the point was for someone who has to install 1 tv every few years if that, drilling 1 set of 4 standard mount holes in a concrete or brick/mortar wall is just not that hard with a normal drill. its 4 holes. one time. unless you move the tv, the next tv can use the same 4 holes...and on and on...
It still makes no sense at all - unless it's a really crappy wall, then it's unlikely that you will be able to drill it at all with a non-hammer drill.
Just because your house has easily drilled walls doesn't mean that others have - MOST don't.
It still makes no sense at all - unless it's a really crappy wall, then it's unlikely that you will be able to drill it at all with a non-hammer drill.
Just because your house has easily drilled walls doesn't mean that others have - MOST don't.
it makes perfect sense, a drill bit costs less than a new hammer drill for anyone who only has a regular drill.
again, you seem to think houses are built with exotic concrete or that concrete is so strong that masonry bits are useless against it. sorry, i've tested this in real life, and it is possible.
again, you seem to think houses are built with exotic concrete or that concrete is so strong that masonry bits are useless against it. sorry, i've tested this in real life, and it is possible.
Some houses ARE built of tough materials. My last house, a perfectly ordinary looking 1930's semi detached, had the hardest bricks I have ever found. A normal non hammer drill would not touch them at all. A "hammer" drill would make slow and noisy progress. Only an SDS drill made any sensible progress drilling the walls of that house.
But my house before that, built with an inner skin of thermalite blocks, you could have practically just hammered a plug straight into the wall, or used a screwdriver like a bradawl to make the hole for the plug, they were that soft.
not likely that tough, again, i'm not saying it won't take you minutes to make a hole, but it can be done with a decent masonry bit. concrete is not magic, especially that used in housing stock, never mind in uk housing stock.
contractors don't use special concrete for bunkers or whatever in houses. no contractor is that generous.
not likely that tough, again, i'm not saying it won't take you minutes to make a hole, but it can be done with a decent masonry bit. concrete is not magic, especially that used in housing stock, never mind in uk housing stock.
contractors don't use special concrete for bunkers or whatever in houses. no contractor is that generous.
Concrete isn't the issue it's the aggregate used in it's basic make up. Cement is very soft, it's the aggegrate used in the basic mix which can be megahard. Hit a pebble it will take the tip off a masonry drill in minutes. Pneumatic drills shatter these in seconds, cam action drills try to drill into them (it doesn't work).
afaik there is little or no concrete used in a standard UK home, It's Brick which can be megahard or soft. Internal walls on outside walls are usually Breeze Blocks which is strong in compression but is as soft as butter to drill into. Mortar courses between the brick is very easy to drill but fixings are equally weak.
Try drilling glass and contrasting this with hitting it with a hammer.
Try drilling into bluebrick or a concrete lintel over a window. A standard hammer drill has no chance even if you don't hit the steel reinforcement. Even worse is if the lintel happens to be steel.
brick is easy, there is no aggregate in brick and you always have the option of drilling into the mortar...which doesn't have any aggregate btw. mortar is weak relatively but for a tv mount, at the correct depth with a concrete anchor it is more than enough to hold a tv.
and again, in most homes, you can drill into the concrete, you have to go to exceptional cases to even claim it isn't possible. how many houses are made with blue brick. even that i'm sure would drill over a few minutes. i think your complaints are based on what a contractor or installer needs which was never my claim, sure they can't spend a few minutes per hole, it woudln't make sense for someone who needs to get the job done asap, but for anyone else who just has to install 1, you can take the chance and probably it will work.
it makes perfect sense, a drill bit costs less than a new hammer drill for anyone who only has a regular drill.
The number of drill bits you'd burn out while trying to make a single hole makes it somewhat less cost effective
again, you seem to think houses are built with exotic concrete or that concrete is so strong that masonry bits are useless against it. sorry, i've tested this in real life, and it is possible.
I've tested in in real life as well, in hundreds of different properties - very few would be possible with a non hammer drill. Most walls are brick, concrete is relatively unusual - but decent brick is EXTREMELY hard to drill.
brick is easy, there is no aggregate in brick and you always have the option of drilling into the mortar...which doesn't have any aggregate btw. mortar is weak relatively but for a tv mount, at the correct depth with a concrete anchor it is more than enough to hold a tv.
and again, in most homes, you can drill into the concrete, you have to go to exceptional cases to even claim it isn't possible. how many houses are made with blue brick. even that i'm sure would drill over a few minutes. i think your complaints are based on what a contractor or installer needs which was never my claim, sure they can't spend a few minutes per hole, it woudln't make sense for someone who needs to get the job done asap, but for anyone else who just has to install 1, you can take the chance and probably it will work.
