Thanks, very much appreciated. That actually makes sense and clears up a lot of what I was missing. It's very rare to have 4 directors working all at once, as it clearly creates problems with storylining.
How long have they been working like this? When I last watched religiously, it was during the Toby Mills serial killer story, and that went on for months, and was featured nearly every week, in every episode. It was seriously dragged out. In fact, all the stories at that time didn't disappear every other week. So, that raises two questions: What was their production model like pre-BK? And why do they carry on having 4 directors shooting all at once when they know it affects the pacing of storylines?
I think the 4 directors production model started late in 2003, when Hollyoaks went 5 nights per week following the end of Brookside. If I remember rightly, that's around the time the Toby Mills storylne concluded too.
They have to have 4 directors shooting at once or the production cycle couldn't sustain 5 episodes per week on single camera. A solution would be to go multi-camera like all the other soaps to speed things up, but that is something Lime Pictures have always resisted.
I guess I just don't agree that Robbie deserves praise for not being a rapist. I would think that's pretty fundamental. If all Robbie can say to defend his character is "at least I'm not a rapist" then that is pretty pitiful. Robbie has been so crap to to other people not just JP, but Jason, Sinead, Maxine, and then dares to act holier-than-thou with Freddie about not telling the truth. I just don't find much redeembale about his character. He's not even a so-evil-that's-he's-fun character. He's just a bully who gets off on bringing others down.
I don't think it's just that. Robbie is a 17 year old schoolboy - the bullying is something that he will grow out of with time. Lots of people are idiots as teenagers. At least as regards the JP situation he has stopped bullying JP and left him alone since he found out the truth. I've always thought anyone who feels genuine guilt and remorse over their actions and/or is capable of being horrified and rightly angry at the heinous actions of others are capable of redemption. Only the really hardened types with no redeeming qualities whatsoever like Finn O Connor, Frank Foster (Corrie) etc are incapable of redemption.
It will take time for Robbie to redeem himself completely I agree but at least he has as far as the JP situation goes, made a start and I'm glad about that.
BIB - it's not praise for not being a rapist. It's acknowledgement of his genuine guilt/remorse over his part in the JP situation and his attempts to make things right i.e. the apology to JP on the bridge, staying away from JP, rewriting his statement to tell the truth....
I don't think it's just that. Robbie is a 17 year old schoolboy - the bullying is something that he will grow out of with time. Lots of people are idiots as teenagers. At least as regards the JP situation he has stopped bullying JP and left him alone since he found out the truth. I've always thought anyone who feels genuine guilt and remorse over their actions and/or is capable of being horrified and rightly angry at the heinous actions of others are capable of redemption. Only the really hardened types with no redeeming qualities whatsoever like Finn O Connor, Frank Foster (Corrie) etc are incapable of redemption.
It will take time for Robbie to redeem himself completely I agree but at least he has as far as the JP situation goes, made a start and I'm glad about that.
BIB - it's not praise for not being a rapist. It's acknowledgement of his genuine guilt/remorse over his part in the JP situation and his attempts to make things right i.e. the apology to JP on the bridge, staying away from JP, rewriting his statement to tell the truth....
I think actions and individuals need to be judged separately. Comparing Finn and Robbie and highlighting Robbie's one shock reaction and possible regret means missing the whole picture.
Finn was a weak lonely desperate young boy who Robbie targeted, bullying him, undermining him, laughing at him resulting in Finn eventually standing up and being a man but in a completely catastrophic and disgraceful way. We saw the build up and what happened so there is some understanding of what happened even if that could never lead to forgiveness. However, he is just 16 I think so there is every chance realistically if he admits what he's done, is properly regretful and truly sees it for what it is and of course is punished that he could change and not end up a violent person and rapist as an adult.
With Robbie we haven't seen anything to explain to us why he is the way he is, in fact the opposite, as he comes from a loving home with family to look out for him and is a very confident youth but still he resorts to bullying and intimidation and shows jealousy and is prepared to lie about his family and to his family. He is shocked that his friend raped someone and can see that may be a result in part to how he treated JP and Finn but all it did was make him see sense in those particular relationships. He continues to belittle and intimidate and steal and lie elsewhere.
