The Sally pimping is getting ridiculous

fireemblemcrazefireemblemcraze Posts: 7,436
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With the addition of Kylie and these song choices, it's very obvious what the BBC are trying to do and that's trying to get to gain viewership with the older demographics.

And Sally winning is catering to that. Hence why the best voices on Team Tom were destroyed before they even got a chance to get to the lives: Leverne, Kenny and Vicky were the top 3 from Team Tom in the DS poll. And look NONE of them made it. They were removed from play so Sally had no competition. Leverne had the everyday mother story going on and the folksy feel. She would have taken votes away from Sally so she was removed. The two left - Georgia and Bizzi are significantly weaker in comparison to Sally and are obvious fodder (reminds me of having Shelley and Lorna who were obvious fodder when paired with Sam Bailey - getting rid of the much stronger Overs, decimating the field for Sam Bailey). It only serves to make Sally look stronger. The battles on Team Tom were the only battles were I felt certain contestants were completely thrown under the bus.

Then they have been pimping Sally constantly and every judge has been praising her constantly whereas Rachael and Christina (the other two frontrunners) have at least received some form of constructive criticism. Coming from a person who loved her Dear Darlin and audition, what I saw tonight was very average I felt yet was given OTT praise. All that stuff about having had a career and having been with a well known folk group for 6 years, having a well established professional career for 35 has conveniently been brushed underneath the carpet and instead she's become a sweet, frail every day mother with a moving/gripping backstory.

I have no problems with this all this manipulation except 1) Sally had her chance being with a well known folk group for 6 years, isn't the pretense of the show to find NEW talent?, 2) Sally is not commercially viable because her folk is a niche genre esp Loreena McKennitt type folk and she has been a well established performer for 35 years and not been commercially successful, 3) the Voice needs a commercial winner otherwise it just feels like a waste of time and that what they're promising these contestants is also a waste of time and also it will also mean less reason to renew/switch contracts for next year (no more The Voice).

Sally has a stunning voice and should be judged for that alone. Why this extra push to pimp when she would do well in the votes anyway baffles me??? Especially with what The Voice is looking for. I know just about every person in this forum will disagree but just to reiterate before the topic gets derailed into mindless chat about opinions vs facts - this is my opinion. :p
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Comments

  • Fairy WingsFairy Wings Posts: 5,680
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    I like Sally and wouldn't have heard her voice if it wasn't for the show so am glad she's taking part.
  • fireemblemcrazefireemblemcraze Posts: 7,436
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    I like Sally and wouldn't have heard her voice if it wasn't for the show so am glad she's taking part.

    I really like Sally too but it feels like Leah last year - the constant over pimping will do nothing but play against her. Leah didn't perform as well in the final when she killed it before with Loving You, RIP, I Will Survive. But then you could see the pressure getting to her on I Will Always Love You - which was 1) a forced demo delighting song choice on her, 2) pitchy (when she's not normally). It's both detrimental to the show and to the performer.
  • -Sid--Sid- Posts: 29,365
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    The two left - Georgia and Bizzi are significantly weaker in comparison to Sally and are obvious fodder

    But, but, but.....up until tonight I kept reading about how brilliant and quirky and different Georgia was!

    I think others have been bigged up too much in order to manufacture some 'competition' and make it seem like the standard is higher than ever.

    Truth is, only Sally and Christina Marie's voices are remarkable. The trouble I have with Christina though is that whilst she can hit any note, I find her delivery quite clinical. And I can't be doing with her whimpering.

    Sally is something else. She's rare. She doesn't need pimping, and she doesn't get it. She gets the truth from the judges and deserves every bit of praise that comes her way.
  • CelticMythCelticMyth Posts: 3,090
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    Sally is an international star in the making. The producers are wise to pimp her to ensure the audience do not opt for less commercial contestants.
  • water_carrierwater_carrier Posts: 1,237
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    -Sid- wrote: »
    But, but, but.....up until tonight I kept reading about how brilliant and quirky and different Georgia was!

    I think others have been bigged up too much in order to manufacture some 'competition' and make it seem like the standard is higher than ever.

    Truth is, only Sally and Christina Marie's voices are remarkable. The trouble I have with Christina though is that whilst she can hit any note, I find her delivery quite clinical. And I can't be doing with her whimpering either!

    Sally is something else. She's rare. She doesn't need pimping, and she doesn't get it. She gets the truth from the judges and deserves every bit of praise.