I wish I could send you round to my Son In Laws, Even a sds+ pro drill struggled to punch a 10mm hole through the outer wall. His bricks are extremely hard. As for reinforced concrete, many years ago as an apprentice had the job of running copper earthing strip up the concrete structures in a YEB 66kV colliery substation. In the end had to use explosive anchors.
brick is easy, there is no aggregate in brick and you always have the option of drilling into the mortar...which doesn't have any aggregate btw. mortar is weak relatively but for a tv mount, at the correct depth with a concrete anchor it is more than enough to hold a tv.
Brick can be extremely hard, it is in my house. You can't easily find the mortar when the brick is behind plaster.
I wish I could send you round to my Son In Laws, Even a sds+ pro drill struggled to punch a 10mm hole through the outer wall. His bricks are extremely hard. As for reinforced concrete, many years ago as an apprentice had the job of running copper earthing strip up the concrete structures in a YEB 66kV colliery substation. In the end had to use explosive anchors.
yeesh, no one is talking about going through walls, we are talking holes for concrete anchors for just a tv. again, you can always claim an installer or someone who needs to drill a 10 foot hole into a reinforced concrete bunker is going to need a hammer drill, but that kind missing the point to miss the point..it was never about that
yeesh, no one is talking about going through walls, we are talking holes for concrete anchors for just a tv. again, you can always claim an installer or someone who needs to drill a 10 foot hole into a reinforced concrete bunker is going to need a hammer drill, but that kind missing the point to miss the point..it was never about that
He never suggested that, he was talking about small fixing bolts (as we have been all the time).
yeesh, no one is talking about going through walls, we are talking holes for concrete anchors for just a tv. again, you can always claim an installer or someone who needs to drill a 10 foot hole into a reinforced concrete bunker is going to need a hammer drill, but that kind missing the point to miss the point..it was never about that
Completely missed the point, the holes in the concrete structure were for no 10 Rawlplugs and 3" screws, no different to you would use at home. And where is all this concrete coming from, as said before Concrete is only used to build walls in a tiny minority of houses. It's non standard construction and such properties aren't normally mortgageable.
yeesh, no one is talking about going through walls, we are talking holes for concrete anchors for just a tv. again, you can always claim an installer or someone who needs to drill a 10 foot hole into a reinforced concrete bunker is going to need a hammer drill, but that kind missing the point to miss the point..it was never about that
We had a major job getting fixing holes (50mm/10mm) for my sons TV, that was using a heavy duty hammer drill, burnt out 3 drill bits, later found they were Red bricks.
They used the same bricks on certain walls in our house, made a simple job very difficult when using normal day to day DIY tools.
you can pretend concrete is blunting all your tools if you want thats fine, i've tried enough of this to know you are either using sub par equipment or simply exaggeration. we are talking 4 holes for home mounting. i don't know what you are going on about, but i'l let you go on if you want... i'm done.
My final word is get yourself an SDS drill and give it a try. I can assure you, that you won't even consider any other drill for masonry work once you have tried one.
Or you can waste your time and make a lot of noise trying inferior tools if you like taking a long time to do a job and like making a lot of noise to annoy your neighbours.
Just an example. Yesterday I drilled through a 900mm stone wall. It took less than 5 minutes with one of my long SDS bits. There's no way any other sort of drill would have done that.
That would be you - we are both professionals who have drilled holes in hundreds of houses - and can't allow such incorrect advice to go unchallenged,
you can pretend concrete is blunting all your tools if you want thats fine, i've tried enough of this to know you are either using sub par equipment or simply exaggeration. we are talking 4 holes for home mounting. i don't know what you are going on about, but i'l let you go on if you want... i'm done.
Where do you keep getting 'concrete' from?, we have all the time mentioned brick walls, or occasionally stone. Incidentally, the absolute worst are probably limestone walls, where hammer drills are useless as well, and only SDS will work..
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It still makes no sense at all - unless it's a really crappy wall, then it's unlikely that you will be able to drill it at all with a non-hammer drill.