There is no more basis for redemption in Robbie than there is Finn in what we've seen so far but the idea that Robbie could be seen in any kind of good light over the rape story line would be sickening IMO without him first being suitably punished for his disgusting treatment of JP and his part in how it all played out.
I think actions and individuals need to be judged separately. Comparing Finn and Robbie and highlighting Robbie's one shock reaction and possible regret means missing the whole picture.
Finn was a weak lonely desperate young boy who Robbie targeted, bullying him, undermining him, laughing at him resulting in Finn eventually standing up and being a man but in a completely catastrophic and disgraceful way. We saw the build up and what happened so there is some understanding of what happened even if that could never lead to forgiveness. However, he is just 16 I think so there is every chance realistically if he admits what he's done, is properly regretful and truly sees it for what it is and of course is punished that he could change and not end up a violent person and rapist as an adult.
With Robbie we haven't seen anything to explain to us why he is the way he is, in fact the opposite, as he comes from a loving home with family to look out for him and is a very confident youth but still he resorts to bullying and intimidation and shows jealousy and is prepared to lie about his family and to his family. He is shocked that his friend raped someone and can see that may be a result in part to how he treated JP and Finn but all it did was make him see sense in those particular relationships. He continues to belittle and intimidate and steal and lie elsewhere.
There is no more basis for redemption in Robbie than there is Finn in what we've seen so far but the idea that Robbie could be seen in any kind of good light over the rape story line would be sickening IMO without him first being suitably punished for his disgusting treatment of JP and his part in how it all played out.
I only followed the rape storyline so I can't comment on Robbie or Finn's actions or behaviour elsewhere - what you say about the build up to the rape may be true but Finn's reaction after the rape wasn't "Oh my God what have I done? I'm absolutely sickened and horrified that I'm capable of this" - if anything he became hardened and enjoyed having power over JP. He sat at the front of class the very next day with arms folded, told JP he asked for the brutal attack, forced him to change his grades back to A's and B's when JP was desperate to get him out of his class etc. His utter lack of gratitude over JP saving his life, threatening to rape Robbie and implicate him in the rape when Robbie's immediate instinct was to hate Finn and try and do the right thing, turning on the waterworks with Sam and writing that sick nonsense in Robbie's name to seal JP's fate - there is absolutely no way back for Finn. Considering his utter lack of humanity so far, it would be unrealistic for Finn to start suddenly showing guilt/remorse imo.
While I agree that Robbie's horror that his friend raped someone made him see sense only in those particular relationships, like I said, it would be unrealistic for someone who is in the habit of bullying, lying and stealing to completely change their tune overnight. Robbie is an immature teenager and as such it will take time for him to completely mature though his actions in apologising to JP, trying to expose Finn etc are at least a good start. Though Robbie does need to be punished for the bullying, I'm not entirely sure what kind of punishment would be suitable - detention is too lenient and expulsion from school seems too strong, particularly if he helps JP put Finn behind bars.
Personally I don't have a problem with Robbie finding out the truth and siding with JP. It shows things are not black and white and makes things much more interesting. I also know that his bullying behaviour of JP was before he found out about the rape. Take Monday 24th for example. While his behaviour was appalling, he was unaware that Finn raped JP so from his point of view he arrived on the scene to see his teacher walking away from his unconscious best friend for no reason and he was the only person who knew that JP nearly left Finn to die - everyone else treated JP like a hero so Robbie's indignation under those circumstances was possibly understandable. What was unforgivable though was his childish revenge on JP (locking him in a cupboard and setting off the fire alarm) and the homophobic abuse he hurled at him. Still, when he got suspicious and dragged the truth out of Fin he was quick to apologise.
Realistically Robbie is the only person Finn would admit his crime to. Also, the affair between JP and Danny had to come out since it's a soap and Sam though out of order for implying JP made up the rape, naturally felt betrayed so didn't want to help him any more. Robbie is realistically in a better position to help JP given that he knows all the details of the attack including who the attacker is.