    Agree with all your points.
    Sally is amazing. Many of these pop groups of today could learn a lot from her. Little Mix take note; there's singing and there's singing. When Sally sings I believe every single word. She sings with emotion unrivaled. She is a remarkable singer, she really is. She'll probably win The Voice, whether that's right for this type of show I don't know but in my book Sally, Jermain & Bizzi are ahead by a country mile.
  • vpowervpower Posts: 1,278
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    Tonight was the only night that I got Sally. Really enjoyed her performance. The GBP results pi**ed me off though :)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 260
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    Ok I understand that you might have a problem with the support for Sally, but I think she deserves all the hype she is getting. And for me:

    1) It's not about finding new talent. It's simply about finding talent. If it was about finding new talent they wouldn't invite artists who have already had success to audition - Leo from this year, Cleo from the year before etc. If a person is talented (and Sally is extremely talented, amongst a few others) they deserve the chance to be apart of the show and potentially win it.

    2) Just because it is niche doesn't make it any more or less important. I like a lot of niche genres.. folk being one of them. I don't listen to mainstream music, it is very rare I find a song I like to listen to that is in the charts. My favorite music includes the likes of Billy Joel, Bob Dylan, David Bowie and Josh Groban. I personally would prefer to go and watch Sally sing live out of all the other contestants and I'm 24.

    3) Why can't Sally be commercial? Because you don't think she is 'commercial'? Whether she makes a little bit of success or a lot of success from this I am sure she will be grateful for any. And perhaps it's not always about making money, but about doing something that makes them happy. Besides many artists get by just as well without any media promotion. How often do you see Iron Maiden, Queen or David Bowie being promoted, yet are still some of the highest selling and paid musicians. This is just a platform for her and I would buy her album if she released one - win or lose.
  • caz789caz789 Posts: 4,014
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    Christina Marie was the most pimped tonight.
  • lulu glulu g Posts: 52,620
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    caz789 wrote: »
    Christina Marie was the most pimped tonight.
    Indeed she got the much-vaunted 'pimp slot' last Sunday and once again tonight, along with the star-of-the-show production and big frock.
  • Pet MonkeyPet Monkey Posts: 11,923
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    Ray Lamontagne does (or did?) a great live version of that Kinks song, which Sally's version reminds me of. That'll be praise to some.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7py_aC191iU

    Track starts about 3:00

    Of course (thanks lulu g) it's the Bee Gees not the Kinks. (Eejit!) It's the quietness and the painful sincerity (™ Lamontagne) that reminded me of it.
  • KapellmeisterKapellmeister Posts: 41,322
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    lulu g wrote: »
    Indeed she got the much-vaunted 'pimp slot' last Sunday and once again tonight, along with the star-of-the-show production and big frock.

    Agreed. Massively pimped!
  • lulu glulu g Posts: 52,620
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    To Love Somebody is a Bee Gees song.
  • attackmusicattackmusic Posts: 3,828
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    Yawn, I knew people would start arguing about Sally and Christina being pimped. People started to say the same about Leah last year, then complained when she didn't win! :D:p
  • Pet MonkeyPet Monkey Posts: 11,923
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    lulu g wrote: »
    To Love Somebody is a Bee Gees song.

    True, I was just coming back to correct my idiocy!
    :blush:
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 6,340
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    Seeing as Sally just got up and performed without dancers, a show-stopping outfit and a light show I fail to see how she is the one being pimped. If you think the BBC are desperate for an older demographic with The Voice then you must be deluded. They are desperate for a commercial pop act to win this year. I don't think Sally will become a big star but she has a credibility that few on these types of shows possess. Even though I like some of the singers left at this stage I don't see many of them going on to success beyond the show.
  • fireemblemcrazefireemblemcraze Posts: 7,436
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    Ok I understand that you might have a problem with the support for Sally, but I think she deserves all the hype she is getting. And for me:

    1) It's not about finding new talent. It's simply about finding talent. If it was about finding new talent they wouldn't invite artists who have already had success to audition - Leo from this year, Cleo from the year before etc. If a person is talented (and Sally is extremely talented, amongst a few others) they deserve the chance to be apart of the show and potentially win it.

    2) Just because it is niche doesn't make it any more or less important. I like a lot of niche genres.. folk being one of them. I don't listen to mainstream music, it is very rare I find a song I like to listen to that is in the charts. My favorite music includes the likes of Billy Joel, Bob Dylan, David Bowie and Josh Groban. I personally would prefer to go and watch Sally sing live out of all the other contestants and I'm 24.

    3) Why can't Sally be commercial? Because you don't think she is 'commercial'? Whether she makes a little bit of success or a lot of success from this I am sure she will be grateful for any. And perhaps it's not always about making money, but about doing something that makes them happy. Besides many artists get by just as well without any media promotion. How often do you see Iron Maiden, Queen or David Bowie being promoted, yet are still some of the highest selling and paid musicians. This is just a platform for her and I would buy her album if she released one - win or lose.

    Perfect example of a post which hasn't read what I said. And you make your arguments quite personal when I've made my statements from evidence: ie 35 years being in the business and she has still not made it = not commercially viable. It's got nothing to do with what I think, it's what's there right in front of you.

