Toxic Friendships
Miss-Daisy
Posts: 52 Forum Member
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I was just reading through the thread about why people get into abusive relationships, and the descriptions of partners who initially seemed very normal and charming and even flatteringly over-eager got me thinking of a couple of friends I have had in the past and one woman with whom I am currently friends (I use the term loosely).
While I doubt that an emotionally abusive friend will usually cause as much damage as an emotionally or physically abusive partner, there did seem to be a few parallels. I remember in my when I was twenty having a friend who I initially got on intensely well with. I loved spending time with her. After a couple of months though, the real her outed. She began to make up ludicrous stories –she’d been raped twice, she’d been forced to perform oral sex on another guy, she had overdosed on heroin and LSD(she wasn’t actually on drugs), she had tried to kill herself several times, she had breast cancer but she wasn’t going to get treatment for it because she had nothing to live for, she had woken up naked in a park that morning, her mum was kicking her out of the house... She would sulk if anyone disagreed with her or didn’t give her the attention she craved. When I confronted her about her lies, she spread some nasty untrue rumours about me. She was a very obvious example of histrionic personality disorder.
The woman I am currently friends with is less extreme, but seems to have some narcissistic tendencies. She never loses an opportunity to tell others how great she is –professional, fair, tough, independent, ballsy (she actually uses that word…) –and when other people achieve something she hasn’t, she will try to put them down by making some underhand little comment that she can’t be picked up on, but makes the other person feel crappy. I recently received a promotion and her response was to suggest that I wasn‘t up to it and that she found it very funny that I had got it. I spent the night feeling completely shitty until I considered her other behaviour and realised that perhaps she wasn’t just being “an honest friend.” Everything she does is a performance –she is always trying to prove how different she is to everyone else, how much more opinionated she is, how much more passionate she is.
Anyway, I wondered if other people had experiences of friends who weren’t actually friends at all? Did you initially blame yourself for the problems, and if so, how long did it take you to realise that actually you weren’t to blame? Did you have to end the friendship?
While I doubt that an emotionally abusive friend will usually cause as much damage as an emotionally or physically abusive partner, there did seem to be a few parallels. I remember in my when I was twenty having a friend who I initially got on intensely well with. I loved spending time with her. After a couple of months though, the real her outed. She began to make up ludicrous stories –she’d been raped twice, she’d been forced to perform oral sex on another guy, she had overdosed on heroin and LSD(she wasn’t actually on drugs), she had tried to kill herself several times, she had breast cancer but she wasn’t going to get treatment for it because she had nothing to live for, she had woken up naked in a park that morning, her mum was kicking her out of the house... She would sulk if anyone disagreed with her or didn’t give her the attention she craved. When I confronted her about her lies, she spread some nasty untrue rumours about me. She was a very obvious example of histrionic personality disorder.
The woman I am currently friends with is less extreme, but seems to have some narcissistic tendencies. She never loses an opportunity to tell others how great she is –professional, fair, tough, independent, ballsy (she actually uses that word…) –and when other people achieve something she hasn’t, she will try to put them down by making some underhand little comment that she can’t be picked up on, but makes the other person feel crappy. I recently received a promotion and her response was to suggest that I wasn‘t up to it and that she found it very funny that I had got it. I spent the night feeling completely shitty until I considered her other behaviour and realised that perhaps she wasn’t just being “an honest friend.” Everything she does is a performance –she is always trying to prove how different she is to everyone else, how much more opinionated she is, how much more passionate she is.
Anyway, I wondered if other people had experiences of friends who weren’t actually friends at all? Did you initially blame yourself for the problems, and if so, how long did it take you to realise that actually you weren’t to blame? Did you have to end the friendship?
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Truth to say, they were incredibly self oriented and actually hard as nails underneath, ruthless.
Both of them hurt and confused me and let me down. I felt like a fool, but then, I was, and it's a risk you run when you start a friendship.
One just fell to bits when I realised - she did a couple of really nasty things. The other I kept at arms length, then we both moved but occasionally she contacts me. I know what she's like though, and I don't have to deal on a regular basis.
