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Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere

Callum_BrownCallum_Brown Posts: 745
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in Doctor Who #1
As the Missy>Mistress>Master was guessed fairly quickly by a lot of the fandom, surely Moff must have known this. Why, therefore, wasn't Missy's name just kept as Michelle Gomez's original role as Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere?

It would've prevented everyone guessing the twist and, I believe, retained the same amount of mystery and intrigue surrounding the character.

Perhaps I'm missing something but I'm surprised that Moffat didn't say that the title of Missy was too obvious, with Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere being much more vague and subtle. What do you think?

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    doctor blue boxdoctor blue box Posts: 7,341
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    #2
    I think it worked quite well actually. For casual viewers who don't think about this kind of thing too much, it would have been a good reveal, along the lines of 'oh yeah, missy>mistress>master, cool' whereas for the fandom, it was a clue so hidden in plain sight that many people on here were suggesting that whatever missy was she would definitely not be the master just because such a thing would seem so obvious.

    Basically it cleverly fooled both type's of fan one way or another.
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    Xmas_TrenzaloreXmas_Trenzalore Posts: 550
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    #3
    Perhaps he made it obvious SO we would work it out easily.

    That way, the concept could settle in amongst the fandom for a while, and lessening some the impact to anyone who might have been outraged by changing the Master's gender.

    One of the arguments against changing The Doctor's/Master's gender, is that its just a stunt to shock everyone and get views. If we expected it, you could hardly use that complaint.

    Or maybe he just went for a simpler twist just for a change. Could be over-thinking it. Then again, Deep Breath was meticulously constructed as one big guilt trip forcing people to accept an older Doctor.
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 500
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    #4
    It was actually such a fairly obvious reveal that people started to doubt it could be the Missy > Mistress > Master scenario.
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    Callum_BrownCallum_Brown Posts: 745
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    #5
    Ha, yes, I didn't think it could be a double bluff. Very interesting, thank you.
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    cezzycezzy Posts: 4,840
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    #6
    I quite like the thought of Missy being the Master but what if Missy is acting as a decoy & the real Master is her assistant Seb? Can't claim it to be my idea, my son suggested it because Seb has some similar personality traits to John Simm's Master. It's certainly a point worth considering?
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    doctor blue boxdoctor blue box Posts: 7,341
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    #7
    cezzy wrote: »
    I quite like the thought of Missy being the Master but what if Missy is acting as a decoy & the real Master is her assistant Seb? Can't claim it to be my idea, my son suggested it because Seb has some similar personality traits to John Simm's Master. It's certainly a point worth considering?
    They've made her so like the master, i'd be disappointed if they were to backtrack on the point now. I am definitely interested in finding out more about seb though as he blatantly understands all of what is going on, and seems to be enjoying himself every bit as much as Missy, so whoever he is, he must be evil like her.
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    CorwinCorwin Posts: 16,607
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    #8
    doctor blue box wrote: »
    They've made her so like the master, i'd be disappointed if they were to backtrack on the point now. I am definitely interested in finding out more about seb though as he blatantly understands all of what is going on, and seems to be enjoying himself every bit as much as Missy, so whoever he is, he must be evil like her.

    My guess is Seb (like Gus was) is the Computer.
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    doctor blue boxdoctor blue box Posts: 7,341
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    #9
    Corwin wrote: »
    My guess is Seb (like Gus was) is the Computer.
    Could be, we have yet to see him outside the 'nethersphere'
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    performingmonkperformingmonk Posts: 20,086
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    #10
    In some promo shots she looks like a female version of Capaldi's Doctor, which works wonderfully. :)
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    johnnysaucepnjohnnysaucepn Posts: 6,775
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    #11
    Seb could either be a real dead person that just happened to be compliant, unquestioning and good at admin, or a construct of the Matrix. He may just be a facade, like Mr. Popplewick in Trial of a Time Lord (disclaimer: only going by descriptions, haven't watched that episode in a long time.)
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    plateletplatelet Posts: 26,386
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    #12
    Corwin wrote: »
    My guess is Seb (like Gus was) is the Computer.

    I'm thinking SEB: Someone Else's Brain (or Body maybe?)

    a nod to Douglas Adams SEP field
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    slouchingthatchslouchingthatch Posts: 2,351
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    #13
    doctor blue box wrote: »
    I think it worked quite well actually. For casual viewers who don't think about this kind of thing too much, it would have been a good reveal, along the lines of 'oh yeah, missy>mistress>master, cool' whereas for the fandom, it was a clue so hidden in plain sight that many people on here were suggesting that whatever missy was she would definitely not be the master just because such a thing would seem so obvious.

    Basically it cleverly fooled both type's of fan one way or another.
    Yep. Had me fooled. My first thought was to draw the conclusion that Missy = Mistress = Master, only to immediately discount it as being too obvious. Another example of Moffat's love of hiding answers in plain slight, this time using a simple double bluff.
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    adams66adams66 Posts: 3,945
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    #14
    slouchingthatch wrote: »
    Yep. Had me fooled. My first thought was to draw the conclusion that Missy = Mistress = Master, only to immediately discount it as being too obvious. Another example of Moffat's love of hiding answers in plain slight, this time using a simple double bluff.

    I'm another who thought that Missy / Master link was too obvious, especially knowing Moffat's love of complexity. I called that one wrong!
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    slouchingthatchslouchingthatch Posts: 2,351
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    #15
    adams66 wrote: »
    I'm another who thought that Missy / Master link was too obvious, especially knowing Moffat's love of complexity. I called that one wrong!
    Be a dull place if we were always right, eh? :-)
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    garbage456garbage456 Posts: 8,225
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    #16
    Callum_Brown wrote: »
    As the Missy>Mistress>Master was guessed fairly quickly by a lot of the fandom, surely Moff must have known this. Why, therefore, wasn't Missy's name just kept as Michelle Gomez's original role as Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere?

    It would've prevented everyone guessing the twist and, I believe, retained the same amount of mystery and intrigue surrounding the character.

    Perhaps I'm missing something but I'm surprised that Moffat didn't say that the title of Missy was too obvious, with Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere being much more vague and subtle. What do you think?

    He might of as well called the episode the return of the master .
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    Ship's SurgeonShip's Surgeon Posts: 15
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    #17
    adams66 wrote: »
    I'm another who thought that Missy / Master link was too obvious, especially knowing Moffat's love of complexity. I called that one wrong!

    Way back in time in classic Who The Master was hidden under the name of Reverend Magister in The Dæmons. Many didn't see that coming so is this a Moffat nod to history?

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dæmons
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    adams66adams66 Posts: 3,945
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    #18
    Ship's Surgeon wrote: »
    Way back in time in classic Who The Master was hidden under the name of Reverend Magister in The Dæmons. Many didn't see that coming so is this a Moffat nod to history?

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dæmons

    Huh? The first time we see Rev Magister it's clearly Roger Delgado. As I remember we even get the little Master musical motif. So you can't really say that no-one saw that coming. Also, the Master had been in every story that season and was credited in Radio Times. Not really hidden...
    Better 'no-one guessed that it was the Master' scenarios might include a number of the 80s Master stories where his involvement was hidden from the public by the use of anagrams of Anthony Ainley's name on the credits.
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    ArthurJBearArthurJBear Posts: 6,909
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    #19
    Seb is the RANI ;-)
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