Are Irish people foreign?

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  • 1066andallthat1066andallthat Posts: 1,793
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    The Turk wrote: »
    Is that what you really think of us southerners and the English in general? With a stereotypical view like that, its obvious you've never been to the south. You've certainly never been to Folkestone.

    Me? Im not middle class, Im not a softie and I don't have a clue what the rules of cricket are. Im not into Tennis either, my favourite sport is football just like you 'tough' northerners, I prefer beer cold and Im as far removed from Eton and its culture as you are. Most of my friends and other people I know in Folkestone share most of those characteristics.

    I guess in your eyes that makes me an anomally or even worse, a northerner. Well, I can assure you Im a southerner and I've never set foot in the north.

    Remember, no matter what part of England you come from, we all have Anglo-Saxon, Roman and Norman blood. That means genetically at least you've got far more in common with the southern English than you do with most Scots.

    If you don't feel English, that's a shame but I have to ask? Do you have a problem with England and if so, why?

    1. its obvious you've never been to the south

    I left the north in 1985 and lived in London and Brighton until 2000 when I moved back up north and benefited from the difference in house prices thanks very much!

    2.just like you 'tough' northerners

    And, that is not a stereotypical view?

    3.That means genetically at least you've got far more in common with the southern English than you do with most Scots

    If genetics are that important (and I have a degree in Biochemistry) why, in some cases, is one twin homosexual and the other heterosexual?

    4.Do you have a problem with England and if so, why?

    Yes. The English are arrogant.

    For example, they insist that England has the best health care system in the world that everyone admires.

    The truth?

    Most EU countries have better survival rates than the UK. No other country funds their entire health system out of taxation.
  • JosquiusJosquius Posts: 1,514
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    Remember, no matter what part of England you come from, we all have Anglo-Saxon, Roman and Norman blood. That means genetically at least you've got far more in common with the southern English than you do with most Scots.
    That's wrong.
    There's quite a marked genetic divide roughly along the lines of the old Danelaw.

    And actually anglo-saxons aren't one people. The south was mainly settled by Saxons. The north, and parts of Scotland, by Angles.

    The name of the state is Éire when speaking in Irish, but Ireland when speaking in English. Some people in the UK think they should use Éire when speaking to Irish people, but nobody in Ireland uses it, not even in official government documents that are in English.
    Eire is a handy shorthand as saying Republic of Ireland everytime is a bit of a mouthfull. Saying Eire lets it be known you're speaking of the republic, not the island as a whole or the north.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 8,718
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    Josquius wrote: »
    Culturally I'd see northern England as having more in common with Ireland than it does with southern England.

    The North West of England and the West Midlands does have more in common with Ireland by virtue of large Irish communities in those areas.
  • mountymounty Posts: 19,141
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    No other country funds their entire health system out of taxation.

    Maybe in Europe, but the health systems used in Australia and New Zealand are largely identical to ours
  • edExedEx Posts: 13,460
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    Abolish all nation states. Nobody is "foreign".
  • The Exiled DubThe Exiled Dub Posts: 8,358
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    Josquius wrote: »


    Eire is a handy shorthand as saying Republic of Ireland everytime is a bit of a mouthfull. Saying Eire lets it be known you're speaking of the republic, not the island as a whole or the north.

    When I first arrived in the UK and someone asked me if I was from Éire, I hadn't a clue as to where they were talking about. I had never heard the term used in conversation before. It is just not used in Ireland unless you are speaking in Irish, which is extremely unlikely. How Irish people differentiate between the Republic and NI, is by calling them Ireland (the official name) and Northern Ireland or the North (though saying the North is supposed to be bad form now).
  • camercamer Posts: 5,237
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    Josquius wrote: »
    That's wrong.
    There's quite a marked genetic divide roughly along the lines of the old Danelaw.

    And actually anglo-saxons aren't one people. The south was mainly settled by Saxons. The north, and parts of Scotland, by Angles.



