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Roger Mugford on The One Show
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Did anyone see Roger Mugford on the One Show last Friday? He was helping a lady with a Red Setter to stop her dog chasing livestock. His technique was to allow the dog to go near sheep (on a longline) but if the dog showed any interest in the sheep (other than fear avoidance) then a can full of pebbles would be thrown towards the dog. The idea was to instil a fear reaction to sheep in the dog. After a few minutes (of probably highly-edited TV!) the dog apparently tried to avoid the sheep or at least was not trying to chase them or show much interest in them. But it was difficult to tell exactly what was going on as there were plenty of other things going on in the background that could have overshadowed the presence of sheep.
The clip did not have any "don't try this at home" warnings or "seek professional advice before you try this" disclaimers, nor was there any information on the need for very good timing when dishing out this sort of punishment. I was quite surprised (in a bad way) that Roger Mugford was happy for this abridged version of behavioural modification to be shown on prime time TV without any sort of warnings. I just have visions of rattle cans now being used up & down the country for all sorts of behaviour problems:eek:.
I don't know how effective this was on the dog in question nor was there any information about the dog's general behaviour, but I can imagine the effect that this sort of technique could have on a much more reactive dog or a dog with noise phobias ~ it could potentially create a huge fear reaction to sheep leading to fear aggression, attack sheep etc ~ which would be a much bigger problem than just chasing & rounding the sheep up!
Anyone else see this or have any views?
The clip did not have any "don't try this at home" warnings or "seek professional advice before you try this" disclaimers, nor was there any information on the need for very good timing when dishing out this sort of punishment. I was quite surprised (in a bad way) that Roger Mugford was happy for this abridged version of behavioural modification to be shown on prime time TV without any sort of warnings. I just have visions of rattle cans now being used up & down the country for all sorts of behaviour problems:eek:.
I don't know how effective this was on the dog in question nor was there any information about the dog's general behaviour, but I can imagine the effect that this sort of technique could have on a much more reactive dog or a dog with noise phobias ~ it could potentially create a huge fear reaction to sheep leading to fear aggression, attack sheep etc ~ which would be a much bigger problem than just chasing & rounding the sheep up!
Anyone else see this or have any views?
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Comments
It's usually when he is selling something, such as his services or products.
A while back there was a very similar clip when he was busy selling remote spray collars (masterplus) to resolve the same livestock problem.
He didn't bother to mention at that time that the dog he was showing had been having a considerable amount of training prior to the "instant cure" clip.
As you say very few owners would have the timing necessary to achieve this correctly and it would also be highly unsuitable for some dogs, and highly ineffective with some others!
It could also be highly unsuitable and even dangerous in some situations e.g. aggression or chasing ridden horses when the horse could be more frightened by the noise than the dog, with dire consequences, including for the rider.
Additionally the reason remote collars are necessary for some dogs is that the really smart, determined ones will behave very differently when off lead as to how they might behave when on a long or even trailing line.
I don't know about now but he used to charge clients £5, on top of all the other charges, for an old tin can with pebbles which anyone could make for free!
The situation you describe of rattle cans being used (badly) up and down the country was very much the case in the early 90's when he was promoting his training book like mad, the message being "Don't say no, when a rattle can does it better"
It's a technique beloved by Dog Borstal too.
I have seen these cans, or bottels, used very very close to dogs' ears, including by Mugford, when they are not just a sound aversion but actually painful, not only if there is contact but just from the loud noise that close.
Even to a preson that can hurt, never mind to a dog's more sensitive hearing.
Dogs should always be on a lead when there are livestock around, however supposedly well trained they are. And if he was on a lead, he couldn't chase the animals anyway.
While the "livestock" protection clip apparently involved a sheep, to dogs "livestock" in terms of things that are fun to chase (with more, or less, aggression being involved) can include wild deer, rabbits, squirrels, other dogs, cats, waterfowl, crows, pigeons,children, joggers, cyclists etc etc, so it is not just a question of having your dog on lead if walking through sheep in the country but rather it would require never having your dog off lead, even in enclosed city parks.
That in itself can create other behavioural problems due to pent-up energy and frustration
I agree that these short edited clips presented to the public as "cure-alls" are so dangerous. As much as I disagree with CM's methods, at least his shows do have the "don't try this at home" disclaimers.
I suspect that the problem with the setter in the clip was more that he got so excited with the urge to chase livestock, rabbits, deer etc that he didn't come back & the owner was left for hours trying to catch him. I didn't get the impression that the setter showed any actual aggression to sheep, more that it was just highly excited when the sheep ran away & gave him the opportunity to chase.
Another of my bugbears with this clip was that the owner had a longline attached to the dog's collar but at no stage was it pointed out that this was dangerous. At least when Roger Mugford was handling the dog he did have the line on a harness.
If the technique led to the dog being scared/not interested specifically re sheep though... would the owner be expected to go around rattling pebbles for every species of animal
Basically yes, although you could pair it with a leave command which would cut down some the generalisation training needed and in many cases the owner would have to maintain/repeat the treatment periodically so it's negative effect didn't wear off.