I only followed the rape storyline so I can't comment on Robbie or Finn's actions or behaviour elsewhere - what you say about the build up to the rape may be true but Finn's reaction after the rape wasn't "Oh my God what have I done? I'm absolutely sickened and horrified that I'm capable of this" - if anything he became hardened and enjoyed having power over JP. He sat at the front of class the very next day with arms folded, told JP he asked for the brutal attack, forced him to change his grades back to A's and B's when JP was desperate to get him out of his class etc. His utter lack of gratitude over JP saving his life, threatening to rape Robbie and implicate him in the rape when Robbie's immediate instinct was to hate Finn and try and do the right thing, turning on the waterworks with Sam and writing that sick nonsense in Robbie's name to seal JP's fate - there is absolutely no way back for Finn. Considering his utter lack of humanity so far, it would be unrealistic for Finn to start suddenly showing guilt/remorse imo.
While I agree that Robbie's horror that his friend raped someone made him see sense only in those particular relationships, like I said, it would be unrealistic for someone who is in the habit of bullying, lying and stealing to completely change their tune overnight. Robbie is an immature teenager and as such it will take time for him to completely mature though his actions in apologising to JP, trying to expose Finn etc are at least a good start. Though Robbie does need to be punished for the bullying, I'm not entirely sure what kind of punishment would be suitable - detention is too lenient and expulsion from school seems too strong, particularly if he helps JP put Finn behind bars.
Personally I don't have a problem with Robbie finding out the truth and siding with JP. It shows things are not black and white and makes things much more interesting. I also know that his bullying behaviour of JP was before he found out about the rape. Take Monday 24th for example. While his behaviour was appalling, he was unaware that Finn raped JP so from his point of view he arrived on the scene to see his teacher walking away from his unconscious best friend for no reason and he was the only person who knew that JP nearly left Finn to die - everyone else treated JP like a hero so Robbie's indignation under those circumstances was possibly understandable. What was unforgivable though was his childish revenge on JP (locking him in a cupboard and setting off the fire alarm) and the homophobic abuse he hurled at him. Still, when he got suspicious and dragged the truth out of Fin he was quick to apologise.
Realistically Robbie is the only person Finn would admit his crime to. Also, the affair between JP and Danny had to come out since it's a soap and Sam though out of order for implying JP made up the rape, naturally felt betrayed so didn't want to help him any more. Robbie is realistically in a better position to help JP given that he knows all the details of the attack including who the attacker is.
BIB - I'd say expulsion from school would be inevitable, and is the least he should expect. When Robbie first appeared in Hollyoaks, he had been expelled from every school he had ever attended and Patrick Blake made it clear to him and to his mother that this was his last chance.
BIB - I'd say expulsion from school would be inevitable, and is the least he should expect. When Robbie first appeared in Hollyoaks, he had been expelled from every school he had ever attended and Patrick Blake made it clear to him and to his mother that this was his last chance.
It seems a shame though - I have warmed to him since he found out the truth about the rape.
It seems a shame though - I have warmed to him since he found out the truth about the rape.
I know you have. I understand you have only watched since the rape and that you only watch the JP-related scenes. I may be wrong, but I suspect you might be less kindly disposed towards Robbie if you had seen him from his introduction. At least you might more easily understand why some of us find him such an unsavoury and unsympathetic character.
I know you have. I understand you have only watched since the rape and that you only watch the JP-related scenes. I may be wrong, but I suspect you might be less kindly disposed towards Robbie if you had seen him from his introduction. At least you might more easily understand why some of us find him such an unsavoury and unsympathetic character.
Maybe, but I would probably still acknowledge any good he's tried to do but even you must admit that Finn has put him in an impossible situation.
You don't need to interpret Robbie being the one to expose Finn's true colours as Robbie turning into some kind of hero/saint - you can just think of it as him starting to take small steps towards redemption after having done a lot of nasty things in the past or acknowledge that it doesn't matter who brings Finn to justice provided that he is brought to justice. Even really nasty bullies can in certain situations mature and do the right thing.
I'm not entirely sure he will be expelled though because when JP suggested it to Patrick before Robbie found out about the rape, didn't Patrick say that there weren't enough grounds?
Maybe, but I would probably still acknowledge any good he's tried to do but even you must admit that Finn has put him in an impossible situation.
