Dredd (2012)

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  • NinjyBearNinjyBear Posts: 8,317
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    Are you done now?
  • floopy123floopy123 Posts: 6,003
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    I get paid by the post! :D:D
  • zwixxxzwixxx Posts: 10,295
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    But does the film work as an easy introduction to the Dredd Universe which (when successful) can be followed by a movie that makes better use of all that Dredd-History. Simple story THIS time, bring out the Judge Death and others next time. ?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,305
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    Saw it earlier and really liked it. I didn't find the confined location to be a problem at all because the interior of the building was fairly varied and the visuals were striking enough to keep you interested visually. For the record, i thought the script was fine...cliched, yes, but it didn't stop it being enjoyable, and lets face it, what action movie isn't fairly cliched and takes inspiration from prior films these days. I thought it was a good attempt at a Judge Dredd film and infinitely better than the 1995 film (which this film has finally erased from my memory), and yes Zwixxx, in my opinion it works as a small-ish scale introduction to the character and world. Hopefully with an increased budget the sequel (if this makes enough) could be something special. The 18 rating (R in the US) might prevent it from being a big success though, but i'd take a low-mid level budget Dredd film over a mega budget PG-13 rated version any day.

    The native 3D was pretty good too, especially in the "Slo-Mo" scenes, so if you've got the option i'd say go for the 3D version (unless you're name is Mark Kermode, in which case you can just f*ck off and cling to the past...i really don't get why anyone would pay attention to that self important arsehole. As you can tell, i'm not a fan, lol).

    Anyway, back to the film, i'd say an 8/10 from me.
  • floopy123floopy123 Posts: 6,003
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    I don’t consider this film to be better than the Stallone one. Hand on heart, that’s my honest opinion. The plot is worse! There isn’t much plot in the first place! Sure, the plot of the first film was a mess but it tried to do something with JD’s world. Garland does nothing other than stick Dredd and Anderson in a block. The slo-mo has no bearing on the plot. For example, if you have Anderson say

    “Peach Trees is the base for all the slo-mo production and distrubution in the city”

    …but don’t show Ma-Ma and her gang spreading it around city or sector, it becomes a bit meaningless. The slo-mo doesn’t seem a threat to the city, there’s no mention about its side-effects. We’re not even told why Judge Dredd is concerned about slo-mo. The slow-mo exists to do a few slow motion scenes but it doesn’t provide a compelling ‘Mcguffin’.

    “In fiction, a MacGuffin (sometimes McGuffin or maguffin) is a plot device in the form of some goal, desired object, or other motivator that the protagonist (and sometimes the antagonist) is willing to do and sacrifice almost anything to pursue, often with little or no narrative explanation as to why it is considered so desirable.”

    Had slo-mo made the cits insane it would have made the story a bit more exciting but Garland couldn’t come up with any reason why slo-mo is so bad for the citizens. Slo-mo isn’t a compelling element of the story. It’s funny to think this film is trying to create a gritty, nasty vision of Judge Dredd’s world but the drug it showcases seems tame. Smoking a cigarette seems a lot more dangerous and anti-social than slo-mo!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,305
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    floopy123 wrote: »
    The slo-mo has no bearing on the plot. For example, if you have Anderson say

    “Peach Trees is the base for all the slo-mo production and distrubution in the city”

    …but don’t show Ma-Ma and her gang spreading it around city or sector, it becomes a bit meaningless.

    You obviously weren't paying close enough attention then because at one point Ma Ma is discussing expanding their Slo-Mo distribution empire into the other sectors. We don't need to actually see her gang distributing it, they clearly show numerous people using it so it's obviously getting distributed.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 356
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    But Slo-mo did have it's side effects, right at the start, the effects caused dangerous and erratic driving and gave rise to the short (or long?) chase sequence. Did you arrive late? There would be no reference to long term effects as it was a new drug.

    As to the Stallone film. Oh drokk me no. It has more plot holes than Peach Trees block has bullet holes. Don't get me started on that City Wall tunnel sequence or the clone lab that blows up for no reason. Stallone without helmet, uniform, city and character is not Dredd.

    There is a better Dredd film to be made, certainly, but this new one was a hugely entertaining film and definitely the best Dredd seen to date.

    There is no way any single film of Dredd could reflect the entire 35+ years history of the character but neither does any one story featured within 2000AD.
  • floopy123floopy123 Posts: 6,003
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    I need to repost this as one of my spoilers was revealed! Oops.
  • floopy123floopy123 Posts: 6,003
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    Let's try again!

    MAJOR SPOILERS SO PLEASE DO NOT READ THE HIDDEN SECTIONS IF YOU'VE NOT SEEN THE FILM!

    The action scenes felt disappointing. The one with the huge gun was great but the rest were, quite frankly, poor. The first car chase was pretty brief, the scene that followed featured
    one perp who didn't even fire at Dredd!

    Why?
    His death was okay but hardly thrilling. He holds a woman hostage. But it would have been better had he run through the building firing back at Dredd and then finding the hostage.

    The scene in the block where
    Dredd throws the gas grenade into the room. Notice how badly structured it is. There is a decent build-up but the actual battle is non-existent. No decent payoff. This is a classic example of short-changing the character and us, the audience. The scene is about 20 seconds long, has no excitement. Dredd and Anderson kill the perps but there is no danger, it’s so brief. It should have been more exiting but it’s bang bang, they’re dead in a few seconds. It’s kind of lame.

    The fight between Dredd and one of the
    corrupt Judges looked like they were fighting in a tiny boiler room.

    It looked like something out of a tv show, not in a major (ish) sci-fi film.

    Only one action scene excited me, the one with the huge gun - you know, the one in the trailer when Ma-Ma says "fire!"

    This film has one of the worst bits of plotting I've ever seen in an action film.
    When Lex shoots through the wall and hits Dredd. Dredd slumps down and Lex walks over and starts explaining why he's going to kill Dredd. He doesn't kill Dredd cos he's talking so much. We all know Dredd isn't going to die cos he's the hero of the film but it was done in such a crass way. How did Dredd even know Anderson was going to appear behind Lex and shoot him? Anyway, even if he did sense Anderson, the whole "why I should kill you now, Dredd" scene was terrible. Why Garland just didn't have Dredd and Lex shoot it out and Dredd kills him, God knows! Would have been so much better than the "I'm going to kill you but first I'll talk for a minute so you can find a way to kill me first" plot gimmick. Just crappy stuff, Mr Garland. Cliché personified! :rolleyes:

    This film conforms to every action cliché in the film book. And the beauty of Judge Dredd - the comic book version - is it didn't. John Wagner would try his best to avoid the predictable cliché route of plotting a story.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,305
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    Floopy, It sounds to me like you're complaining that the film didn't match up with the film that you had already imagined in your head, which is never a good idea. The action scenes were fine and your complaints about them are quite frankly ridiculous (none of them are examples of bad writing in my opinion, it's just you trying to re-write the film to suit you which is utterly pointless). I'm not going to deny that the film featured a lot of action movie cliches, but does that stop it being enjoyable? No, it doesn't. I know it's taboo to bring The Raid up in this thread, but did the cliches in that film stop it being enjoyable too? Absolutely not. There was nothing wrong with the grenade scene (or any of the others you mention for that matter...), personally i thought it was quite tense, and when the action kicked in it paid off nicely. No offense, but you just sound like a fanboy trying to poke holes in everything...
  • MrSuperMrSuper Posts: 18,473
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    I've never read any of the comic books and frankly i don't care. I'm judging the film (see what i did there? :D) on its own merits and i thought it was a great film. I'm really surprised just how much i enjoyed it. Really, really well made. Great action, impressive special effects, lots of violence, blood, guts and gore. I couldn't ask for more really. The plot is similar to The Raid but at the same time it's nothing like The Raid at all, content wise. I don't know how good the 3D is but i chose to watch the 2D version.

    I thought Karl Urban was pretty cool as Dredd, very believable and he had some really great one-liners which made the whole audience laugh. Olivia Thirlby as Anderson however was fantastic who i LOVED! She did amazing work and i can't believe this is the same chick who was in Juno! For me the chemistry between these two characters is really the foundation of the film and that's what worked the most for me (''you look ready!'' :cool:). Lena Headey as Ma-Ma was a pretty scary character and there were certain points in the film where she freaked me out. Seriously one bad-ass bitch.

    Overall, a resounding success! Bring on the sequel!
  • Stone_JonesStone_Jones Posts: 225
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    I'm not going to deny that the film featured a lot of action movie cliches, but does that stop it being enjoyable? No, it doesn't.

    The plot seemed to be in permanent loop. Most of the film was Dredd walking down a grubby looking corridor. I dunno about slo-mo, this film was more like repeat-mo.

    :D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,274
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    Well, I saw it today and I loved it.
    Urban has nailed the character perfectly.
    Got to disagree with Floopy and the other nay-sayers, because this is now in my top 3 for the year so far.
    And I was reading 2000AD on when it first started, although Dredd didn't appear until Issue 2 ... can't catch me out there!
    Also loved Thirlby as Anderson. She's not the flippant, flirty foil to Dredd yet, but this is her at the start of her "career" as a judge, and you can see that happening.

    Incidentally I was at a Q&A session with Alex Garland (who scripted and produced) recently, where he addressed some of the issues spoken about here. Primarily he said that the first script was based around Judge Death vs Dredd, but didn't work. With the film in it's current form, he felt it acted as a good opener to the character, and if there were further films he would open up Mega-City beyond the slums and concentrate on the more sci-fi and fantastical elements of the past stories. Which sounds good to me..:D

    My only concern is that it will probably do less business in the states, because the yanks are such a bunch of pansies when it comes to R Rated films and never support them ... and then moan when films are geared towards a PG-13 rating! Go figure!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,305
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    The plot seemed to be in permanent loop. Most of the film was Dredd walking down a grubby looking corridor. I dunno about slo-mo, this film was more like repeat-mo.

    :D

    That post is utter bullshit :rolleyes:
  • GoatyGoaty Posts: 7,776
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    CJClarke wrote: »
    That post is utter bullshit :rolleyes:

    Thank you, sadly floopy123 and Stone_Jones is same person, he got banned from too many forums for his silly posts, now you all see his posts on this thread. very sad person.
  • GoatyGoaty Posts: 7,776
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    CJClarke wrote: »
    Floopy, It sounds to me like you're complaining that the film didn't match up with the film that you had already imagined in your head, which is never a good idea. The action scenes were fine and your complaints about them are quite frankly ridiculous (none of them are examples of bad writing in my opinion, it's just you trying to re-write the film to suit you which is utterly pointless). I'm not going to deny that the film featured a lot of action movie cliches, but does that stop it being enjoyable? No, it doesn't. I know it's taboo to bring The Raid up in this thread, but did the cliches in that film stop it being enjoyable too? Absolutely not. There was nothing wrong with the grenade scene (or any of the others you mention for that matter...), personally i thought it was quite tense, and when the action kicked in it paid off nicely. No offense, but you just sound like a fanboy trying to poke holes in everything...

    Good post, just ignore him, he got banned from many forums for idiot rantings against the film for last few years, only cos they don't accept his 'scripts'.

    He is called Scojo, you can google "Scojo 2000AD" to see what it about.

    Very disappeared to see his rantings on this forum, and why someone send out copy of film ticket? nutter!
  • Stone_JonesStone_Jones Posts: 225
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    Not bitter, Goaty. My review of Dredd 3D is based on what I saw on the screen. The following is my honest opinion:
    The scene in the block where Dredd throws the gas grenade into the room. Not well structured. There is a decent build-up but the actual battle is non-existent. No decent payoff. This is a classic example of short-changing the character and us, the audience. The scene is about 20 seconds long, has no excitement. Dredd and Anderson kill the perps but there is no danger, it’s so brief. It should have been more exiting but it’s bang bang, they’re dead in a few seconds. It’s kind of lame.

    That is my honest opinion. I didn't rate that scene. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't great. it built up and then fizzled out. I think the same is true of the first action scene, the second action scene when Dredd deals with the

    hostage.

    It was okay but it a bit brief.

    I didn't think the gun fight
    going up the stairs - there's green smoke - was that good. It was about 10 seconds long!

    This is an action film, a sci-fi action film. I didn't rate 90 percent of the action. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't great.

    The perps didn't show any intelligence. What I mean is, they didn't try to lure Dredd and Anderson into tight spots. There was no strong sense of cat and mouse. I dunno, just felt a bit flat to me. And the end wasn't that exciting. It was no Die Hard in conclusion. Die Hard's end was much exciting and spectacular. I accept Dredd 3D's budget was small, but gut feeling is the 45 million price tag was exaggerated. It wouldn't surprise me if this film is around 30 -35 million dollars which would be consistent with IM Globals's last release: Safe.

