Exquisitely typical Guardian article. You can juggle statistics any way you like (and every way still shows ethnic minorities over-represented in those put away for sex crimes, but then again, they are over-represented in the prison population as a whole).
I know what my neighbours told me who both worked in the local NHS in Tower Hamlets when I lived there, and I believed them. They were so sick of it, and the intimidation that went with it, they sold up and moved back to their home town.
To be honest, I don't know enough about the cases to say whether it is or not, or to what extent. However, if it is, it's something that needs dealing with much more carefully than overblown Daily Mail headlines that are more likely to call the EDL to arms than actually deal with the subject at hand.
You see, what gets me a bit about this issue is that people are very quick to call out the tabloid media on how they word their headlines, but they never say what they would put in it's place.
I'll bite on this one. If a typical Daily Mail headline was "Muslim paedophile gang targets innocent white girls", which factually may well be true, I might have:-
"Sex predators target young girls"
You got any thoughts on how you would word the headline if you were a newspaper editor ? Or would it even merit a headline in your view ? Or even reporting at all ?
Would it make any difference if you were reporting locally in Bradford itself ?
If Jimmy Saville et al targetted ethnic minority victims then the comparison on the coverage (or lack of it) would be fair comment. They didn't.
In the context of the Bradford and Derby incidents the crime would seem to have had a specific target against victims of a different ethnicity. In other crimes of violence this would be characterised as a "hate crime" and would be punished more severely.
That is the concern about the Asian led paedophile rings compared to the "celebrity" paedophile rings.
If it is more important to stamp out racist violence in society it is equally a more important issue to stamp out racially motivated sexual violence in society.
You see, what gets me a bit about this issue is that people are very quick to call out the tabloid media on how they word their headlines, but they never say what they would put in it's place.
I'll bite on this one. If a typical Daily Mail headline was "Muslim paedophile gang targets innocent white girls", which factually may well be true, I might have:-
"Sex predators target young girls"
You got any thoughts on how you would word the headline if you were a newspaper editor ? Or would it even merit a headline in your view ? Or even reporting at all ?
Would it make any difference if you were reporting locally in Bradford itself ?
Half the problem is the nature of that type of paper in the first place. They're always going to go for the more sensationalist headline, because that's the nature of the beast. I'd like to think they'd consider the potential implications of a headline that screams out about Muslim Sex Gangs or the like.
However, they did go into that side of the issue in the article, where they could do so in more detail and lay it out properly. I think that was the correct way to do it.
Yep - well I'm white and I certainly don't think that way. I tend to distance myself from anyone who comes out with that kind of stuff, because it doesn't represent how I feel. Maybe it comes from having mixed race relatives and friends with different ethnic backgrounds that I grew up with, who I consider to belong here every bit as much as I do.
Why do you distance yourself from it? The person who I quoted was not even being racist.
Well there have been countless threads about Muslim paedo gangs so I understand the OPs point but If he can not be arsed to put more effort in... Frankly niether can I
Half the problem is the nature of that type of paper in the first place. They're always going to go for the more sensationalist headline, because that's the nature of the beast. I'd like to think they'd consider the potential implications of a headline that screams out about Muslim Sex Gangs or the like.
However, they did go into that side of the issue in the article, where they could do so in more detail and lay it out properly. I think that was the correct way to do it.
So the Jimmy Saville case should have been reported as "Deceased Leeds man abused children"?
Why do you distance yourself from it? The person who I quoted was not even being racist.
Because it's the polar opposite from what I consider to be British.
The people I mean when I say I distance myself from them tend to be white, who might come out with the odd racist comment, as if I'm supposed to nod in agreement just because I happen to be white as well.
Half the problem is the nature of that type of paper in the first place. They're always going to go for the more sensationalist headline, because that's the nature of the beast. I'd like to think they'd consider the potential implications of a headline that screams out about Muslim Sex Gangs or the like.