You don't need to interpret Robbie being the one to expose Finn's true colours as Robbie turning into some kind of hero/saint - you can just think of it as him starting to take small steps towards redemption after having done a lot of nasty things in the past or acknowledge that it doesn't matter who brings Finn to justice provided that he is brought to justice. Even really nasty bullies can in certain situations mature and do the right thing.
I'm not entirely sure he will be expelled though because when JP suggested it to Patrick before Robbie found out about the rape, didn't Patrick say that there weren't enough grounds?
Yes, Finn has put him in a difficult - maybe not impossible - position.
I acknowledge that Robbie tried to do the right thing re Finn's rape of JP. Maybe he could have done more (or done it better)? You're right - this does not have to, and should not, turn Robbie into some kind of hero/saint, but I have a strong suspicion that 'hero of the hour' is exactly the direction HO have planned for Robbie, and it doesn't sit well with me. Some nasty bullies grow out of it, some don't.
I don't remember Patrick saying that, but I don't doubt you're right. I'm sure he won't be expelled, sufficient grounds or no (and I think there probably are sufficient grounds).
I definitely have the feeling Hollyoaks will try to turn Robbie into the hero of the hour and it just does not sit well with me as well. Robbie has been such a homophobe for so long and suddenly that will all be forgotten if he finally after so long helps JP. I just don't buy it at all. I find that Robbie is getting way over praised for behaviour that should be fundamental and all his hateful offensive behaviour will be ignored. Robbie in my eyes has done absolutely nothing to redeem himself. He did a pathetic attempt to help JP and is still horrible to other people.
I definitely have the feeling Hollyoaks will try I turn Robbie into the hero of the hour and it just does not sit well with me as well. Robbie has been such a homophobe for so long and suddenly that will all be forgotten if he finally after so long helps JP. I just don't buy it at all. I find that Robbie is getting way over praised for behaviour that should be fundamental and all his hateful offensive behaviour will be ignored.
I don't mind redemption only if it's done properly, he has to be punished for his actions and I don't want to see JP being his best buddy.
He was vile and deserves punishment, even now he is still being horrible.
Yes, Finn has put him in a difficult - maybe not impossible - position.
I acknowledge that Robbie tried to do the right thing re Finn's rape of JP. Maybe he could have done more (or done it better)? You're right - this does not have to, and should not, turn Robbie into some kind of hero/saint, but I have a strong suspicion that 'hero of the hour' is exactly the direction HO have planned for Robbie, and it doesn't sit well with me. Some nasty bullies grow out of it, some don't.
I don't remember Patrick saying that, but I don't doubt you're right. I'm sure he won't be expelled, sufficient grounds or no (and I think there probably are sufficient grounds).
After JP went for his counselling session, he asked Patrick to expel Finn and Robbie. Patrick said he knew JP was being bullied but not that things were that bad and then sent him off on that trip where he was forced to save Finn's life.
Yes, maybe he could have told his family or gone to Sam's house alone and told her and Danny the truth but such things would end the storyline too quickly.
Even if Robbie does end up being the "hero" of the rape storyline, getting justice for JP etc, this should not really matter because it's only with regard to that particular storyline and nothing to do with his character as a whole. We know he apologised to JP and stopped bullying him when he found out the truth.
Though his behaviour the day JP lashed out at him was appalling, he didn't know about the rape then and only saw his teacher walk away from his injured/unconscious best friend for no reason so he thought - of course it doesn't make his conduct any less appalling but it does explain why he taunted him at the time tough that was a very childish way to go about things instead of thinking about why JP might have hesitated to save Finn.
I don't mind redemption only if it's done properly, he has to be punished for his actions and I don't want to see JP being his best buddy.
He was vile and deserves punishment, even now he is still being horrible.
That won't happen for a while. Though Robbie and JP reached an understanding on that bridge, there was still an awkwardness there. It will take time but I do hope in time that they can at least be cordial with each other.
I definitely have the feeling Hollyoaks will try to turn Robbie into the hero of the hour and it just does not sit well with me as well. Robbie has been such a homophobe for so long and suddenly that will all be forgotten if he finally after so long helps JP. I just don't buy it at all. I find that Robbie is getting way over praised for behaviour that should be fundamental and all his hateful offensive behaviour will be ignored. Robbie in my eyes has done absolutely nothing to redeem himself. He did a pathetic attempt to help JP and is still horrible to other people.
