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Whats the best 90s indie music album?


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Old 07-01-2014, 20:51
thewaywardbus
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i presume you mean their second album, which was their second independant release, as their first album froggystyle which was an independant release hasn't been reissued on a major label. if an album is released on an indie label it's an indie album, even if it's subsequently reissued or distributed by a major label. it's the original release that counts. pretty simple in black and white really. it's just like singles that have the original release on an indie label and get picked up for distribution on a major label, such as commonly happened with dance music. dj's buy the import 12" and it gets popular in clubs and labels like sony would license it for release in the uk
No froggystyle was a 10 track demo tape that was sold at gigs and never officially released. Most of the tracks were remastered and used on their first two albums or as b sides, and then some released on the special tenth anniversary edition of their first album.
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Old 07-01-2014, 22:25
unique
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Actually indie music has every sort of genre, including indie rock, indie pop and even indie dance are definable genres of music through their association with indie labels. Some of those genres also exist on major labels or indie labels owned by majors.

What was a possibly an interesting thread about the indie ethos and the music that emerges from that has been spoilt by a semantic argument…
but you were one of the first to argue that oasis weren't indie as creation were partly sold to sony, and in your post quoted above you are arguing semantics about indie music being every sort of genre as opposed to having no genre, when it's pretty clear you share the same view as me in that "indie music" is not a genre of music, it's a term that encompasses a wide variety of different styles of music.

you also said before that it was interesting to hear peoples views, but if an OP asks specifically one question and people give replies that don't answer that question, surely that's beyond the point? if the OP simply wanted to know what peoples favourite albums were they would have asked that, not asked for someones favorite indie album for people to list huge selling bands on major labels like blur and radiohead. you yourself were one of the first to argue semantics about a band who were on an indie label because part of the shares were owned by a major, and have continued to argue about it. i've merely tried to steer the thread back on topic so the best indie albums can be listed, as i'm interested in seeing the replies, but not interested in seeing a list of major label big selling popular albums included in that list
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Old 07-01-2014, 22:29
unique
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No froggystyle was a 10 track demo tape that was sold at gigs and never officially released. Most of the tracks were remastered and used on their first two albums or as b sides, and then some released on the special tenth anniversary edition of their first album.
you are wrong. the album was released and sold by the band officially. it's pretty much the definition of an indie release. you don't get much more indie than that
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Old 07-01-2014, 23:31
thewaywardbus
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you are wrong. the album was released and sold by the band officially. it's pretty much the definition of an indie release. you don't get much more indie than that
But PUSA are a rock band, have always called themselves a rock band and have never said they were indie.

However, I will message Chris Bellew on facebook and see whether he considers froggystyle as their first album. I am happy to go with whatever he says.
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Old 08-01-2014, 00:23
mgvsmith
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you also said before that it was interesting to hear peoples views, but if an OP asks specifically one question and people give replies that don't answer that question, surely that's beyond the point? if the OP simply wanted to know what peoples favourite albums were they would have asked that, not asked for someones favorite indie album for people to list huge selling bands on major labels like blur and radiohead. you yourself were one of the first to argue semantics about a band who were on an indie label because part of the shares were owned by a major, and have continued to argue about it. i've merely tried to steer the thread back on topic so the best indie albums can be listed, as i'm interested in seeing the replies, but not interested in seeing a list of major label big selling popular albums included in that list[
Irrespective of what you wanted that hasn't been the outcome.

Here's a list of 90s Indie Music albums that might be considered the best of the 90s.
And some of these have already been mentioned. I have been relentless about 'Slint'

The Shamen - Boss Dance
The Breeders - Last Splash
PJ Harvey - Dry
St Etienne - Tiger Bay
My Bloody Valentine - Loveless
Neutral Milk Hotel - In the Aeroplane Over the Sea
Belle and Sebastian - If you're feeling sinister
Pavement - Slanted and Enchanted
Mogwai - Young Team
Slint - Spiderland
The Pixies - Bossanova
Poetics head - Dummy
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:17
Rocketpop
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Neutral Milk Hotel - In an Aeroplane Over The Sea
Probably about as good answer as you could get. Covers all the bases - Indie Label, Indie Music, Cult classic album (appears in most critics best of lists), Influenced the sound of Alt music into the 00's.

I'll throw in any 'Yo Lo Tengo' album - 'Painful' probably being the pick of their 90's output. Same with Sleater Kinney 'Dig Me Out'....and as a wild card 'The Crazy Gods of Endless Noises' album 'Heavy Planet'.
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Old 08-01-2014, 10:45
unique
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But PUSA are a rock band, have always called themselves a rock band and have never said they were indie.
what difference does that make? the style of music made makes no difference at all. as has been explained by myself and others, "indie" isn't a style of music. an "indie album" is an album that is released independantly. an album in terms of music is a collection of songs, which froggystyle is. as it was the first collection of songs the band released, and was made available for sale directly to the general public by the band, it was an official release as opposed to a demo not made available to the general public such as tapes and CDr's a band shops round record labels and managers to try and get a deal or a gig, in which case you could reasonably say the demo was unreleased.
a number of websites also show froggystyle as the first album, including wikipedia and POTUS fansites
However, I will message Chris Bellew on facebook and see whether he considers froggystyle as their first album. I am happy to go with whatever he says.
regardless of what he says, it was their first album. his personal view and opinion doesn't change anything. but it would be interesting if you post back a link to his reply
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Old 08-01-2014, 10:50
unique
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Irrespective of what you wanted that hasn't been the outcome.

Here's a list of 90s Indie Music albums that might be considered the best of the 90s.
And some of these have already been mentioned. I have been relentless about 'Slint'

The Shamen - Boss Dance
The Breeders - Last Splash
PJ Harvey - Dry
St Etienne - Tiger Bay
My Bloody Valentine - Loveless
Neutral Milk Hotel - In the Aeroplane Over the Sea
Belle and Sebastian - If you're feeling sinister
Pavement - Slanted and Enchanted
Mogwai - Young Team
Slint - Spiderland
The Pixies - Bossanova
Poetics head - Dummy
you can't always get what you want, but keeping the thread active has resulted in more geniune indie releases being listed, including your interesting choices above. what is good about titles like that as opposed to listing huge selling popular albums on major labels is many people may not have heard of them and may check them out, and others may be reminded to go back and relisten to things they may have forgotten about.
/
btw shamen album was boss drum. i loved the shamen generally but found the album patchy
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Old 08-01-2014, 11:47
thewaywardbus
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The trouble with labelling any release not on a major label as indie is that some of the people releasing this way may not want to be classed as indie.

A hardcore dance artist producing albums on equiptment in his bedroom or a thrash metal band recording in a garage may not want to be called indie and may be insulted to be classed as indie.

You seem to be narrowing the category in one way and then expanding it in a different direction.

It is up to the individual artist what they want to be called, and for that matter what they consider to be their first album. Their opinions are a lot more important than yours!
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Old 08-01-2014, 12:23
mgvsmith
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The trouble with labelling any release not on a major label as indie is that some of the people releasing this way may not want to be classed as indie.

A hardcore dance artist producing albums on equiptment in his bedroom or a thrash metal band recording in a garage may not want to be called indie and may be insulted to be classed as indie.

You seem to be narrowing the category in one way and then expanding it in a different direction.

It is up to the individual artist what they want to be called, and for that matter what they consider to be their first album. Their opinions are a lot more important than yours!
It is quite possible that some artists may not want to be classed as indie. The labelling of music is usually from critics and writers rather than artists though. But as artists are the creators of music then their views should be respected.

As I said before a lot of this is about ethos and ethic. Many of the artists on indie labels do so because they adhere to the DIY ethic and want to be able to create music within an ethos which is independent of the major labels. Some artists just see indie as a starting point.

