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Royal Mail privatisation begins today with flotation


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Old 12-09-2013, 12:46
Uncle Fester
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Where can I buy some shares
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:07
Ashford Steve
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BBC news just called this privatization 'long awaited and historic'. So much for the consitution of the BBC and it's supposed commitment to party political impartiality.
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:09
rusty123
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Thanks for the compliment, it was getting a bit dull.
As ever, you're welcome smudge

Forgetting the righty scaremongering about striking unions, do you think costs will stay at their present levels (which are high) and services will be as good for the next 10-15 years?
Listening to Billy Hayes on r5 this morning I wouldn't call the threat of strike action righty scaremongering. He's in the mood for a good old fashioned 70's style us and them ding dong.
Regarding cost projections I can only guess based on listening to the debate from my vantage point on the distant fence of general ignorance.
The govt spokesman on the radio this morning (I think it was Fallon) was talking about things like increased investment opportunities and being able to better exploit overseas interests royal mail are already involved in. It all sounded pretty reasonable to me and didn't get me questioning his logic but then it's a subject I've never really got my head around so I'm not really the person to ask.

Service wise I can only assume the legal framework surrounding contractual terms will answer that. I'm lead to believe it is being protected by law but that's entering into "how long is a piece of string?" territory. The only laws I can think of that were set in stone were carried down a mountain by Moses. I don''t think think there was an eleventh commandment about the price of stamps and daily deliveries.
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:18
LostFool
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Where can I buy some shares
The same place you buy any other shares. I had an email from my dealer this morning asking me if I wanted to register my interest for when the full details are released.

Reports are that the minimum investment will be 750. Royal Mail workers will get free shares worth about 2000 each and eligible to buy more shares with a 500 minimum.
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:19
barky99
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Service wise I can only assume the legal framework surrounding contractual terms will answer that. I'm lead to believe it is being protected by law but that's entering into "how long is a piece of string?" territory. The only laws I can think of that were set in stone were carried down a mountain by Moses. I don''t think think there was an eleventh commandment about the price of stamps and daily deliveries.
protected for 3 years then free to do as they wish -- according to royal mail worker I asked this morning!
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:21
LostFool
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BBC news just called this privatization 'long awaited and historic'. So much for the consitution of the BBC and it's supposed commitment to party political impartiality.
Well, that's true on both counts
"long awaited" - this has been expected for a long time. Indeed the last government tried to do it but backed down.
"historic" - privatising the Royal Mail, the oldest postal service in the world, would indeed be an historic event.

Neither of these terms are impartial or say anything about whether it is a good or bad thing.
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:33
rusty123
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They can't...and that's exactly why your notion of NOT striking and using their income to buy shares is a non runner from the start....that income is ALREADY committed to other things.
If it was me and I feared for my job three years down the line and knew (for several years in advance) that this was all coming to a head i'd have taken steps to try and invest to protect my own future. Better that than writing off wages stood on a picket line.
We're not talking massive loans to achieve it. If the postal workers are as united in their anger at the proposal as the likes of Billy Hayes reckons and that they know best what is right for royal mail and their individual futures i say go borrow up to five grand a piece and buy the bloody thing between them.

They'd have my blessing.

Expecting the taxpayer to act as a human shield simply because the royal mail is as old as the hills doesn't wash with me. If they want to protect it - let them buy it.

On the same basis why don't you start saving all your income for a Rolls Royce.... meanwhile eating fresh air, living in the magic pixie's house which you can run on the energy generated a unicorn's horn.
mature!
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:41
rusty123
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protected for 3 years then free to do as they wish -- according to royal mail worker I asked this morning!
I'd be inclined to look at the legal terms rather than ask the postman.

I see you're up in Scotland. Could be interesting to see what kind of royal mail you might be running should Scotland go independent.
With that in mind that three years could be looking too far into the future. All bets could be off by this time next year
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:50
glasshalffull
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If it was me and I feared for my job three years down the line and knew (for several years in advance) that this was all coming to a head i'd have taken steps to try and invest to protect my own future. Better that than writing off wages stood on a picket line.
We're not talking massive loans to achieve it. If the postal workers are as united in their anger at the proposal as the likes of Billy Hayes reckons and that they know best what is right for royal mail and their individual futures i say go borrow up to five grand a piece and buy the bloody thing between them.

They'd have my blessing.

Expecting the taxpayer to act as a human shield simply because the royal mail is as old as the hills doesn't wash with me. If they want to protect it - let them buy it.



mature!
The cheapest 5k loan over 3 years right now will cost about 154 per month to pay back...and that by the way is assuming you are a homeowner as a minimal qualifying factor.

I'm not so sure 154 per month is that easy to find from the salary of 22k you keep quoting...nor do I know what % of employees are homeowners necessary to secure that sort of loan/rate.

