From what I gather it is in America. Similar to the connection with watermelon eating, or something like that. Over in England, I don't think it has racial connotation, although now we're all thinking about it for some bizarre reason. I suppose the next time someone of a 'non white, non english' type person invites me round for a sunday roast, I should kick up a fuss.
If we don't have the cultural connotation in the UK then you can be sure they don't have in Spain either. Would it have been racist if Garcia had said "hamburgers", "meatloaf" or something stereotypical American?
Woods really should be man enough to accept a genuine apology.
I dont get the racist thing here at all .Can anyone explain to me what fried chicken means in this context and what was said .
There's a thread on the politics board on this. I'm going to copy my posts and the content because I dont want to re write it. And also its quite interesting to read the mockery that the topic has become by some people.
Keep in mind, I always find that whenever an American says how it is in the US, there's always a Brit who says "no that's not it". lol
My posts:
1. It sort of goes back to the early 20th century, the stereotypeof blacks eating fried chicken and watermelon, wearing corn rows and mammies saying "honeychild". Dont know why
WHO doesn't love fried chicken?? be it blacks , whites, asians, etc. And YES,black people do eat chicken, and in the black areas you'll find Popeyes chicken (yum), Churches Fried Chicken and other chicken places because it's good. You'll find those chicken places elsewhere too.
This may have stemmed from that golfiing incident with Tiger woods? I think 'because' it is known to be a stereotype and that golfer said he'd invite Tiger to dinner and serve "fried chicken". NOw I understood the two do not get along well, hence the comment and its connotations.
Since I am not black, I cannot put myself in a black mans shoes and say whether or not he should be offended or not. So it's hard for me to comment. My mothers side is American Indian from Montana. Could I feel offended if I heard someone say "redskin, or kimosabee or paleface or squaw". I'm removed from that environment and never had to deal with that, so it's hard for me to judge.
Anyway, here is a funny sort of video from a black guy here in the US who adresses the 'fried chicken' thing. It's pretty recent.
2. Oh, you're talking about Tiger due to his mixed heritage. You really don't get it, do you, or you're just trying to be funny.
Listen, I think it's virtually impossible to try to explain (edited to add ''American") racist stereotypes and nuanced connations to a british audience . It just is. There really is no point to be honest.
It may even be similar to when Harry Connick Jr was judging in Australia and one of the acts came out in black face. The act I dont think thought they were doing anything particularly wrong.
Really now, you certainly can come to the US and order friend chicken, say you like friend chicken, ask where a good place to find fried chicken is... You can go to the South and have some of the best friend chicken (probably prepared by someone black). I have no idea where this Garcia golfer is from (could not find that info but then I didn't try too hard really), but WHY out of every food choice when asked about a competitor golfer who he is not friends with, did he choose to serve Fried Chicken at his house when asked what he would serve? Come on. You know there is some nuanced reference there.
But if I see a black guy and randomly say "why don't you go home and eat some fried chicken tonight?" Or if I was someone who did not like Obama (which I am not) and said "Sure, I 'd invite him over and serve him some fried chicken". vs. going out with a black friend at a restaurant and say "hmm, I have a craving for some fried chicken, I think Illl order it. what about you?"
"I" will know the difference. You may not, but I would question why someone would specifically mention that in a certain context and more importantly in the situation in which it was presented.
Some of you people are, dare I say, a little challenged I admit.
it is not a question that you don't understand or 'get it'. That's okay. This particular situation is not part of your world (and in no way do I think there is no racism in Britain- but thats another thread) .. It is the fact that you are actually mocking or ridiculing the situation still by comments such as "so I can't invite an Indian round for curry" or "what if I said Chow Mein or bagel."
You don't get it. Fine. But at least have enough respect to understand the people who do. Sad thing about this forum is you never really know the ages of people you are conversating with.
I am Irish and if someone said they would have me for dinner and be sure to serve bacon and cabbage I would laugh .
If on the other hand someone said they would serve blighted potatoes I would take the hump maybe .
For heavens sake we need to keep our sense of humour surely??
I've been accused of being racist for using the word black to describe an object whilst in the presence of a black gentleman from South Africa, Coloured is the term he preferred and insisted black was racism however you used it and white was an acceptable description.
I understand coloured is the preferred description in South Africa for some groups.