She dominated what we did, the entire conversation all the time. She was so nasty to a mutual friend in front of us when she was depressed about some awful stuff going on in her life, she told her that we all have shit to deal with, so deal with it, accompanied by much eye rolling. I suppose the attention was taken away from her for a second. The friend she had said it to had been so kind and supportive to her over stuff, she was very hurt.
I realised that she always made me feel like shit when I had been with her, I had been in a longterm relationship like it. I asked if I could talk to her about it, she has ignored me ever since-it is blissful, soooo peaceful. She was a total stress a draining social vampire. However, as I said in the relationship thread, I know, due to other stuff, I make decisions detrimental to myself and have a neon sign flashing, attracting these people and that is my responsibility, which I have recognised. Does not excuse her behaviour, which I think is some kind of other issue.
ETA-after reading Rhumbie's post, that reminds me, these people always play the victim. They start stuff, they finally trip up, then go to pieces.
very man orientated. If a man was on the go she would ditch me in a second,
found out she had also propositioned my bf for sex up the back of a nightclub. As I was very insecureand had little self esteem I stayed pals with her and stayed with my bf at the time (he took her up on her offer )
What ended up killin the friendship was we were on a night out. She went to a guys house though she had a bf at the time. She phoned me at 3am for some reason. Her bf looked up her phone records and confronted her why dhe was phonin me when she was meant to be at mine. She stopped inviting me for nights out and bevame distant as I assumed her bf didnt like her going on nights out with me as I was a bad influence as she did that while on a night out with me
That's sad Nat, you just can't always help how you feel can you?
I knew a girl like your 2nd example. She was fine, as long as everyone deferred to her, and knew their place. As long as I took her advice right down to clothes I wore and my children's education she was perfectly nice.
Apart from the occasional underhand passive aggressive comment. Never outright insults but snide remarks said In a nice voice which couldn't be countered without leaving me looking a knob.
When I decided to try being veggie she disagreed and because I didn't immediately follow her instructions she became really quite vicious. For example she would say how shit I looked and it must be down to my diet. She made up facts and studies about how dangerous it was.
She had a real superiority complex and hated it if she wasn't the skinniest in the group. She would slam anyone prettier or thinner than her as anorexic. Etc etc. thing was - she was also hilarious at times and really entertaining. Although in retrospect her outrageous stories were most likely made up.
it got too much for me in the end, she was so highly strung and such bloody hard work. Everything had to be a drama and she always had to be in the centre. I'm talking grown women not teenagers. Glad I'm rid now.
If that's hows she treats her mates (shagging their boyfriends ) then you don't need mates like that
Nope
Yeah I know. But she was like a sister to me.
Lucky escape.
nat..... she wasn't ..no decent sister would shag her sisters boy friend
I saw you say you have low self esteem ...trust me when I say this
you are better off friendless than having friends like this
Yeah my problem was I thought I was that unlikeable that when someone wanted to be my friend I grabbed a hold of it. My self esteem is still low but not as bad as when I wss a teenager
I’m the same. I’m even more of a sucker if someone is clever as well, because I equate intelligence with self-awareness, and self-awareness means that if they are telling me how great they are, it must be true. So when they start acting weird, I’m sure it must be my fault because it definitely couldn’t be theirs. You end up really doubting your own judgement.
Nat28 and dekaf, your ex-friends sound awful. It sounds like they both really crossed a line.
I thought I was a friend, but really I was just some Greek Chorus to their endless dramas, and if I didn't agree, or protested, it was obviously because I didn't have such a wonderful, delightful but difficult, wild and free nature.
They were both fun though, and interesting to be around, but friends? NO, I was there to serve really.
Watching their eyes glaze over when I had a problem should have been a clue:D
They were really similar in many ways, I've not really thought about that. They both wreaked havoc and seemed to get away with it without a smidge of guilt or self doubt.
Amazing. I was a fool to think they were friends at all.
