I thought Series 5 was quite good.Wasn't the best but I wouldn't call it awful. The main problem with this series was most the episodes had lots of material cut out of it to fit the 45 minute time slot. There were quite a few good scenes that they cut for time that added to the stories. Vincent and the Doctor was originally 75 minute long before they chopped it down.
I agree. Basically, itr was proper Doctor Who again. I would have said any comparison to Coupling was a very positive comment...
They weren't 'the first four series', just the last four series. Moffat has returned Doctor Who to something approaching its old self prior to the 2005 relaunch, and I welcome it.
If the man in the street thinks otherwise, why are the AI's still so high?
You may have your own reasons for disliking New Who 1-4, but to call Series 5 "proper Who again" in comparison is absurd. It was fairy tale mumbo jumbo, a lot of which made no sense. Just imagine in "proper Who" - "Brigadier, just remember me back into existence and everything will be ok". I agree with the OP, 5 was by far the worst Who series since its return.
We should give Matt Smith a bit more time I suppose before we judge him but early impressions to me make me lean towards David Tennant, still.
Not because of anything that Matt Smith has done wrong perse(sic) I just think Tennant is more suited to the role. I need to watch more Series 5 more though because other than the finale i haven't watched them much. I just think DT is a better Doctor.
the thing that most sticks with me about series 5 was reading the letters page in DWM after Vincent aired, I have honestly never seen such lovely, warm tributes to an episode of the show ever, it really struck an emotional chord with large segments of the audience.
I think I read in the edition of DWM about the readers poll that this episode was the favorite of the over 30's age group (might have been over 35's, but something like that) and rated a little lower (though still highly) but the youngest age group, which I can understand, because from an emotional stand point I think it helps to have experience a bit more of life to really understand the concepts the episode involves.
I think it's ironic that the episode that many were dreading (because of Curtis being involved) has ended up being the episode that arguably has had the most emotional resonance with many fans....:)
Anyway, makes me hope for more Curtis, perhaps he could be persuaded to do an episode involving Chaucer...:)
You may have your own reasons for disliking New Who 1-4, but to call Series 5 "proper Who again" in comparison is absurd. It was fairy tale mumbo jumbo, a lot of which made no sense. Just imagine in "proper Who" - "Brigadier, just remember me back into existence and everything will be ok". I agree with the OP, 5 was by far the worst Who series since its return.
It made enough sense to me. If you didn't get it, that's your problem. There was more imagination and tighter plotting on display this year than at any time since 1989.
I agree. Basically, itr was proper Doctor Who again.
From the opening of the Eleventh Hour it somehow 'felt' like Who, a feeling I havn't had for some time,as I was one who was getting heartily tired of Tennant's Doctor, (not knocking him as such but there weren't that many high points the last couple of series) to me Matt's Doctor was a breath of fresh air. He's alien, unpredictable, and can't be categorized. In other words he's far more like the earlier Doctors than Tennant was and that made it for me. I thought some episodes weren't up to the same standard as others but that always happens, and on the whole I was riveted to it and looked forward to it all week, which hasn't happened for a while. So while Tenth Doctor fans have had it good the last few years, it was time for a change and I'm happy!
From the opening of the Eleventh Hour it somehow 'felt' like Who, a feeling I havn't had for some time,as I was one who was getting heartily tired of Tennant's Doctor, (not knocking him as such but there weren't that many high points the last couple of series) to me Matt's Doctor was a breath of fresh air. He's alien, unpredictable, and can't be categorized. In other words he's far more like the earlier Doctors than Tennant was and that made it for me. I thought some episodes weren't up to the same standard as others but that always happens, and on the whole I was riveted to it and looked forward to it all week, which hasn't happened for a while. So while Tenth Doctor fans have had it good the last few years, it was time for a change and I'm happy!
That was exactly how I felt-it was like I was watching a new version of the show I grew up with again, rather than a completely different show with the same title as it has been in recent years, if that makes sense.
From the opening of the Eleventh Hour it somehow 'felt' like Who, a feeling I havn't had for some time,as I was one who was getting heartily tired of Tennant's Doctor, (not knocking him as such but there weren't that many high points the last couple of series) to me Matt's Doctor was a breath of fresh air. He's alien, unpredictable, and can't be categorized. In other words he's far more like the earlier Doctors than Tennant was and that made it for me. I thought some episodes weren't up to the same standard as others but that always happens, and on the whole I was riveted to it and looked forward to it all week, which hasn't happened for a while. So while Tenth Doctor fans have had it good the last few years, it was time for a change and I'm happy!
