I'm not a fan of Lady Gaga but I'm thankful to live in a place where I am free to be one if I wish. That is the issue here . It may only be 60,000 fans but they are the people who have had their freedom curtailed by religious extremists.
Probably best to look her up on YouTube. Her videos are the ones that tend to have hundreds of millions of views. I think it's excellent pop music, but it's still just pop music at the end of the day. Hardly something to merit the almost religious zeal of some of her fans.
Lots of pap on YouTube has millions of views. Some people watch for a laugh.
I'm not a fan of Lady Gaga but I'm thankful to live in a place where I am free to be one if I wish. That is the issue here . It may only be 60,000 fans but they are the people who have had their freedom curtailed by religious extremists.
Indeed. The "she brings it on herself" attitude is a bit much. I mean she is who she is, she does what she does. People either like her style of music/performance or they don't.
She shouldnt have to "tone it down" just because some religious nut doesnt like it. One would assume that the concert sold well otherwise it wouldnt have been an issue in the first place. So she has fans over there who are missing out because once again, someone with a belief that they have the right to tell everyone else what to do threw a hissy fit. A fanatical hissy fit.
Indeed. The "she brings it on herself" attitude is a bit much. I mean she is who she is, she does what she does. People either like her style of music/performance or they don't.
She shouldnt have to "tone it down" just because some religious nut doesnt like it. One would assume that the concert sold well otherwise it wouldnt have been an issue in the first place. So she has fans over there who are missing out because once again, someone with a belief that they have the right to tell everyone else what to do threw a hissy fit. A fanatical hissy fit.
This sums it up for me.
And for the sake of balance, I felt the exactly the same way when I was a little girl, and Christian conservatives were trying to ban Ozzy Osbourne concerts all over my country, and churches were trying to get Mtv taken down. For me, it's not about bashing religion, it's about condemning backward authoritarians pissing on everyone's parade.
Indeed. The "she brings it on herself" attitude is a bit much. I mean she is who she is, she does what she does. People either like her style of music/performance or they don't.
She shouldnt have to "tone it down" just because some religious nut doesnt like it. One would assume that the concert sold well otherwise it wouldnt have been an issue in the first place. So she has fans over there who are missing out because once again, someone with a belief that they have the right to tell everyone else what to do threw a hissy fit. A fanatical hissy fit.
What do people do when holidaying abroad? Maybe to a country that isn't as say liberal as Spanish resorts?
Personally I feel if your going to visit another country for a short while, then at least try and adapt yourself to the local way of life. If you don't like the way of life, then don't visit. Let's be honest, she didn't go there out of her love of spreading, erm what do you call what she does, her performance, she goes to make money.
GaGa herself wrote on Twitter: "There is nothing Holy about hatred. We had to cancel the concert in Indonesia. I'm so very sorry to the fans & just as devastated as you if not more.
She constantly refers to herself as an artist and pushing boundaries and i admire her for that. I think going somewhere where you are aware that a certain type of behaviour isnt tolerated however is sensationalism on her managements part, they knew extreme groups would object they knew it would get headlines for her ongoing world tour, did she actually set foot in the country? is she actually in danger? doubtful, but her management got what they set out to achieve, worldwide headlines and more love for the Gaga for "standing up to these people", very clever marketing.
None of that makes these extremists and their death threats ok but lets get a little prespective here.
Personally I feel if your going to visit another country for a short while, then at least try and adapt yourself to the local way of life. If you don't like the way of life, then don't visit..
I hope you apply this principle to all people visiting all countries, ie that they respect the local culture and history, and not to go in the first place if you have any objections to how the local people live their lives
For example, it would be crazy to set up home in a country you considered 'immoral and decadent' if you disapproved wouldn't it?
What do people do when holidaying abroad? Maybe to a country that isn't as say liberal as Spanish resorts?
Personally I feel if your going to visit another country for a short while, then at least try and adapt yourself to the local way of life. If you don't like the way of life, then don't visit. Let's be honest, she didn't go there out of her love of spreading, erm what do you call what she does, her performance, she goes to make money.
Its a different thing. I would never choose to holiday in a country that restricts my freedom beyond that which I would allow it to be restricted. I certainly would never visit Saudi Arabia for example.
However, whilst I agree she was going there to make money, as its her career, she wouldnt have chosen to attempt a concert in that location had there not been a demand for it. People who lived there WANTED to see her, presumably enough of them to make it worth her while.
