If so, that's an awful lot of 'faulty' sets Samsung and Toshiba are gonna have to fix! I'm not quite sure I see it that way but accept your appraisal - whoever is at fault it's a ridiculous situation and needs a hasty fix; this is unacceptable.
If so, that's an awful lot of 'faulty' sets Samsung and Toshiba are gonna have to fix! I'm not quite sure I see it that way but accept your appraisal - whoever is at fault it's a ridiculous situation and needs a hasty fix; this is unacceptable.
If it were the broadcast chain at fault then it would likely affect every single DVB-T2 receiver, be that in a TV set a PVR or whatever other device you care to mention. The fact that it only appears to affect a subset of Samsung and Toshiba models points more to a fault of some sort in those specific TVs.
Otherwise we would be seeing reports from a much broader spectrum of makes and models. The manufacturers could have avoided all of this had they ensured their receivers complied with the published specs for DVB-T2 broadcasts fully. Can't be that difficult as it seems makes like LG, Sony and Panasonic and even the cheap Turkish and Chinese Supermarket own brand kit seems to be able to cope.
Since these issues started I've been having issues with audio break-up (splat-type noises, primarily in the right-hand channel) on my Sony TV. I've reported this to the BBC, and the guy that I was talking to told me that the BBC has had reports of issues from owners of all makes of TV. The BBC is asking for details as they don't have a clear idea as what's going on, at least they didn't when I talked to them last week.
Something in the data stream is causing affected systems to mis-handle the audio, hence the various issues being reported. My guess, based on previous experience of things like this, is that a firmware update should fix the issue. That assumes of course that the BBC et al don't find the issue, but if they do then the problem may just well go away. The trouble is, this type of problem takes time to investigate and resolve, one way or the other.
Another factor not mentioned is that the specification may not be bullet-proof. There could be an ambiguity or some loop-hole such that the manufacturers have complied with the specification correctly, but is interpreted differently at the BBC.
Another factor not mentioned is that the specification may not be bullet-proof. There could be an ambiguity or some loop-hole such that the manufacturers have complied with the specification correctly, but is interpreted differently at the BBC.
Yes, the FreeviewHD spec. has always seemed 'fluid', and there has been a litany of issues ever since the broadcasts started. That specifications are open to interpretation is bad news for consumers, as we're seeing here again. Contrast that with Freesat, which seems to have been rock steady since its launch.
I Emailed Samsung yesterday evening using the customer reference number I was given 2 weeks ago. I asked;
What have you learned about the cause of this fault in the last 2 weeks?
Just had their reply;
This is to acknowledge that I have received your email about your television. I tried to contact you on the phone number provided, but what I've got is busy tone.
In regard to your concern, we are aware of an issue affecting certain Samsung TV models from 2012. When viewing Freeview HD
channels, the customer may experience a sudden loss of sound on the unit. Please be informed that we are working closely with the broadcasters to find the root cause of the issue and as soon as we get updates on this, we'll let you know’.
I have 3 reactions.
1. They really do struggle with 'phone numbers.
2. No attempt to actually answer the question, we are in 'holding pattern' regarding a diagnosis. They did acknowledge the nature of the fault however (albeit without reference to the BBC or a specific Mux), which is more than I got last time.
3. I bought the TV in April 2013 so assume they mean it is from the 2012 model year.
We believe we have identified the problem which is causing sound issues on certain televisions, when tuned into services on the BBC’s HD multiplex. While we believe our broadcasts are compliant with the relevant international specifications, we think we can make some changes that will help the affected televisions. The change will need testing before a roll-out can begin and we will update this page when we have more details.
We continue to work closely with the device manufacturers on the underlying problem.
Thank you for bearing with us and we are sorry for any inconvenience
About time too. Samsung reckon end of April. BBC say the number of affected receivers isn't much over 100 but I suspect it's considerably more. My main bone of contention remains; they haven't issued any kind of public statement and that's not fair for the vast majority of affected viewers who'll have spent money trying to get their 'broken' TVs fixed. The whole thing is totally Mickey Mouse.
