Not one of you can address the woman moving the piles of yes's into the no's on camera.
thought as much.
It's on a loop and she was obviously sorting. Interesting that nothing is shown after that. Dishonest and manipulative I would say. People in glass houses ........
there is the case of Hamilton polling station that told voters to leave the votes on top of the box claiming the box was full. Even I know thats illegal to do, they should have suspended the vote until a new box was brought in then continued the vote.
They should never have told voters to leave them on top as you never know if they were placed in the new box or not.
you cannot deny that was not legal.
as for the yes votes on a no table, yes its open to argument but they should have placed them on a table that said unsorted or removed the no label from the table. that way it reduces fraud allegations.
Care to provide a reputable link to, or corroboration of, this so called "case".
Not one of you can address the woman moving the piles of yes's into the no's on camera.
thought as much.
This is a freestanding clip lacking any context, therefore it is not evidence of vote rigging. I do wish people would focus on what is important at the moment: bringing the people of Scotland together again and repairing the divide. Instead people are fixating on sharing clips (most of which have been proven to have innocent explanations) that show 'fraud', and belittling those that voted no. Scotland should be uniting, not dividing more. The referendum was what Yes voters wanted, they need to recognise that democracy did not play in their favour and move on. There will be another referendum one day. For now, we should be trying to regain some semblance of normality.
Even more evidence now, although most people would see it as unverified vague assertions and claims made by random people on social media, also unverified. The amount of Yes people willing to countenance widespread vote rigging based on some short video clips given without context and heavily edited coupled with claims on social media is getting to sad levels of desperation.
Care to provide a reputable link to, or corroboration of, this so called "case".
That was a rumour going round twitter on Thursday. Of course no-one corroborated it but it is now a truth that must be repeated until it is passed off as fact.
As a firm Yes voter and a presiding officer in the election I am quite happy with how the election day was run and how the count went.
Remember, it is usually the same bunch of folks who work elections, mainly a pool of current and former public sector workers.
These are the same people that ran and counted the SNP win at the last Scottish election.
And there are plenty of observers from both sides and no one suggested anything untoward. Certainly nothing that would indicate a revote or recount.
Exactly, the counters gain nothing from rigging the election and there have been no prior accusations of this type ever before. Accusations over postal voting has been rife, mainly because its quite easy to fiddle at the voters end. But no-one has made accusations of widespread rigging during the count at UK elections for so long I can't think of it. Well, no-one who made any sense has. These accusations are just from a minority of bitter Yessers, but its quite disturbing they have 86k of signatures.
Exactly, the counters gain nothing from rigging the election and there have been no prior accusations of this type ever before. Accusations over postal voting has been rife, mainly because its quite easy to fiddle at the voters end. But no-one has made accusations of widespread rigging during the count at UK elections for so long I can't think of it. Well, no-one who made any sense has. These accusations are just from a minority of bitter Yessers, but its quite disturbing they have 86k of signatures.
Initial disappointment coupled with some unfortunate footage of votes on a table that had a hand written No sign on it.
Which no doubt had been there since the room was set up and totally ignored by counting staff as they sought somewhere to count the votes.
People need to focus on the next vote whenever that may be.
As for the pencil conspiracists - a few reasons why pencil is used
1) it lasts longer than pen ink. remember these ballots are stored for years.
2) Pencil doesn't leak and spoil your and potentially others ballot papers.
3) Pencil doesn't run dry. Would hate to think how many spoiled papers you would generate with people scraping their ballot with a dodgy pen.
Your obviously in the pay of MI5 mate, trying to spread the truth like this.
I have been reading the comments at WOS since Thursday and a lot of the posters there are convinced that the vote was rigged.
The postal vote was tampered with and over six thousand votes per council were shuffled from Yes to No.
Is there any chance they are Right? How easy is it to stuff ballot boxes to change the vote?
It's generally best to assume that if WOS think it, it's not true. I'm convinced it's run by someone with shares in tin-foil.
I have limited knowledge of the postal vote bit, except a few basics. The easiest way to "tamper" the postal votes would be when they are at people's homes. I'd say they are more vulnerable to fraud, where a dominating parent forces their children to vote in front of them. Hopefully that sort of thing evens itself out for this kind of vote.
It's next to impossible to 'stuff the ballot boxes to change the vote'. They are empty before 7am, and the polling staff all witness the seals going on, and independent observers, or representatives of each side are entitled to be present. At the end of the night, a further (numbered) seal goes on, and again, representatives of each side are entitled to be present and add their own seal. That's very rare, but they have the opportunity.
The boxes are then transported to the counting place. It is theoretically possible that the staff doing the transporting might manage to pull over in a side street for a few minutes, break the seals and add extra votes, then put another seal on, with a matching number. They'd also have to go in and edit the paperwork that's sealed in another envelop, so no-one gets suspicious at the extra 200 votes which would take that polling station to 110% voter turn-out, without it looking like it was written by a different person etc.