And the "local way of life" there is how the fanatics see it is it? Really? Thats how it is over there and everyone agrees? In which case, why was the concert selling?
Its the people over there that are missing out, not Lady Ga Ga...she'll just move on to somewhere that welcomes her. So its the people of Indonesia that were looking forward to her concert that are missing out. Because of religious nutjobs.
She constantly refers to herself as an artist and pushing boundaries and i admire her for that. I think going somewhere where you are aware that a certain type of behaviour isnt tolerated however is sensationalism on her managements part, they knew extreme groups would object they knew it would get headlines for her ongoing world tour, did she actually set foot in the country? is she actually in danger? doubtful, but her management got what they set out to achieve, worldwide headlines and more love for the Gaga for "standing up to these people", very clever marketing.
None of that makes these extremists and their death threats ok but lets get a little prespective here.
Again I ask if its blanketly not tolerated why were people buying tickets?
Its not as easy as all that. People in these countries are repressed no getting around that. The fanatics rule. Obviously. If they didnt it wouldnt be a problem.
I think she has perspective. She may have not been in any danger, but people at the concert may have been if there was violent protests. Plus let's not forget what happened in Bali. That was the result of extremists annoyed at 'Western' culture.
Its a different thing. I would never choose to holiday in a country that restricts my freedom beyond that which I would allow it to be restricted. I certainly would never visit Saudi Arabia for example.
However, whilst I agree she was going there to make money, as its her career, she wouldnt have chosen to attempt a concert in that location had there not been a demand for it. People who lived there WANTED to see her, presumably enough of them to make it worth her while.
And the "local way of life" there is how the fanatics see it is it? Really? Thats how it is over there and everyone agrees? In which case, why was the concert selling?
Its the people over there that are missing out, not Lady Ga Ga...she'll just move on to somewhere that welcomes her. So its the people of Indonesia that were looking forward to her concert that are missing out. Because of religious nutjobs.
Again I ask if its blanketly not tolerated why were people buying tickets?
Its not as easy as all that. People in these countries are repressed no getting around that. The fanatics rule. Obviously. If they didnt it wouldnt be a problem.
I dont know why dont you ask her management who released them, booked the event and agreed certain conditions with the goverment, why is it my or anyone else job to explain or justify it? we are giving opinions the same as you. Its certainly not as easy as "fanatics rule" dont you have respect for other cultures and countries? I repeat NONE of this makes death threats from extremists ok you seem to have convinenatly skipped that part of my post.:rolleyes:
I dont know why dont you ask her management who released them, booked the event and agreed certain conditions with the goverment, why is it my or anyone else job to explain or justify it? we are giving opinions the same as you. Its certainly not as easy as "fanatics rule" dont you have respect for other cultures and countries? I repeat NONE of this makes death threats from extremists ok you seem to have convinenatly skipped that part of my post.:rolleyes:
No I havent I totally agree with what you say in that death threats are not ok. Something I think the majority (presumably excepting those that make them) agree with.
You made a point, I made a point back...that IS an opinion, mine now, yours before. You don't need to justify it, or explain it, we all read the situation as we read it so there is no need at all for the :rolleyes: that you seem to be throwing at me in every discussion we both get involved in.
My OPINION is that in this case the fanatics ruled as is shown by the fact that the concert is now cancelled and all those people who WANTED to see it now cannot.
You can disagree if you like thats up to you. But thats how I read it.
And I can respect other cultures whilst critisising those that would deny others pleasure based on their twisted belief system.
No I havent I totally agree with what you say in that death threats are not ok. Something I think the majority (presumably excepting those that make them) agree with.
You made a point, I made a point back...that IS an opinion, mine now, yours before. You don't need to justify it, or explain it, we all read the situation as we read it so there is no need at all for the :rolleyes: that you seem to be throwing at me in every discussion we both get involved in.
My OPINION is that in this case the fanatics ruled as is shown by the fact that the concert is now cancelled and all those people who WANTED to see it now cannot.
You can disagree if you like thats up to you. But thats how I read it.
No i agree they got their own way and it shouldnt be allowed to happen, but its the fault of a lot of people including GaGas management that it got to that point and i believe they knew going into it what would happen and it was done to garnier headlines around the world for her ongoing tour.
No i agree they got their own way and it shouldnt be allowed to happen, but its the fault of a lot of people including GaGas management that it got to that point and i believe they knew going into it what would happen and it was done to garnier headlines around the world for her ongoing tour.
