Surely there should be a charge for habitual missed appointments? That is the biggest issue I believe.
My own surgery has approx 150-200 missed appointments every month.
And for non-attenders & non-payers, they should be allowed to strike patients off their list. At the moment, they can cry 'human rights' & get reinstated & continue being a pain & burden to the rest of the patients!
I agree with penalties for people who repeatedly skip appointments without warning, apology or cancelling. Somehow, somewhere people do need to start understanding the responsibilities they have for their own healthcare and wellbeing. People who repeatedly miss appointments would be the first to kick off if they couldn't get one 'on demand'. I don't believe in charging people for GP appointments, though. Cutting unnecessary bureaucracy and waste within the NHS would be a far more effective way of saving money.
Thing is though, is it that big a problem? I have to attend my GP quite often at the moment and I never get called in at the time of the appointment - it's always later. If all these no-shows were a problem, surely I would be seen on time all the time? Also, the practice posts the turn-up rate for patients in the surgery waiting room and the last notice I saw had a 97% attendance rate. Obviously this is anecdotal evidence but I wonder just how big a problem non-attendance really is.
My local health centre has a display above the reception desk with a figure for non-attendance in the past week and it's always in double figures. I have no way of knowing what percentage that is. Surely the main reason appointments start later and later as the day goes on is that each appointment is officially limited to 10 minutes, but in reality it's impossible to deal with a patient in that time. So the first one overruns by five minutes, then the second one starts five minutes late and overruns by five minutes, the third starts ten minutes late and overruns, and so on.
My doctor's practice now encourages online booking, which means it's easier to manage your appointments and goes a long way towards eliminating unncecessary phone calls. I wonder whether widespread use of online booking would reduce no-shows because people would be more likely to inform the practice of a cancellation if they could do it online.
I would feel mightily p*ssed off if I had to pay £25 on the very rare occasions when I needed to see a doctor, it is bad enough I have to pay nearly £9 for a prescription, that would bring the whole visit up to over £30. It would also put people off from seeing them about things that may not seem that important but could end up saving someone's life.
They got into power and immediately made University education elitist. Gordon Brown decimated private pensions for millions of voters. I agree, they would certainly run with it.
I totally disagree with the proposed charge and doubt very much it will be implemented. Fine patients who miss appointments by all means, far more effective and fair.
Woah, how did they make University Education elitist? Don't the facts support the absolute opposite, that in fact more people went to Uni than ever before and from a more diverse range of backgrounds than ever before?
But that aside their policies are totally opposed to privatisation of the NHS or charging in this way. The Tories have allowed this to happen by letting GP's have control of the commissioning budgets and essentially letting private organisations run the NHS.
But the effects were not to make University Education more elitist.
And it didn't actually cost poorer families any more until their child had a degree and was earning enough for the automatic repayments to kick in. In effect it is a graduate tax.
What Labour did with their "must have 50% going to University" messed up and made degrees worthless and caused all this graduate unemployment that we see. Before they got into power yes it was elitist but it was elitist for the brightest/more intelligent not for even the thickest(and believe me there are some that should not be doing a degree). After all they had to make up degrees to get the rest of those that wouldn't have made it in previously which is why so many seem to do "soft" subjects.
I would feel mightily p*ssed off if I had to pay £25 on the very rare occasions when I needed to see a doctor, it is bad enough I have to pay nearly £9 for a prescription, that would bring the whole visit up to over £30. It would also put people off from seeing them about things that may not seem that important but could end up saving someone's life.
What Labour did with their "must have 50% going to University" messed up and made degrees worthless and caused all this graduate unemployment that we see. Before they got into power yes it was elitist but it was elitist for the brightest/more intelligent not for even the thickest(and believe me there are some that should not be doing a degree). After all they had to make up degrees to get the rest of those that wouldn't have made it in previously which is why so many seem to do "soft" subjects.
That too! I dread to think how many unemployed graduates, with worthless degrees, there are and knee deep in debt at the beginning of adulthood. In know of quite a few. Demoralising crap. Saved Labour doing anything about creating proper employment, well apart from the hundreds of thousands of civil servants they manufactured jobs for, of course. Get as many into uni as possible knowing full well there would be a lack of employment at the end of it..