I know the crash on the A9 was considered suspicious. I dare say in that time the drivers conveying the votes would have had a bit more time, but who really thinks MI5 is going to stage a crash like that?
Comments
It's on a loop and she was obviously sorting. Interesting that nothing is shown after that. Dishonest and manipulative I would say. People in glass houses ........
Care to provide a reputable link to, or corroboration of, this so called "case".
This is a freestanding clip lacking any context, therefore it is not evidence of vote rigging. I do wish people would focus on what is important at the moment: bringing the people of Scotland together again and repairing the divide. Instead people are fixating on sharing clips (most of which have been proven to have innocent explanations) that show 'fraud', and belittling those that voted no. Scotland should be uniting, not dividing more. The referendum was what Yes voters wanted, they need to recognise that democracy did not play in their favour and move on. There will be another referendum one day. For now, we should be trying to regain some semblance of normality.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11110426/Scottish-referendum-A-useful-lesson-in-the-limits-of-fiery-activism.html
That was a rumour going round twitter on Thursday. Of course no-one corroborated it but it is now a truth that must be repeated until it is passed off as fact.
https://www.change.org/p/alex-salmon...tional-parties
ooooh conspiracy - it was earlier this morning.
"Well this is embarrassing…
We couldn't find the page you were looking for."
*titter*
Remember, it is usually the same bunch of folks who work elections, mainly a pool of current and former public sector workers.
These are the same people that ran and counted the SNP win at the last Scottish election.
And there are plenty of observers from both sides and no one suggested anything untoward. Certainly nothing that would indicate a revote or recount.
Shut down by da Feds...
No sane person would ever think that the Scottish count was anything other than honest & above board
Exactly, the counters gain nothing from rigging the election and there have been no prior accusations of this type ever before. Accusations over postal voting has been rife, mainly because its quite easy to fiddle at the voters end. But no-one has made accusations of widespread rigging during the count at UK elections for so long I can't think of it. Well, no-one who made any sense has. These accusations are just from a minority of bitter Yessers, but its quite disturbing they have 86k of signatures.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-29294087
No doubt the tinfoil hat brigade will now claim that's all the proof they need to confirm it was fixed
Indeed and so the number of people involved in the conspiracy grows by one, as it always does when someone doesn't agree with them.
Initial disappointment coupled with some unfortunate footage of votes on a table that had a hand written No sign on it.
Which no doubt had been there since the room was set up and totally ignored by counting staff as they sought somewhere to count the votes.
People need to focus on the next vote whenever that may be.
As for the pencil conspiracists - a few reasons why pencil is used
1) it lasts longer than pen ink. remember these ballots are stored for years.
2) Pencil doesn't leak and spoil your and potentially others ballot papers.
3) Pencil doesn't run dry. Would hate to think how many spoiled papers you would generate with people scraping their ballot with a dodgy pen.
Just wait for the next vote.
I may have grey hair then and DS may no longer exist but I'll seek you out for a right good harangue!
I look forward to it
Your obviously in the pay of MI5 mate, trying to spread the truth like this.
I have been reading the comments at WOS since Thursday and a lot of the posters there are convinced that the vote was rigged.
The postal vote was tampered with and over six thousand votes per council were shuffled from Yes to No.
Is there any chance they are Right? How easy is it to stuff ballot boxes to change the vote?
It's generally best to assume that if WOS think it, it's not true. I'm convinced it's run by someone with shares in tin-foil.
I have limited knowledge of the postal vote bit, except a few basics. The easiest way to "tamper" the postal votes would be when they are at people's homes. I'd say they are more vulnerable to fraud, where a dominating parent forces their children to vote in front of them. Hopefully that sort of thing evens itself out for this kind of vote.
It's next to impossible to 'stuff the ballot boxes to change the vote'. They are empty before 7am, and the polling staff all witness the seals going on, and independent observers, or representatives of each side are entitled to be present. At the end of the night, a further (numbered) seal goes on, and again, representatives of each side are entitled to be present and add their own seal. That's very rare, but they have the opportunity.
The boxes are then transported to the counting place. It is theoretically possible that the staff doing the transporting might manage to pull over in a side street for a few minutes, break the seals and add extra votes, then put another seal on, with a matching number. They'd also have to go in and edit the paperwork that's sealed in another envelop, so no-one gets suspicious at the extra 200 votes which would take that polling station to 110% voter turn-out, without it looking like it was written by a different person etc.
I know the crash on the A9 was considered suspicious. I dare say in that time the drivers conveying the votes would have had a bit more time, but who really thinks MI5 is going to stage a crash like that?
http://scottishreferedum.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/polling-day-18th-sept-2014-vote-rigging.html?m=1