I've been accused of being racist for using the word black to describe an object whilst in the presence of a black gentleman from South Africa, Coloured is the term he preferred and insisted black was racism however you used it and white was an acceptable description.
I understand coloured is the preferred description in South Africa for some groups.
they had tiers of colour in south africe didn`t they, i think being coloured wasn`t as bad as being black. [i may have remembered wrong].
edit: four tiers, in top to bottom order: white, indian, coloured, black.
I am Irish and if someone said they would have me for dinner and be sure to serve bacon and cabbage I would laugh .
If on the other hand someone said they would serve blighted potatoes I would take the hump maybe . For heavens sake we need to keep our sense of humour surely??
Were you a black man growing up in the American south in the early part of the 20th Century? If not, you will never truly be able to understand any historical connations especially if you try to apply it to yourself. I'ts laughable, but oddly understandable, that some of you will try to make it out to be about Corned Beef and Cabbage, spoiled potatoes, Haggis, Fried Mars Bars and Curry.
Just shrug your shoulders and say "I don't understand". But you asked anyway.
I sometimes have to ask my family what is acceptable and what is not now .Words we used can no longer be spoken and it confuses me . We used the word coloured for black people when we were young , no insult was intended at all .I am now aware I cannot use it as it not acceptable so I dont .But am very confused as to what I can and cannot use now .
Both my husband and I wondered what word is now acceptable in 2013 to use for black people( sorry if that one is wrong ) and what word will be acceptable in 2014 as we need to keep up .
Your post reminded me of a conversation I witnessed a few years ago between two black guys, one very old and one very young. The older chap forgot someone's name so he was trying to identify him to the other by a description and included 'coloured' in this. The young guy started teasing him, saying, 'coloured? coloured? What colour - white, black, yellow, green and blue spotted....?..'
they had tiers of colour in south africe didn`t they, i think being coloured wasn`t as bad as being black. [i may have remembered wrong].
edit: four tiers, in top to bottom order: white, indian, coloured, black.
I always read that there were Americans (ie. US Citizens) of mixed race, or latin descent or American indian descent that would be considered 'coloured' in South Africa and during that period were advised not to go. So yes, that would explain the tiers. Whether or not they were denied entry, I have no idea. What about British citizens of ethnic varieties? Did they have issues?
So if I invited Sergio around for dinner and offered to serve paella is that the same thing?
Don't see why it would. I'd bet he'd be flattered you'd want to attempt his home dish! Invite away! The think the issue really would be would you be able to produce a Paella worthy of his tasting?
If we don't have the cultural connotation in the UK then you can be sure they don't have in Spain either. Would it have been racist if Garcia had said "hamburgers", "meatloaf" or something stereotypical American?
Woods really should be man enough to accept a genuine apology.
Why should he? Sergio Garcia doesn't like Tiger Woods and is constantly taking cheap shots at him and that's why it is highly unlikely that he didn't mean it offensively. At best he was thinking it and it slipped out. The guys an idiot and a troublemaker.
I saw a TYT episode about this, it seems to go much deeper if you're American.
Now I'm not sure if this is true, but it was said that the idea of fried chicken goes back to the days of slavery where chicken was considered the cheapest meat and the only one owners felt their slaves were worthy enough to eat. So it became a symbol of your lack of status. (But was delicious and became a fave for many).
If that''s the case then I can understand why Woods and others would get angry about it. The point is, is Garcia aware of this meaning? Woods and Garcia don't like each other apparently, it was a cheap shot, and it backfired. However he did apologise, and the only way forward is to either to accept it and move on, or don't accept it and move on.
Were you a black man growing up in the American south in the early part of the 20th Century? If not, you will never truly be able to understand any historical connations especially if you try to apply it to yourself. I'ts laughable, but oddly understandable, that some of you will try to make it out to be about Corned Beef and Cabbage, spoiled potatoes, Haggis, Fried Mars Bars and Curry.
Just shrug your shoulders and say "I don't understand". But you asked anyway.
I actually dont understand your point if I am honest ??
When I was younger, 'coloured' was considered to be the polite term of reference. I must have been on holiday when the official announcement was made that it should be changed to black.
I've been accused of being racist for using the word black to describe an object whilst in the presence of a black gentleman from South Africa, Coloured is the term he preferred and insisted black was racism however you used it and white was an acceptable description.
I understand coloured is the preferred description in South Africa for some groups.