Why not just say the same as me..."they would be dumbasses to go on strike"...instead of coming up with this "fantasy" alternative
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Old 12-09-2013, 13:50
LostFool
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As the service is relatively good at the moment, what are the benefits of privatisation? Availability of capital is a red herring based on (almost) unlimited money being available for HS2.
I'd query the assumption that the service is "relatively good" at the moment. 10 years ago I'd get my post before 9am in the morning. Now I'm lucky it it appears before 2pm (it's 1:50pm now and still no sign of the postie). Yet I live less than a mile from a main post office.

In terms of capital investment, the government is limited in terms what it can spend on the Royal Mail due to EU rules on state subsidies. Some investment is allowable in order for the RM to maintain a public service but a privately owned RM would be free of such restrictions and could expand overseas in the same way that Deutsche Post has to become the world's biggest delivery company - in case you didn't know Deutsche Post owns DHL while the Royal Mail's Parcelforce is a wreck of a company.
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Old 12-09-2013, 14:05
rusty123
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Why not just say the same as me..."they would be dumbasses to go on strike"...instead of coming up with this "fantasy" alternative
Because from the sound of things these dumbasses are itching for a strike if this plan goes ahead.

My "fantasy" alternative to that financial hit they'd suffer from taking strike action is just to demonstrate how they could almost guarantee to secure the future they want for the same money they're prepared to lose on a picket line for an unspecified time and an unknown outcome.

I'll bet the union hasn't been talking to them along such lines for the past few years.
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Old 12-09-2013, 14:10
cheesy_pasty
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Another institution dies. Farewell.
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Old 12-09-2013, 14:22
LostFool
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More information: https://www.gov.uk/royalmailshares for the public or http://www.royalmailemployeeshares.co.uk/ if you are an employee.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:16
occy
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The Royal Mail is different from the Post Office which will stay under Government control. It will be worth Three Billion. Staff will receive shares around two grand. Hopefully Pensions will be kept and know doubt ballot will be held for industrial action.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:33
rusty123
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The Royal Mail is different from the Post Office which will stay under Government control. It will be worth Three Billion. Staff will receive shares around two grand. Hopefully Pensions will be kept and know doubt ballot will be held for industrial action.
Strike ballot starts next week. The unions were already peev'd over pensions and had a prearranged meeting scheduled for today where they'd probably have been discussing industrial action on that alone. Now they're all chomping at the bit and the news is a strike ballot is almost a formality and strikes could start as early as October 10th if what I heard on r5 about an hour ago is accurate.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:34
Richard1960
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Where can I buy some shares
From some Dutch company when it goes out of UK control much like our utilities.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:34
horace_Tort1
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and there it goes .....
Yes just like water, gas, railways, electric, our steel works we were told, the customer has nothing to worry about and these services would be cheaper
Never trust the Tories and there rich friends.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:36
Richard1960
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Yes just like water, gas, railways, electric, our steel works we were told, the customer has nothing to worry about and these services would be cheaper
Never trust the Tories and there rich friends.
To be fair Peter Mandelson wanted to do the same but was thwarted under Nu Labour.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:43
smudges dad
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The Royal Mail is different from the Post Office which will stay under Government control. It will be worth Three Billion. Staff will receive shares around two grand. Hopefully Pensions will be kept and know doubt ballot will be held for industrial action.
So, essentially, the government is bribing the Royal Mail workers to behave with 300,000,000 of our (i.e. hard working tax payers) money?
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:43
occy
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The Government can't afford to keep it. It'll end up going the same way as IE : Water companies went with big bosses receiving massive bonuses.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:46
Richard1960
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The Government can't afford to keep it. It'll end up going the same way as IE : Water companies went with big bosses receiving massive bonuses.
You mean to say big bonuses are not made in the private sector.?

Look at the banks in private hands paying money galore in bonuses before going bust,and relying on the taxpayer for a bail out.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:48
Richard1960
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So, essentially, the government is bribing the Royal Mail workers to behave with 300,000,000 of our (i.e. hard working tax payers) money?
Of course just the same as they bribed us to buy shares in the Water,Utilities,Rail ect companies that we as taxpayers already owned.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:55
rusty123
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So, essentially, the government is bribing the Royal Mail workers to behave with 300,000,000 of our (i.e. hard working tax payers) money?
Peanuts compared to the Royal Mails 8 or 9 billion quid pension liability that the tax payer is saddled with.
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Old 12-09-2013, 17:58
Richard1960
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Peanuts compared to the Royal Mails 8 or 9 billion quid pension liability that the tax payer is saddled with.
To be honest rusty123 i would rather be saddled with that for ordinary workers predominately.

Then debt for failed banks.

BT a private company has caught up with its pension debt given time i am sure Royal Mail would have too.
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Old 12-09-2013, 18:00
LostFool
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So, essentially, the government is bribing the Royal Mail workers to behave with 300,000,000 of our (i.e. hard working tax payers) money?
If that 2,000 each prevents strikes and motivates them to improve efficiency and service levels then it will be money well spent.

Of course if the government weren't giving away free shares to the workers you'd be complaining about that too.
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