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UKIP Watch

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    riceutenriceuten Posts: 5,876
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    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    You will find most BNP voters are ex Labour. It's Labour areas where they poll well.

    Where do you find that stunning piece of political analysis ? I think most people who vote BNP struggle with putting one foot in front of another, never mind voting.
    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    I am surprised this silly thread still drones on. We now gave the musings of a UKIP candidate for a council seat who hasn't been elected yet.

    Yawn yean yawn!:D

    Remind me again how many councils UKIP control....
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    MARTYM8MARTYM8 Posts: 44,710
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    riceuten wrote: »
    Where do you find that stunning piece of political analysis ? I think most people who vote BNP struggle with putting one foot in front of another, never mind ....

    Maybe because when the BNP won seats they were in solid Labour areas like Barking and Dagenham, Stoke, Sunderland! Burnley etc etc and not in Richmond upon Thames or Dorset. Just an observation.

    Its so easy to sneer and belittle people who clearly are experiencing such a desperate struggle with life they end up being forced to turn to the BNP because the mainstream parties have ignored them or treat them as if they don't exist.

    Maybe a little more understanding and a bit less sneering might be useful!
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    riceutenriceuten Posts: 5,876
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    Let's be honest, UKIP have the 'luxury' of not actually having any MPs at the moment. Their MEPs (the few that are left in the party that is) are just as guilty of electoral sleaze as any other far right group are. If UKIP (heaven forfend) had any MPs, given the behaviour of their councillors - who are not exactly beacons of moral rectitude or keeping their mouth shut - they would also have their snouts in the trough.

    http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/News/Cambridgeshire-county-councillor-Gordon-Gillick-deeply-sorry-as-probe-into-claim-he-called-children-in-care-takers-from-society-finds-him-guilty-of-breaching-code-of-conduct-20140412073000.htm

    UKIP Cambridgeshire county councillor Gordon Gillick 'deeply sorry' as probe into claim he called children in care 'takers' from society finds him guilty of breaching code of conduct

    A UKIP councillor accused of branding children in care “takers” from society said he was “deeply sorry” after an investigation found him guilty of breaching the members’ code of conduct.

    Cllr Gordon Gillick failed to treat three looked-after teenagers visiting Shire Hall for a training session with respect and brought Cambridgeshire County Council into disrepute, the probe concluded.

    Cllr Gillick’s outburst on November 6 during the session on safeguarding children triggered a complaint on behalf of the three teenagers, another on behalf of nine councillors who were present, and four complaints from members of the public.

    Investigator Steve Tinkler said Cllr Gillick had first interjected when Niki Clemo, the children’s social care director, was speaking about court hearings involved looked-after children, allegedly shouting: “These are secret courts aren’t they, come on, tell us the truth.”

    Cllr Gillick then spoke after the teenagers showed a film about their experiences, although Mr Tinkler said it was “impossible” to be sure of the exact wording.

    The cross-party complaint claims Cllr Gillick said: “It was all very ‘me, me, me’ your film. What about your responsibilities – to work, to give back, for example. Can you tell us, how does it feel to be takers from the system?”

    But the complaint from the teenagers claimed Cllr Gillick said: “It’s a funny world where young people are taught to take, take. That film was all about ‘me, me, me’, and that children should be taught to give.”
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    riceutenriceuten Posts: 5,876
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    Remember how UKIP were now gay-friendly and pro-gay marriage? This from a candidate for next month's elections to Portsmouth City Council

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/andy-mcsmiths-diary-the-ukip-candidate-who-finds-gay-rights-hard-to-swallow-9249353.html

    Douglas Denny, a Ukip member, thinks that gays are abnormal. In January, the Sunday Mirror noted his contribution to an online forum where he wrote: “What irritates me is the way they and their leftie, neo-Commie followers seem to want to force the rest of us to consider them as normal. I just wish they would keep their homosexual nature and practices to themselves.”

    Since then, he has been adopted as a Ukip candidate for a place on Portsmouth City Council, and has explained to the Portsmouth News that his online comments were “taken out of context” – of course – that he is not anti-homosexual – heavens, no – and that he does not believe in discrimination. It is just that he believes gays are “abnormal” in the sense that they are a minority, and objects to their claiming to be normal. To quote his precise words: “I wish that they wouldn’t try to keep ramming it down my throat.”

    Oh dear, is that what they have been trying to do? No wonder the poor man is distressed.
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    riceutenriceuten Posts: 5,876
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    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    Maybe because when the BNP won seats they were in solid Labour areas like Barking and Dagenham, Stoke, Sunderland! Burnley etc etc and not in Richmond upon Thames or Dorset. Just an observation.

    Its so easy to sneer and belittle people who clearly are experiencing such a desperate struggle with life they end up being forced to turn to the BNP because the mainstream parties have ignored them or treat them as if they don't exist.

    Maybe a little more understanding and a bit less sneering might be useful!