    I don't know who this film is appealing towards? Despite what people say on 2000AD's forum I don't think this does appeal to some Judge Dredd fans because it's a massively scaled down version of the comic strip and I don't think it's going to appeal to a huge number of action sci-fi fans because the action is rather stilted and the sci-fi plot is generic, 'seen it before'.

    A perfect example:
    The scene when Judge Lex says "I'm going to kill you, Dredd" and doesn't but just talks and talks and Anderson magically appears - this has been done so many times before. It's a bit old hat, cliché stuff. Sure, James Bond films have done that - the bad guy doesn't try to kill Bond straight way - but they do it with far more subtlety. There was no subtlety in Garland's approach. It was done in a dumb way. I thought it was a rubbish scene with bad dialogue.

    I didn't hate the film, but I didn't like it that much. It was fun and some of the visuals, particularly in the first act of the film, were great. The pounding score was great - the music in the cinema was so loud!

    Urban was a great Judge Dredd, Thirlby was a great rookie Anderson 'coming of age'. Lena Heady was cool as the slightly deranged Ma-Ma.

    Some of the direction by Pete Travis was superb, nice use of 3D, great camera angles, nice moody moments. The 3D slo-mo was fantastic but didn't feel integral to the plot.
    We see Dredd shooting up the slo-mo factory
    but the actual drug didn't seem to play a crucial part in the storyline. Had we seen Ma-Ma actually distributing the stuff to other blocks, other people, I think it would have been more credible.

    I didn't like the endless f word swearing. It didn't spoil the film but it wasn't true to the comic strip. There are no f words in 2000AD's Judge Dredd.

    The look of Peach Trees seems too basic. No sci-fi flourishes aside from one data screen. All the rest was a slummy look that killed off a lot of the sci-fi look of the film. The shot of the block floor was amazing but didn't appear much.

    The budget of the film seemed to restrict the scale of the plot. Once we're halfway through Dredd 3D it feels so contained.

    I felt the film lacked any of the humour and wacky charm of the comic strip. This film has an ugly tone. Okay, I accept it's creating a depressing view of a dystopian future but 2000AD's Judge Dredd was, to a great extent, a crazy view of a dystopian future. The inherent craziness of Mega-City 1 is totally missing from this film and I think it makes Judge Dredd, the actual character, seem less interesting.

    When Dredd is fighting fatties, uglies, simps, antique collectors, sponts (cits who confess to crimes they haven't committed) it makes Dredd seem more extreme, more larger-than-life. It makes him look more absurd. When Dredd is fighting gang perps in dingy block apartments and corridors it makes Dredd seem ordinary. The wacky environment of Wagner's Mega-City 1 makes Dredd more of a perverse figure of fun. He's the straight-laced guy amid a world of insanity and violence. But in Garland's screenplay and in the film, Judge Dredd is kind of dull and non-descript. The perps are so 'seen it before' that Dredd doesn't seem much different to them. He's slightly bland next to bland perps. The 2000AD strip tried to avoid that by making the perps seem more extreme, be it by their personality, the clothes they wear, the weapons they use, the crimes they commit.

    When you have a film full of grungy perps shooting Dredd in lots of corridors you completely kill off the extreme 'Mega-City 1 is an insane city' aspect of Judge Dredd's world. Judge Dredd's world is utterly insane, absurd and violent. Dredd 3D gets the violence bit right but the insanity and absurdity? Nope, totally non-existent. In this respect, Dredd 3D is a bit of a failure but all credit to the film makers for succeeding in getting a new Judge Dredd film made. But the budget and vision and execution of the screenplay didn't deliver much.
  • GoatyGoaty Posts: 7,776
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    Sad rantings as usual.
  • StrakerStraker Posts: 79,567
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    Goaty wrote: »
    Thank you, sadly floopy123 and Stone_Jones is same person, he got banned from too many forums for his silly posts, now you all see his posts on this thread. very sad person.