    I am not against the support for Sally considering I am a supporter myself. I believe her Dear Darlin was by far the best battle in the battle rounds for example and I believe her voice to be stunning. I am against the show's manipulation to pimp her.

    I am also not against indie/niche artists at all? If you know me at all or ask anyone here who knows me, I actually love indie/niche genres (hence why I even know about Loreena in the first place). I don't understand your argument here at all - it's got nothing to do with the importance of niche genres! The Voice looking for a commercial pop star. Whether you like it or not, that will be a consideration in whether the show continues next year or not and the quality of contestants we receive (whether they would feel the Voice delivers on its promises). It's got nothing to do with whether being indie is inherently right or not??? :confused:
  • Poppy99_PoppyPoppy99_Poppy Posts: 2,255
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    We are overdue a real singer in this country. All the hysterical vocal gymnastic crowd leaves me cold. Christina falls into that category, she can do it but it is all technical. Sally voice is quality.
  • fireemblemcrazefireemblemcraze Posts: 7,436
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    Seeing as Sally just got up and performed without dancers, a show-stopping outfit and a light show I fail to see how she is the one being pimped. If you think the BBC are desperate for an older demographic with The Voice then you must be deluded. They are desperate for a commercial pop act to win this year. I don't think Sally will become a big star but she has a credibility that few on these types of shows possess. Even though I like some of the singers left at this stage I don't see many of them going on to success beyond the show.

    Deluded??? Remind me again how Matt Henry (soul) and Mike Ward (country) didn't win then over Andrea's more current pop style? Two genres which inevitably have more older demo supporters?

    You must be deluded if you think the show wouldn't prioritize ratings...hence the added enjoyment factor for the older demos. Considering that plays a big part in whether the show will be renewed or not!!!

    And you contradicted yourself here really but I'll let yourself work it out. :kitty:
  • GeorgiecatsGeorgiecats Posts: 6,628
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    Sally is there where she belongs because of her Voice. Which is what the show is about - where does it say it's to find new young talent? It's about finding someone who can record stuff we want to buy.

    Sally and Chris are stand outs for me. I would buy their albums.

    Sally's voice is pure velvet. I didn't like the song choice tonight but that's not her fault they don't choose it.

    Christina I find a bit false. She does a lot of simpering and whimpering but no actual crying. She can't be that unconfident when she gets up there and does that with that voice. She knows how good she is so she needs to cut out the little girl act. Her voice is phenomenal - I'm sure the dance acts will sign her up as a lead vocal.

    Chris doesn't need to do anything neither does Sally - they say nor do nothing to pimp themselves - they can't help what other people say about them. Tonight nobody got negative comments - as with X Factor once you get to the live shows suddenly they all like everybody!
  • AaronWxAaronWx Posts: 2,531
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    Pimping? I think you are imagining things. Watch the x factor if you want to make conspiracy theories that might be taken seriously.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 6,126
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    When push comes to shove.....Sally deserves to be pimped....although in truth she is the one contestant who genuinely does't need pimping.....More radio2 than 1 but that might not be such a bad thing....In all honesty I can see Sally being someone who the BBC as whole will push and give exposure across the network should she win
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 25
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    If creating a superstar is so important for these kind of shows, why is the american version of the voice a ratings juggernaut without having produced a single star?

    I don't think Sally winning - if she does, I think she has stiff competition from Christina - is the end of the Voice. I personally would not predict the arrival of the apocalypse just because Sally wins, if she does in fact do so which is still to be seen.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 260
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    Perfect example of a post which hasn't read what I said. And you make your arguments quite personal when I've made my statements from evidence: ie 35 years being in the business and she has still not made it = not commercially viable. It's got nothing to do with what I think, it's what's there right in front of you.

    I am not against the support for Sally considering I am a supporter myself. I believe her Dear Darlin was by far the best battle in the battle rounds for example and I believe her voice to be stunning. I am against the show's manipulation to pimp her.

    I am also not against indie/niche artists at all? If you know me at all or ask anyone here who knows me, I actually love indie/niche genres (hence why I even know about Loreena in the first place). I don't understand your argument here at all - it's got nothing to do with the importance of niche genres! The Voice looking for a commercial pop star. Whether you like it or not, that will be a consideration in whether the show continues next year or not and the quality of contestants we receive (whether they would feel the Voice delivers on its promises). It's got nothing to do with whether being indie is inherently right or not??? :confused:

    But music is a personal topic. It's not a topic of facts or evidence. It's about personal tastes, interests and individuality.

    She said she has sung for 30 odd years, but not necessarily in any limelight for all those years. She has a little bit of success commercially years and years ago but gave it up, then went back to it in the last few years. So she has only been doing shows again for a the last couple of years. Pretty much the same as a lot of unrecognised musicians do until someone gives them a chance. At least that's my understanding. So 30 years or one year - at least she is having that chance to show off her talent.