    I think the BNP trade on hate and fear and exploit this. The BNP won in rock solid Lib Dem and Tory areas like Epping Forest and Three Rivers as well - I guess that was due to disillusionment with non-existent Labour Councils ? Frankly, I have nothing but contempt for anyone who vote for a holocaust denying, prejudiced bunch of ill-educated thugs in suits - BNP - Bloody Nasty People. Saying I should sympathise with them is like saying I should sympathise for people who have voted for far right oppressive regimes the world over

    http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/hate-groups/bnp/councillors
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    Mike_1101Mike_1101 Posts: 8,012
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    No way would I vote BNP, but if you think they are extreme, have a look at this lot!
    http://www.britainfirst.org/

    The reason I won't be voting for the 3 main parties is that I voted for them for the last 40 years and they did very little for me.

    So it's UKIP for me for the foreseeable future.
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    MARTYM8MARTYM8 Posts: 44,710
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    riceuten wrote: »
    I think the BNP trade on hate and fear and exploit this. The BNP won in rock solid Lib Dem and Tory areas like Epping Forest and Three Rivers as well - I guess that was due to disillusionment with non-existent Labour Councils ?
    http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/hate-groups/bnp/councillors

    Given that you are such an expert - do you know which bits of Epping Forest District they won seats in? The Debden area - a traditionally Labour area full of social housing. Buckhurst Hill it aint!

    And yes they did win a seat in Three Rivers - in the Ashridge ward which has traditionally voted Labour and is now represented by two Labour councillors.

    And who was in national government at the time - Labour!

    And who therefore were these ex Labour BNP converts - probably on low wages/unemployed, probably with housing problems and other challenges in life. So rather than sneering at these people in your so superior trendy lefty tone - you might actually take time to consider why they felt this way. Cos by recognising it - and addressing it - might actually stop these people voting BNP in future!
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    wallsterwallster Posts: 17,609
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    bass55 wrote: »
    "Ramming it down my throat" Haha! He couldn't be more of a cliche of he tried :D

    Well, you know what they say about those who shout the loudest...

    Indeed!
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    EnnerjeeEnnerjee Posts: 5,131
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    riceuten wrote: »
    It is just that he believes gays are “abnormal” in the sense that they are a minority, and objects to their claiming to be normal. To quote his precise words: “I wish that they wouldn’t try to keep ramming it down my throat.”

    The adjective "normal" is defined as conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected. It's whatever the majority does within a particular group.

    If 51% of people were born with one leg, then they would be classed as normal while the other 49% with two legs would be disadvantaged; had the world evolved catering for the majority. The behaviour of the 49% would be deemed abnormal for the 100%, but normal within the 49%.

    Taking the population as a whole any behaviour of a minority is correctly deemed to be abnormal, but not necessarily wrong.
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    smudges dadsmudges dad Posts: 36,989
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    Ennerjee wrote: »
    The adjective "normal" is defined as conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected. It's whatever the majority does within a particular group.

    If 51% of people were born with one leg, then they would be classed as normal while the other 49% with two legs would be disadvantaged; had the world evolved catering for the majority. The behaviour of the 49% would be deemed abnormal for the 100%, but normal within the 49%.

    Taking the population as a whole any behaviour of a minority is correctly deemed to be abnormal, but not necessarily wrong.
    You seem to be mixing up normal and typical.
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    Mike_1101Mike_1101 Posts: 8,012
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    I know this story isn't new but here is the latest stage.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-27020970

    "An investigation into an alleged Islamic takeover plot of Birmingham schools has widened, with 25 schools now under the spotlight."

    "Birmingham City Council leader Sir Albert Bore said it had spoken to local authorities in both Manchester and Bradford.

    "There are certainly issues in Bradford which have similarities with the issues being spoken about in Birmingham
    "

    Immigration - the subject the main parties won't talk about.
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    EnnerjeeEnnerjee Posts: 5,131
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    In France there is evidence of racism against white French citizens:

    http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2014/April/Native-French-under-Attack-in-Muslim-Areas/
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    DadDancerDadDancer Posts: 3,920
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    Good to see UKIP are up in the polls, on a nice 20% now, with Lib Dems falling to 7%

    http://news.sky.com/story/1241625/ukip-poll-boost-tory-and-lib-dem-support-falls

    Also it smacks of desperation that some people on here are still posting those silly local councillor stories. :blush:
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    smudges dadsmudges dad Posts: 36,989
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    DadDancer wrote: »
    Good to see UKIP are up in the polls, on a nice 20% now, with Lib Dems falling to 7%

    http://news.sky.com/story/1241625/ukip-poll-boost-tory-and-lib-dem-support-falls

    Also it smacks of desperation that some people on here are still posting those silly local councillor stories. :blush:
    Much better to censor the news so people don't hear about them, isn't it.
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    Nick1966Nick1966 Posts: 15,742
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    riceuten wrote: »
    Let's be honest, UKIP have the 'luxury' of not actually having any MPs at the moment. Their MEPs (the few that are left in the party that is) are just as guilty of electoral sleaze as any other far right group are.

