I'm just baffled that their main plot point was stolen, hook, line and sinker from The Usual Suspects ( a film made about 20 years ago) and some people claim that as 'genius' - where's the 'genius' in stealing somebody else's great idea? There was to me, I'm sorry to say, just too many loose ends, too many continuity errors, and too much style over substance for this to be anything more than art house students having a play at making a TV series.
No it wasn't. End of debate. Sorry Barrie, I don't want to joust with you any more!
Thanks Ch4 for a great series in glorious HD too, thanks to all the folks on this great thread too. Can't wait to see if another series materialises, surely? I also wonder why Becky never retrieved the drugs from the pond? Anyway...
What a brilliant show this was! I saw the billboard posters but never saw any trailers or read about it so I didn't know what to expect.I found some of the scenes in the early shows a bit hard to take and had to fast forward the torture and defenestration scenes.But every twist and turn and every sinister character were absolutely compelling,right til the very last scene.I was literally open mouthed when the final plan was revealed...sterilisation! And quite honestly,like Wilson,I would not know what to do in the situation.It really is a genuinely thought provoking scenario and I think that the world would be a better place with several billion people less.But that could be another thread on its own in the General discussion forum.
For the show itself though,just brilliant.Great mix of characters,both good and evil.I just loved Wilson Wilson's conspiracy theories and even read about the 'tsunami bomb'.Eye opening stuff indeed (no pun intended!).His was the most complex character,changing from reluctant anti-hero at the start into a potentially ultimate villain by the end.Jessica was one toughest female characters you could get,but she ended up being the big bad lady boss's bitch! Just great turnarounds,and so unexpected.I'm not usually a fan of younger characters and it took a while to warm to Grant,but he turned out to be very good with a really soft side.Which made it all the more shocking when he had to cut the guys throat.I always like Alice though,especially when she took an instant dislike to Grant and called him a ****.Absolutely hilarious! There doesn't seem to be much scope for an immediate sequel,but you could use the Grant and Alice characters somewhere down the line for a spin off of sorts.
Ian went from being a geek to a foul mouthed pistol packin' dude,and I always wanted to see Becky and Jessica have a fight.I'm sure she could give as good as she gets.I would like to be the referee for that one! I absolutely loved when would swear in that lovely Welsh accent,she made even the rudest words sound almost poetic! It's a shame she went out with a bit of a whimper,but then I'm more glad that she didn't throw herself in front of a train,which I was worried might happen.
Just an unbelievably gripping show from start to finish.Even at this early stage,I would be amazed if there is a better show than this at any time this year.
I really enjoyed the interaction between them in the final episode, having a go at eachother. Bet the pair of them loved doing those scenes!
I'm just baffled that their main plot point was stolen, hook, line and sinker from The Usual Suspects ( a film made about 20 years ago) and some people claim that as 'genius' - where's the 'genius' in stealing somebody else's great idea? There was to me, I'm sorry to say, just too many loose ends, too many continuity errors, and too much style over substance for this to be anything more than art house students having a play at making a TV series.
If you didn't like it, that's fine but to say the plot is from The Usual Suspects is just not true. I don't remember anything about bunch of people trying to untangle a secret organisation with a dark manifesto in TUS - that is the main plot. It had a character twist at the end, which is certainly not "the plot" and it's certainly not the first film to do that.
Series 1: The Network attempt to perform a test run of Janus on the UK. They fail to get the Utopia manuscript, but capture Jessica Hyde (Janus carrier) - Mr Rabbit's plan along.
Series 2: The Network release Janus worldwide and sterilize the planet using Jessica's blood. The gang fail to stop the Network, but save themselves from being sterilized. As a result, the gang become celebrities of sorts due to their ability to still reproduce.
Series 3: Set years in the future after the planet has been sterilized in a Children of Men-type scenario. The gang attempt to switch Janus off and destroy the Network once and for all.
The series will end with the establishment of a "Utopia" - thus bringing the title full circle.
I was wondering about this - I can't remember the last time I even started watching another British TV drama (Charlie Brooker's stuff aside)..after seeing The Wire and The Sopranos I thought anything homegrown would be so much worse that it wasn't even worth trying. I could be wrong though. I'm glad the trailers for Utopia were interesting enough to draw me in and I'm so glad I didn't miss such great TV.
