BBC were interviewing a UKIP MEP this morning and she confirmed that the manifesto isn't out yet. I don't think it's the manifesto itself that's the particular problem here. It's the people the party manages to attract, with or without, as it does seem to have quite a few racists among its numbers. And this isn't information that anyone has to dig up. It's right there.
the only good thing i can think about is they want to limit immigration. sadly do gooder types think limiting immigration is racist.
but i don't trust ukip like i don't trust the conservatives so i will not vote them.
People who question the validity of a poll based on the numbers asked need to read up on how polling and research is conducted. Not everyone needs to be asked to find a causal, statistically significant relationship. You look at the population size (so the overall number of supporters), set a confidence level (usually 95%), a confidence interval (usually +/-3) and then from that you can calculate the sample size needed to find an accurate representative group.
Following that, the data gathered will be inputted into software such as IBM SPSS and from that cross-tabulations and tests will be ran to find out if a true causal relationship can be found by the generation of a chi-squared score. If the chi-squared score indicates that it is statistically significant, then it is a true causal relationship that will also be found within the whole population and not a random finding found just within the sample group. If they're polling and research indicated that the findings we are discussing weren't statistically significant, there'd be very little chance they'd be published at all as they wouldn't warrant discussion.
And for what it's worth, even if you took the total number of UKIP supporters (aka the population) to be at somewhere close to 15 million, they'd still only need to survey 1067 people to have an accurate sample.
If you find that you don't consider yourself racially prejudiced then you would have come under the 42% who don't had you been a part of the sample. Simple really.
BBC were interviewing a UKIP MEP this morning and she confirmed that the manifesto isn't out yet. I don't think it's the manifesto itself that's the particular problem here. It's the people the party manages to attract, with or without, as it does seem to have quite a few racists among its numbers. And this isn't information that anyone has to dig up. It's right there.
Ok it may be last years, but if you look at the site they are not saying IMO anything racist.
Ok it may be last years, but if you look at the site they are not saying IMO anything racist.
All the same, as UKIP hasn't had a manifesto, or even policies as such beyond EU exit, it can't be the manifesto alone that's attracting the racists, can it? UKIP is seen pretty much across the board as a party with a load of racists in it, thanks to what some of its candidates and supporters say. That'll attract more of the same.
The EDL only formed because Muslims Against Crusades and Al-Muhajiroun were insulting British soldiers on their home coming parade. The same groups who were burning poppies.
MAC was founded by Omar Bakri Mohammed who had known Islamist groups in Luton but it was ignored by the police and local council.
Anjem Choudary is a member of Muslims Against Crusades who call non-Muslims kuufar, a racist term to describe anyone who isn't a Muslim.
All the same, as UKIP hasn't had a manifesto, or even policies as such beyond EU exit, it can't be the manifesto alone that's attracting the racists, can it? UKIP is seen pretty much across the board as a party with a load of racists in it, thanks to what some of its candidates and supporters say. That'll attract more of the same.
I didn't say it did attract them I said they obviously didn't read it.
One thing I do like about UKIP is when they find a racist they kick them out no ifs or buts no 12 week investigation or feeble wandering around wondering how best to look good.
The EDL only formed because Muslims Against Crusades and Al-Muhajiroun were insulting British soldiers on their home coming parade. The same groups who were burning poppies.
MAC was founded by Omar Bakri Mohammed who had known Islamist groups in Luton but it was ignored by the police and local council.
Anjem Choudary is a member of Muslims Against Crusades who call non-Muslims kuufar, a racist term to describe anyone who isn't a Muslim.
The EDL marched against both and called racist.
So who is actually racist ?
All pretty nasty and unacceptable really but I would say the EDL are racist whereas the MAC are anti anyone not of their religion which is a bit different.
It relates to the Kippers programme which was on last night. This report is totally worth discussing here, imo, given the timing. The documentary had a far wider audience than simply those with a keen interest in politics. It also featured one of the racist members of UKIP, and a bunch of clowns. You couldn't buy that.
