Full Seasons each year, Wall-to-Wall-Who for the 50th, Matt Smith in Series 8 .... all bollo¢ks.
I don't believe a word the BBC say anymore.
Production staff dropping like flies, the entire cast quitting, a Producer who's clearly more interested in producing Sherlock that Who, crap nonsensical plots, widespread fan dissatisfaction.... I think Private Eye got it absolutely right.
Full Seasons each year, Wall-to-Wall-Who for the 50th, Matt Smith in Series 8 .... all bollo¢ks
I think it also matters what we are counting as 'the BBC.'
Moffat's PR spin? Quotes from Matt Smith? Out of context third-party stories? GallifreyBase 'insider info'. What Barry said down the pub? Or statements from the press office?
I don't recall the BBC announcing Smith would be in Series 8, for example. I could be wrong, of course.
Doctor Who being simulcast in November is being billed as big, factual news. But where did that news come from? The Sun - with a quote from a BBC Worldwide source. But have the BBC come out and confirmed this? No. Is it on the Doctor Who website? No.
But if they turned around tomorrow and confirmed "The Doctor Who 50th Anniversary Special will not be simulcast" - will the BBC be accused of lying to the fans? No doubt.
It's likely their fault for remaining silent. But not for releasing the story. Do we need an official response whenever anyone who has anything remotely to do with the show opens their mouth?
Bull. You don't have a clue what they didn't tell you.
Do you not remember the wailing and gnashing of teeth that we were only getting a few specials? What were they doing to our beloved programme? This must be them winding down the series before cancelling it? That they were only doing it because of budgeting problems?
People had the same feeling that they were entitled to a full series then that they do now. Nothing has changed.
They tell you what they're able to tell you. There's no lies or dishonesty involved.
It is quite clear that the information given by the BBC in 2008 was far more accurate and clear than anything given from 2011 onwards, which has seen a series of ambiguous, vague statements being issued in regards to Who.
Doctor Who being simulcast in November is being billed as big, factual news. But where did that news come from? The Sun - with a quote from a BBC Worldwide source. But have the BBC come out and confirmed this? No. Is it on the Doctor Who website? No.
Full Seasons each year, Wall-to-Wall-Who for the 50th, Matt Smith in Series 8 .... all bollo¢ks.
I don't believe a word the BBC say anymore.
Production staff dropping like flies, the entire cast quitting, a Producer who's clearly more interested in producing Sherlock that Who, crap nonsensical plots, widespread fan dissatisfaction.... I think Private Eye got it absolutely right.
The BBC never said anything about this? All there was was a quote from Matt in an interview with The Sun in which he said that "we start shooting series 8" and The Sun and all the other media used that quote to confirm that Matt will be in series 8.
I think there's a lot of butt-covering at the Beeb at the moment. The May 2008 announcement (about the 2009 specials/2010 season) proved the BBC could deliver unhappy news but in an open and clear way.
Private Eye has run quite a few stories about Doctor Who production being in chaos. I have no idea how true that is (if at all) but it would explain why the BBC's PR around Who over the past couple of years has become less clear.
I think the complications that have befallen production in the last year or two are definitely there - and they're becoming more apparent to the public (inevitably as social media continues to grow, and once these things get noticed people won't let them drop off the radar) but that there is also a clear difference between being dishonest and avoiding the truth.
The BBC's PR statements have definitely become less clear too, but I wouldn't say it's become any less trustworthy. They tell us what they can, and keep the fandom in the know to keep us talking about the show whilst it's off air (hey, free promotion) but there is a limit on that. In that regard I don't think much has changed between 2006 and 2013...there's just uncertainties within production right now that are harder to address to the public.
They have purposely misled us for two years now. It's unfair. Honesty never hurt anyone. I remember the upset when the lineup for 2009 was announced but at least they were honest and gave us warning; they also promised us a full series the following year. We've had none of that during this era. IF (and it's a big if) they run series 8 as a full series (even if it is just twelve episodes) from August 2014 and do the same with series 9 in 2015 then I *might* just start to trust them again. But hey, I guess we'll have to wait and see.
The BBC never said anything about this? All there was was a quote from Matt in an interview with The Sun in which he said that "we start shooting series 8" and The Sun and all the other media used that quote to confirm that Matt will be in series 8.
To be fair, when someone uses the word 'we' you kind of expect them to be involved, seeing as that's what 'we' means. I think it was right for everyone to assume he would be in series eight.
To be fair, when someone uses the word 'we' you kind of expect them to be involved, seeing as that's what 'we' means. I think it was right for everyone to assume he would be in series eight.
Well, I dunno, it's not quite the same as saying "I start", also he only ever said that they start shooting series 8 and all the reports then used it to say that he would be in all of series 8 even though he never said it. Also, isn't the Christmas special usually considered to be a part of the next series rather than the previous one (I think there was some discussion on it on here in an another thread today), so technically he could have been talking about that. But who knows, my main point was that the BBC never issued a statement that Matt would be in series 8. EDIT: What Matt himself said was misleading, but the thing is that at that point he most likely knew he was leaving and I guess they had a plan when they would announce it officially, so he wouldn't just go and say oh, btw I'm quitting once The Sun asked him about it.
What are the behind the scenes production problems?
No idea - but they've lost three executive producers since Autumn 2011, (Caro Skinner very suddenly, with no contingency plan!) and only produced one series.
To paraphrase Moffat, they've got a problem and they're not telling us what it is. Quite right, too - don't want to undermine confidence in the anniversary year. Not any more than they have to.
