Considering that Scotland will need the goodwill of the rUK to make a success of Independence I'm somewhat surprised at all the threats so early in the game - its like they dont expect to win.
A member of the Yes campaign has just said on BBC News "In the unlikely event now of a no vote".
They seem to think one tv show has suddenly changed everyone's mind.
I don't think it's blackmail since Scotland isn't obliged to take any debt.
There’s no legal rule that says the UK as a continuator state would be obliged to hold on to all of its public debt: the transfer of liabilities would be up for negotiation along with everything else. This is the view set out in the Vienna Conventions on Succession of States, which the SNP has often referred to in the past.
The convention that relates to property and debt says: “When part of the territory of a state is transferred by that state to another state, the passing of the state debt of the predecessor state to the successor state is to be settled by agreement between them.
“In the absence of such an agreement, the state debt of the predecessor state shall pass to the successor State in an equitable proportion…”
One way or another, Scotland will wind up with its share of the debt. If it doesn't, assets to the value of the debt will be maintained within the UK. The issue of how much debt will be passed on to Scotland will be a matter which the rest of the UK would take a very keen interest in.
I wonder if the debt could be allocated on the basis of geography, rather than population? After all, if that's how oil is being allocated...
Only if you don't accept she got the wrong hospital. The Queen Elizabeth that does the kind of surgery she was talking about is just over 40 miles from Newcastle in Birmingham. That's not to say someone from Newcastle couldn't have a job there.
Has Newcastle moved 150 miles south or Birmingham 150 miles north?
Didn't watch it but by all accounts it is 1 win a piece Whether the Scots will vote to go it alone or hold on for devo-max remains to be seen, thankfully it will be all over soon.
Didn't watch it but by all accounts it is 1 win a piece Whether the Scots will vote to go it alone or hold on for devo-max remains to be seen, thankfully it will be all over soon.
Then I'll paint a picture for you....
Alex Salmond acted the part of a razor wielding Glaswegian thug whilst a battered Darling cowered behind his lectern.
They do if they every want to borrow from anyone ever again. No international body will lend Scotland money again if they pull a stunt like that.
I don't think that's the case........there'll always be somebody wiling to lend if the price is right, ie the interest rate
What'll happen is that the Scottish Government will borrow money at a higher interest rate than other countries because the perceived risk would be higher for the lender
Well, luckily I was not around to watch the debate last night but made the mistake of watching the 'trident' question on the BBC website.
If that is the way those two act, I would have thought the only impression they left was one of embarrassment. Salmond constantly shouting and clearly not even interested in answers to the questions, and Darling not being forceful enough with the answers.
If appallingly rude, thuggish behaviour wins debates, then Salmond won hands down. Ironically, with his style of debate, his natural home would seem to be with the English Defence League.
The presenter must take a lot of the blame for allowing this so-called debate to degenerate into a glorified Jeremy Kyle Show. I found it impossible to watch after he allowed Salmond to make constant interruptions out of turn.
That's the Salmond way just shout and bluff and bluster your way through whilst chucking some chum into the water about the tories for the yes supporters to devour. His plan B for the currency seemed to be just naming every currency on earth. That's not a plan.
The threat to walk away from the debt if the UK don't agree to the CU is an empty one. The conditions of independence will include an acceptance of the debt correctly assigned to Scotland. The idea they can just break and seize power might a great statement to make on a stage but in reality they have no power to enable it.
It is a bit like the CU and issue of the pound. You can make all the statements you like on a stage but when you have no control over the issue it counts for nothing. You can claim the pound is also Scotland's but this does not make it so. It is Bank of England that manages the pound for the UK. If Scotland leave it will be up to them to decide if a CU would be best for the rest of the UK. Unless Scotland have something to offer the UK beyond accepting risk the answer will be no.
The threat to walk away from the debt if the UK don't agree to the CU is an empty one. The conditions of independence will include an acceptance of the debt correctly assigned to Scotland. The idea they can just break and seize power might a great statement to make on a stage but in reality they have no power to enable it.