Just because your house has easily drilled walls doesn't mean that others have - MOST don't.
it makes perfect sense, a drill bit costs less than a new hammer drill for anyone who only has a regular drill.
again, you seem to think houses are built with exotic concrete or that concrete is so strong that masonry bits are useless against it. sorry, i've tested this in real life, and it is possible.
Some houses ARE built of tough materials. My last house, a perfectly ordinary looking 1930's semi detached, had the hardest bricks I have ever found. A normal non hammer drill would not touch them at all. A "hammer" drill would make slow and noisy progress. Only an SDS drill made any sensible progress drilling the walls of that house.
But my house before that, built with an inner skin of thermalite blocks, you could have practically just hammered a plug straight into the wall, or used a screwdriver like a bradawl to make the hole for the plug, they were that soft.
contractors don't use special concrete for bunkers or whatever in houses. no contractor is that generous.
Concrete isn't the issue it's the aggregate used in it's basic make up. Cement is very soft, it's the aggegrate used in the basic mix which can be megahard. Hit a pebble it will take the tip off a masonry drill in minutes. Pneumatic drills shatter these in seconds, cam action drills try to drill into them (it doesn't work).
afaik there is little or no concrete used in a standard UK home, It's Brick which can be megahard or soft. Internal walls on outside walls are usually Breeze Blocks which is strong in compression but is as soft as butter to drill into. Mortar courses between the brick is very easy to drill but fixings are equally weak.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staffordshire_blue_brick
Try drilling glass and contrasting this with hitting it with a hammer.
Try drilling into bluebrick or a concrete lintel over a window. A standard hammer drill has no chance even if you don't hit the steel reinforcement. Even worse is if the lintel happens to be steel.
and again, in most homes, you can drill into the concrete, you have to go to exceptional cases to even claim it isn't possible. how many houses are made with blue brick. even that i'm sure would drill over a few minutes. i think your complaints are based on what a contractor or installer needs which was never my claim, sure they can't spend a few minutes per hole, it woudln't make sense for someone who needs to get the job done asap, but for anyone else who just has to install 1, you can take the chance and probably it will work.
The number of drill bits you'd burn out while trying to make a single hole makes it somewhat less cost effective
I've tested in in real life as well, in hundreds of different properties - very few would be possible with a non hammer drill. Most walls are brick, concrete is relatively unusual - but decent brick is EXTREMELY hard to drill.
I wish I could send you round to my Son In Laws, Even a sds+ pro drill struggled to punch a 10mm hole through the outer wall. His bricks are extremely hard. As for reinforced concrete, many years ago as an apprentice had the job of running copper earthing strip up the concrete structures in a YEB 66kV colliery substation. In the end had to use explosive anchors.
Brick can be extremely hard, it is in my house. You can't easily find the mortar when the brick is behind plaster.
Plus it's really best if you don't insert plugs in the mortar, it's far less secure than the brick.
yeesh, no one is talking about going through walls, we are talking holes for concrete anchors for just a tv. again, you can always claim an installer or someone who needs to drill a 10 foot hole into a reinforced concrete bunker is going to need a hammer drill, but that kind missing the point to miss the point..it was never about that
He never suggested that, he was talking about small fixing bolts (as we have been all the time).
Completely missed the point, the holes in the concrete structure were for no 10 Rawlplugs and 3" screws, no different to you would use at home. And where is all this concrete coming from, as said before Concrete is only used to build walls in a tiny minority of houses. It's non standard construction and such properties aren't normally mortgageable.
We had a major job getting fixing holes (50mm/10mm) for my sons TV, that was using a heavy duty hammer drill, burnt out 3 drill bits, later found they were Red bricks.
They used the same bricks on certain walls in our house, made a simple job very difficult when using normal day to day DIY tools.
you can pretend concrete is blunting all your tools if you want thats fine, i've tried enough of this to know you are either using sub par equipment or simply exaggeration. we are talking 4 holes for home mounting. i don't know what you are going on about, but i'l let you go on if you want... i'm done.
Or you can waste your time and make a lot of noise trying inferior tools if you like taking a long time to do a job and like making a lot of noise to annoy your neighbours.
Just an example. Yesterday I drilled through a 900mm stone wall. It took less than 5 minutes with one of my long SDS bits. There's no way any other sort of drill would have done that.
That would be you
Where do you keep getting 'concrete' from?, we have all the time mentioned brick walls, or occasionally stone. Incidentally, the absolute worst are probably limestone walls, where hammer drills are useless as well, and only SDS will work..