I'd be interested in getting some recommendation for some more quality drama series - I have a list of US stuff such as Boardwalk Empire and Breaking Bad to see at some stage and I guess I should give the Scandinavian stuff like The Killing and Borgen a go. Maybe people can advise on anything that's out there that manages to even come close to how good Utopia was to give us all some more good stuff to seek out.
As a starter, anyone who has seen the Sopranos but not caught Lillyhammer, it's worth checking out. Much lighter in tone but enjoyable none-the-less.
Yep, I'm the same. I haven't watched many UK TV shows at all over the years - they just seem to lack that quality edge. All my favourites shows are from the US.
The only homegrown show that I liked before Utopia was Spooks - thought that was a great show at its peak and certainly was the UK's answer to 24. I also like Black Mirror - a very cool concept from Charlie Brooker.
Can't think of anything else . I suppose Misfits is pretty decent, but it doesn't really have a killer storyline to draw you in like Utopia. The plotlines tend to be quite small scale and unambitious, but they are well told for the most part I guess.
On the other hand, Outcasts and Survivors (remake) had potential to be great series, but they were both terribly executed. I'm a sucker for post-apocalyptic stories, so I was disappointed. I hate seeing good ideas being badly handled by writers.
As for recommendations, I've watched all the top US TV shows over the last decade, so you probably already know about them from the sounds of it. Love The Wire and Breaking Bad :cool:.
I've said this before but the bit where Arby rams his car into the other car outside the institution before shooting the Network people dead ('Have you got your seatbelt on?'). The camerawork was exhilarating.
The ending. Everything about it.
When they all went to see that Lane guy, Grant was given the shotgun by Becky & told to shoot him if he moves and Grant goes, 'F***ing yes!' Made me laugh out loud.
When Dugdale killed Anya, I shouted like a madwoman.
And yes, it was a shame they got rid of Lee so soon.
Haha nice . Good choices :cool:.
The BIB: I loved that scene too!
It was certainly a very amusing moment, but the thing that made it more amusing for me was that you couldn't imagine kids saying on the BBC or ITV or any of those mainstream US TV networks. The kids always tend to be so polite, so, innocent, so naive and annoying on US TV shows. But Grant was the total opposite . Best child character in YEARS in my humble opinion :cool:.
If you didn't like it, that's fine but to say the plot is from The Usual Suspects is just not true. I don't remember anything about bunch of people trying to untangle a secret organisation with a dark manifesto in TUS - that is the main plot. It had a character twist at the end, which is certainly not "the plot" and it's certainly not the first film to do that.
The BIB: I loved that scene too!
It was certainly a very amusing moment, but the thing that made it more amusing for me was that you couldn't imagine kids saying on the BBC or ITV or any of those mainstream US TV networks. The kids always tend to be so polite, so, innocent, so naive and annoying on US TV shows. But Grant was the total opposite . Best child character in YEARS in my humble opinion :cool:.
I thought that Sally Draper in Mad Men was quite entertaining, she didn't fit in with the usual portrayal of kids in American drama. She wasn't what her parents wanted her to be a lot of the time, either! Driving with Grandpa Gene was hilarious Although I haven't seen the last few series, she might be boring now.
I loved Grant's scenes with Jessica, although his banter with the poo-handed man in his scenes in Ep1 were cooking on classical gas
Well if Wilson is the one who sourced the photo (which he was), there's your answer-he wouldn't have told the group as he's on The Network's side!
The editing implied they had all looked at the group photo, but I guess that could explain it. It still detracted from the reveal for me at the time though.
I'm also curious as to where they could go in season 2, because Janus being in Jessica doesn't really change that much. The grand stelisation plan is still happening, albeit with a different leader, so what now? The same group of people try to stop it, again?
A better ending would have been for the sterlisation to have definitely started - it would have worked as either a cliffhanger or a depressing final note if there isn't another series. The current ending felt more appropriate for a penultimate episode leading into a finale, not a finale.