Couldn't have said it better myself. Matt Smith and Series 5 has made me enjoy Who again. I was never much of a David Tennant fan, and while there were some very good episodes, overall I haven't rated the last few series that much and watched it because it was Who (and I can't not watch Who !!) but without a great deal of enthusiasm. I loved Series 5, Matt's Doctor IS The Doctor as far as I'm concerned, far more than David's ever was, and long may he continure in the role
We should give Matt Smith a bit more time I suppose before we judge him
Matt has been overwhelming praised in the role, even by some of the harshest critics of series 5.
Speaking for myself, I thought after 30 years I thought no one would ever take over from Davison as my fave Doctor, but Smith managed to do so effortlessly.
I have no doubt the wider audience would still rate Tennant higher at this point, but then he did three and a bit series so looms large in peoples minds, I do think with time Smith could be regarded just as highly though.
We should give Matt Smith a bit more time I suppose before we judge him but early impressions to me make me lean towards David Tennant, still.
Not because of anything that Matt Smith has done wrong perse(sic) I just think Tennant is more suited to the role. I need to watch more Series 5 more though because other than the finale i haven't watched them much. I just think DT is a better Doctor.
This is the thing though for me, I like Matt Smith and Karen Gillian, I thought they both did a good job.
My problem with series 5 was the overall feel of it, 1-4 had an epic movie quality to it which quite often had me on the edge of my seat.
I didn't feel that at all with series 5, I kept watching hoping it would improve but it never did and for the first time since it came back I am not even looking forward to the Christmas special or series 6 for that matter.
Someone mentioned it was the first time that they felt it was real Doctor Who since before the new series, would that be when the show got cancelled due to lack of viewers by any chance?
YJust imagine in "proper Who" - "Brigadier, just remember me back into existence and everything will be ok".
Uh, yeah. That didn't happen. Nothing remotely like that happened in Series 5.
Loved Series 5. Greater imagination, clever ideas, more complex character relationships, stronger plot arcs, higher level of mystery and intrigue. And some great dialogue.
Uh, yeah. That didn't happen. Nothing remotely like that happened in Series 5.
Loved Series 5. Greater imagination, clever ideas, more complex character relationships, stronger plot arcs, higher level of mystery and intrigue. And some great dialogue.
That's exactly how I feel about it. Plus, I loved the almost Spielbergian bounce that it had. You could definitely tell the influence in Moffat's writing.
Someone mentioned it was the first time that they felt it was real Doctor Who since before the new series, would that be when the show got cancelled due to lack of viewers by any chance?
It was when the show was cancelled because the BBC wanted to get rid of it for a variety of reasons, most of them not connected to ratings. The ratings fell because they buried the show opposite Coronation Street: that was an effect of that decision, not the cause.
The 1989 series was the last time Who was consistently worth watching every week until 2010.
Matt has been overwhelming praised in the role, even by some of the harshest critics of series 5.
Speaking for myself, I thought after 30 years I thought no one would ever take over from Davison as my fave Doctor, but Smith managed to do so effortlessly.
I have no doubt the wider audience would still rate Tennant higher at this point, but then he did three and a bit series so looms large in peoples minds, I do think with time Smith could be regarded just as highly though.
Give it another year and i'm sure some opinions will be swayed. By then we should all have come to terms with what Smith's Doctor is all about. I don't think it's far to draw comparisons between the 2 though cos to be honest, Tennant brings a kind of style to Doctor Who that Smith cannot hope to match so he'll do it in his own way. Personally I think i;ll always favour DT's doctor because my obsession with Doctor kicked right into gear during his reign.
This is the thing though for me, I like Matt Smith and Karen Gillian, I thought they both did a good job.
My problem with series 5 was the overall feel of it, 1-4 had an epic movie quality to it which quite often had me on the edge of my seat.
I didn't feel that at all with series 5, I kept watching hoping it would improve but it never did and for the first time since it came back I am not even looking forward to the Christmas special or series 6 for that matter.
Someone mentioned it was the first time that they felt it was real Doctor Who since before the new series, would that be when the show got cancelled due to lack of viewers by any chance?