To be fair to him, Finn has put a lot of pressure on him. I don't really see his attempts to help JP s pathetic - it was idiotic to let slip to Finn what he was planning to do but he really thought his changed statement would help JP and I don't think he is homophobic any more.
I guess I'm more forgiving than most people generally. When I was 12 I was bullied for a whole year by a lead bully and his hangers on - school found out and sorted things but when mom suspected the lead bully fancied me I was flattered and ended up forgiving him though I never told him so. In later years I befriended the hangers on though I never spoke to the lead bully again. Shrugs.
I agree with the jp thing its ridiolous and as a viewer im sorry its very off putting when they run a storyline like that and then it dissapears and i dont care whever it has anything to do with the buildings or scenery thats theyre fault not mine! so i will be switching off.
I agree with the jp thing its ridiolous and as a viewer im sorry its very off putting when they run a storyline like that and then it dissapears and i dont care whever it has anything to do with the buildings or scenery thats theyre fault not mine! so i will be switching off.
I agree that it is frustrating that the JP storyline is not airing for a few weeks.
I would be very irritated if Robbie becomes the hero of this storyline, especially if we have to watch the McQueen family kiss his hateful, homophobic ass for " saving" JP. Robbie, from almost when he first appeared in Hollyoaks, has been hateful of gays and has showed that time and time again. Now, he has one moment of feeling bad and that changes everything? Not in my opinion.
I would be very irritated if Robbie becomes the hero of this storyline, especially if we have to watch the McQueen family kiss his hateful, homophobic ass for " saving" JP. Robbie, from almost when he first appeared in Hollyoaks, has been hateful of gays and has showed that time and time again. Now, he has one moment of feeling bad and that changes everything? Not in my opinion.
Realistically though Robbie is the only one who can help JP because Robbie is the only one who knows the truth about what happened apart from Finn and JP. Finn is very unlikely to feel guilty or confess to anyone else. JP may speak up but his reputation has been ruined so nobody will believe him unless Robbie backs him up. Once the truth comes out about Finn, everyone will rightly hate Finn more than Robbie given Finn's heinous actions and complete lack of guilt and remorse - I am glad Robbie feels guilt and remorse and hopefully this will teach him never to be homophobic again.
If Robbie helped JP and brought Finn to justice I wouldn't have a problem with the McQueens being grateful to him for that. Whatever he has done in the past, the past after all is the past. You can't change your past but you can learn from your past. The present and the future are what matter, not the past. Robbie apologised to JP and stayed away from him after he found out the truth. His initial instinct was to discharge himself from hospital and go straight to the police. If it hadn't been for Finn, he would have helped JP I'm sure of that. Plus I don't think Robbie is homophobic any more.
I thought I'd use this thread to promote my new rap song. It's called "Hollyoaks, What Happened To You".
Okay, here goes. 1, 2 3... *Puts on Showbiz face*
When you give it all, you get it all
Hollyoaks, what happened to you.
From the beginning I knew what I was getting
But I was with it, and I'll admit that
Shit was clear that once I got up in it
Wouldn't be easy for me to let it go
For my time I got money, but money don't buy time
I got a head something got left behind
The world is yours, just sign this dotted line
And in no time... money, clothes, fancy cars,
Big old cribs, platinum on the wall, seven Grammys
Sold out concerts damn I've been working hard
Private jets to France, many women
I den had a ball
You can say I made it
But I'm faded, cause I miss you
Can we go back
But the issue this we can get back
Oh Hooollyoaks, what happened to youuuuu!
Yeah, come back to me, baby
Cause I miss you, can we go back
Hooollyoaks what happened to youuuuu!!
Oh yeah oh yeah
Oh Hooollyoaks what happened to youuuuu!!