The final scene with Milner and Jessica reminded me of the end of a lot of novels, tbf. It was a "they won" ending. We don't really need to know the grizzly details of Jessica's torture.
That said...there's plenty of strands that are plausible for a second and even third season. There are loads of ideas in this thread for a start (Arby busting out Jessica and Milner being the mother of both of them being my personal favourite).
As for Wilson-sure, but if he turns up in Series 2-bearing in mind that only Jessica knows how he's betrayed them-he's potentially the most enigmatic character of all. He could end up working for Milner as a plant to help bring them in. All of our gang characters are after all now experienced kick-asses, heh heh-I loved the irony of Ian of all people giving Donaldson his gun instructions for the raid on the warehouse.
If you didn't like it, that's fine but to say the plot is from The Usual Suspects is just not true. I don't remember anything about bunch of people trying to untangle a secret organisation with a dark manifesto in TUS - that is the main plot. It had a character twist at the end, which is certainly not "the plot" and it's certainly not the first film to do that.
Yes sorry, the main twist is what I meant, (my brain wasn't working properly when I wrote that) and for anyone not to agree that that was stolen 'hook line and sinker' means that they haven't seen the Usual Suspects. Having said that it was a great final episode, although with one too many twists really, but I just wonder what they intend to do with Jessica now.
It was pretty obvious that she and Arby were brother and sister though wasn't it?
So many unanswered questions.....is the blonde MI5 agent really Mr Rabbit? And what was Becky's role in all of this ie sneaking off to make phone calls...
Not really clear of the point of the Anya twist other than being a twist for it's own sake. Her presence was dependant on Dugdale's wife which the network couldn't have predicted.
Were Jessica and Arby really siblings? Did Arby know this or just believe it? Was Carver just a 'father figure' to him?
So many unanswered questions.....is the blonde MI5 agent really Mr Rabbit? And what was Becky's role in all of this ie sneaking off to make phone calls...
Becky was just working for Donaldson in return for the pills to help her with Deels (sp). I don't think she really appreciated what she had involved herself in.
Becky was just working for Donaldson in return for the pills to help her with Deels (sp). I don't think she really appreciated what she had involved herself in.
Can anyone explain why, if Jessica was the target all along, Milner didn't just send in a team to pick her up straight away? The Stephen Rea character said the country house was under observation and they were just hanging back to let them find the manuscript for them. Now we know they didn't really care about the manuscript it begs the question why not just go in straight away.
Also didn't Milner have at least one face to face with Jessica (at the church I think)? Just take her in then. Makes no sense to me.
Jessica wasn't at the church, she'd already split with Grant.
She wasn't staying at the house either - she did drop in there a couple of times granted (I guess we assume she'd made sure it was safe to do so each time) but remember she's been on the run from them all her life without being captured so she wouldn't have stayed there like a sitting duck.
All of our gang characters are after all now experienced kick-asses, heh heh-I loved the irony of Ian of all people giving Donaldson his gun instructions for the raid on the warehouse.
The bit in the car with Grant and Jessica and they're listening to Yellow - Coldplay and Grant say's "You like some shit music." and Jessica looks genuinely interested/perplexed for the first time and says "Is this shit?"
There was lots of YELLOW in Utopia but not in jessica's car. It was Beautiful World by Coldplay
Comments
No it wasn't. End of debate. Sorry Barrie, I don't want to joust with you any more!
Well if Wilson is the one who sourced the photo (which he was), there's your answer-he wouldn't have told the group as he's on The Network's side!
I really enjoyed the interaction between them in the final episode, having a go at eachother. Bet the pair of them loved doing those scenes!
I'm not convinced Milner is Mr Rabbit if indeed a Mr Rabbit exists at all.
Milner could just be the current head of project.
Here a thought, Series Two, twenty years later, whole world 98% sterile, now fight back and find the key to turn Janus off.
If you didn't like it, that's fine but to say the plot is from The Usual Suspects is just not true. I don't remember anything about bunch of people trying to untangle a secret organisation with a dark manifesto in TUS - that is the main plot. It had a character twist at the end, which is certainly not "the plot" and it's certainly not the first film to do that.