Its possible that what you say is true, don't think there is enough information. But I'm sure I saw somewhere that agreements were made when the concert was first arranged, and it was only after the "fanatics" made their death threats that things changed.
Its possible that what you say is true, don't think there is enough information. But I'm sure I saw somewhere that agreements were made when the concert was first arranged, and it was only after the "fanatics" made their death threats that things changed.
I think they may have had certain agreements in place about what she could and couldnt do on stage for instance in certain countries Madonna wasnt allowed to stimulate sex on stage and even got arrested for it maybe she refused to change her show after bookings etc were made? she is an artist with integrity i dont think it matters to her about the money, just the fans getting to see her. Unfortunately i dont think we can say the same for her management its all been handled imo for headlines.
The concert was sold out so obviously people wanted to see her, why are they listening to these fanatics!!
They're hard to ignore! Gaga management has probably reasoned it's just easier to cancel than stay and make a point. It is only a pop concert after all and for people to be injured or killed over it isn't on.
However, whilst I agree she was going there to make money, as its her career, she wouldnt have chosen to attempt a concert in that location had there not been a demand for it. People who lived there WANTED to see her, presumably enough of them to make it worth her while.
And the "local way of life" there is how the fanatics see it is it? Really? Thats how it is over there and everyone agrees? In which case, why was the concert selling?
Agree with this. In addition to that, she clearly wouldn't have been violating the law of the land, or else the plans to tour there would not have got so far.
The hardliners are not representatives of the people - they speak on behalf of no-one but themselves. They're authoritarians using violent intimidation to fashion society according to their own whims.
Conservatives should be free to protest, but threats of violence belong to a different category.
I mean seriously in 2012 there are still nutters who think that the devil exists and that she worships him. How completely backward!
Countries that backward in common sense and basic education should be force educated for their own good. And if not for their own good then for ours as that kind of stupidity is dangerous.
I think they may have had certain agreements in place about what she could and couldnt do on stage for instance in certain countries Madonna wasnt allowed to stimulate sex on stage and even got arrested for it maybe she refused to change her show after bookings etc were made? she is an artist with integrity i dont think it matters to her about the money, just the fans getting to see her. Unfortunately i dont think we can say the same for her management its all been handled imo for headlines.
Sorry not sure what you are saying, if you could clarify?
Do you think that the concert was booked by the management, knowing that this would happen thereby gaining publicity for Lady Ga Ga? Or that once it DID happen they THEN have milked it for all it is worth?
Sorry not sure what you are saying, if you could clarify?
Do you think that the concert was booked by the management, knowing that this would happen thereby gaining publicity for Lady Ga Ga? Or that once it DID happen they THEN have milked it for all it is worth?
I already did, did you not reply to this post once already where i explained it fully?
She constantly refers to herself as an artist and pushing boundaries and i admire her for that. I think going somewhere where you are aware that a certain type of behaviour isnt tolerated however is sensationalism on her managements part, they knew extreme groups would object they knew it would get headlines for her ongoing world tour, did she actually set foot in the country? is she actually in danger? doubtful, but her management got what they set out to achieve, worldwide headlines and more love for the Gaga for "standing up to these people", very clever marketing.
I already did, did you not reply to this post one already where i explained it fully?
Aha! Indeed you did, sorry.
Ok I'm not sure I agree in that case. I think that in general, management of any music act will book them concerts based initially on demand for said concert. They would have been unlikely to book one there just for publicity - there must have been demand.
Comments
I am not saying I agree with death threats but I could see this happening a mile off. It is part and parcel of trying to be sensational.
Each to their own I suppose, but personally I wouldn't call her a musician. More of a performer.
Lots of pap on YouTube has millions of views. Some people watch for a laugh.
Agree, not that she needs publicity, but I don't think the whole episode has done her 'image' any harm.
Indeed. The "she brings it on herself" attitude is a bit much. I mean she is who she is, she does what she does. People either like her style of music/performance or they don't.
She shouldnt have to "tone it down" just because some religious nut doesnt like it. One would assume that the concert sold well otherwise it wouldnt have been an issue in the first place. So she has fans over there who are missing out because once again, someone with a belief that they have the right to tell everyone else what to do threw a hissy fit. A fanatical hissy fit.
This sums it up for me.
And for the sake of balance, I felt the exactly the same way when I was a little girl, and Christian conservatives were trying to ban Ozzy Osbourne concerts all over my country, and churches were trying to get Mtv taken down. For me, it's not about bashing religion, it's about condemning backward authoritarians pissing on everyone's parade.