It always felt a bit different as it was shot in HD so even in SD the picture looked so much more crisp and pristine, hardly a negative factor there, but I don't know if anyone else noticed this but while the music and the soundtrack didn't detract from the dialogue in the RTD error there were times in Series 5 when I couldn't hear any dialogue for the music which for me was a let down.
Throughout the series I've been watching and while it's been enjoyable enough something hasn't been quite right. I'm finding Matt Smith's style hard to get to grips with. I'm not saying it's bad or Smith is a bad Doctor, I'm just saying I'm finding it hard to shake off the shackles of David Tennant, who brought so much pizazz and enthusiasm to the role. I just don't think Matt brings in the same.
For instance... I've seen a trailer for the Christmas Special and the line that grabs me is "I'm the ghost of Christmas Past" There's just something dry and wooden about the line and I just fail to be inspired by it. Not that it stops me from wanting to see the episode and more than open to be proved wrong in the context of the actual episode.
As for the claims that it's more like "proper who" well I've experienced that feeling a few times in New Who so I don't think Moffat should be feeling any kind of pressure to try and bring us "proper who". He has his own vision for way of doings and as far as I'm concerned it's up to us to "put up for shut up".
This is the thing though, isn't it? The ones who are complaining about Smith 'not matching up' to tennant are mostly the ones who weren't actually fans before tennant, who was after all only the latest in a long line of Doctors. They're looking at it from entirely the wrong perspective. They're seeing Tennant as somehow the definitive Doctor-and he isn't, he can't be, none of them can really, as they're all totally different!
This is the thing though, isn't it? The ones who are complaining about Smith 'not matching up' to tennant are mostly the ones who weren't actually fans before tennant, who was after all only the latest in a long line of Doctors. They're looking at it from entirely the wrong perspective. They're seeing Tennant as somehow the definitive Doctopr-and he isn't, he can't be, none of them can, really!
so what? What has been a long time fan of the programme got to do with peoples opinions?
and I've been fan since my earliest memories and I still prefer Tennant over Smith
This is the thing though, isn't it? The ones who are complaining about Smith 'not matching up' to tennant are mostly the ones who weren't actually fans before tennant, who was after all only the latest in a long line of Doctors. They're looking at it from entirely the wrong perspective. They're seeing Tennant as somehow the definitive Doctopr-and he isn't, he can't be, none of them can really, as they're all totally different!
Sure I wasn't an obsesive fan of Doctor Who in the classic years but there's nothing wrong at all in preferring one Doctor over another so long as you accept that the change comes with the show.
I thought the last series was by far and away the best since the series came back on our screens. No childish monsters like the Slitheen, brilliant writing, fantastic story arc (which has yet to be concluded), superb acting, a finale that didn't suck (and just have a deux ex-machina ending), no pavement blow jobs, no Doctor-lite epiosde, no Absorbaloff, and no obvious gay agenda which had become cringeworthy during the RTD years (and before anyone accuses me of being 'homephobic', what I'm referring to is the regular 'Oh by the way, I'm gay' moments where the character's sexuality had no bearing on the script but there was a conscious effort to include it).
I always looked forward to new series' but time and time again RTD disappointed with his stories, while other writers did a much better job. In fact the only RTD story I really enjoyed was 'Turn Left' which I thought was fantastic.
Like others have said, series 5 made me feel like we finally had the series we loved back. Can't wait for the next series and the Xmas special.
One final point to the OP. The viewing figures don't lie - it's retained it's popularity and also built on it.
indeed, that really in a nutshell is what this whole thread boils down to. Most viewers loved series 5, a small number didn't...was ever thus, since it is impossible to produce a series that pleases everyone.
It just annoys me that so many of those that didn't care for this series seem to think there is something special and unique about their dissatisfaction, when really it isn't, beyond the fact that in many cases they have been on other side of the fence till this year.
The other thing i find sad is even though there was a lot of personal nastiness aimed at RTD by the detractors of his era, never did it seem to be the case that it's detractors actually wanted the show to fail, as though to prove some sort of point. Can't say the same for some of series 5 detractors, who even in this thread seem to relish the idea of the show being axed purely because it didn't work for them...
I feel the complete opposite to the OP. I have re-watched series 1-4 and all the Specials and have to say the variance in quality is shocking. It is so inconsistent. They go from great episodes to complete embarrassments. Way too much slapstick, irrelevant cultural references and those awful cameos in the Christmas Specials. Can't say I think much of any of the Specials.
