Madeleine:The Last Hope ? BBC1 25/4/12

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  • Abbasolutely 40Abbasolutely 40 Posts: 15,589
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    jules1000 wrote: »
    Well I for one have always found him slimy and creepy and sinister and would'nt trust him as far as I could throw him. I don't feel that way about her though. Perhaps she is a woman controlled I have always seen her grief as genuine but not his.

    I have from day one found Kate Mc Canns body language to be subservient to Gerrys .When asked a question she looks to him first to check its okay to answer , he often interupts her answer and finishes her sentance .She sits with head to one side , eyes down and he looks straight ahead and a look that says "Dont mess with me "
    Just my opinion and not fact of course .
  • MetermaidMetermaid Posts: 804
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    I have from day one found Kate Mc Canns body language to be subservient to Gerrys .When asked a question she looks to him first to check its okay to answer , he often interupts her answer and finishes her sentance .She sits with head to one side , eyes down and he looks straight ahead and a look that says "Dont mess with me "
    Just my opinion and not fact of course .

    You are spot on. Have been told by a reliable source that she exhibits all the signs of a victim of domestic abuse.
  • GracelandGraceland Posts: 8,158
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    premixxed wrote: »
    Bloody hell, no punches pulled on this site.

    http://truthformadeleine.com/

    I may sound like a newbie suckup, but kudos to the mods for keeping this thread alive, when I was a lurker these threads were taboo.

    That site is very informative.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 10,488
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    LucyDTrym wrote: »
    Yes I found a very good one just done 5 months ago, and I tell you what I hadnt realised what Kate had said about the dogs either in her book I was shocked really shocked.

    Anyway if anyone wants the link I have it.

    Could you PM me please? Ta!
  • FBIFBI Posts: 817
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    aggs wrote: »
    If we are going down that route :) then bangs head against brick wall

    If someone had picked their handy big jar of cadaverine* off the shelf and planted evidence then

    The dogs were altering to what they are trained too.

    Again, until the alerts are contextualised then they remain as what they are. Alerts that happened that need context - what is so wrong with thinking that and that they shouldn't be dismissed just because we don't understand that context yet :confused:

    (* disclaimer - I don't believe that for a minute. At the time the dogs were deployed there were others more fit up worthy than the parents. I think the alerts took more than one by surprise)

    The context here is that the dogs are alerting to a location from which a toddler has vanished without a trace. It's not like they've alerted somewhere completely innocent.

    For instance noone has ever been reported vanished from my house - so if a cadaver dog alerted here I would not expect anyone to conclude foul play. There could well be an innocent explanation - perhaps someone died before I lived here. In the Shannon Matthews case a cadaver dog alerted to a piece of furniture which was found to have come from a house clearance of someone who died at home.

    But in this case there was an extensive dog search and the dog alerted 9 times - all of which were associated with the McCanns NEVER anywhere else. This same couple have had a toddler vanish without a trace - ridiculous to say this is not extremely significant.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    FBI wrote: »
    But in this case there was an extensive dog search and the dog alerted 9 times - all of which were associated with the McCanns NEVER anywhere else. This same couple have had a toddler vanish without a trace - ridiculous to say this is not extremely significant.

    but the handler specifically says its meaningless without evidence to corroborate it.

    are you saying he is wrong? :confused:
  • FBIFBI Posts: 817
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    primer wrote: »
    well, amaral is a convicted criminal. in my opinion it was a great mistake to have him on the case at all as he tainted everything about it.

    There has never been any suggestion that Amaral did anything untoward in the Maddie case. And his conclusions were shared by other senior officers.
  • FBIFBI Posts: 817
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    primer wrote: »
    but the handler specifically says its meaningless without evidence to corroborate it.

    are you saying he is wrong? :confused:

    Where does he say it's meaningless?
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    Metermaid wrote: »
    You are spot on. Have been told by a reliable source that she exhibits all the signs of a victim of domestic abuse.

    how would you tell those 'signs' apart from any other trauma. such as having your child abducted and then finding yourself the object of unpleasant speculation on the internet.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    FBI wrote: »
    Where does he say it's meaningless?

    in his report. no evidential or intelligence reliability can be made from the alerts unless confirmed by corroborating evidence.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    FBI wrote: »
    There has never been any suggestion that Amaral did anything untoward in the Maddie case. And his conclusions were shared by other senior officers.

    The PJ report and the AG's report come to distinctly different conclusions from those drawn by amaral - eg no evidence of any crime committed by the mccanns.

    amaral was sacked from the case for non professional conduct and subsequently convicted of corruption. i do think you have to have treat everything about him and his 'theories' with a great deal of caution.
  • penelopesimpsonpenelopesimpson Posts: 14,909
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    Metermaid wrote: »
    You are spot on. Have been told by a reliable source that she exhibits all the signs of a victim of domestic abuse.

    Oh, something else now.
  • Loz KernowLoz Kernow Posts: 2,185
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    Idacyder wrote: »
    What was particularly bad about the Panorama programme was the obvious zenophobia towards the Portuguese, editing Goncalo Amaral`s interview to show him negatively and obviously cutting out the bit about exactly why the investigation was sabotaged and by whom. The poor PJ didn`t stand a chance with all the media and political interference at that time. Google Joana Morais website to see the latest TV interview with Goncalo, which is in the process of being translated. Portugal have spent millions on this case and put in more man hours and expertise than on any other case. Yet we see our media constantly dissing them - its horrendous.