    I'm not trying to have a go or sound abrupt or anything, I understand because I hate manipulation. However I just think that Sally is one of those ones who, without all this hype would still be the best singer in this show and deserves to be shown off. To be honest I am glad they are more focused on Sally and Christina Marie than they were on someone like Rachel.

    But just because someone is niche doesn't mean they can not be commercial. Folk is huge and quite popular right now.. Lumineers, Bastille, Kodaline, Laura Marlin, Mumford & Sons, Gabrille Aplin, .... Bob Dylan is still pretty big. Granted some of them fall into a wider genre category but they still sing Folk. And if you haven't noticed but festivals like Glastonbury, Woodstock and Coachella just love that genre and I can see the potential of Sally singing in something like that. Yes she may need to be given the right marketing if she wins, but if the show are willing to 'pimp' her then they must be willing to give her the right promotion and marketing to achieve what they want. Otherwise it's a waste of their time and money.
  • fireemblemcrazefireemblemcraze Posts: 7,436
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    But music is a personal topic. It's not a topic of facts or evidence. It's about personal tastes, interests and individuality.

    She said she has sung for 30 odd years, but not necessarily in any limelight for all those years. She has a little bit of success commercially years and years ago but gave it up, then went back to it in the last few years. So she has only been doing shows again for a the last couple of years. Pretty much the same as a lot of unrecognised musicians do until someone gives them a chance. At least that's my understanding. So 30 years or one year - at least she is having that chance to show off her talent.

    I'm not trying to have a go or sound abrupt or anything, I understand because I hate manipulation. However I just think that Sally is one of those ones who, without all this hype would still be the best singer in this show and deserves to be shown off. To be honest I am glad they are more focused on Sally and Christina Marie than they were on someone like Rachel.

    But just because someone is niche doesn't mean they can not be commercial. Folk is huge and quite popular right now.. Lumineers, Bastille, Kodaline, Laura Marlin, Mumford & Sons, Gabrille Aplin, .... Bob Dylan is still pretty big. Granted some of them fall into a wider genre category but they still sing Folk. And if you haven't noticed but festivals like Glastonbury, Woodstock and Coachella just love that genre and I can see the potential of Sally singing in something like that. Yes she may need to be given the right marketing if she wins, but if the show are willing to 'pimp' her then they must be willing to give her the right promotion and marketing to achieve what they want. Otherwise it's a waste of their time and money.

    She has still had 30 years trying for/having a singing career - if she didn't get her chance then again there must have been a reason. She was part of the group the Poozies which have been releasing material/singles since 1993. There is a reason she wasn't successful commercially.

    I agree that Sally's voice is beautiful and stunning. However I think she is also the wrong winner for this show. And she will win thanks to this hyping. They had a chance if they kept Leverne/Kenny - people with fan bases but they completely decimated Team Tom. Or they could have stopped the Sally pimping but they have continued with it (even though yes her Knockout performance was again very nice). I do agree in a way they should pimp the best voices like Christina and Sally but again I just feel Sally shouldn't be pimped for the sake of the show.

    Folk rock is quite huge and popular right now. Kodaline/Bastille/Mumford are folk rock groups. Sally is in a completely different kind of folk genre I feel - more bluesy folk - the old school kind. Laura Marling has not set the charts alight. Gabrielle had a fairly successful first album so I'll give that to you but again she seems to be more indie pop/folk. Bob Dylan may be popular now but he started at a point where that kind of acoustic folk was popular and he built up a fanbase with that sort of music. She also needs airplay to be commerically viable...and I cannot see electro-pop crazy Radio 1 playing any of the singles Sally has released so far. She can do well in the indie scene but that's not what The Voice want.

    The situation with Sally I feel is a difficult one...because where I feel she has a lovely voice...would a Sally win be the best scenario for the Voice? Will a Sally win over a Christina/Sophie one help the Voice in convincing the BBC or another channel to continue their program?
  • -Sid--Sid- Posts: 29,365
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    The situation with Sally I feel is a difficult one...because where I feel she has a lovely voice...would a Sally win be the best scenario for the Voice? Will a Sally win over a Christina/Sophie one help the Voice in convincing the BBC or another channel to continue their program?

    People asked the same questions after Leanne won and then again when Andrea did. And the show came back both times with healthy ratings (higher ones for the blind auditions this time if I'm not mistaken).

    I think of the audience don't really care too much about picking the singer that'll have the most success after The Voice (they know that contestants who don't win these types of shows can still be successful). They vote for whoever compels them to. And if that's Sally, then so be it. I don't believe her winning or not winning will have any bearing on the future of the show.
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