Yeah that is about time, can forget about me saying it looks to be fixed here, was fine all day, until the BBC News@ 10pm, where it started dropping again, and has carried on dropping all the time again.
About time too. Samsung reckon end of April. BBC say the number of affected receivers isn't much over 100 but I suspect it's considerably more. My main bone of contention remains; they haven't issued any kind of public statement and that's not fair for the vast majority of affected viewers who'll have spent money trying to get their 'broken' TVs fixed. The whole thing is totally Mickey Mouse.
So what do you expect that a mux operator transmitting to the d book ( which as a specification restricts the range of the DVB standard to a uk profile) to do .....?
Or do you think it is digital uk or DTG ...
My feeling is that it is a set manufacturers duty to inform their dealers etc and the mending industry ( if it exists) that they have a problem.
Btw there was not a single tv set sold since about 1985 that could decide any teletext to the standard ETS300-706 .......
So what do you expect that a mux operator transmitting to the d book ( which as a specification restricts the range of the DVB standard to a uk profile) to do .....?
Or do you think it is digital uk or DTG ...
My feeling is that it is a set manufacturers duty to inform their dealers etc and the mending industry ( if it exists) that they have a problem.
Btw there was not a single tv set sold since about 1985 that could decide any teletext to the standard ETS300-706 .......
I'd like an altogether greater level of professionalism and liaison between everyone involved so the job gets done properly for everyone and a standard system implementing whereby should there be a similar situation information is readily available from all parties involved. Its called 'Doing your job properly'!
I'd like an altogether greater level of professionalism and liaison between everyone involved so the job gets done properly for everyone and a standard system implementing whereby should there be a similar situation information is readily available from all parties involved. Its called 'Doing your job properly'!
I'm certain that the BBC ATOS etc are proving the reciver industry with a great deal of assistance and that BBC FTA ltd is keeping us customers informed as well as DTG , DTG testing and digital uk
I would expect that the receiver industry to tell its customer what is going on as it is only them that can decliner the solution.
This IS the standard system....
We believe we have identified the problem which is causing sound issues on certain televisions, when tuned into services on the BBC’s HD multiplex. While we believe our broadcasts are compliant with the relevant international specifications, we think we can make some changes that will help the affected televisions. The change will need testing before a roll-out can begin and we will update this page when we have more details.
We continue to work closely with the device manufacturers on the underlying problem.
Thank you for bearing with us and we are sorry for any inconvenience
I like the word help, it should say fix the problem, if this rollout doesn't fix the problem then i'll be onto my manufacturer and demanding a new tv as this one ain't fit for consumer purpose when bought 4 years ago, it is still under warranty until 2018
Manufacturers must sell new product all the time or they have no revenue. To do so they push 'enhanced' features.
TV's (digital) are now data processing devices, required to support multiple protocols.
Building reliable computer systems is well understood, you keep your code as small as possible and change it as seldom as possible. The opposite to what the market demands.
if this rollout doesn't fix the problem then i'll be onto my manufacturer and demanding a new tv as this one ain't fit for consumer purpose when bought 4 years ago, it is still under warranty until 2018
I have just had the sound drop out 3 times in about 5 mins. This was on BBC2 HD on Bake Off Crème da la Crème. The sound dropped out everytime they showed a graphic/drawing of the upcoming recipe. Has anyone else noticed a pattern in the drop outs?
I did call John Lewis about this and they sent out an engineer, who unfortunately knew about the problem. I was hoping for a new tv:)
I have just had the sound drop out 3 times in about 5 mins. This was on BBC2 HD on Bake Off Crème da la Crème. The sound dropped out everytime they showed a graphic/drawing of the upcoming recipe. Has anyone else noticed a pattern in the drop outs?
Interesting - I've noticed the dropouts are particularly frequent on news programmes where there are lots of graphics e.g. 10 o'clock News/News at Ten on BBC1/ITV1 HD.