For me series 5 was consistent in quality. I didn't find it overblown and as cringeworthy as some of the stuff in series 2-4.
Having said that, I do like series 1-4, but will pick and choose the episodes I watch in future, whereas I can sit through all the episodes of series 5.
indeed, that really in a nutshell is what this whole thread boils down to. Most viewers loved series 5, a small number didn't...was ever thus, since it is impossible to produce a series that pleases everyone.
It just annoys me that so many of those that didn't care for this series seem to think there is something special and unique about their dissatisfaction, when really it isn't, beyond the fact that in many cases they have been on other side of the fence till this year.
The other thing i find sad is even though there was a lot of personal nastiness aimed at RTD by the detractors of his era, never did it seem to be the case that it's detractors actually wanted the show to fail, as though to prove some sort of point. Can't say the same for some of series 5 detractors, who even in this thread seem to relish the idea of the show being axed purely because it didn't work for them...
Completly agree.
The problem isn't the quality of the programme. It's so called fans with a false sense of ownership towards the programme
Comments
...and with me. It would appear that StalwartUK is outvoted.:)
You may have your own reasons for disliking New Who 1-4, but to call Series 5 "proper Who again" in comparison is absurd. It was fairy tale mumbo jumbo, a lot of which made no sense. Just imagine in "proper Who" - "Brigadier, just remember me back into existence and everything will be ok". I agree with the OP, 5 was by far the worst Who series since its return.
Not because of anything that Matt Smith has done wrong perse(sic) I just think Tennant is more suited to the role. I need to watch more Series 5 more though because other than the finale i haven't watched them much. I just think DT is a better Doctor.
the thing that most sticks with me about series 5 was reading the letters page in DWM after Vincent aired, I have honestly never seen such lovely, warm tributes to an episode of the show ever, it really struck an emotional chord with large segments of the audience.
I think I read in the edition of DWM about the readers poll that this episode was the favorite of the over 30's age group (might have been over 35's, but something like that) and rated a little lower (though still highly) but the youngest age group, which I can understand, because from an emotional stand point I think it helps to have experience a bit more of life to really understand the concepts the episode involves.
I think it's ironic that the episode that many were dreading (because of Curtis being involved) has ended up being the episode that arguably has had the most emotional resonance with many fans....:)
Anyway, makes me hope for more Curtis, perhaps he could be persuaded to do an episode involving Chaucer...:)
Really? I didn't see the old bloke travelling with his granddaughter and a couple of teachers, in a TARDIS he couldn't control at all,
From the opening of the Eleventh Hour it somehow 'felt' like Who, a feeling I havn't had for some time,as I was one who was getting heartily tired of Tennant's Doctor, (not knocking him as such but there weren't that many high points the last couple of series) to me Matt's Doctor was a breath of fresh air. He's alien, unpredictable, and can't be categorized. In other words he's far more like the earlier Doctors than Tennant was and that made it for me. I thought some episodes weren't up to the same standard as others but that always happens, and on the whole I was riveted to it and looked forward to it all week, which hasn't happened for a while. So while Tenth Doctor fans have had it good the last few years, it was time for a change and I'm happy!
Couldn't have said it better myself. Matt Smith and Series 5 has made me enjoy Who again. I was never much of a David Tennant fan, and while there were some very good episodes, overall I haven't rated the last few series that much and watched it because it was Who (and I can't not watch Who !!) but without a great deal of enthusiasm. I loved Series 5, Matt's Doctor IS The Doctor as far as I'm concerned, far more than David's ever was, and long may he continure in the role
Matt has been overwhelming praised in the role, even by some of the harshest critics of series 5.
Speaking for myself, I thought after 30 years I thought no one would ever take over from Davison as my fave Doctor, but Smith managed to do so effortlessly.
I have no doubt the wider audience would still rate Tennant higher at this point, but then he did three and a bit series so looms large in peoples minds, I do think with time Smith could be regarded just as highly though.
This is the thing though for me, I like Matt Smith and Karen Gillian, I thought they both did a good job.
My problem with series 5 was the overall feel of it, 1-4 had an epic movie quality to it which quite often had me on the edge of my seat.
I didn't feel that at all with series 5, I kept watching hoping it would improve but it never did and for the first time since it came back I am not even looking forward to the Christmas special or series 6 for that matter.