I agree with you first paragraph but many people need to see a Doctor frequently. A & E and drop in centres will have to pick up the slack. What next charges for that too? It will never be implicated so no worries.
It's stupid idea as people just wouldn't go to their GP and when the condition became serious enough they would just ring for an ambulance to take them to A&E.
And at A&E they would say "Oh why have you left it this long before seeing someone about it." *rolleyes*
That too! I dread to think how many unemployed graduates, with worthless degrees, there are and knee deep in debt at the beginning of adulthood. In know of quite a few. Demoralising crap. Saved Labour doing anything about creating proper employment, well apart from the hundreds of thousands of civil servants they manufactured jobs for, of course. Get as many into uni as possible knowing full well there would be a lack of employment at the end of it..
Wait? So now you're saying that Labour's University policy wasn't elitist enough?
What they should do and I think most people would endorse this, is make people who fail to show up for an appointment pay and make it so that they cannot book another appointment *until* they have paid for the missed appointment. My dentist operates a scheme not dissimilar to this and she tells me that patients rarely miss appointments these days
Of course, if they do want to do this, that's fine as well but they had better make sure they see me on time, not 5/ 10/ 15 minutes late as is normal, I don't enjoy having my time wasted either.
You are banned from that dentist's surgery, as far as I know, so have to call up and try and get accepted at the next-nearest one.
As for emergency home visits, this service can be provided by a local medical centre based on postcodes and would not have an impact on or be related to regular GP appointments.
Yes you have to call up another NHS dentist and try and register but in most areas you are lucky if any are taking on patients. Hence people who are banned end up not having a dentist in some cases.
As for emergency home visits, that isn't how it works. Your practice is responsible for some of the home visits, it is why practices have catchment areas. To make sure GP's who have to do visits aren't covering huge areas.
But there are other practical issues with banning patients from practices for missed appointments. For example what if a patient comes out of hospital and needs daily post operative care from their practice nurse? Wound management lets say. You can't expect them to travel a long distance everyday for wound management, especially as in many cases that might not be possible. Equally you can't necessarily pass the burden of such things onto already overstretched community nurses.
Making people pay to see their GP isn't going to happen.
But although it sounds better, making people who miss appointments pay won't happen, either. You can't make people pay if they don't have the money, so there will be so many exclusions that it'll be useless. It would give extra work to surgeries in administering it all, handling the extra cash, dealing with non-payers. And it would just persuade even more people to go to A&E, instead, where they'd cost us even more than they're doing at the moment.
What I don't understand why people are adamant that missed GP appoints cost the surgeries mega bucks.
The other day I had a 10am apt got there at 9.55, at 10 my GP (who I had the appt with) came out and called in the next patient it wasn't me, that meant the GP was running late, after that patient came out it was only a minute when he came out and called the next patient in, again that wasn't me so he must have been running approx. 20 mins late by this time.
I was the 3rd person he called in at 10.21, now if the person before me had not turned up then surely all he would have done is to have a quick glance at my records and call ME in at around 10.10, how would that have cost the surgery money, all it would have meant that the person behind me waiting would also have been seen 10 minutes earlier and so would the rest of his patients.
If that patients apt was for 9.50 it would have been apparent that when called at 10.10
and he wasn't there, he wasn't coming or even the receptionist should have realised that at 10.10 the 10am patient was there but the 9.50 was a no show and let the GP know so he could have called me in next
Its not as if they have to wade through piles of handwritten notes before seeing a patient all they have to do is to get the correct records up on computer and as I said the next patient was called in only a minute after the last one left.
GPs are doing less and less work with many traditional activities now being performed by HCA or nurses, my Husband has to have regular health checks, up to a couple of years ago this was done by his GP, now its done by the nurse
I agree with penalties for people who repeatedly skip appointments without warning, apology or cancelling. Somehow, somewhere people do need to start understanding the responsibilities they have for their own healthcare and wellbeing. People who repeatedly miss appointments would be the first to kick off if they couldn't get one 'on demand'. I don't believe in charging people for GP appointments, though. Cutting unnecessary bureaucracy and waste within the NHS would be a far more effective way of saving money.