What do people do when holidaying abroad? Maybe to a country that isn't as say liberal as Spanish resorts?
Personally I feel if your going to visit another country for a short while, then at least try and adapt yourself to the local way of life. If you don't like the way of life, then don't visit. Let's be honest, she didn't go there out of her love of spreading, erm what do you call what she does, her performance, she goes to make money.
Amen.
None of that makes these extremists and their death threats ok but lets get a little prespective here.
For example, it would be crazy to set up home in a country you considered 'immoral and decadent' if you disapproved wouldn't it?
Its a different thing. I would never choose to holiday in a country that restricts my freedom beyond that which I would allow it to be restricted. I certainly would never visit Saudi Arabia for example.
However, whilst I agree she was going there to make money, as its her career, she wouldnt have chosen to attempt a concert in that location had there not been a demand for it. People who lived there WANTED to see her, presumably enough of them to make it worth her while.
And the "local way of life" there is how the fanatics see it is it? Really? Thats how it is over there and everyone agrees? In which case, why was the concert selling?
Its the people over there that are missing out, not Lady Ga Ga...she'll just move on to somewhere that welcomes her. So its the people of Indonesia that were looking forward to her concert that are missing out. Because of religious nutjobs.
Again I ask if its blanketly not tolerated why were people buying tickets?
Its not as easy as all that. People in these countries are repressed no getting around that. The fanatics rule. Obviously. If they didnt it wouldnt be a problem.
I dont know why dont you ask her management who released them, booked the event and agreed certain conditions with the goverment, why is it my or anyone else job to explain or justify it? we are giving opinions the same as you. Its certainly not as easy as "fanatics rule" dont you have respect for other cultures and countries? I repeat NONE of this makes death threats from extremists ok you seem to have convinenatly skipped that part of my post.:rolleyes:
No I havent I totally agree with what you say in that death threats are not ok. Something I think the majority (presumably excepting those that make them) agree with.
You made a point, I made a point back...that IS an opinion, mine now, yours before. You don't need to justify it, or explain it, we all read the situation as we read it so there is no need at all for the :rolleyes: that you seem to be throwing at me in every discussion we both get involved in.
My OPINION is that in this case the fanatics ruled as is shown by the fact that the concert is now cancelled and all those people who WANTED to see it now cannot.
You can disagree if you like thats up to you. But thats how I read it.
And I can respect other cultures whilst critisising those that would deny others pleasure based on their twisted belief system.
No i agree they got their own way and it shouldnt be allowed to happen, but its the fault of a lot of people including GaGas management that it got to that point and i believe they knew going into it what would happen and it was done to garnier headlines around the world for her ongoing tour.
Its possible that what you say is true, don't think there is enough information. But I'm sure I saw somewhere that agreements were made when the concert was first arranged, and it was only after the "fanatics" made their death threats that things changed.
I think they may have had certain agreements in place about what she could and couldnt do on stage for instance in certain countries Madonna wasnt allowed to stimulate sex on stage and even got arrested for it maybe she refused to change her show after bookings etc were made? she is an artist with integrity i dont think it matters to her about the money, just the fans getting to see her. Unfortunately i dont think we can say the same for her management its all been handled imo for headlines.
They're hard to ignore! Gaga management has probably reasoned it's just easier to cancel than stay and make a point. It is only a pop concert after all and for people to be injured or killed over it isn't on.
Agree with this. In addition to that, she clearly wouldn't have been violating the law of the land, or else the plans to tour there would not have got so far.
The hardliners are not representatives of the people - they speak on behalf of no-one but themselves. They're authoritarians using violent intimidation to fashion society according to their own whims.
Conservatives should be free to protest, but threats of violence belong to a different category.
Countries that backward in common sense and basic education should be force educated for their own good. And if not for their own good then for ours as that kind of stupidity is dangerous.
Sorry not sure what you are saying, if you could clarify?
Do you think that the concert was booked by the management, knowing that this would happen thereby gaining publicity for Lady Ga Ga? Or that once it DID happen they THEN have milked it for all it is worth?
I already did, did you not reply to this post once already where i explained it fully?
Aha! Indeed you did, sorry.
Ok I'm not sure I agree in that case. I think that in general, management of any music act will book them concerts based initially on demand for said concert. They would have been unlikely to book one there just for publicity - there must have been demand.
No demand = no supply.