electronics with the Goodmans name were just badged.
True, the original Goodmans made speakers. Although it was a brand name for Alba / Harvard International before the Chinese bought out what remained of that company.
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Old 16-02-2013, 18:58
tellytart1
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Indeed they did. I remember our family's first TV, a Decca DM4C purchased about 1957, had a turret tuner. Was it 13 positions - Band 1 channels 1 to 5, Band 3 channels 9 to 13 and 3 FM stations in Band 2? The tube and a lot of other circuitry were switched off in FM mode.

I also remember one day (a Saturday or Sunday morning?) my father listening to the same programme on both our LW/MW/SW radio and the TV (in VHF radio mode) at the same time. He said it was an experiment the BBC were doing with something called stereo.
I remember turning the TV sound down and tuning the hifi into Radio 1 to watch Top of the Pop with stereo sound!

Couldn't even begin to do that now with digital TV and radio and the differing delays through each of the transmission chains!
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Old 16-02-2013, 19:52
gomezz
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Yes you can if you record the radio transmission and put it on a few seconds chase-play delay.
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Old 16-02-2013, 20:18
jj20x
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I remember turning the TV sound down and tuning the hifi into Radio 1 to watch Top of the Pop with stereo sound!

Couldn't even begin to do that now with digital TV and radio and the differing delays through each of the transmission chains!
No real point as TV stereo soundtracks are usually at a higher bitrate than radio.
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Old 16-02-2013, 20:27
Nigel Goodwin
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True, the original Goodmans made speakers. Although it was a brand name for Alba / Harvard International before the Chinese bought out what remained of that company.
It was just a badge (one of many) used by Alba/Harvard as well, it was also sold to Comet (I think?) and used as a badge on their cheap crap at the same time - and nothing to do with the Goodmans from Alba/Harvard.
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Old 16-02-2013, 20:35
jj20x
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It was just a badge (one of many) used by Alba/Harvard as well, it was also sold to Comet (I think?) and used as a badge on their cheap crap at the same time - and nothing to do with the Goodmans from Alba/Harvard.
Technically Alba was just a badge, even though Harvard took on the name for their company for a while before selling the Alba and Bush names on to Argos's parent company.

Speaking of Argos and speaker manufacturers, Argos have also used the Wharfedale name for their own brand electronic equipment.
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Old 17-02-2013, 12:05
Nigel Goodwin
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Speaking of Argos and speaker manufacturers, Argos have also used the Wharfedale name for their own brand electronic equipment.
Yes, the Wharfdale name has been used by all and sundry for mostly Vestel gear - they seem to sell the rights to the name for 12 months at a time.

For one of those 12 months it belonged to Euronics, but the members were less than impressed with the Vestel quality.
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Old 17-02-2013, 22:48
*MikeB*
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A television set top box is really a box to watch television through.

Having radio channels on "freeview" is really rather pointless. When I see someone "listening" to radio via a freeview box, with the tv switched on, displaying a static caption, and listening through a pathetic tiny pair of television speakers I cringe.

Listening to radio should be through a decent amp and decent speakers. So if you are going to listen to DAB, have a dedicated DAB tuner as part of your hi fi setup.

Having said all that, a far better solution is use a satellite receiver connected to your hi fi to listen to the radio. Loads more channels available than on DAB, and in general most at a much higher bit rate.
Yeah that's what I do. A DAB receiver as part of my hi fi setup would sound awful, my Sky+HD box connected to my surround sound system on the other hand sounds fantastic.
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Old 18-02-2013, 09:06
figrin_dan
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So when Nigel said the company would go bust, what company was he referring to?
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Old 18-02-2013, 09:16
gomezz
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My DAB radio doesn't sound too bad through my hi-fi system. Nor does my Freeview box. I suppose it depends on the capability of the hi-fi sytem and your expectations.

The advantages of using the Freeview box over DAB are the higher bit rates and the ease of recording shows to playback at your convenience. But then again two of radio stations I listen to most are not on Freeview so then DAB is the preferred option.

The best solution is to have access to *all* sources.
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Old 18-02-2013, 11:36
Nigel Goodwin
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So when Nigel said the company would go bust, what company was he referring to?
Any company that tried to sell a high price Freeview box that included DAB - entirely pointless, and a guaranteed disaster.
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Old 18-02-2013, 12:23
lbear
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Any company that tried to sell a high price Freeview box that included DAB - entirely pointless, and a guaranteed disaster.
Just to be perverse, I will observe that there are UK sellers on eBay claiming that a DVB-T USB computer stick is also capable of receiving DAB radio.

As they also use a counterfeit version of the Freeview logo, I have taken that with a large bucket of salt however I would be interested in knowing if anybody has experience of these.
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Old 18-02-2013, 20:28
jj20x
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Just to be perverse, I will observe that there are UK sellers on eBay claiming that a DVB-T USB computer stick is also capable of receiving DAB radio.

As they also use a counterfeit version of the Freeview logo, I have taken that with a large bucket of salt however I would be interested in knowing if anybody has experience of these.
I'd rather have a DVB-T2 version to be honest and there's not a great deal of choice with this type of equipment.
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Old 18-02-2013, 20:57
Winston_1
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Just to be perverse, I will observe that there are UK sellers on eBay claiming that a DVB-T USB computer stick is also capable of receiving DAB radio.
Argos claim that their Bush TVs can receive DAB radio. I even have an email from their technical department assuring me that this is the case!!!!
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