It's too broad a statement and I'm surprised Darling didn't counter it better. For example, if Scotland walked away from the debt then surely they also walk away from the assets too. In particular what happens to the Scottish state pension pot? Would the Scottish government replace all Nat Insurance contributions made to the UK Treasury ? If so, where does that money come from? Does all the land and property owned by the UK pass to the Scottish government if they walk away from the debt? It's easy for Salmond and Darling to argue the same point about whether Scotland can use Sterling but they've both glossed over the details. The one thing that came across during that debate is that the Scottish voter is really no closer to understanding how independence would really affect them (for better and worse) and are now going to be voting on promises and vagueness from both sides rather than detailed and agreed plans.
That's the Salmond way just shout and bluff and bluster your way through whilst chucking some chum into the water about the tories for the yes supporters to devour. His plan B for the currency seemed to be just naming every currency on earth. That's not a plan.
Have the Yes side explained why they are so against the Euro? If it's good enough for Ireland and their Auld Alliance socialist friends in France then why not for Scotland?
Have the Yes side explained why they are so against the Euro? If it's good enough for Ireland and their Auld Alliance socialist friends in France then why not for Scotland?
given their position over the EU then I think the EURO is very much their plan
only problem is they know it would lose them votes if they said that now
Have the Yes side explained why they are so against the Euro? If it's good enough for Ireland and their Auld Alliance socialist friends in France then why not for Scotland?
He was busy telling us we could be the 'Celtic Lion' just like Ireland's 'Celtic Tiger' a few years ago, not so much talk of that now after they went tits up. Salmond would promise you the moon on a stick if you voted yes. He knows he couldn't sell the euro to us just now but I think that's the way an iScotland would head.
Salmond knows he's going to lose this referendum, so it's now at a point where he can make whatever bold statements he likes, knowing it's not something he's actually going to have to follow through with. It's just posturing.
Have the Yes side explained why they are so against the Euro? If it's good enough for Ireland and their Auld Alliance socialist friends in France then why not for Scotland?
The Eurozone has been through a stormy patch in recent years - that could explain it!
If appallingly rude, thuggish behaviour wins debates, then Salmond won hands down. Ironically, with his style of debate, his natural home would seem to be with the English Defence League.
The presenter must take a lot of the blame for allowing this so-called debate to degenerate into a glorified Jeremy Kyle Show. I found it impossible to watch after he allowed Salmond to make constant interruptions out of turn.
it was Darling who continually interupted the debate by talking over Salmond.
He was busy telling us we could be the 'Celtic Lion' just like Ireland's 'Celtic Tiger' a few years ago, not so much talk of that now after they went tits up. Salmond would promise you the moon on a stick if you voted yes. He knows he couldn't sell the euro to us just now but I think that's the way an iScotland would head.
And yet Ireland is in a better position now than the UK.
It's too broad a statement and I'm surprised Darling didn't counter it better. For example, if Scotland walked away from the debt then surely they also walk away from the assets too. In particular what happens to the Scottish state pension pot? Would the Scottish government replace all Nat Insurance contributions made to the UK Treasury ? If so, where does that money come from? Does all the land and property owned by the UK pass to the Scottish government if they walk away from the debt? It's easy for Salmond and Darling to argue the same point about whether Scotland can use Sterling but they've both glossed over the details. The one thing that came across during that debate is that the Scottish voter is really no closer to understanding how independence would really affect them (for better and worse) and are now going to be voting on promises and vagueness from both sides rather than detailed and agreed plans.
Bt have constantly refused to make the case for the Union
No, I meant exactly what I said. It'll be like giving pocket money to an 8 year old. Does an 8 year old decide how much pocket money they get? Of course not.
If Scotland wins independence and keeps the pound, not only do they not have financial independence, but they will be dictated to financially by the very people they want to be independent from. Only this time, those people won't have a compelling reason to help them.