    That's if UKIP can be bothered to attend council meetings
    http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/local-news/tories-ukip-row-over-council-6433022

    Or represent British interests in the EU parliament.
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/85563e82-8f44-11e3-be85-00144feab7de.html#axzz2yrRrs3hI

    UKIP are the laziest political party in the EU. Not my words, but a story from the Daily Express.
    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/405805/Nigel-Farage-defends-lunchtime-pint-as-UKIP-tops-LAZIEST-political-parties-in-Europe
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    LateralthinkingLateralthinking Posts: 8,027
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    DadDancer wrote: »
    Good to see UKIP are up in the polls, on a nice 20% now, with Lib Dems falling to 7%

    http://news.sky.com/story/1241625/ukip-poll-boost-tory-and-lib-dem-support-falls

    Also it smacks of desperation that some people on here are still posting those silly local councillor stories. :blush:

    My weekly personal opinion poll has just been published:

    UKIP 36 (+2.9)
    Green 30 (-3)
    Bob Crow's Left Alliance 22 (+3)
    Offical Monster Raving Loony Party 4.9 (New entry)
    Lib Dems 3 (-9.9)
    Labour 3 (+4)
    Conservatives 1 (-2)
    BNP 0.1 (+0.1)
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    DadDancerDadDancer Posts: 3,920
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    Much better to censor the news so people don't hear about them, isn't it.

    No not censor, but to put things into perspective.
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    DadDancerDadDancer Posts: 3,920
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    My weekly personal opinion has just been published:

    UKIP 36 (+2.9)
    Green 30 (-3)
    Bob Crow's Left Alliance 22 (+3)
    Offical Monster Raving Loony Party 5.9 (New entry)
    Lib Dems 3 (-9.9)
    Labour 3 (+3)
    Conservatives 1 (-2)
    BNP 0.1 (+0.1)

    I like it:D, but unusual split there between UKIP and Greens. I would consider them to be opposite sides of the spectrum, on just about every policy. From immigration to Climate Change
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    LateralthinkingLateralthinking Posts: 8,027
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    DadDancer wrote: »
    I like it:D, but unusual split there between UKIP and Greens. I would consider them to be opposite sides of the spectrum, on just about every policy. From immigration to Climate Change

    Yes - you are quite right. That is, unless you are completely wrong. :D

    (I have just technically rebalanced the figures in the OP as I remembered Labour had Minus 1 last time)
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    Nick1966Nick1966 Posts: 15,742
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    DadDancer wrote: »
    Good to see UKIP are up in the polls, on a nice 20% now, :

    About the same as in the run up to the May 2009 UK EU parliamentary elections. In those elections, UKIP got 17% of the popular vote. And 19% of the seats.

    My prediction for the May 2015 general election: UKIP with the largest party by popular votes - without parliamentary representation. Just like in 2010.
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    DadDancerDadDancer Posts: 3,920
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    Nick1966 wrote: »
    About the same as in the run up to the May 2009 UK EU parliamentary elections. In those elections, UKIP got 17% of the popular vote. And 19% of the seats.

    My prediction for the May 2015 general election: UKIP with the largest party by popular votes - without parliamentary representation. Just like in 2010.

    nah i think Farage will definitely get a seat and reckon Diane James could go one better at Eastleigh next time. Hopefully the people who wasted their vote on Tory will realise that UKIP is the way go if they want to get rid of the Lib Dems. Other than that you are probably right about the rest, with lot's of 2nds and 3rds. We need PR!
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    HowardessexHowardessex Posts: 2,072
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    Mike_1101 wrote: »
    No way would I vote BNP, but if you think they are extreme, have a look at this lot!
    http://www.britainfirst.org/

    The reason I won't be voting for the 3 main parties is that I voted for them for the last 40 years and they did very little for me.

    So it's UKIP for me for the foreseeable future.

    You might think they are bad , but I think the Muslim people they confront at demos are much worse . Terrorists walking the streets after 4 years in jail, the Muslim guy calling the English protesters racist , because in his words , they are holding union jack flags . We need some one here in UK like Marine Le Pen , she knows what she is talking about and she commands respect .
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    Nick1966Nick1966 Posts: 15,742
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    DadDancer wrote: »
    We need PR!

    So did the Lib Dems.

    But David Cameron offered the LibDems a referendum on the alternative vote - in return for supporting the Conservatives in government.
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    allaortaallaorta Posts: 19,050
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    You might think they are bad , but I think the Muslim people they confront at demos are much worse . Terrorists walking the streets after 4 years in jail, the Muslim guy calling the English protesters racist , because in his words , they are holding union jack flags . We need some one here in UK like Marine Le Pen , she knows what she is talking about and she commands respect .

    And she may win both/either the next French Parliamentary elections and/or the presidential election....but they may find a reason to incarcerate her befor that, that's what the other parties would like.
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