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Cable calls for "greatly expanded" spending funded through borrowing, not cuts


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Old 07-03-2013, 00:09
Jol44
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Vince Cable calls on Osborne to change direction

Cable calls for "greatly expanded" capital spending and suggests that any increase should be funded through borrowing, not greater cuts elsewhere.

Cable takes a significant step towards Labour's position by implying that the government should now borrow to invest".

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics...ange-direction

I think this government previously comparing the UK economy to having debt on a credit card as beyond simplistic. It is only through growth will be be able to start to clear our debts and removing investment clearly isn't going to bring that growth.
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Old 07-03-2013, 00:23
rusty123
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Growth from where? Our travel industry? Our carpet manufacturers? Our DVD rental shops? Camera shops?

The govt can't reinvent the private sector, be held responsible for business models fit for an episode of Antiques Roadshow or create a market that isn't there.

It would be nice if they could because if they could - logic dictates they'd have already done it. Here's hoping that if they do consider a spending spree they do it with monies budgetted elsewhere (such as Trident and foreign aid) rather than going "all in" on the credit card so to speak.
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Old 07-03-2013, 00:35
WindWalker
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What government can do is make a concerted effort to lower housing costs so that jobs become tenable. It's no good pricing many jobs out of the market by huge living costs then expecting temporary workers from overseas to do them. That way lies madness. Benefits to support wages too low to allow people to afford a roof over their head helps no-one in the long term. Mass building of real council houses will help the situation. Use the QE interest money to get the ball rolling, rule out housing associations and make sure they're never sold.
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Old 07-03-2013, 00:42
cloudymountain
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No use. You can only use money to grow money if you have the ability to seek greater returns. However, when you have workers who take 20 years to build a railway line, a line that took China 18 months to build, I know as a business where I would rather set up shop. What is needed is not simply some kind of financial chincanery or policy adjustment to rejuvenate the country. What Britain needs is a sea change in attitudes and psyche to work, responsibility and frugality. In short, the protestant work ethic. This is what the government has been trying to achieve, not merely to cure Britain from it's debt hangover. That is merely the symptom. What we have is something much more intractable, we have a disease of the mind.

No, this is just a scam to keep the welfare ponzi running. But Cable should have heard the sound of silence, that's the sound of the music stopping.
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Old 07-03-2013, 00:51
WindWalker
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No use. You can only use money to grow money if you have the ability to seek greater returns. However, when you have workers who take 20 years to build a railway line, a line that took China 18 months to build, I know as a business where I would rather set up shop. What is needed is not simply some kind of financial chincanery or policy adjustment to rejuvenate the country. What Britain needs is a sea change in attitudes and psyche to work, responsibility and frugality. In short, the protestant work ethic. This is what the government has been trying to achieve, not merely to cure Britain from it's debt hangover. That is merely the symptom. What we have is something much more intractable, we have a disease of the mind.

No, this is just a scam to keep the welfare ponzi running. But Cable should have heard the sound of silence, that's the sound of the music stopping.
You create it out of thin air. Banks do it by the bucket load everyday. The fed is doing it every day this month bar one, the 8th i think it is.

Shorting The Market On These March Days Will Be Hazardous To Your Health


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-0...us-your-health
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:06
Jol44
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No use. You can only use money to grow money if you have the ability to seek greater returns. However, when you have workers who take 20 years to build a railway line, a line that took China 18 months to build, I know as a business where I would rather set up shop. What is needed is not simply some kind of financial chincanery or policy adjustment to rejuvenate the country. What Britain needs is a sea change in attitudes and psyche to work, responsibility and frugality. In short, the protestant work ethic. This is what the government has been trying to achieve, not merely to cure Britain from it's debt hangover. That is merely the symptom. What we have is something much more intractable, we have a disease of the mind.

No, this is just a scam to keep the welfare ponzi running. But Cable should have heard the sound of silence, that's the sound of the music stopping.
So the People's Republic of China is your idea of utopia. Interesting.
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:15
Aneechik
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I'd like to see them spend some quantitative easing money rebuilding British industry the way Germany did after the war.
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:59
Tyr
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"Greatly expanded spending through borrowing" - That is exactly what got us into this cluster**** of a mess in the first place and has condemned future generations to a life of debt slavery to the banking elites.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:08
Jol44
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It's time for Vince to wrestle the controls off Osborne and grab hold of the joystick
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:40
Majlis
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"Greatly expanded spending through borrowing" - That is exactly what got us into this cluster**** of a mess in the first place and has condemned future generations to a life of debt slavery to the banking elites.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.
Quite, we were 'borrowing to invest' in the years leading up to the crisis - worked well didn't it?
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Old 07-03-2013, 05:00
thomas pain
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Quite, we were 'borrowing to invest' in the years leading up to the crisis - worked well didn't it?
no it didn't work well because money was spent on the wrong things. hopefully this or the next government can make some wise investments like building more homes which can help to reduce the huge housing benefit bill.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:41
U.R.Correct
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If Cable truly believes this maybe he should resign his post . Why be part of something that you don't believe in?
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:21
helioslumos
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I'd like to see them spend some quantitative easing money rebuilding British industry the way Germany did after the war.
This. A thousand times this. Unfortunately our industrial sector was largely decimated by Margaret Thatcher and our economy has been propped up by the service industries ever since. However borrowing to invest might take a while to catch on with the British public. Most of them are still convinced that you can't borrow your way out of a recession (you can, this being one of the basic rules of Keynesian economics)
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:22
helioslumos
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If Cable truly believes this maybe he should resign his post . Why be part of something that you don't believe in?
Because most politicians prefer to follow the party line rather than their conscience. I miss Robin Cook
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:25
Jilly
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I guess Vince has been out for tea with the two Ed's.
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:42
allaorta
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I guess Vince has been out for tea with the two Ed's.
Discussing which Labour safe seat he'll get come the next election. When will people realise this guy is a duplicitous ship jumper?
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:49
helioslumos
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Discussing which Labour safe seat he'll get come the next election. When will people realise this guy is a duplicitous ship jumper?
He has a 20% majority in his own constituency and has been MP there since 1997, so there is little chance of losing his seat. But of course it is fun to speculate with no factual basis!
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:51
PrestonAl
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I would say now we're looking at growth and the recession is behind us, it is a good policy to start to invest and help growth. Much better that the last lot who just borrowed and borrowed right up to election day.