I watched something about the coloureds (not sure if it was Ross Kemp) about the Americans street gang they said they were now the lowest on the social scale. Blacks were first then Whites and Asians anyway the coloureds were the lowest and they didn't seem to have anytime for black people.
Sorry if this has already been mentioned but didn't another golfer make a similar comment about Tiger Woods and fried chicken a few years ago? I'm sure that's what they said on Sky News yesterday morning.
When I was younger, 'coloured' was considered to be the polite term of reference. I must have been on holiday when the official announcement was made that it should be changed to black.
It always confuses me as to who and when the new rules are made .Who decides that black or coloured is now unacceptable ?
Will white one day be unacceptable and will we be called pinkish .No offence intended by the way before someone leaps down my throat and tells me pinkish is a curse of some sort
Comments
If we don't have the cultural connotation in the UK then you can be sure they don't have in Spain either. Would it have been racist if Garcia had said "hamburgers", "meatloaf" or something stereotypical American?
Woods really should be man enough to accept a genuine apology.
There's a thread on the politics board on this. I'm going to copy my posts and the content because I dont want to re write it. And also its quite interesting to read the mockery that the topic has become by some people.
Plus I posted a few stereotypical ads from the 1930s.
http://cdn.hiphopwired.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/GEadvertchix.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/e6a76e52fe863d959d846333e737b490/tumblr_mij748aLIV1qzmh88o1_500.jpg
http://abagond.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/1900sc_postcard-watermelon_02.jpg
Keep in mind, I always find that whenever an American says how it is in the US, there's always a Brit who says "no that's not it". lol
My posts:
If on the other hand someone said they would serve blighted potatoes I would take the hump maybe .
For heavens sake we need to keep our sense of humour surely??
I understand coloured is the preferred description in South Africa for some groups.
edit: four tiers, in top to bottom order: white, indian, coloured, black.
Were you a black man growing up in the American south in the early part of the 20th Century? If not, you will never truly be able to understand any historical connations especially if you try to apply it to yourself. I'ts laughable, but oddly understandable, that some of you will try to make it out to be about Corned Beef and Cabbage, spoiled potatoes, Haggis, Fried Mars Bars and Curry.
Just shrug your shoulders and say "I don't understand". But you asked anyway.
As you say, its very hard to keep up to date
I always read that there were Americans (ie. US Citizens) of mixed race, or latin descent or American indian descent that would be considered 'coloured' in South Africa and during that period were advised not to go. So yes, that would explain the tiers. Whether or not they were denied entry, I have no idea. What about British citizens of ethnic varieties? Did they have issues?
Don't see why it would. I'd bet he'd be flattered you'd want to attempt his home dish! Invite away! The think the issue really would be would you be able to produce a Paella worthy of his tasting?
Why should he? Sergio Garcia doesn't like Tiger Woods and is constantly taking cheap shots at him and that's why it is highly unlikely that he didn't mean it offensively. At best he was thinking it and it slipped out. The guys an idiot and a troublemaker.
Any Spaniard would be amused that a British person would think that they could make a decent paella.
Now I'm not sure if this is true, but it was said that the idea of fried chicken goes back to the days of slavery where chicken was considered the cheapest meat and the only one owners felt their slaves were worthy enough to eat. So it became a symbol of your lack of status. (But was delicious and became a fave for many).
If that''s the case then I can understand why Woods and others would get angry about it. The point is, is Garcia aware of this meaning? Woods and Garcia don't like each other apparently, it was a cheap shot, and it backfired. However he did apologise, and the only way forward is to either to accept it and move on, or don't accept it and move on.
I actually dont understand your point if I am honest ??
Touché !
I watched something about the coloureds (not sure if it was Ross Kemp) about the Americans street gang they said they were now the lowest on the social scale. Blacks were first then Whites and Asians anyway the coloureds were the lowest and they didn't seem to have anytime for black people.
That most of you don't understand what you are talking about.
It always confuses me as to who and when the new rules are made .Who decides that black or coloured is now unacceptable ?
Will white one day be unacceptable and will we be called pinkish .No offence intended by the way before someone leaps down my throat and tells me pinkish is a curse of some sort
Exactly.
I have a watermelon in my fridge at the moment. Should I hide it?
i agree, it`s difficult for [some] people from a different culture to understand the significance.
Seen all those used and Collard greens too.