The trade off with indie is that an artist will have much more artistic control with an indie label but will lose potential audience.
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Old 08-01-2014, 13:43
unique
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The trouble with labelling any release not on a major label as indie is that some of the people releasing this way may not want to be classed as indie.
but really, who cares? it is what it is
A hardcore dance artist producing albums on equiptment in his bedroom or a thrash metal band recording in a garage may not want to be called indie and may be insulted to be classed as indie.
again who cares? i'm sure most artists have better things to concern themselves with
You seem to be narrowing the category in one way and then expanding it in a different direction.
not really. all i'm saying is that indie music is music released on an independant label, not on a major. that's a pretty simple category. i'm not narrowing it from anything other than what the OP asked, nor expanding it in any way. there are all sorts of genres of music released independantly as myself and others have mentioned a few times on this thread
It is up to the individual artist what they want to be called, and for that matter what they consider to be their first album. Their opinions are a lot more important than yours!
are they? in what way? an opinion doesn't change the facts. an artist can't write off their first album or two if they don't like them, and say their third album to be released is their first. even if in their opinion they consider it the first, it's not. and that's pretty simple.
/
as far as i'm concerned it's all just music. if you work in a record store, or shop in a record store you may want to know which section to put the stock or look for it, but in most stores the categories are pretty simplified and vague, such as rock and pop section, urban/hiphop/rnb section, dance section, classical section and jazz section. a more specialised store that specialises in say dance music may then break down into house/techno/garage/dubstep/etc, but most record stores that specialise in indie music will just have a vague rock/pop section, urban, and dance, and have a mix of both indie and major label releases mixed together. i don't remember ever seeing any record store where indie and major label music was seperated in such a way, or having umpteen subgroups of music. at record fairs i've seen the odd stand that say specialises in punk/hardcore have a couple of trays of cds and cardboard sections with subgroups, but that's about it. whether an album or artist is indie or not is irrelevant really. whether the music is good or not, or more importantly whether you as an individual like it or not as what really counts, unless you are in the business of making money from music.
/
but just like a thread asking to name favourite jazz albums, or favourite dance records, if someone is asking for best indie albums it's pointless listing albums that aren't indie. you wouldn't list led zep albums on a thread about favourite hip hop albums would you?
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Old 08-01-2014, 14:20
Cat Simon
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I'll finish the argument;

All the albums mentioned on this thread have one thing in common -

Just great frigging music!

Thread closed - now go play some records!
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Old 08-01-2014, 15:44
TCD1975
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You've pretty much killed a thread, which has the potential to be interesting, with a really boring discussion on what constitutes "indie" music.

Well done!
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Old 09-01-2014, 08:51
thewaywardbus
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regardless of what he says, it was their first album. his personal view and opinion doesn't change anything. but it would be interesting if you post back a link to his reply
His reply is as follows

call Froggystyle a demo I think...the debut is our first ALBUM with a capitol A but if that had not happened then Froggystyle would have been our only album!

I think the answer is somewher between our opinions........although he doesn't seem too sure himself!

And as you seem to have some interest in the band I'm sure you will want to support the pledge music campaign for their new album (which meets all your criteria to be indie! )

http://www.pledgemusic.com/projects/...ce=pledgemusic
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Old 09-01-2014, 10:24
SaddlerSteve
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The Charlatans - Tellin' Stories
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Old 09-01-2014, 10:46
thewaywardbus
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The Charlatans - Tellin' Stories
Good choice
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Old 09-01-2014, 11:06
unique
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You've pretty much killed a thread, which has the potential to be interesting, with a really boring discussion on what constitutes "indie" music.

Well done!
well that's your opinion, and your opinion only. i don't think it's boring, and if other people thought it boring too they wouldn't have participated in discussing it. if you find it boring you don't need to either read or participate in the thread, you can leave everyone else to read, post and participate if they want. just because you think one thing doesn't mean everyone else thinks the same


His reply is as follows

call Froggystyle a demo I think...the debut is our first ALBUM with a capitol A but if that had not happened then Froggystyle would have been our only album!

I think the answer is somewher between our opinions........although he doesn't seem too sure himself!

And as you seem to have some interest in the band I'm sure you will want to support the pledge music campaign for their new album (which meets all your criteria to be indie! )

http://www.pledgemusic.com/projects/...ce=pledgemusic
well he agrees froggystyle is an album, and it it was the first they released, and it was released as they sold it, so you can see i most certainly wasn't wrong. i wasn't really a fan of the band tho, didn't dislike them, but that college rock kinda thing was a bit boring to me as there was so much of it in the 90s following on from grunge. i really loved the cover of videostar and lump was a good track. i guess most of their fans will have grown out of that style so they are doing the pledge thing, which is a pretty cool way for fans and artists to intereact, especially ones where you get your name in the credits and a signed copy and stuff. some have packages where you can meet and greet and go to soundchecks
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Old 09-01-2014, 11:25
thewaywardbus
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well that's your opinion, and your opinion only. i don't think it's boring, and if other people thought it boring too they wouldn't have participated in discussing it. if you find it boring you don't need to either read or participate in the thread, you can leave everyone else to read, post and participate if they want. just because you think one thing doesn't mean everyone else thinks the same



well he agrees froggystyle is an album, and it it was the first they released, and it was released as they sold it, so you can see i most certainly wasn't wrong. i wasn't really a fan of the band tho, didn't dislike them, but that college rock kinda thing was a bit boring to me as there was so much of it in the 90s following on from grunge. i really loved the cover of videostar and lump was a good track. i guess most of their fans will have grown out of that style so they are doing the pledge thing, which is a pretty cool way for fans and artists to intereact, especially ones where you get your name in the credits and a signed copy and stuff. some have packages where you can meet and greet and go to soundchecks
We will have to agree to disagree on both points then.

One good thing about this thread (despite people complaining about our discussions) is that a thread about 'indie' music has reached nearly 70 posts which is unusual on these forums.
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Old 09-01-2014, 14:10
Terrence Chant
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Swagger - Blue Aeroplanes
Snog - The Popguns
Feral Pop Frenzy - Even As We Speak
Eat Yourself Whole - Kingmaker
Le Jardin De Heavenly - Heavenly
Strange Free World - Kitchens Of Distinction
One Part Lullaby - Folk Implosion
Strange Weather Lately - Astrid
And Then Nothing Turned Itself Inside Out - Yo La Tengo
New Wave - The Auteurs
Reading Writing & Arithmetic - The Sundays

Picked up one or two new corkers from this thread too, ta folks keep 'em coming
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Old 09-01-2014, 14:27
Arcana
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Blind* by The Sundays is probably my favourite.

* this album is technically not 'indie' as I understand it but the band was signed originally by Rough Trade so that's good enough for me
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Old 09-01-2014, 14:34
mgvsmith
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Swagger - Blue Aeroplanes
Snog - The Popguns
Feral Pop Frenzy - Even As We Speak
Eat Yourself Whole - Kingmaker
Le Jardin De Heavenly - Heavenly
Strange Free World - Kitchens Of Distinction
One Part Lullaby - Folk Implosion
Strange Weather Lately - Astrid
And Then Nothing Turned Itself Inside Out - Yo La Tengo
New Wave - The Auteurs
Reading Writing & Arithmetic - The Sundays

Picked up one or two new corkers from this thread too, ta folks keep 'em coming
Which are the best though? And I would ask what makes some better than others? Do you still listen to any of these and what lasting influence have they had? For me a lot of this music has not stood the test of time.
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Old 09-01-2014, 15:06
thewaywardbus
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I know a few people have mentioned Neutral Milk Hotel, but you should also try their Elephant 6 compatriats The Apples in stereo's album Fun Trick Noisemaker.
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Old 09-01-2014, 16:13
Soupietwist
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I know a few people have mentioned Neutral Milk Hotel, but you should also try their Elephant 6 compatriats The Apples in stereo's album Fun Trick Noisemaker.
The Gay Parade by Of Montreal is another one worthy of inclusion on this thread - Elephant 6 link too. I enjoyed the early albums of Beulah too.
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Old 09-01-2014, 16:13
Terrence Chant
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Which are the best though? And I would ask what makes some better than others? Do you still listen to any of these and what lasting influence have they had? For me a lot of this music has not stood the test of time.
I thought I'd just put a selection as a heads up for anyone who fancied checking one or two out as much as anything, but if pushed I'd probably favour Yo La Tengo. Still listen to selected tracks on all though.

Dated? You were lucky didn't include the Family Cat and Ten Benson I suppose a lot of (especially early) 90's indie guitar music sounds a bit dated now but on the plus side so many of those songs create a kind of Proustian rush that it's hard not to listen to them fondly
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Old 09-01-2014, 16:31
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I thought I'd just put a selection as a heads up for anyone who fancied checking one or two out as much as anything, but if pushed I'd probably favour Yo La Tengo. Still listen to selected tracks on all though.

Dated? You were lucky didn't include the Family Cat and Ten Benson I suppose a lot of (especially early) 90's indie guitar music sounds a bit dated now but on the plus side so many of those songs create a kind of Proustian rush that it's hard not to listen to them fondly
Ten Benson, now you're going back.

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