How people can vote for labour again is beyond me. I'm still furious for doing so
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:58
shortyknickers
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It's time for Vince to wrestle the controls off Osborne and grab hold of the joystick
great idea!
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:14
allaorta
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He has a 20% majority in his own constituency and has been MP there since 1997, so there is little chance of losing his seat. But of course it is fun to speculate with no factual basis!
Joining Labour wouldn't be a sea change for him and would provide him with a much better chance of minister position; he's changed party before and he'd probably do it again. Looking at the chances of the LibDems come 2015, they certainly won't be in government either as a party or in coalition with Labour.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:48
Majlis
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no it didn't work well because money was spent on the wrong things. hopefully this or the next government can make some wise investments like building more homes which can help to reduce the huge housing benefit bill.
Trouble isn't that politicians from across the spectrum have an incredibly bad record for investment, whatever it was in. I am not convinced that mass council house building is going to be a massive growth stimulus. The idea suffers from the same issues as private house building, ie the regulations restricting it. If you are proposing scrapping those restrictions then why not simply allow private house building and therefore no need for extra borrowing.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:58
helioslumos
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Joining Labour wouldn't be a sea change for him and would provide him with a much better chance of minister position;
Not necessarily - see my third point

He's changed party before and he'd probably do it again.
Complete speculation

Looking at the chances of the LibDems come 2015, they certainly won't be in government either as a party or in coalition with Labour.
Well they obviously won't win a majority, so I'm not sure why you mentioned that. And it is perfectly believable, perhaps even probable, that the Lib Dems could end up in coalition with Labour if there is a hung parliament
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:58
flagpole
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What government can do is make a concerted effort to lower housing costs so that jobs become tenable. It's no good pricing many jobs out of the market by huge living costs then expecting temporary workers from overseas to do them. That way lies madness. Benefits to support wages too low to allow people to afford a roof over their head helps no-one in the long term. Mass building of real council houses will help the situation. Use the QE interest money to get the ball rolling, rule out housing associations and make sure they're never sold.
I absolutely think we need to build more houses and that housing costs need to come down. but it doesn't really help with economic growth...

...and that has to be a priority at the moment. if you're going to borrow for capex you need to do it in a way that will generate or facilitate the generation of income. transport infrastructure is a great example of this. but there are more modern examples around IT. building schools. stuff that will pay you back.

as for the specific allocation of one source of revenue to one source of expenditure, it's economic nonsense. it's a thing that only exists in the minds of politicians. it's not real.
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Old 07-03-2013, 09:01
Auld Snody
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No use. You can only use money to grow money if you have the ability to seek greater returns. However, when you have workers who take 20 years to build a railway line, a line that took China 18 months to build, I know as a business where I would rather set up shop. What is needed is not simply some kind of financial chincanery or policy adjustment to rejuvenate the country. What Britain needs is a sea change in attitudes and psyche to work, responsibility and frugality. In short, the protestant work ethic. This is what the government has been trying to achieve, not merely to cure Britain from it's debt hangover. That is merely the symptom. What we have is something much more intractable, we have a disease of the mind.

No, this is just a scam to keep the welfare ponzi running. But Cable should have heard the sound of silence, that's the sound of the music stopping.
And therein lies the problem with this country, people like you with entrenched dogmatic views and simplistic notions. And they are running the country!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-03-2013, 09:05
Auld Snody
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I absolutely think we need to build more houses and that housing costs need to come down. but it doesn't really help with economic growth...

...and that has to be a priority at the moment. if you're going to borrow for capex you need to do it in a way that will generate or facilitate the generation of income. transport infrastructure is a great example of this. but there are more modern examples around IT. building schools. stuff that will pay you back.

as for the specific allocation of one source of revenue to one source of expenditure, it's economic nonsense. it's a thing that only exists in the minds of politicians. it's not real.
Public housing does pay you back. It reduces housing costs, puts more money into the economy ( by creating jobs and allowing the recipients of public housing having more disposable income). It stabilises family life, makes people feel more secure, etc. It is a GOOD thing
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