Series 1: The Network attempt to perform a test run of Janus on the UK. They fail to get the Utopia manuscript, but capture Jessica Hyde (Janus carrier) - Mr Rabbit's plan along.
Series 2: The Network release Janus worldwide and sterilize the planet using Jessica's blood. The gang fail to stop the Network, but save themselves from being sterilized. As a result, the gang become celebrities of sorts due to their ability to still reproduce.
Series 3: Set years in the future after the planet has been sterilized in a Children of Men-type scenario. The gang attempt to switch Janus off and destroy the Network once and for all.
The series will end with the establishment of a "Utopia" - thus bringing the title full circle.
Yep, I'm the same. I haven't watched many UK TV shows at all over the years - they just seem to lack that quality edge. All my favourites shows are from the US.
The only homegrown show that I liked before Utopia was Spooks - thought that was a great show at its peak and certainly was the UK's answer to 24. I also like Black Mirror - a very cool concept from Charlie Brooker.
Can't think of anything else
On the other hand, Outcasts and Survivors (remake) had potential to be great series, but they were both terribly executed. I'm a sucker for post-apocalyptic stories, so I was disappointed. I hate seeing good ideas being badly handled by writers.
As for recommendations, I've watched all the top US TV shows over the last decade, so you probably already know about them from the sounds of it. Love The Wire and Breaking Bad :cool:.
Haha nice
The BIB: I loved that scene too!
It was certainly a very amusing moment, but the thing that made it more amusing for me was that you couldn't imagine kids saying on the BBC or ITV or any of those mainstream US TV networks. The kids always tend to be so polite, so, innocent, so naive and annoying on US TV shows. But Grant was the total opposite
Quoted for truth. Well said, pingu. :cool:
I thought that Sally Draper in Mad Men was quite entertaining, she didn't fit in with the usual portrayal of kids in American drama. She wasn't what her parents wanted her to be a lot of the time, either! Driving with Grandpa Gene was hilarious
I loved Grant's scenes with Jessica, although his banter with the poo-handed man in his scenes in Ep1 were cooking on classical gas
The editing implied they had all looked at the group photo, but I guess that could explain it. It still detracted from the reveal for me at the time though.
I'm also curious as to where they could go in season 2, because Janus being in Jessica doesn't really change that much. The grand stelisation plan is still happening, albeit with a different leader, so what now? The same group of people try to stop it, again?
A better ending would have been for the sterlisation to have definitely started - it would have worked as either a cliffhanger or a depressing final note if there isn't another series. The current ending felt more appropriate for a penultimate episode leading into a finale, not a finale.
That said...there's plenty of strands that are plausible for a second and even third season. There are loads of ideas in this thread for a start (Arby busting out Jessica and Milner being the mother of both of them being my personal favourite).
As for Wilson-sure, but if he turns up in Series 2-bearing in mind that only Jessica knows how he's betrayed them-he's potentially the most enigmatic character of all. He could end up working for Milner as a plant to help bring them in. All of our gang characters are after all now experienced kick-asses, heh heh-I loved the irony of Ian of all people giving Donaldson his gun instructions for the raid on the warehouse.
Yes sorry, the main twist is what I meant, (my brain wasn't working properly when I wrote that) and for anyone not to agree that that was stolen 'hook line and sinker' means that they haven't seen the Usual Suspects. Having said that it was a great final episode, although with one too many twists really, but I just wonder what they intend to do with Jessica now.
It was pretty obvious that she and Arby were brother and sister though wasn't it?
Were Jessica and Arby really siblings? Did Arby know this or just believe it? Was Carver just a 'father figure' to him?
Good point
Also didn't Milner have at least one face to face with Jessica (at the church I think)? Just take her in then. Makes no sense to me.
I guess that would make her Jessica Rabbit!
She wasn't staying at the house either - she did drop in there a couple of times granted (I guess we assume she'd made sure it was safe to do so each time) but remember she's been on the run from them all her life without being captured so she wouldn't have stayed there like a sitting duck.
And, of course, you meant Dugdale
There was lots of YELLOW in Utopia but not in jessica's car. It was Beautiful World by Coldplay
Aaahh - tis wonderful what a little editing can do :cool: