Can I ask you something that's kind of an obvious question in this whole debate but is never raised because it's kind of taboo?
Please don't get offended because that's not the intention (though I suppose if you want to, obviously feel free)
Using your situation purely as an example, not personally directed;
At some point there are not going to be enough working people to provide the money to provide the amount of support you need for your daughter.
At some point working people wth families of their own are going to ask why should they go without to give you what you need.
I mean with modern advances, I can't see anything other than there being an ever increasing number of people who can't function yet need ever increasing levels of support.
So what happens then?
Can it be dismissed as pure selfishness to expect to be able to have things for yourself and family if you work hard to get them?
There has to be a limit on what can be provided otherwise there's going to be a sort of second class created of people who do all the work for those who can't do any?
How do you see this being sorted out in the future?
I totally agree my son gets DLA and how does he cost me an extra £97per WEEK ???????? how does he cost me more than any other child costs there parent?
Its a little extra help at school he needs not cash but there is no money (so the school have told me) for for extra help in school
I totally agree my son gets DLA and how does he cost me an extra £97per WEEK ???????? how does he cost me more than any other child costs there parent?
Its a little extra help at school he needs not cash but there is no money (so the school have told me) for for extra help in school
So your son basically applied on the off chance, and got awarded both components straight off? :eek:
Can I ask you something that's kind of an obvious question in this whole debate but is never raised because it's kind of taboo?
Please don't get offended because that's not the intention (though I suppose if you want to, obviously feel free)
Using your situation purely as an example, not personally directed;
At some point there are not going to be enough working people to provide the money to provide the amount of support you need for your daughter.
At some point working people wth families of their own are going to ask why should they go without to give you what you need.
I don't think the situation you describe is realistic.
Hell, it's not like I'm going for the whole thing - I'm only applying for the low-rate care component because my partner has to take time off work to look after me - has to come home early to cook, etc. And that's the case with most people - they're not making big outlandish claims and they're not receiving big outlandish sums.
I don't think the situation you describe is realistic.
Hell, it's not like I'm going for the whole thing - I'm only applying for the low-rate care component because my partner has to take time off work to look after me - has to come home early to cook, etc. And that's the case with most people - they're not making big outlandish claims and they're not receiving big outlandish sums.
I wasn't suggesting that you were asking for huge amounts nor that they weren't needed.
It was more trying to widen the debate from "I need more money, we won't give you money".
I think it is a realistic debate to have. Not only what we provide for disabled people but what resources we use to keep people alive when they are very elderly, what resources we use to support people in the frameworks they want ect.
The country/society has come to the end of the good times. We need to start discussing the ongoing lack of money and resources. They are not coming back anytime soon, I personally don't think they ever will.
The WRO organizations have had their funding scrapped the one organization that helps the disabled are to be no more, :mad:yes this Tory government hate the disabled with a passion, Cameron should hang ,,, his head in shame, This was a man who praised the help he got with his disabled son oh how he soon forgets. Are we to see the pitiful sight of the disabled chaining themselves to the railings of downing street once more:mad: what the hell is this country turning into.
Funding towards supporting the disabled is being cut significantly... I know- I work in the sector.
To say that direct services will not be affected is a joke and a lie:mad:
I wasn't suggesting that you were asking for huge amounts nor that they weren't needed.
It was more trying to widen the debate from "I need more money, we won't give you money".
I think it is a realistic debate to have. Not only what we provide for disabled people but what resources we use to keep people alive when they are very elderly, what resources we use to support people in the frameworks they want ect.
The country/society has come to the end of the good times. We need to start discussing the ongoing lack of money and resources. They are not coming back anytime soon, I personally don't think they ever will.
If all that's the case, why focus on disability benefits? ESA and DLA make up a small part of the welfare budget, yet an inordinate amount of attention is focused on it, causing stress to people who often really aren't able to cope with it.
But then that small group make a handy demon to focus on.
If all that's the case, why focus on disability benefits? ESA and DLA make up a small part of the welfare budget, yet an inordinate amount of attention is focused on it, causing stress to people who often really aren't able to cope with it.
But then that small group make a handy demon to focus on.
Wok, I have looked at the pics of your hands and absolutely astounded at what job they expect you to do! Obviously any manual labour is out of the question. Driving? No way! Typing? Very slow and difficult (I would imagine). Waiter? Well just imagine the diners' reaction. Supermarket? Again nope!
Wok, I have looked at the pics of your hands and absolutely astounded at what job they expect you to do! Obviously any manual labour is out of the question. Driving? No way! Typing? Very slow and difficult (I would imagine). Waiter? Well just imagine the diners' reaction. Supermarket? Again nope!
It's why I read the "it's too easy to get disability benefits" posts with such disbelief!
Dye those white gloves black hun (just for YOU)
Heh, thanks, have been tempted to - but they don't live for long. Have to buy about 5 new pairs a week!
I wasn't suggesting that you were asking for huge amounts nor that they weren't needed.
It was more trying to widen the debate from "I need more money, we won't give you money".
I think it is a realistic debate to have. Not only what we provide for disabled people but what resources we use to keep people alive when they are very elderly, what resources we use to support people in the frameworks they want ect.
The country/society has come to the end of the good times. We need to start discussing the ongoing lack of money and resources. They are not coming back anytime soon, I personally don't think they ever will.
Where as under Labour it was all flowers waving in the sunshine was it?
My enduring memories of the last labour goverment will be me having the 'priviledge' of working full time, with the reward of watching large amounts of my earnings going to the goverment for them to squander. I was not put on this earth just as cash cow to fund the life of others.
There is no 'war' on disbaled people per sa....there's a war on 'waste'. In the current economic climate it's stupid to not review where all taxpayer money goes. Those that are in need should recieve support without fail........but........and I'm sorry this is a big 'but'...if disabled people are able to work at home doing some duties then that should be perfectly reasonable to expect. Of course there will always be exemptions but I strongly believe everyone should pull together. I'm sure i'll get jumped on for the 'horrific' thought of making some disabled people work. Let me put this into context.....my OH's father is missing a leg, does he sit at home all day complaining about the 'attack' on his benefits? No he gets up and goes to work like every other person, he's a person, not a disability statistic.
There's some horrific conditions mentioned across the threads yet i'm sure in most instances there's some form of suitable work that could be assigned.
We're reaching a status quo in this country where the recipents of benefits are far outstripping the ability of the working population to pay for it. It can't go on forever as people like me will start to think 'what is the point in working'? We're not here to solely pay for the existence of others.
Just reading on some of the disability forums it seems like the government are just stopping peoples DLA and ESA for ridiculous reasons, these are people who have had arthritis for many years its disgusting and putting many disabled people through much stress. Why do people pay good money to go to Lourdes France when the answer to all ailments is to just go to atos centers ill and walk out cured. IDS , Chris Grayling, Osborne,and Cameron should hang their heads in shame!!!!!!!!!! Yes NU-labour started this persecution but these four are taking it a step to far. As someone who has witnessed a much loved one suffer the agony of this horrible disease and die through it, it makes me wonder if these four have any humanity in them at all !!:mad:
Just reading on some of the disability forums it seems like the government are just stopping peoples DLA and ESA for ridiculous reasons, these are people who have had arthritis for many years its disgusting and putting many disabled people through much stress. Why do people pay good money to go to Lourdes France when the answer to all ailments is to just go to atos centers ill and walk out cured. IDS , Chris Grayling, Osborne,and Cameron should hang their heads in shame!!!!!!!!!! Yes NU-labour started this persecution but these four are taking it a step to far. As someone who has witnessed a much loved one suffer the agony of this horrible disease and die through it, it makes me wonder if these four have any humanity in them at all !!:mad:
No doubt a horrible condition to see in others ...my respects...
Back on topic....I noticed you fail to include the Lib Dems in this...why's that? Also if faced with a huge budget to solve which areas (ie people in need) would you take money from instead? sharing the pain is always gonna cause some eggs to break but is the fairest approach overall. Has any 'disadvantaged' group been left untouched? I doubt few if any.....
Where as under Labour it was all flowers waving in the sunshine was it?
My enduring memories of the last labour goverment will be me having the 'priviledge' of working full time, with the reward of watching large amounts of my earnings going to the goverment for them to squander. I was not put on this earth just as cash cow to fund the life of others.
There is no 'war' on disbaled people per sa....there's a war on 'waste'. In the current economic climate it's stupid to not review where all taxpayer money goes. Those that are in need should recieve support without fail........but........and I'm sorry this is a big 'but'...if disabled people are able to work at home doing some duties then that should be perfectly reasonable to expect. Of course there will always be exemptions but I strongly believe everyone should pull together. I'm sure i'll get jumped on for the 'horrific' thought of making some disabled people work. Let me put this into context.....my OH's father is missing a leg, does he sit at home all day complaining about the 'attack' on his benefits? No he gets up and goes to work like every other person, he's a person, not a disability statistic.
There's some horrific conditions mentioned across the threads yet i'm sure in most instances there's some form of suitable work that could be assigned.
We're reaching a status quo in this country where the recipents of benefits are far outstripping the ability of the working population to pay for it. It can't go on forever as people like me will start to think 'what is the point in working'? We're not here to solely pay for the existence of others.
Then why not start at the top the tax avoiders but oh hell no lets start with the most vulnerable the weakest the ones with little fight in them first!! your attitude stinks madam:rolleyes:
Where as under Labour it was all flowers waving in the sunshine was it?
My enduring memories of the last labour goverment will be me having the 'priviledge' of working full time, with the reward of watching large amounts of my earnings going to the goverment for them to squander. I was not put on this earth just as cash cow to fund the life of others.
There is no 'war' on disbaled people per sa....there's a war on 'waste'. In the current economic climate it's stupid to not review where all taxpayer money goes. Those that are in need should recieve support without fail........but........and I'm sorry this is a big 'but'...if disabled people are able to work at home doing some duties then that should be perfectly reasonable to expect. Of course there will always be exemptions but I strongly believe everyone should pull together. I'm sure i'll get jumped on for the 'horrific' thought of making some disabled people work. Let me put this into context.....my OH's father is missing a leg, does he sit at home all day complaining about the 'attack' on his benefits? No he gets up and goes to work like every other person, he's a person, not a disability statistic.
There's some horrific conditions mentioned across the threads yet i'm sure in most instances there's some form of suitable work that could be assigned.
We're reaching a status quo in this country where the recipents of benefits are far outstripping the ability of the working population to pay for it. It can't go on forever as people like me will start to think 'what is the point in working'? We're not here to solely pay for the existence of others.
Even if it were the case that employers were willing to spend who knows how many thousands of pounds to make their workplaces suitable for people with a myriad of conditions, each with it's own needs, I'll ask one more time, where are these jobs?
If able bodied and mentally fine people are applying for countless jobs and being turned down, what do you think the chances are that the disabled will get them? Unfortunately, the Disability Discrimination Act is not going to help us now.
No doubt a horrible condition to see in others ...my respects...
Back on topic....I noticed you fail to include the Lib Dems in this...why's that? Also if faced with a huge budget to solve which areas (ie people in need) would you take money from instead? sharing the pain is always gonna cause some eggs to break but is the fairest approach overall. Has any 'disadvantaged' group been left untouched? I doubt few if any.....
Overseas aid billions btw get our own home in order first :rolleyes:
Then why not start at the top the tax avoiders but oh hell no lets start with the most vulnerable the weakest the ones with little fight in them first!! your attitude stinks madam:rolleyes:
Have i mentioned tax avoidence? No I mentioned nothing of the sort so stop inventing things that aren't there.
Why does my attitude stink when i'm advocating that anybody who can work (regardless of rich or poor) does their bit? What 'stinks' about that?
Even if it were the case that employers were willing to spend who knows how many thousands of pounds to make their workplaces suitable for people with a myriad of conditions, each with it's own needs, I'll ask one more time, where are these jobs?
If able bodied and mentally fine people are applying for countless jobs and being turned down, what do you think the chances are that the disabled will get them? Unfortunately, the Disability Discrimination Act is not going to help us now.
I understand there is distinct lack of jobs....does that mean we roll over and say 'its buggered, let's just give up' or we try and do something about it? Technology is changing and there's no reason that work ethic and practices will gradually change throughout the future. If you're able to sit at home typing on a keyboard then there's no reason that can't be applied to a working situation. Granted the jobs aren't there yet but with some forward thinking this can be tackled.
Even if it were the case that employers were willing to spend who knows how many thousands of pounds to make their workplaces suitable for people with a myriad of conditions, each with it's own needs, I'll ask one more time, where are these jobs?
If able bodied and mentally fine people are applying for countless jobs and being turned down, what do you think the chances are that the disabled will get them? Unfortunately, the Disability Discrimination Act is not going to help us now.
Good point hundreds of thousands of young able bodied cant find work but miraculously millions of jobs for the disabled are going to appear, what then discrimination against the able bodied
Have i mentioned tax avoidence? No I mentioned nothing of the sort so stop inventing things that aren't there.
Why does my attitude stink when i'm advocating that anybody who can work (regardless of rich or poor) does their bit? What 'stinks' about that?
I can asure you elissa from what i have seen its no fun and games being disabled, im sure thousands of disabled would love to be working instead of being criminalized because thats what the government are trying to do just look at the media reports on the disabled
Gets my vote but you'll jumped upon as a racist and selfish for suggesting the abolition of overseas aid.....
WHAT? not at all it makes perfect sense to get your own home in order first but commonsense seems to be lacking in this country for many years regards jack
Comments
I totally agree my son gets DLA and how does he cost me an extra £97per WEEK ???????? how does he cost me more than any other child costs there parent?
Its a little extra help at school he needs not cash but there is no money (so the school have told me) for for extra help in school
So your son basically applied on the off chance, and got awarded both components straight off? :eek:
when he was diagnosed his specialist give me the pack of forms and said hes entitled to this make sure u apply!!!!
Which i did the DLA wrote to his specialist he filled in more forms and thats it!!!
The money goes into my sons account and is there for him when he needs it
Hell, it's not like I'm going for the whole thing - I'm only applying for the low-rate care component because my partner has to take time off work to look after me - has to come home early to cook, etc. And that's the case with most people - they're not making big outlandish claims and they're not receiving big outlandish sums.
I wasn't suggesting that you were asking for huge amounts nor that they weren't needed.
It was more trying to widen the debate from "I need more money, we won't give you money".
I think it is a realistic debate to have. Not only what we provide for disabled people but what resources we use to keep people alive when they are very elderly, what resources we use to support people in the frameworks they want ect.
The country/society has come to the end of the good times. We need to start discussing the ongoing lack of money and resources. They are not coming back anytime soon, I personally don't think they ever will.
Funding towards supporting the disabled is being cut significantly... I know- I work in the sector.
To say that direct services will not be affected is a joke and a lie:mad:
But then that small group make a handy demon to focus on.
Wok, I have looked at the pics of your hands and absolutely astounded at what job they expect you to do! Obviously any manual labour is out of the question. Driving? No way! Typing? Very slow and difficult (I would imagine). Waiter? Well just imagine the diners' reaction. Supermarket? Again nope!
Dye those white gloves black hun (just for YOU)
Heh, thanks, have been tempted to - but they don't live for long. Have to buy about 5 new pairs a week!
Not for the rich not for the front bench tories
Yes it is and more power to you for working in that sector good on ya
Where as under Labour it was all flowers waving in the sunshine was it?
My enduring memories of the last labour goverment will be me having the 'priviledge' of working full time, with the reward of watching large amounts of my earnings going to the goverment for them to squander. I was not put on this earth just as cash cow to fund the life of others.
There is no 'war' on disbaled people per sa....there's a war on 'waste'. In the current economic climate it's stupid to not review where all taxpayer money goes. Those that are in need should recieve support without fail........but........and I'm sorry this is a big 'but'...if disabled people are able to work at home doing some duties then that should be perfectly reasonable to expect. Of course there will always be exemptions but I strongly believe everyone should pull together. I'm sure i'll get jumped on for the 'horrific' thought of making some disabled people work. Let me put this into context.....my OH's father is missing a leg, does he sit at home all day complaining about the 'attack' on his benefits? No he gets up and goes to work like every other person, he's a person, not a disability statistic.
There's some horrific conditions mentioned across the threads yet i'm sure in most instances there's some form of suitable work that could be assigned.
We're reaching a status quo in this country where the recipents of benefits are far outstripping the ability of the working population to pay for it. It can't go on forever as people like me will start to think 'what is the point in working'? We're not here to solely pay for the existence of others.
No doubt a horrible condition to see in others ...my respects...
Back on topic....I noticed you fail to include the Lib Dems in this...why's that? Also if faced with a huge budget to solve which areas (ie people in need) would you take money from instead? sharing the pain is always gonna cause some eggs to break but is the fairest approach overall. Has any 'disadvantaged' group been left untouched? I doubt few if any.....
Then why not start at the top the tax avoiders but oh hell no lets start with the most vulnerable the weakest the ones with little fight in them first!! your attitude stinks madam:rolleyes:
Even if it were the case that employers were willing to spend who knows how many thousands of pounds to make their workplaces suitable for people with a myriad of conditions, each with it's own needs, I'll ask one more time, where are these jobs?
If able bodied and mentally fine people are applying for countless jobs and being turned down, what do you think the chances are that the disabled will get them? Unfortunately, the Disability Discrimination Act is not going to help us now.
Overseas aid billions btw get our own home in order first :rolleyes:
Have i mentioned tax avoidence? No I mentioned nothing of the sort so stop inventing things that aren't there.
Why does my attitude stink when i'm advocating that anybody who can work (regardless of rich or poor) does their bit? What 'stinks' about that?
I understand there is distinct lack of jobs....does that mean we roll over and say 'its buggered, let's just give up' or we try and do something about it? Technology is changing and there's no reason that work ethic and practices will gradually change throughout the future. If you're able to sit at home typing on a keyboard then there's no reason that can't be applied to a working situation. Granted the jobs aren't there yet but with some forward thinking this can be tackled.
Gets my vote but you'll jumped upon as a racist and selfish for suggesting the abolition of overseas aid.....
Good point hundreds of thousands of young able bodied cant find work but miraculously millions of jobs for the disabled are going to appear, what then discrimination against the able bodied
I can asure you elissa from what i have seen its no fun and games being disabled, im sure thousands of disabled would love to be working instead of being criminalized because thats what the government are trying to do just look at the media reports on the disabled
WHAT? not at all it makes perfect sense to get your own home in order first but commonsense seems to be lacking in this country for many years regards jack