What you actually mean is that those people who've continually stolen from the people of Scotland in order to subsidise London & the South East won't be able to continue to do so because the Scots will be in control of their purse strings. Good luck Scotland......I hope we'll be able to join you at the top table sooner rather than later.
Comments
A member of the Yes campaign has just said on BBC News "In the unlikely event now of a no vote".
They seem to think one tv show has suddenly changed everyone's mind.
Are they saying Scottish people are that fickle?
One way or another, Scotland will wind up with its share of the debt. If it doesn't, assets to the value of the debt will be maintained within the UK. The issue of how much debt will be passed on to Scotland will be a matter which the rest of the UK would take a very keen interest in.
I wonder if the debt could be allocated on the basis of geography, rather than population? After all, if that's how oil is being allocated...
Has Newcastle moved 150 miles south or Birmingham 150 miles north?
Newcastle-under-Lyme ?
Then I'll paint a picture for you....
Alex Salmond acted the part of a razor wielding Glaswegian thug whilst a battered Darling cowered behind his lectern.
It appears 70% preferred the former.
Alistair Darling would not shut up. Get out the stopwatch.
I don't think that's the case........there'll always be somebody wiling to lend if the price is right, ie the interest rate
What'll happen is that the Scottish Government will borrow money at a higher interest rate than other countries because the perceived risk would be higher for the lender
If that is the way those two act, I would have thought the only impression they left was one of embarrassment. Salmond constantly shouting and clearly not even interested in answers to the questions, and Darling not being forceful enough with the answers.
I can't believe these debates achieve anything.
The presenter must take a lot of the blame for allowing this so-called debate to degenerate into a glorified Jeremy Kyle Show. I found it impossible to watch after he allowed Salmond to make constant interruptions out of turn.
It is a bit like the CU and issue of the pound. You can make all the statements you like on a stage but when you have no control over the issue it counts for nothing. You can claim the pound is also Scotland's but this does not make it so. It is Bank of England that manages the pound for the UK. If Scotland leave it will be up to them to decide if a CU would be best for the rest of the UK. Unless Scotland have something to offer the UK beyond accepting risk the answer will be no.
It's too broad a statement and I'm surprised Darling didn't counter it better. For example, if Scotland walked away from the debt then surely they also walk away from the assets too. In particular what happens to the Scottish state pension pot? Would the Scottish government replace all Nat Insurance contributions made to the UK Treasury ? If so, where does that money come from? Does all the land and property owned by the UK pass to the Scottish government if they walk away from the debt? It's easy for Salmond and Darling to argue the same point about whether Scotland can use Sterling but they've both glossed over the details. The one thing that came across during that debate is that the Scottish voter is really no closer to understanding how independence would really affect them (for better and worse) and are now going to be voting on promises and vagueness from both sides rather than detailed and agreed plans.
Have the Yes side explained why they are so against the Euro? If it's good enough for Ireland and their Auld Alliance socialist friends in France then why not for Scotland?
given their position over the EU then I think the EURO is very much their plan
only problem is they know it would lose them votes if they said that now
He was busy telling us we could be the 'Celtic Lion' just like Ireland's 'Celtic Tiger' a few years ago, not so much talk of that now after they went tits up. Salmond would promise you the moon on a stick if you voted yes. He knows he couldn't sell the euro to us just now but I think that's the way an iScotland would head.
Salmond knows he's going to lose this referendum, so it's now at a point where he can make whatever bold statements he likes, knowing it's not something he's actually going to have to follow through with. It's just posturing.
The Eurozone has been through a stormy patch in recent years - that could explain it!
it was Darling who continually interupted the debate by talking over Salmond.
And yet Ireland is in a better position now than the UK.
Bt have constantly refused to make the case for the Union
What you actually mean is that those people who've continually stolen from the people of Scotland in order to subsidise London & the South East won't be able to continue to do so because the Scots will be in control of their purse strings. Good luck Scotland......I hope we'll be able to join you at the top table sooner rather than later.
So has the pound. It was a "millstone", remember?