If it's any consolation, those who have been duped by a psycho, don't beat yourself up about it, psychopaths and sociopaths are often VERY good at fooling people. And if they feed you a sob story or lie about things that have happened to them, it's normal for you to feel sympathy for them, there's nothing wrong with you. We sometimes get stuck in the 'I should have known' mindset or think we ought to have seen the signs, but that puts the emphasis of wrong-doing on the wrong person.
Feel bad for you Nat, horrible.
I was in my early 30's before I woke up and realised that I was better off without anyone than having friends who made me feel upset and angry. I'm better off being lonely than have friends who are toxic. I've learned to actually prefer my own company these days and actually love going out by myself because I can please myself and not feel like I'm having to please someone else or be made to feel second best.
Friends are only friends when it suits THEM.
a lot of people who i thought were close friends turn out to be nothing more then people who want what they want from me, and nothing more.
person that springs to mind is leanne. actually she was on a forum- she messaged me 1 time saying oh, she's gonna help me, and understand me, and get me more support.. but during our conversations, more and more of her talk was about herself.. what she'd been doing, what she was planning to do, who with, etc.
ended up blocking her because i felt it just wasn't working
same goes for chelsea. she was a so called friend, and i actually got as far as getting her to sign up to 1 of my forums to read what i go through (we even had our own song to remind us of our friendship)
turns out as soon as she saw the forums, she turned on me and said i'm better off locked away anyway
i've also had friends who have turned on me just because i don't like what they like
my friend nessa decided not to be my friend anymore after finding out that my sister eats at the rainforest cafe (stupid reason really, but what ever)
Great post. We have someone like this at work a guy. I know he doesn't like me. But I am convinced he tries to get others to see his negative view point of me as well due to the atmosphere when he and others are around. He is lower in the hierarchy which gets under his skin.
Ugh... "friends!"
nobody got time for dat
Its horrible though because a few months ago she started an argument and we hadnt spoken since. We were on bad terms and i was thinking of cutting all ties. Then out of the blue late one night she starts a fb conversation with me saying how we havent met up in a while and starts planning a night out, as if shes oblivious to all the nasty things she said a few months back!
The change can be so sudden. Last time we were all out in person and she was really cold and off with me and ignored me all night except when she was finding faults with what i was saying. As soon as we left i got a text saying how nice it was to catch up and chatting!
Its so difficult because if shes in a weird mood she snaps at everything you say, even if you say something nice she will take it the wrong way and start an argument. Or on the other hand she will be sending sarky messages and then suddenly start acting like your best friend!
Tbh if she wasnt with my partners mate i would cut all ties because its stressfull being friends with her. But that would make things difficult for my partner so i just put up with her for his sake. I dont know why other people are friends with her though, the ones who have no reason to stick by?
When I'm not out with my wife, I go out on my own to the pub and pass the time making chit chat with the locals or joining in with banter or putting 50p on the table for a game of pool quite often with people I don't know. This is why I drink in locals pubs because you can make acquaintances inside the pub then leave them at the door on the way out. I don't have any friends other than my wife who is my best friend but I don't feel lonely anymore because I've learned to enjoy my own company and just passing the time with others without getting involved. Plus the fact I'm free to go out and chat to new and different people each time I go out. These days I love nothing more than going out to different pubs chatting to new and different people.
I'll happily go out by myself, have a wander about, make small talk and have a chat with a few people then go home by myself. I don't need friends anymore. If anything friends are like a weight around your neck. Without friends you're free to do what YOU want to do instead of having to think about others.
It's such a pity I never had this attitude when I was younger. I've wasted so much of my life pandering to other people and doing what others wanted to do when I could have been out and about doing my own thing. I used to be part of a group of friends who always wanted to do the same thing week after week and go to the same pub. I tried to get them to do other stuff but they wouldn't. It drove me crazy so in the end I broke away from the group and started to do my own thing. It was around this time that I realised that I could be happier without friends. I guess when you're young friends are important. As you get older you realise they mean nothing because you mean nothing to them.
That's the spirit