Just a thought. If people are noticing this when static graphics appear on screen, it could maybe be linked to when the video stream dynamically switches between 1080i50 and 1080p25.
Don't know what's suddenly changed with the workings of that though in the last couple of months!
Comments
If it were the broadcast chain at fault then it would likely affect every single DVB-T2 receiver, be that in a TV set a PVR or whatever other device you care to mention. The fact that it only appears to affect a subset of Samsung and Toshiba models points more to a fault of some sort in those specific TVs.
Otherwise we would be seeing reports from a much broader spectrum of makes and models. The manufacturers could have avoided all of this had they ensured their receivers complied with the published specs for DVB-T2 broadcasts fully. Can't be that difficult as it seems makes like LG, Sony and Panasonic and even the cheap Turkish and Chinese Supermarket own brand kit seems to be able to cope.
Something in the data stream is causing affected systems to mis-handle the audio, hence the various issues being reported. My guess, based on previous experience of things like this, is that a firmware update should fix the issue. That assumes of course that the BBC et al don't find the issue, but if they do then the problem may just well go away. The trouble is, this type of problem takes time to investigate and resolve, one way or the other.
Clem
Yes, the FreeviewHD spec. has always seemed 'fluid', and there has been a litany of issues ever since the broadcasts started. That specifications are open to interpretation is bad news for consumers, as we're seeing here again. Contrast that with Freesat, which seems to have been rock steady since its launch.
Clem
What have you learned about the cause of this fault in the last 2 weeks?
Just had their reply;
This is to acknowledge that I have received your email about your television. I tried to contact you on the phone number provided, but what I've got is busy tone.
In regard to your concern, we are aware of an issue affecting certain Samsung TV models from 2012. When viewing Freeview HD
channels, the customer may experience a sudden loss of sound on the unit. Please be informed that we are working closely with the broadcasters to find the root cause of the issue and as soon as we get updates on this, we'll let you know’.
I have 3 reactions.
1. They really do struggle with 'phone numbers.
2. No attempt to actually answer the question, we are in 'holding pattern' regarding a diagnosis. They did acknowledge the nature of the fault however (albeit without reference to the BBC or a specific Mux), which is more than I got last time.
3. I bought the TV in April 2013 so assume they mean it is from the 2012 model year.
Sound issues on Freeview HD services
We believe we have identified the problem which is causing sound issues on certain televisions, when tuned into services on the BBC’s HD multiplex. While we believe our broadcasts are compliant with the relevant international specifications, we think we can make some changes that will help the affected televisions. The change will need testing before a roll-out can begin and we will update this page when we have more details.
We continue to work closely with the device manufacturers on the underlying problem.
Thank you for bearing with us and we are sorry for any inconvenience
So what do you expect that a mux operator transmitting to the d book ( which as a specification restricts the range of the DVB standard to a uk profile) to do .....?
Or do you think it is digital uk or DTG ...
My feeling is that it is a set manufacturers duty to inform their dealers etc and the mending industry ( if it exists) that they have a problem.
Btw there was not a single tv set sold since about 1985 that could decide any teletext to the standard ETS300-706 .......
I would expect that the receiver industry to tell its customer what is going on as it is only them that can decliner the solution.
This IS the standard system....
I feel like throwing the TV out the window.
I like the word help, it should say fix the problem, if this rollout doesn't fix the problem then i'll be onto my manufacturer and demanding a new tv as this one ain't fit for consumer purpose when bought 4 years ago, it is still under warranty until 2018
Clem
TV's (digital) are now data processing devices, required to support multiple protocols.
Building reliable computer systems is well understood, you keep your code as small as possible and change it as seldom as possible. The opposite to what the market demands.
Instability guaranteed.
I did call John Lewis about this and they sent out an engineer, who unfortunately knew about the problem. I was hoping for a new tv:)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/reception/news/item91
Edit: sorry, just seen that's already been posted at #83.
Don't know what's suddenly changed with the workings of that though in the last couple of months!