What are the behind the scenes production problems?
You should follow Ian Levine on Twitter - he's very open about what/who he thinks are the cause of the problems! It certainly made it difficult for me to believe any of the reasons the BBC has given for moving the show back to the autumn, the mid-season breaks or extended gaps between seasons.
Some interesting poll results at the moment - just two in five say they trust/mostly trust the BBC to tell the truth about Doctor Who.
The BBC never said anything about this? All there was was a quote from Matt in an interview with The Sun in which he said that "we start shooting series 8" and The Sun and all the other media used that quote to confirm that Matt will be in series 8.
If that is not deliberately misleading I don't know what is. Now we know Matt said it so that people would not think he was leaving the show but that is exactly the sort of thing that annoys some people,. At least D.T had the honesty to announce live on TV that he was leaving.
The BBC never said anything about this? All there was was a quote from Matt in an interview with The Sun in which he said that "we start shooting series 8" and The Sun and all the other media used that quote to confirm that Matt will be in series 8.
Exactly my point. Matt himself states to the national press that he'll be back shooting for series 8 - then quits suddenly.
Exactly my point. Matt himself states to the national press that he'll be back shooting for series 8 - then quits suddenly.
There is trouble afoot in Cardiff.
Whuh?
Is that how you think Matt Smith should announce his retirement from the tweed? To some anonymous journo who asks the completely irrelevant question of when series eight is gonna be broadcast?
I think the gang are full of spin right now, but there's a difference between transparency and mindlessly spilling all your plot twists every time anyone asks.
Comments
I don't believe a word the BBC say anymore.
Production staff dropping like flies, the entire cast quitting, a Producer who's clearly more interested in producing Sherlock that Who, crap nonsensical plots, widespread fan dissatisfaction.... I think Private Eye got it absolutely right.
I think it also matters what we are counting as 'the BBC.'
Moffat's PR spin? Quotes from Matt Smith? Out of context third-party stories? GallifreyBase 'insider info'. What Barry said down the pub? Or statements from the press office?
I don't recall the BBC announcing Smith would be in Series 8, for example. I could be wrong, of course.
Doctor Who being simulcast in November is being billed as big, factual news. But where did that news come from? The Sun - with a quote from a BBC Worldwide source. But have the BBC come out and confirmed this? No. Is it on the Doctor Who website? No.
But if they turned around tomorrow and confirmed "The Doctor Who 50th Anniversary Special will not be simulcast" - will the BBC be accused of lying to the fans? No doubt.
It's likely their fault for remaining silent. But not for releasing the story. Do we need an official response whenever anyone who has anything remotely to do with the show opens their mouth?
It is quite clear that the information given by the BBC in 2008 was far more accurate and clear than anything given from 2011 onwards, which has seen a series of ambiguous, vague statements being issued in regards to Who.
The BBC never said anything about this? All there was was a quote from Matt in an interview with The Sun in which he said that "we start shooting series 8" and The Sun and all the other media used that quote to confirm that Matt will be in series 8.
That quote is what was posted by The Sun. But where is the supporting report?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/worldwide/
I think the complications that have befallen production in the last year or two are definitely there - and they're becoming more apparent to the public (inevitably as social media continues to grow, and once these things get noticed people won't let them drop off the radar) but that there is also a clear difference between being dishonest and avoiding the truth.
The BBC's PR statements have definitely become less clear too, but I wouldn't say it's become any less trustworthy. They tell us what they can, and keep the fandom in the know to keep us talking about the show whilst it's off air (hey, free promotion) but there is a limit on that. In that regard I don't think much has changed between 2006 and 2013...there's just uncertainties within production right now that are harder to address to the public.
To be fair, when someone uses the word 'we' you kind of expect them to be involved, seeing as that's what 'we' means. I think it was right for everyone to assume he would be in series eight.
Well, I dunno, it's not quite the same as saying "I start", also he only ever said that they start shooting series 8 and all the reports then used it to say that he would be in all of series 8 even though he never said it. Also, isn't the Christmas special usually considered to be a part of the next series rather than the previous one (I think there was some discussion on it on here in an another thread today), so technically he could have been talking about that. But who knows, my main point was that the BBC never issued a statement that Matt would be in series 8. EDIT: What Matt himself said was misleading, but the thing is that at that point he most likely knew he was leaving and I guess they had a plan when they would announce it officially, so he wouldn't just go and say oh, btw I'm quitting once The Sun asked him about it.
Moffat? Hell no.
To paraphrase Moffat, they've got a problem and they're not telling us what it is. Quite right, too - don't want to undermine confidence in the anniversary year. Not any more than they have to.
You should follow Ian Levine on Twitter - he's very open about what/who he thinks are the cause of the problems! It certainly made it difficult for me to believe any of the reasons the BBC has given for moving the show back to the autumn, the mid-season breaks or extended gaps between seasons.
Some interesting poll results at the moment - just two in five say they trust/mostly trust the BBC to tell the truth about Doctor Who.
If that is not deliberately misleading I don't know what is. Now we know Matt said it so that people would not think he was leaving the show but that is exactly the sort of thing that annoys some people,. At least D.T had the honesty to announce live on TV that he was leaving.
There is trouble afoot in Cardiff.
Whuh?
Is that how you think Matt Smith should announce his retirement from the tweed? To some anonymous journo who asks the completely irrelevant question of when series eight is gonna be broadcast?
I think the gang are full of spin right now, but there's a difference between transparency and mindlessly spilling all your plot twists every time anyone asks.