Someone mentioned it was the first time that they felt it was real Doctor Who since before the new series, would that be when the show got cancelled due to lack of viewers by any chance?
He ought to be. He's one of the best they've had in the role imho.
Uh, yeah. That didn't happen. Nothing remotely like that happened in Series 5.
Loved Series 5. Greater imagination, clever ideas, more complex character relationships, stronger plot arcs, higher level of mystery and intrigue. And some great dialogue.
That's exactly how I feel about it. Plus, I loved the almost Spielbergian bounce that it had. You could definitely tell the influence in Moffat's writing.
It was when the show was cancelled because the BBC wanted to get rid of it for a variety of reasons, most of them not connected to ratings. The ratings fell because they buried the show opposite Coronation Street: that was an effect of that decision, not the cause.
The 1989 series was the last time Who was consistently worth watching every week until 2010.
IN YOUR OPINION! it's a very simple concept.
The fact that the ratings and AI figures where very similar for the 5 years the programme has been back should say a lot.
just because one person individually doesn't like a season / concept / character / or incarnation of the Doctor it does not mean that opinion is fact
and I prefer season 5 too!
Give it another year and i'm sure some opinions will be swayed. By then we should all have come to terms with what Smith's Doctor is all about. I don't think it's far to draw comparisons between the 2 though cos to be honest, Tennant brings a kind of style to Doctor Who that Smith cannot hope to match so he'll do it in his own way. Personally I think i;ll always favour DT's doctor because my obsession with Doctor kicked right into gear during his reign.
It always felt a bit different as it was shot in HD so even in SD the picture looked so much more crisp and pristine, hardly a negative factor there, but I don't know if anyone else noticed this but while the music and the soundtrack didn't detract from the dialogue in the RTD error there were times in Series 5 when I couldn't hear any dialogue for the music which for me was a let down.
Throughout the series I've been watching and while it's been enjoyable enough something hasn't been quite right. I'm finding Matt Smith's style hard to get to grips with. I'm not saying it's bad or Smith is a bad Doctor, I'm just saying I'm finding it hard to shake off the shackles of David Tennant, who brought so much pizazz and enthusiasm to the role. I just don't think Matt brings in the same.
For instance... I've seen a trailer for the Christmas Special and the line that grabs me is "I'm the ghost of Christmas Past" There's just something dry and wooden about the line and I just fail to be inspired by it. Not that it stops me from wanting to see the episode and more than open to be proved wrong in the context of the actual episode.
As for the claims that it's more like "proper who" well I've experienced that feeling a few times in New Who so I don't think Moffat should be feeling any kind of pressure to try and bring us "proper who". He has his own vision for way of doings and as far as I'm concerned it's up to us to "put up for shut up".
so what? What has been a long time fan of the programme got to do with peoples opinions?
and I've been fan since my earliest memories and I still prefer Tennant over Smith
Sure I wasn't an obsesive fan of Doctor Who in the classic years but there's nothing wrong at all in preferring one Doctor over another so long as you accept that the change comes with the show.
I always looked forward to new series' but time and time again RTD disappointed with his stories, while other writers did a much better job. In fact the only RTD story I really enjoyed was 'Turn Left' which I thought was fantastic.
Like others have said, series 5 made me feel like we finally had the series we loved back. Can't wait for the next series and the Xmas special.
One final point to the OP. The viewing figures don't lie - it's retained it's popularity and also built on it.
indeed, that really in a nutshell is what this whole thread boils down to. Most viewers loved series 5, a small number didn't...was ever thus, since it is impossible to produce a series that pleases everyone.
It just annoys me that so many of those that didn't care for this series seem to think there is something special and unique about their dissatisfaction, when really it isn't, beyond the fact that in many cases they have been on other side of the fence till this year.
The other thing i find sad is even though there was a lot of personal nastiness aimed at RTD by the detractors of his era, never did it seem to be the case that it's detractors actually wanted the show to fail, as though to prove some sort of point. Can't say the same for some of series 5 detractors, who even in this thread seem to relish the idea of the show being axed purely because it didn't work for them...
For me series 5 was consistent in quality. I didn't find it overblown and as cringeworthy as some of the stuff in series 2-4.
Having said that, I do like series 1-4, but will pick and choose the episodes I watch in future, whereas I can sit through all the episodes of series 5.
best
Completly agree.
The problem isn't the quality of the programme. It's so called fans with a false sense of ownership towards the programme