    Personally I would like to have seen/heard more from the interview with Amaral and less of Bilton strolling on the beach at PdL looking thoughtful. The Panorama programme was only 30 mins so why waste valuable air-time with footage that looked like his holiday video?

    I'd like to see a documentary that approaches the case without the assumption that an abduction took place - there's no evidence to support it - one that investigates other theories and reconstructs the Tapas Group timeline. Obviously it would require more than a mere 30 mins but surely Madeleine deserves it.

    I'm not going to hold my breath though.
  • FBIFBI Posts: 817
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    primer wrote: »
    in his report. no evidential or intelligence reliability can be made from the alerts unless confirmed by corroborating evidence.

    Correct. Nowhere does he say it is meaningless.

    He's now working for the FBI. Perhaps you should contact them to let them know how meaningless his work is?
  • FBIFBI Posts: 817
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    primer wrote: »
    The PJ report and the AG's report come to distinctly different conclusions from those drawn by amaral - eg no evidence of any crime committed by the mccanns.

    Not the PJ report - the prosecutors summary. It found no evidence of any crime - including abduction.
  • penelopesimpsonpenelopesimpson Posts: 14,909
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    Lastlaugh wrote: »
    She 'didn't own a toothbrush'?

    I've never heard that. Bloody hell.

    Are these posters serious or seriously deranged?
  • penelopesimpsonpenelopesimpson Posts: 14,909
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    academia wrote: »
    She could have been killed by a stranger in the apartment. Imagine it - someone gets in and scoops up Madeleine. How does he keep her quiet if she stirs? A hand over her face? A pillow? Clutch her to his chest? She suffocates. He takes the little girl's body away.perhas not even realising that she's dead. That would account for the dog alerts. It's as possible as the idea that her parents klled her - and probably more likely.

    Wow! A poster speaking common sense. Unbelievable.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    FBI wrote: »
    Correct. Nowhere does he say it is meaningless.

    He's now working for the FBI. Perhaps you should contact them to let them know how meaningless his work is?

    after you.

    because in my world, no evidential or intelligence reliability means exactly that. none.

    whereas you are claiming its 'ridiculous' not to see them as 'extremely significant'.
  • Loz KernowLoz Kernow Posts: 2,185
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    FBI wrote: »
    Not the PJ report - the prosecutors summary. It found no evidence of any crime - including abduction.

    Basically, the findings in the public prosecutor's archiving dispatch are inconclusive.

    He gives equal credibility to neglectful homicide, intended homicide, targeted abduction or opportunistic abduction.

    What it does say is that the McCanns "lost the possibility to prove... their innocence" due to their failure to take part in a reconstruction.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    FBI wrote: »
    Not the PJ report - the prosecutors summary. It found no evidence of any crime - including abduction.

    if by the 'prosecutors summary' you mean the attorney general's report then it specifically states there is no evidence of any crime committed by the mccanns.

    the PJ report concludes they cannot say what happened.

    neither of which support your claim that senior officers all supported amaral's theories.
  • MetermaidMetermaid Posts: 804
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    primer wrote: »
    how would you tell those 'signs' apart from any other trauma. such as having your child abducted and then finding yourself the object of unpleasant speculation on the internet.[/

    I'm not the expert, my reliable source is.
  • .Lauren..Lauren. Posts: 7,864
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    I have from day one found Kate Mc Canns body language to be subservient to Gerrys .When asked a question she looks to him first to check its okay to answer , he often interupts her answer and finishes her sentance .She sits with head to one side , eyes down and he looks straight ahead and a look that says "Dont mess with me "
    Just my opinion and not fact of course .

    I've always felt that about their relationship dynamic, that's not to say it means anything sinister though.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    Metermaid wrote: »
    I'm not the expert, my reliable source is.

    oh. right.

    lol.
  • IdacyderIdacyder Posts: 852
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    primer wrote: »
    The PJ report and the AG's report come to distinctly different conclusions from those drawn by amaral - eg no evidence of any crime committed by the mccanns.

    amaral was sacked from the case for non professional conduct and subsequently convicted of corruption. i do think you have to have treat everything about him and his 'theories' with a great deal of caution.

    I`m afraid to say you`ve got your facts totally wrong there, which obviously causes suspicion about all your other writings - Goncalo was not `sacked`, he was moved to another area because he complained about the interference from media - he has never been sacked - he left of his own accord and subsequently wrote the police case files in book form.
  • primerprimer Posts: 6,370
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    Idacyder wrote: »
    I`m afraid to say you`ve got your facts totally wrong there, which obviously causes suspicion about all your other writings - Goncalo was not `sacked`, he was moved to another area because he complained about the interference from media - he has never been sacked - he left of his own accord and subsequently wrote the police case files in book form.

    lol. according to several news sources he was sacked. according to himself he was moved sideways then resigned.

    however, i think we can both agree that he does have a criminal conviction. for corruption i believe, therefore i tend to treat most of what he says as highly suspect. :)
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