I think that depends on why people miss appointments if we ring up for an appointment today it will be 3-4 weeks before we can be seen, last month when I rang I was told no appointments at all available and I should ring again after the 1st of the month when they might have some cancellations, I did and got an appointment for 4 weeks time. Now either I will be better or dead by then I am thinking, obviously if I m better I will try to cancel the appointment and my husband has orders to let them know if I die. But I can completely see why people may forget.
A non-medical person at my dentist's phones me on the day before an appointment. (I don't think I'm being especially targetted as I've never missed an appointment.) It would seem a particularly efficient way of doing things and needed be too costly.
I'd be happy with a system where you pay 25 that gets refunded if you turn up and doesn't if you miss the appt.
Would you? and what would happen if you were a pensioner or someone on benefits and having to pay £25 up front would leave you without the money for food or utilities or travel, you would need that money NOW not in a couples of weeks time after you had your appointment and were refunded
Would you? and what would happen if you were a pensioner or someone on benefits and having to pay £25 up front would leave you without the money for food or utilities or travel, you would need that money NOW not in a couples of weeks time after you had your appointment and were refunded
For someone on benefits who couldn't afford an upfront fee, if they didn't turn up (without good reason), I would take the money out of their next benefit payment.
Charging for missed appointments seems like a better idea. The problem is, how do you enforce it?
Ask them to pay in advance for their next appointment.
They should, however, be allowed one miss in a year before being charged.
I am confused.
If missed appointments are a problem, why is the doctor always later in seeing me.
£25 is far to much every time someone wants to see a doctor. Doctors are already very well paid. If this went through. They would just be collecting their hefty salary and seeing very few patients.
Charging a fee for a missed GPs appointment may deter those who make a habit of the practice, but to charge whether you turn up or not is preposterous and defeats the claim that the NHS is a free service at the point of need. Its bad enough if you are taken ill at weekends, and its official that the chances of recovery are reduced if you are admitted as a hospital patient
I wonder why so many people miss appointments they've made. Anyhow, the answer isn't to make everyone else pay. I think they should be able to charge those who make a habit of it, though. Some people just think that everything and everyone revolves around them.
They've got a f*****g cheek haven't they, so you ring to get your appointment, get there 5 mins before, and end up waiting 15-20mins to see the doctor and are seen within about 5 minutes, most of the time they aren't interested and fob you off. Now they want this? Whose pockets will this line, NHS, GP's or the pharmaceutical companies?
A non-medical person at my dentist's phones me on the day before an appointment. (I don't think I'm being especially targetted as I've never missed an appointment.) It would seem a particularly efficient way of doing things and needed be too costly.
My dentists rings me to remind the day before and my Doctor's surgery send me a text the day before.
That said, I must be quite lucky with my Doctor because if I ring before 8.30 am I *will* be seen that day by someone. If I want to see the person I call *my* Dr then it takes about 3 weeks.
Comments
My own surgery has approx 150-200 missed appointments every month.
And for non-attenders & non-payers, they should be allowed to strike patients off their list. At the moment, they can cry 'human rights' & get reinstated & continue being a pain & burden to the rest of the patients!
My local health centre has a display above the reception desk with a figure for non-attendance in the past week and it's always in double figures. I have no way of knowing what percentage that is. Surely the main reason appointments start later and later as the day goes on is that each appointment is officially limited to 10 minutes, but in reality it's impossible to deal with a patient in that time. So the first one overruns by five minutes, then the second one starts five minutes late and overruns by five minutes, the third starts ten minutes late and overruns, and so on.
My doctor's practice now encourages online booking, which means it's easier to manage your appointments and goes a long way towards eliminating unncecessary phone calls. I wonder whether widespread use of online booking would reduce no-shows because people would be more likely to inform the practice of a cancellation if they could do it online.
Oh yeah, I should have clarified to only charge them if they're not turning up without providing a good reason.
What Labour did with their "must have 50% going to University" messed up and made degrees worthless and caused all this graduate unemployment that we see. Before they got into power yes it was elitist but it was elitist for the brightest/more intelligent not for even the thickest(and believe me there are some that should not be doing a degree). After all they had to make up degrees to get the rest of those that wouldn't have made it in previously which is why so many seem to do "soft" subjects.
