Jimmy Saville to be revealed as a paedophile? (Part 7)

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  • dorydaryldorydaryl Posts: 15,927
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    It is all beginning to smack of Mc Carthyism and threatens to undermine some of the much more insidious abuse that has prevailed against vulnerable people.
  • jzeejzee Posts: 25,498
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    chuffster wrote: »
    So, Bill Roach gets into trouble for`rape comments` and weeks later is arrested on suspicion of`hisorical`rape? Hmm...
    His comments against rape victims were so full of bile & over the top I said at the time perhaps he was feeling the heat himself now one of his long time colleagues was on trial.
    dorydaryl wrote: »
    It is all beginning to smack of Mc Carthyism and threatens to undermine some of the much more insidious abuse that has prevailed against vulnerable people.
    Complete nonsense, it is highly likely there was corruption which allowed celebrities to be protected or simply police acting in a completely unhelpful way to victims. The Savile case has made people realise they don't have to keep quiet about abusive behaviour anymore.
  • bryemycazbryemycaz Posts: 11,735
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    jzee wrote: »
    Complete nonsense, it is highly likely there was corruption which allowed celebrities to be protected or simply police acting in a completely unhelpful way to victims. The Savile case has made people realise they don't have to keep quiet about abusive behaviour anymore.

    Yes but again it's a celebrity. Where are the politicians and other high profile people. It must have happened, the chances of their being that many celebritys who were the only ones who abused their position for me is very unlikely.

    people higher up the food chain are being protected and the Celebs are the easiest fodder to throw to the lions. Say a accused celeb names one now. A lot of people would say "making it up to save himself".
  • Parker45Parker45 Posts: 5,849
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    divingbboy wrote: »
    Yeah, I mean, I'm genuinely all for people being made to account for their past actions, but too many of these claims seem to be very, very old and involve people about whom there hasn't been a whiff of scandal. How do you defend youself against the allegation that you sexually assaulted someone in 1967!?

    None of these cases have gone to court yet so we will have to wait to see what evidence there is and what the defence is and, of course, what the juries make of it. Should be interesting to say the least...
  • SambdaSambda Posts: 6,185
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    I apologise...the first reports did not mention rape at all

    With a 15-year-old girl it would be statutory rape. This does not necessarily mean "forced intercourse". It could be what any normal person would call consensual sex.

    The media love to wave these phrases around as it makes things sound worse.
  • fluffybunyipfluffybunyip Posts: 4,909
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    Sambda wrote: »
    With a 15-year-old girl it would be statutory rape. This does not necessarily mean "forced intercourse". It could be what any normal person would call consensual sex.

    The media love to wave these phrases around as it makes things sound worse.

    You actually have no idea if it was statutory rape or forced rape at all. That hasn't been made public.
  • SambdaSambda Posts: 6,185
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    You actually have no idea if it was statutory rape or forced rape at all. That hasn't been made public.

    Doh - that's the point I'm making. It can be called "rape" and might just be what any normal person would call consensual sex.
  • fluffybunyipfluffybunyip Posts: 4,909
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    Sambda wrote: »
    Doh - that's the point I'm making. It can be called "rape" and might just be what any normal person would call consensual sex.

    D'oh. And you're saying that he might be innocent, and I'm saying he might not be. That's what 'normal' people say.
  • davidmcndavidmcn Posts: 12,086
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    Sambda wrote: »
    With a 15-year-old girl it would be statutory rape. This does not necessarily mean "forced intercourse". It could be what any normal person would call consensual sex.

    The media love to wave these phrases around as it makes things sound worse.

    The police wouldn't have described the allegation as rape if they meant consensual sex with a 15 year old. "Statutory rape" doesn't exist as a charge in England.
  • fluffybunyipfluffybunyip Posts: 4,909
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    davidmcn wrote: »
    The police wouldn't have described the allegation as rape if they meant consensual sex with a 15 year old. "Statutory rape" doesn't exist as a charge in England.

    I had no idea on that, to be honest. And now I wish that rep existed on DS.
  • StrmChaserSteveStrmChaserSteve Posts: 2,728
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    The way things are going...

    New show for TV, presented by Ant and Dec

    I'm an innocent celebrity, get me out of jail
  • fluffybunyipfluffybunyip Posts: 4,909
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    The way things are going...