:cool:
Realistically though Robbie is the only one who can help JP because Robbie is the only one who knows the truth about what happened apart from Finn and JP. Finn is very unlikely to feel guilty or confess to anyone else. JP may speak up but his reputation has been ruined so nobody will believe him unless Robbie backs him up. Once the truth comes out about Finn, everyone will rightly hate Finn more than Robbie given Finn's heinous actions and complete lack of guilt and remorse - I am glad Robbie feels guilt and remorse and hopefully this will teach him never to be homophobic again.
If Robbie helped JP and brought Finn to justice I wouldn't have a problem with the McQueens being grateful to him for that. Whatever he has done in the past, the past after all is the past. You can't change your past but you can learn from your past. The present and the future are what matter, not the past. Robbie apologised to JP and stayed away from him after he found out the truth. His initial instinct was to discharge himself from hospital and go straight to the police. If it hadn't been for Finn, he would have helped JP I'm sure of that. Plus I don't think Robbie is homophobic any more.
Why would Robbie suddenly not be homophobic any more?
Why would Robbie suddenly not be homophobic any more?
I'm hoping he won't because of the way the JP situation went out of control. I might be wrong though. He might not mature until he's in his twenties or something. Still, having said that, if he helps JP then I will acknowledge it whether he is a bully or not.
If Robbie helped JP and brought Finn to justice I wouldn't have a problem with the McQueens being grateful to him for that.
I guess I don't agree that the McQueen's should kiss Robbie's ass after after he bullied JP and basically implied that he got aroused while giving Finn mouth to mouth. JP should not have to owe anything to Robbie.
I guess I don't agree that the McQueen's should kiss Robbie's ass after after he bullied JP and basically implied that he got aroused while giving Finn mouth to mouth. JP should not have to owe anything to Robbie.
hopefully the writers don't make Robbie the hero, hopefully he remains Finn's bitch ,afraid to speak up and portray him as what he really is and that is a nasty bully and a pathetic coward and shouldn't be portrayed a hero at all, hopefully they do it with JP eventually finding the courage and speaks up about the rape.
Comments
I think the 4 directors production model started late in 2003, when Hollyoaks went 5 nights per week following the end of Brookside. If I remember rightly, that's around the time the Toby Mills storylne concluded too.
They have to have 4 directors shooting at once or the production cycle couldn't sustain 5 episodes per week on single camera. A solution would be to go multi-camera like all the other soaps to speed things up, but that is something Lime Pictures have always resisted.
I don't think it's just that. Robbie is a 17 year old schoolboy - the bullying is something that he will grow out of with time. Lots of people are idiots as teenagers. At least as regards the JP situation he has stopped bullying JP and left him alone since he found out the truth. I've always thought anyone who feels genuine guilt and remorse over their actions and/or is capable of being horrified and rightly angry at the heinous actions of others are capable of redemption. Only the really hardened types with no redeeming qualities whatsoever like Finn O Connor, Frank Foster (Corrie) etc are incapable of redemption.
It will take time for Robbie to redeem himself completely I agree but at least he has as far as the JP situation goes, made a start and I'm glad about that.
BIB - it's not praise for not being a rapist. It's acknowledgement of his genuine guilt/remorse over his part in the JP situation and his attempts to make things right i.e. the apology to JP on the bridge, staying away from JP, rewriting his statement to tell the truth....
I think actions and individuals need to be judged separately. Comparing Finn and Robbie and highlighting Robbie's one shock reaction and possible regret means missing the whole picture.
Finn was a weak lonely desperate young boy who Robbie targeted, bullying him, undermining him, laughing at him resulting in Finn eventually standing up and being a man but in a completely catastrophic and disgraceful way. We saw the build up and what happened so there is some understanding of what happened even if that could never lead to forgiveness. However, he is just 16 I think so there is every chance realistically if he admits what he's done, is properly regretful and truly sees it for what it is and of course is punished that he could change and not end up a violent person and rapist as an adult.
With Robbie we haven't seen anything to explain to us why he is the way he is, in fact the opposite, as he comes from a loving home with family to look out for him and is a very confident youth but still he resorts to bullying and intimidation and shows jealousy and is prepared to lie about his family and to his family. He is shocked that his friend raped someone and can see that may be a result in part to how he treated JP and Finn but all it did was make him see sense in those particular relationships. He continues to belittle and intimidate and steal and lie elsewhere.