    Eire is a handy shorthand as saying Republic of Ireland everytime is a bit of a mouthfull. Saying Eire lets it be known you're speaking of the republic, not the island as a whole or the north.

    Yep, I always type Eire as a form of shotrhand.
  • The Exiled DubThe Exiled Dub Posts: 8,358
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    camer wrote: »
    Yep, I always type Eire as a form of shotrhand.

    Why not RoI?
  • The TurkThe Turk Posts: 5,148
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    1. its obvious you've never been to the south

    I left the north in 1985 and lived in London and Brighton until 2000 when I moved back up north and benefited from the difference in house prices thanks very much!
    And still you ended up holding those views you have of the southerners? That's surprising, that's all I can say.
    2.just like you 'tough' northerners

    And, that is not a stereotypical view?
    Maybe so but I did mean it in jest, hence the quotation marks. You labelled the entire southern half of England as softies thus implying that by comparison the northerners are 'tough'.

    3.That means genetically at least you've got far more in common with the southern English than you do with most Scots

    If genetics are that important (and I have a degree in Biochemistry) why, in some cases, is one twin homosexual and the other heterosexual?
    Good point. I admit I can't argue with that one.

    4.Do you have a problem with England and if so, why?

    Yes. The English are arrogant.

    For example, they insist that England has the best health care system in the world that everyone admires.

    The truth?

    Most EU countries have better survival rates than the UK. No other country funds their entire health system out of taxation.
    We're arrogant?! Another sweeping generalisation on top of the cricket, tennis, warm beer, eton softie tag.
    I absolutely agree with you on the NHS, it does need reform but where did you get the assertion that only the English think the NHS is the best in the world?! Im pretty sure you'll find plenty in Scotland, Wales and N.Ireland who hold the same view about their NHS.

    And for the record, there are plenty of English people who DO think the NHS needs reform for precisely the reasons you gave about better survival rates in other EU countries. The right-wing media for starters, ordinary people, not to mention an Englishman called David Cameron who actually is planning to reform the NHS, backed by englishman health secretary Andrew Lansley (correct me anyone if Im wrong on his nationality) and a mainly English Tory party/coalition.

    England isn't full of arrogant pricks. We have people of differing opinions, no different to the other nations of the UK or the world for that matter.
  • 1066andallthat1066andallthat Posts: 1,793
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    The Turk wrote: »
    And still you ended up holding those views you have of the southerners? That's surprising, that's all I can say.

    Maybe so but I did mean it in jest, hence the quotation marks. You labelled the entire southern half of England as softies thus implying that by comparison the northerners are 'tough'.

    Good point. I admit I can't argue with that one.

    We're arrogant?! Another sweeping generalisation on top of the cricket, tennis, warm beer, eton softie tag.
    I absolutely agree with you on the NHS, it does need reform but where did you get the assertion that only the English think the NHS is the best in the world?! Im pretty sure you'll find plenty in Scotland, Wales and N.Ireland who hold the same view about their NHS.

    And for the record, there are plenty of English people who DO think the NHS needs reform for precisely the reasons you gave about better survival rates in other EU countries. The right-wing media for starters, ordinary people, not to mention an Englishman called David Cameron who actually is planning to reform the NHS, backed by englishman health secretary Andrew Lansley (correct me anyone if Im wrong on his nationality) and a mainly English Tory party/coalition.

    England isn't full of arrogant pricks. We have people of differing opinions, no different to the other nations of the UK or the world for that matter.

    I'm not totally anti-English!!!

    I hope the two you mentioned will go down in history as the greatest reformers of the NHS that this country has ever seen.

    Tony Blair and New Labour talked a good fight but didn't deliver when the bell rang.