    New show for TV, presented by Ant and Dec

    I'm an innocent celebrity, get me out of jail

    That's so unfunny that it's painful. A teen got raped by a famous 30-something? How funny is that!
  • skp20040skp20040 Posts: 66,872
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    That's so unfunny that it's painful. A teen got raped by a famous 30-something? How funny is that!

    Allegedly, whilst victims should not be dismissed the accused are innocent until proven guilty.
  • End-Em-AllEnd-Em-All Posts: 23,629
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    Cryolemon wrote: »
    That's the point though, we wouldn't necessarily know if those people had been arrested or questioned because it wouldn't be reported. That doesn't necessarily mean it isn't happening.

    Then the number of arrests for the particular operation would go up but I don't believe that's the case. Unless non-celebs are being rounded up under a different titled operation.
  • luckylegsluckylegs Posts: 7,400
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    davidmcn wrote: »
    The police wouldn't have described the allegation as rape if they meant consensual sex with a 15 year old. "Statutory rape" doesn't exist as a charge in England.

    They've been watching to many USA programs :rolleyes:
  • Ivy RoseIvy Rose Posts: 318
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    But the allegations aren't of groping - they're of rape of a fifteen year old girl. When he himself would've been 35. One might almost think that this sheds some light on his ridiculous comments of forgiving paedophiles, and victims bringing it upon themselves.

    Very much agreed. This is one arrest that makes me think they might actually be barking up the right tree for once. I say that as someone who is usually really distrusting of Operation Yewtree and anything to do with it.
  • ZeusZeus Posts: 10,459
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    jzee wrote: »
    His comments against rape victims were so full of bile & over the top I said at the time perhaps he was feeling the heat himself now one of his long time colleagues was on trial.


    Complete nonsense, it is highly likely there was corruption which allowed celebrities to be protected or simply police acting in a completely unhelpful way to victims. The Savile case has made people realise they don't have to keep quiet about abusive behaviour anymore.

    No it is not complete nonsense, the poster you quoted raises a valid concern. We can't comment on the specifics of individual cases but I can understand why alarm bells are clanging in many quarters over allegations about incidents that are said to have happened 40 years ago. What level of evidence is needed in order for these people to be arrested? Arrest isn't the same as conviction but the consequences of arrest, for the suspect and their families, are severe nonetheless. What controls are in place, what safeguards? Possibly it might not be Macarthyism at all, but I can understand why some are starting to draw those kind of parallels.
  • IzzySIzzyS Posts: 11,045
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    Just saw this tweet

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/statuses/329676019076304896

    seems he's been charged with 2 counts of raping a 15 year old (presumably the same person?).
  • luckylegsluckylegs Posts: 7,400
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    IzzyS wrote: »
    Bill Roache has been charged with 2 counts of raping a 15 year old.

    Source:- http://news.sky.com/story/1085727/corrie-actor-bill-roache-charged-with-rape

    I take it thats news in that he's been charged? though I'd heard about him being arrested this morning...

    Blimey that was quick they're not hanging about now are they!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 17,021
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    Arrested this morning, questioned all day and now charged.
  • IzzySIzzyS Posts: 11,045
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    luckylegs wrote: »
    Blimey that was quick they're not hanging about now are they!

    Apparently its been in the pipeline for a couple of months. I just saw this too:-
    Bill Roache will appear in court on May 14. CPS say been advising Lancs Polce on this since March 1. CPS say he has right to fair trail.

    https://twitter.com/lucymanning/statuses/329678850709667840

    Can't help but question the chance of a fair trial. I noticed today that again the police don't seem to name the person being arrested but the media do.
  • Ivy RoseIvy Rose Posts: 318
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    The media being allowed to name people before any convictions does need to stop. I have never supported it and never will.
  • luckylegsluckylegs Posts: 7,400
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    IzzyS wrote: »
    Apparently its been in the pipeline for a couple of months. I just saw this too:-
    https://twitter.com/lucymanning/statuses/329678850709667840

    Can't help but question the chance of a fair trial. I noticed today that again the police don't seem to name the person being arrested but the media do.

    Who do you think told the press?

    The press wouldn't report unless they had been given the name kosher wise.

    The press can report who is arrested and who is charged unless the police ask them not to. Of course the press don't have to comply.

    They've held off on a few names one they decided to out two weeks ago but there are some they haven't.
  • lemonbunlemonbun Posts: 5,371
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    This is a joke now. How on earth can you prove rape with one victim 46 years ago?
This discussion has been closed.