There is no more basis for redemption in Robbie than there is Finn in what we've seen so far but the idea that Robbie could be seen in any kind of good light over the rape story line would be sickening IMO without him first being suitably punished for his disgusting treatment of JP and his part in how it all played out.
I only followed the rape storyline so I can't comment on Robbie or Finn's actions or behaviour elsewhere - what you say about the build up to the rape may be true but Finn's reaction after the rape wasn't "Oh my God what have I done? I'm absolutely sickened and horrified that I'm capable of this" - if anything he became hardened and enjoyed having power over JP. He sat at the front of class the very next day with arms folded, told JP he asked for the brutal attack, forced him to change his grades back to A's and B's when JP was desperate to get him out of his class etc. His utter lack of gratitude over JP saving his life, threatening to rape Robbie and implicate him in the rape when Robbie's immediate instinct was to hate Finn and try and do the right thing, turning on the waterworks with Sam and writing that sick nonsense in Robbie's name to seal JP's fate - there is absolutely no way back for Finn. Considering his utter lack of humanity so far, it would be unrealistic for Finn to start suddenly showing guilt/remorse imo.
While I agree that Robbie's horror that his friend raped someone made him see sense only in those particular relationships, like I said, it would be unrealistic for someone who is in the habit of bullying, lying and stealing to completely change their tune overnight. Robbie is an immature teenager and as such it will take time for him to completely mature though his actions in apologising to JP, trying to expose Finn etc are at least a good start. Though Robbie does need to be punished for the bullying, I'm not entirely sure what kind of punishment would be suitable - detention is too lenient and expulsion from school seems too strong, particularly if he helps JP put Finn behind bars.
Personally I don't have a problem with Robbie finding out the truth and siding with JP. It shows things are not black and white and makes things much more interesting. I also know that his bullying behaviour of JP was before he found out about the rape. Take Monday 24th for example. While his behaviour was appalling, he was unaware that Finn raped JP so from his point of view he arrived on the scene to see his teacher walking away from his unconscious best friend for no reason and he was the only person who knew that JP nearly left Finn to die - everyone else treated JP like a hero so Robbie's indignation under those circumstances was possibly understandable. What was unforgivable though was his childish revenge on JP (locking him in a cupboard and setting off the fire alarm) and the homophobic abuse he hurled at him. Still, when he got suspicious and dragged the truth out of Fin he was quick to apologise.
Realistically Robbie is the only person Finn would admit his crime to. Also, the affair between JP and Danny had to come out since it's a soap and Sam though out of order for implying JP made up the rape, naturally felt betrayed so didn't want to help him any more. Robbie is realistically in a better position to help JP given that he knows all the details of the attack including who the attacker is.
It seems a shame though - I have warmed to him since he found out the truth about the rape.
Maybe, but I would probably still acknowledge any good he's tried to do but even you must admit that Finn has put him in an impossible situation.
You don't need to interpret Robbie being the one to expose Finn's true colours as Robbie turning into some kind of hero/saint - you can just think of it as him starting to take small steps towards redemption after having done a lot of nasty things in the past or acknowledge that it doesn't matter who brings Finn to justice provided that he is brought to justice. Even really nasty bullies can in certain situations mature and do the right thing.
I'm not entirely sure he will be expelled though because when JP suggested it to Patrick before Robbie found out about the rape, didn't Patrick say that there weren't enough grounds?
I acknowledge that Robbie tried to do the right thing re Finn's rape of JP. Maybe he could have done more (or done it better)? You're right - this does not have to, and should not, turn Robbie into some kind of hero/saint, but I have a strong suspicion that 'hero of the hour' is exactly the direction HO have planned for Robbie, and it doesn't sit well with me. Some nasty bullies grow out of it, some don't.
I don't remember Patrick saying that, but I don't doubt you're right. I'm sure he won't be expelled, sufficient grounds or no (and I think there probably are sufficient grounds).
He was vile and deserves punishment, even now he is still being horrible.
After JP went for his counselling session, he asked Patrick to expel Finn and Robbie. Patrick said he knew JP was being bullied but not that things were that bad and then sent him off on that trip where he was forced to save Finn's life.