    The Tory led coalition said nothing about major reform, yet, may do the most radical thing in this country since Thatcher.
  • AiramAiram Posts: 6,764
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    Deleted because my reply was to something off topic.
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    Josquius wrote: »
    I hope it happens.
    Purely for how delicious the outrage and retarded rhetoric from the Irish far right would be. :D

    Excuse me? so wanting Independence is right wing now is it?
    :rolleyes:
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    camer wrote: »
    Yep, I always type Eire as a form of shotrhand.

    no one in Ireland refers to it as Eire and even in irish , it's Eireann
  • camercamer Posts: 5,237
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    no one in Ireland refers to it as Eire and even in irish , it's Eireann

    I do:D
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    camer wrote: »
    I do:D

    Are u in ireland/Eire then? :D
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    I lived in Cumbria for a while and during the 2006 WC, when england were knocked out, a drunken old lady heard my accent while in a pub and said "foreigners should stay where they're not wanted"

    I was speechless :D
  • The Exiled DubThe Exiled Dub Posts: 8,358
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    I lived in Cumbria for a while and during the 2006 WC, when england were knocked out, a drunken old lady heard my accent while in a pub and said "foreigners should stay where they're not wanted"

    I was speechless :D

    I wouldn't be, I would've given her a piece of my mind.
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    I wouldn't be, I would've given her a piece of my mind.

    I ignored her but my english mates and incidentally others in the pub confronted her and told her she was out of line!!

    I really like the english and I loved living in England
  • The Exiled DubThe Exiled Dub Posts: 8,358
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    I ignored her but my english mates and incidentally others in the pub confronted her and told her she was out of line!!

    I really like the english and I loved living in England

    I have lived here for quite a few years now, and generally they are nice people. Haven't had any nasty comments in a long time.
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    I have lived here for quite a few years now, and generally they are nice people. Haven't had any nasty comments in a long time.

    well anyone who resorts to that isnt worth commenting on- there are bigots everywhere
  • IndoIndo Posts: 1,832
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    I use to think Eire was an area in Scotland and I am from NI.
  • Sorcha_27Sorcha_27 Posts: 138,453
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    Indo wrote: »
    I use to think Eire was an area in Scotland and I am from NI.

    i really hope you didn't pursue a career involving anything to do with geography :D
  • JosquiusJosquius Posts: 1,514
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    Excuse me? so wanting Independence is right wing now is it?
    :rolleyes:

    No but nationalism and being anti-anything-remotely-British purely for the sake of it is.
  • The TurkThe Turk Posts: 5,148
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    I'm not totally anti-English!!!
    I believe you now!:D
    I hope the two you mentioned will go down in history as the greatest reformers of the NHS that this country has ever seen.

    Tony Blair and New Labour talked a good fight but didn't deliver when the bell rang.

    The Tory led coalition said nothing about major reform, yet, may do the most radical thing in this country since Thatcher.
    I agree with every word of that post. Im not firmly at either end of the political spectrum. I find myself agreeing with both the left and the right wing of the political spectrum depending on the issue. On the issue of the NHS I agree with the right-wing argument. Tony Blair's lack of guts to see through reform right to the end is one of the reasons Im glad both he and Labour are out of office. I hope the coalition succeed on NHS reform (provided they make the right reform) as well as in other areas.
  • The TurkThe Turk Posts: 5,148
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    Josquius wrote: »
    That's wrong.
    There's quite a marked genetic divide roughly along the lines of the old Danelaw.

    And actually anglo-saxons aren't one people. The south was mainly settled by Saxons. The north, and parts of Scotland, by Angles.
    Oh, I know. I admit I was using the Anglo-Saxon word to save time on the point I was making but you're right, I should've acknowledged the difference between the Angles and the Saxons and as a result, the difference between the northerners (and south-east Scots) and the southerners.

    In my defence though, I happened to be doing some research on them these last few weeks (on wikipedia:o) and it seems they inhabited the same sort of area in northern Germany including the Jutland peninsula. So Im willing to believe the two tribes were closely related at least.
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