    If I’d been outed as two different IDs having a biased agenda used to bolster my own opinions I’d slink off in abject shame, never to be seen again.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 7,305
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    I would put Floopy/Stone Jones on my ignore list, but his posts are so entertainingly deluded. For anyone reading this thread and being put off the film by his posts, i strongly advise you to ignore him, pretty much all of his complaints are completely invalid.
  • Trsvis_BickleTrsvis_Bickle Posts: 9,202
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    Straker wrote: »
    “Still yet to have a great Judge Dredd movie”. Mark Kermode 5Live (I paraphrased as my memory is like Swiss cheese).

    When pushed he rated it 3.5/5 although it sounds like much if his irritation with it was down to it being 3D and too similar to The Raid. The filmmakers should add another strapline to the poster: “We thought of the ****ing idea before The Raid but....admittedly after Die Hard”.

    Film24 review (Jason Solomon?) should be on at 5.45pm.

    Good film critic that he is, Kermode does have a 'thing' about 3D and is particularly opposed to its recent reintroduction. In his book The Good, The Bad and the Multiplex, he devotes a whole chapter to why he dislikes 3D and, to be fair, he makes some good points. However,from the reviews I've seen, the makers of Dredd have got the use of it right.
  • Stone_JonesStone_Jones Posts: 225
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    If people think I'm deluded then so is Digital Spy's reviewer. His review is similar to mine. DS say the plot is threadbare, I've mentioned that.

    I think this IMDB review sums up the film - and no, I didn't write it. I'm not the reviewer.
    Not all that, 7 September 2012

    Author: cake-26 from United Kingdom

    The film suffers from it's tight budget. The future should be expensive to film, so we don't really get much 'future' here. Also, it should have been sold on the 'Dredd' stuff, ie. making fun of Dredd's humourless character, colourful villains, lunatic citizens etc, but this is all dumbed down to make a pretty uninspired formulaic action thriller. You've seen this plot a million times. I thought the movie was clichéd and boring and not really much to do with Dredd. I'm a hardcore old-school Dredd fan and am disappointed with the look of the thing. Dark, grimy, claustrophobic, cheap, not like in the comic. The helmet is wrong, the lawmaster is rubbish and Anderson is not as hot as in the comic. All the reviews that are hailing this as the 'real Dredd' etc, are just reacting against the previous movie's obvious flaws. They did an OK job considering the constraints, but this is far from being the definitive Dredd. Go read some of your back issues if you've forgotten what that is.

    Last review on this link:

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1343727/reviews?start=10

    I thought the helmet was fine, the bike was okay and Thirlby was good. But the rest of the points I agree with. It's 100 percent how I feel about this film. The budget is so tiny you get the bare bones of Judge Dredd's world and Garland isn't smart or imaginative enough to do anything with the bare bones. Perhaps a cleverer writer could have done more with the budget, come up with a more imaginative, less predictable plot? Garland didn't to do enough, the plot plods along with no invention, almost zero wit and the film never recovers. Once you see some grungy perps in slummy corridors saying "f*ck, kill Dredd!" the film has lost its USP - unique selling point. It wasn't that unique in the first place!

    If the film is a success let's hope someone comes up with something more DREDD WORLD imaginative in a sequel. Go read some actual progs of Judge Dredd and adapt one of those stories. Is that so hard to do? Sheesh! :rolleyes: Try adapting the actual source material!!!! Hardly a radical idea, is it? No, so let's use some brain cells, people, and let's see a proper sequel and not this Dredd 'in slum corridors' plot!
  • StrakerStraker Posts: 79,567
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    Film24 on the BBC News Channel entirely ignored Dredd. Didn’t even get a passing mention. They even had time to review Jaws on Blu-ray but not Dredd in the cinema!!
  • Matt DMatt D Posts: 13,153
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    I saw it last night.

    My review: http://letterboxd.com/tezcatlipoca/film/dredd/

    4/5. I loved it.


    I didn't love the ticket price, though... £13 to see a 3D film on a Friday night! If Cambridge had 2D screenings, I'd have gone to one of those.
  • Matt DMatt D Posts: 13,153
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    Goaty wrote: »
    Thank you, sadly floopy123 and Stone_Jones is same person, he got banned from too many forums for his silly posts, now you all see his posts on this thread. very sad person.

    Yeah, the posting styles are very similar, plus "they" both go on about the "structure" of the gas grenade scene and about the Lex scene in the same way. Does seem to indicate it's the same person...
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