The professional and personal worlds are two very different playing fields. Generally, when anyone is providing a service, that are held to certain standards. In your example, if someone picked a dodgy surgeon and they complained to the Medical Board, the surgeon could be struck off.
Yes, but the example works regardless of how different the two spheres are and regardless of whether or not surgeons can and will get struck off. The salient point is that consent cannot be given without capacity and capacity is undermined by deception.
A man (or woman) lying to get sex makes them a liar but not a rapist.
It really depends on the lie. You may have missed what I was hinting at in my last post, but suppose a man consents to sex with someone he thinks is a woman but turns out to be a man. Is that consent valid? It's a somewhat extreme example, yes, but it demonstrates that not all lies are equally trivial and therefore not all consent is equally valid for anything that follows.
It's only rape if one party had absolutely no choice and was forced to do it.
Well, that's quite simply incorrect. Rape is the absence of consent, not the presence of force. A person can agree to sex but not consent to it, the obvious (but not solitary) example being children.
Being tricked into sex might make you feel stupid but it doesn't mean you have being raped. As long as she had the option of not having sex, then it wasn't rape.
As I already said, it depends whether the nature of the lie renders the consent invalid. One can consent to one thing and have a different thing happen to you. In this case I certainly wouldn't say the sex she consented to was different enough from the sex she got to render it non-consensual.
The bases of my argument is that he told her information that she could have checked up. He didn't force himself on her. Feeling stupid doesn't justify branding someone a rapist.
No, in this case I agree it doesn't, but I do find myself objecting to some of the reasoning that brings you to your conclusion.
There is enough real rape in the world without clouding the issue even further. Imagine how many people could be accused of rape for lying about things to get sex.
I suppose the obvious suggestion would be don't lie to get sex.
People lie all the time and part of obtaining your degree at the University of Life is learning to spot the bullsh!tters from the real deal. Sometimes this means learning from really stupid and embarrassing mistakes, which you have to take responsibility for, not blame on others.
I don't think you and I are going to agree on this and it's just going to go round in circles
Well we do agree that believing someone is not the race they actually are isn't grounds for rape/non-consensual sex, if that helps . I'm just not able to extend that to saying consent on false premises is always valid in all situations.
Extend this ruling to other situations. A man is having an affair. He has sex with his girlfriend. She would not have had sex had she known he was having an affair. Would that make him a rapist? If this ruling was extended then Israeli jails would be busting at the seams.
Comments
I think it does more than smack of it.
It really depends on the lie. You may have missed what I was hinting at in my last post, but suppose a man consents to sex with someone he thinks is a woman but turns out to be a man. Is that consent valid? It's a somewhat extreme example, yes, but it demonstrates that not all lies are equally trivial and therefore not all consent is equally valid for anything that follows.
Well, that's quite simply incorrect. Rape is the absence of consent, not the presence of force. A person can agree to sex but not consent to it, the obvious (but not solitary) example being children.
As I already said, it depends whether the nature of the lie renders the consent invalid. One can consent to one thing and have a different thing happen to you. In this case I certainly wouldn't say the sex she consented to was different enough from the sex she got to render it non-consensual.
No, in this case I agree it doesn't, but I do find myself objecting to some of the reasoning that brings you to your conclusion.
I suppose the obvious suggestion would be don't lie to get sex.
Well we do agree that believing someone is not the race they actually are isn't grounds for rape/non-consensual sex, if that helps
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1303193