However, they did go into that side of the issue in the article, where they could do so in more detail and lay it out properly. I think that was the correct way to do it.
Yes.
I wonder if the sensationalist headline does cause the paper to sell better. Or if it makes no difference.
Because it's the polar opposite from what I consider to be British.
The people I mean when I say I distance myself from them tend to be white, who might come out with the odd racist comment, as if I'm supposed to nod in agreement just because I happen to be white as well.
So black = British?
Well everone says racist, sexist, homophobic stuff. What offends and does not offend is subjective.
So the Jimmy Saville case should have been reported as "Deceased Leeds man abused children"?
That's the flip side of the coin.
What pisses me off on here is that people are full of invective for the media, but don't seem to have any meaningful plan in place for what they would do if confronted with the reality of reporting.
If anyone dare let slip the lazy assumption that British = white, or worse, actually believe that should exclusively be the case, then they are instantly tasered by the Right-On Mob.
To hear it from a Black poster is just a little startling, that's all.
Comments
I know what my neighbours told me who both worked in the local NHS in Tower Hamlets when I lived there, and I believed them. They were so sick of it, and the intimidation that went with it, they sold up and moved back to their home town.
No, it really isn't, y'know.
Your agenda is pretty clear now.
Bit of a cat-out-the-bag, is it not?
You see, what gets me a bit about this issue is that people are very quick to call out the tabloid media on how they word their headlines, but they never say what they would put in it's place.
I'll bite on this one. If a typical Daily Mail headline was "Muslim paedophile gang targets innocent white girls", which factually may well be true, I might have:-
"Sex predators target young girls"
You got any thoughts on how you would word the headline if you were a newspaper editor ? Or would it even merit a headline in your view ? Or even reporting at all ?
Would it make any difference if you were reporting locally in Bradford itself ?
*jaw drops*
Precisely.
Care to amplify "*jaw drops*"
Half the problem is the nature of that type of paper in the first place. They're always going to go for the more sensationalist headline, because that's the nature of the beast. I'd like to think they'd consider the potential implications of a headline that screams out about Muslim Sex Gangs or the like.
How did the broadsheets report the story? The Guardian didn't mention their ethnicity in the headline for this article - http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/may/08/rochdale-gang-guilty-exploiting-girls
However, they did go into that side of the issue in the article, where they could do so in more detail and lay it out properly. I think that was the correct way to do it.
I don't think that. I think of all of us of whatever colour, creed or religion. As long as British values have been adopted.
Sorry, you'll have to remind me. What precisely is the OP's agenda in your view ?
So the Jimmy Saville case should have been reported as "Deceased Leeds man abused children"?
Because it's the polar opposite from what I consider to be British.
The people I mean when I say I distance myself from them tend to be white, who might come out with the odd racist comment, as if I'm supposed to nod in agreement just because I happen to be white as well.
Yes.
I wonder if the sensationalist headline does cause the paper to sell better. Or if it makes no difference.
When I think of British values, I tend to think (probably quite naively) of honesty, decency and fair play. The old fashioned values.
I never watch Jeremy Kyle.
Re: BIB above ~ What do you know, out of interest ?
Well everone says racist, sexist, homophobic stuff. What offends and does not offend is subjective.
I'll come back to you when I've figured out the relevance to the point I was making.
I may be some time... :cool:
That's the flip side of the coin.
What pisses me off on here is that people are full of invective for the media, but don't seem to have any meaningful plan in place for what they would do if confronted with the reality of reporting.
I'm sure it does. Perhaps they put that consideration above the potential damage it does to race relations.
Do they ? I certainly don't.
Oh, you can be sure of that. Profit before anything.
If anyone dare let slip the lazy assumption that British = white, or worse, actually believe that should exclusively be the case, then they are instantly tasered by the Right-On Mob.
To hear it from a Black poster is just a little startling, that's all.
Black cat out of a politically correct bag?