That too! I dread to think how many unemployed graduates, with worthless degrees, there are and knee deep in debt at the beginning of adulthood. In know of quite a few. Demoralising crap. Saved Labour doing anything about creating proper employment, well apart from the hundreds of thousands of civil servants they manufactured jobs for, of course. Get as many into uni as possible knowing full well there would be a lack of employment at the end of it..
I agree with you first paragraph but many people need to see a Doctor frequently. A & E and drop in centres will have to pick up the slack. What next charges for that too? It will never be implicated so no worries.
And at A&E they would say "Oh why have you left it this long before seeing someone about it." *rolleyes*
Wait? So now you're saying that Labour's University policy wasn't elitist enough?
Make your mind up.
Of course, if they do want to do this, that's fine as well but they had better make sure they see me on time, not 5/ 10/ 15 minutes late as is normal, I don't enjoy having my time wasted either.
Yes you have to call up another NHS dentist and try and register but in most areas you are lucky if any are taking on patients. Hence people who are banned end up not having a dentist in some cases.
As for emergency home visits, that isn't how it works. Your practice is responsible for some of the home visits, it is why practices have catchment areas. To make sure GP's who have to do visits aren't covering huge areas.
But there are other practical issues with banning patients from practices for missed appointments. For example what if a patient comes out of hospital and needs daily post operative care from their practice nurse? Wound management lets say. You can't expect them to travel a long distance everyday for wound management, especially as in many cases that might not be possible. Equally you can't necessarily pass the burden of such things onto already overstretched community nurses.
But although it sounds better, making people who miss appointments pay won't happen, either. You can't make people pay if they don't have the money, so there will be so many exclusions that it'll be useless. It would give extra work to surgeries in administering it all, handling the extra cash, dealing with non-payers. And it would just persuade even more people to go to A&E, instead, where they'd cost us even more than they're doing at the moment.
The other day I had a 10am apt got there at 9.55, at 10 my GP (who I had the appt with) came out and called in the next patient it wasn't me, that meant the GP was running late, after that patient came out it was only a minute when he came out and called the next patient in, again that wasn't me so he must have been running approx. 20 mins late by this time.
I was the 3rd person he called in at 10.21, now if the person before me had not turned up then surely all he would have done is to have a quick glance at my records and call ME in at around 10.10, how would that have cost the surgery money, all it would have meant that the person behind me waiting would also have been seen 10 minutes earlier and so would the rest of his patients.
If that patients apt was for 9.50 it would have been apparent that when called at 10.10
and he wasn't there, he wasn't coming or even the receptionist should have realised that at 10.10 the 10am patient was there but the 9.50 was a no show and let the GP know so he could have called me in next
Its not as if they have to wade through piles of handwritten notes before seeing a patient all they have to do is to get the correct records up on computer and as I said the next patient was called in only a minute after the last one left.
GPs are doing less and less work with many traditional activities now being performed by HCA or nurses, my Husband has to have regular health checks, up to a couple of years ago this was done by his GP, now its done by the nurse
I think that depends on why people miss appointments if we ring up for an appointment today it will be 3-4 weeks before we can be seen, last month when I rang I was told no appointments at all available and I should ring again after the 1st of the month when they might have some cancellations, I did and got an appointment for 4 weeks time. Now either I will be better or dead by then I am thinking, obviously if I m better I will try to cancel the appointment and my husband has orders to let them know if I die. But I can completely see why people may forget.
Would you? and what would happen if you were a pensioner or someone on benefits and having to pay £25 up front would leave you without the money for food or utilities or travel, you would need that money NOW not in a couples of weeks time after you had your appointment and were refunded
For someone on benefits who couldn't afford an upfront fee, if they didn't turn up (without good reason), I would take the money out of their next benefit payment.
Ask them to pay in advance for their next appointment.
They should, however, be allowed one miss in a year before being charged.
I am confused.
If missed appointments are a problem, why is the doctor always later in seeing me.
£25 is far to much every time someone wants to see a doctor. Doctors are already very well paid. If this went through. They would just be collecting their hefty salary and seeing very few patients.
My dentists rings me to remind the day before and my Doctor's surgery send me a text the day before.
That said, I must be quite lucky with my Doctor because if I ring before 8.30 am I *will* be seen that day by someone. If I want to see the person I call *my* Dr then it takes about 3 weeks.