Yes, maybe he could have told his family or gone to Sam's house alone and told her and Danny the truth but such things would end the storyline too quickly.
Even if Robbie does end up being the "hero" of the rape storyline, getting justice for JP etc, this should not really matter because it's only with regard to that particular storyline and nothing to do with his character as a whole. We know he apologised to JP and stopped bullying him when he found out the truth.
Though his behaviour the day JP lashed out at him was appalling, he didn't know about the rape then and only saw his teacher walk away from his injured/unconscious best friend for no reason so he thought - of course it doesn't make his conduct any less appalling but it does explain why he taunted him at the time tough that was a very childish way to go about things instead of thinking about why JP might have hesitated to save Finn.
That won't happen for a while. Though Robbie and JP reached an understanding on that bridge, there was still an awkwardness there. It will take time but I do hope in time that they can at least be cordial with each other.
To be fair to him, Finn has put a lot of pressure on him. I don't really see his attempts to help JP s pathetic - it was idiotic to let slip to Finn what he was planning to do but he really thought his changed statement would help JP and I don't think he is homophobic any more.
I guess I'm more forgiving than most people generally. When I was 12 I was bullied for a whole year by a lead bully and his hangers on - school found out and sorted things but when mom suspected the lead bully fancied me I was flattered and ended up forgiving him though I never told him so. In later years I befriended the hangers on though I never spoke to the lead bully again. Shrugs.
I agree that it is frustrating that the JP storyline is not airing for a few weeks.
Realistically though Robbie is the only one who can help JP because Robbie is the only one who knows the truth about what happened apart from Finn and JP. Finn is very unlikely to feel guilty or confess to anyone else. JP may speak up but his reputation has been ruined so nobody will believe him unless Robbie backs him up. Once the truth comes out about Finn, everyone will rightly hate Finn more than Robbie given Finn's heinous actions and complete lack of guilt and remorse - I am glad Robbie feels guilt and remorse and hopefully this will teach him never to be homophobic again.
If Robbie helped JP and brought Finn to justice I wouldn't have a problem with the McQueens being grateful to him for that. Whatever he has done in the past, the past after all is the past. You can't change your past but you can learn from your past. The present and the future are what matter, not the past. Robbie apologised to JP and stayed away from him after he found out the truth. His initial instinct was to discharge himself from hospital and go straight to the police. If it hadn't been for Finn, he would have helped JP I'm sure of that. Plus I don't think Robbie is homophobic any more.
Okay, here goes. 1, 2 3... *Puts on Showbiz face*
When you give it all, you get it all
Hollyoaks, what happened to you.
From the beginning I knew what I was getting
But I was with it, and I'll admit that
Shit was clear that once I got up in it
Wouldn't be easy for me to let it go
For my time I got money, but money don't buy time
I got a head something got left behind
The world is yours, just sign this dotted line
And in no time... money, clothes, fancy cars,
Big old cribs, platinum on the wall, seven Grammys
Sold out concerts damn I've been working hard
Private jets to France, many women
I den had a ball
You can say I made it
But I'm faded, cause I miss you
Can we go back
But the issue this we can get back
Oh Hooollyoaks, what happened to youuuuu!
Yeah, come back to me, baby
Cause I miss you, can we go back
Hooollyoaks what happened to youuuuu!!
Oh yeah oh yeah
Oh Hooollyoaks what happened to youuuuu!!
:cool:
I'm hoping he won't because of the way the JP situation went out of control. I might be wrong though. He might not mature until he's in his twenties or something. Still, having said that, if he helps JP then I will acknowledge it whether he is a bully or not.
It's gone downhill so much since Brendan Brady left and they killed off any good characters that were left like Claire and Texas.
I guess I don't agree that the McQueen's should kiss Robbie's ass after after he bullied JP and basically implied that he got aroused while giving Finn mouth to mouth. JP should not have to owe anything to Robbie.
hopefully the writers don't make Robbie the hero, hopefully he remains Finn's bitch ,afraid to speak up and portray him as what he really is and that is a nasty bully and a pathetic coward and shouldn't be portrayed a hero at all, hopefully they do it with JP eventually finding the courage and speaks up about the rape.