There are already two threads on that, why do we need a third? And that programme last night was just a few insignificant District Councillors. There are wacky and eccentric councillors in all parties, especially the Green party. Its a common trait, as the role tends to attract retired local busy bodies. So to try an justify that programme last night as being representative of the whole party and its supporters I just ridiculous and disingenuous.
All pretty nasty and unacceptable really but I would say the EDL are racist whereas the MAC are anti anyone not of their religion which is a bit different.
just how many times do people need to be told muslims are not muslims are not a race muslims are not a race get it, anyone, race, skin colour can be a muslim.
What it "a little prejudiced" and " a lot prejudiced"?
These polls make good headlines, but without serious questioning of each individual, you cant get any accurate result.
I think you'd get the same results asking groups in any country.
At a very basic level, people like to be part of a group, and those outside it are distrusted.
As kids, we didn't like kids from the next estate, then it was kids from other schools. Then we'd be against those from the next town, then county, and then country as we get older.
Most people grow out of this tribalism, but it is everywhere at a basic level, and is not something unique to the English, who are much better at integrating than many other nations, and cultures.
There are already two threads on that, why do we need a third? And that programme last night was just a few insignificant District Councillors. There are wacky and eccentric councillors in all parties, especially the Green party. Its a common trait, as the role tends to attract retired local busy bodies. So to try an justify that programme last night as being representative of the whole party and its supporters I just ridiculous and disingenuous.
You do the Kipper councillors a disservice. They were councillors in the heartland of UKIP where dear Nigel wants to be a MP. This was UKIP being given a huge chance to paint their party in a positive way and they failed spectacularly
To imply that most councillors are anything like the idiotic, bumbling bunch of Kippers we saw last night is simply wrong.
All the same, as UKIP hasn't had a manifesto, or even policies as such beyond EU exit, it can't be the manifesto alone that's attracting the racists, can it? UKIP is seen pretty much across the board as a party with a load of racists in it, thanks to what some of its candidates and supporters say. That'll attract more of the same.
There are already two threads on that, why do we need a third? And that programme last night was just a few insignificant District Councillors. There are wacky and eccentric councillors in all parties, especially the Green party. Its a common trait, as the role tends to attract retired local busy bodies. So to try an justify that programme last night as being representative of the whole party and its supporters I just ridiculous and disingenuous.
The green party is full of hippy dippy bleeding heart types. that one uncontrolled immigration.
All pretty nasty and unacceptable really but I would say the EDL are racist whereas the MAC are anti anyone not of their religion which is a bit different.
The EDL is a result of Islamic extremism in Luton.
It has now become acceptable to generalize the EDL as racists, of course anyone who generalizes Muslims as extremists its quickly branded bigot, Islamophobe etc.
When did protesting against extremism become racist ?
There are already two threads on that, why do we need a third? And that programme last night was just a few insignificant District Councillors. There are wacky and eccentric councillors in all parties, especially the Green party. Its a common trait, as the role tends to attract retired local busy bodies. So to try an justify that programme last night as being representative of the whole party and its supporters I just ridiculous and disingenuous.
I have mentioned the programme here, not discussed it or claimed that it represents the whole party. I've said that it makes the racism within UKIP worthy of wider discussion than than one confined to politics alone. This one's about the apparently high number of racists within UKIP.
For example, slightly upthread I've suggested that perhaps it's some supporters and party members themselves who make the party more attractive to racists, given that it doesn't have many clearly-defined policies yet. What do you think?
Because they're unable to articulate much beyond their proposed EU exit. There's been stuff floating around about the removal of employee rights but that tends to be rubbished by supporters. The MEP interviewed this morning said to wait for the manifesto for the full details of how policies were going to be funded. It isn't out yet.
All pretty nasty and unacceptable really but I would say the EDL are racist whereas the MAC are anti anyone not of their religion which is a bit different.
I am sure there are some racist EDL supporters, but I think they are mainly anti-Islam. As for the MAC, I am pretty sure there will be racists there too.
The EDL is a result of Islamic extremism in Luton.
It has now become acceptable to generalize the EDL as racists, of course anyone who generalizes Muslims as extremists its quickly branded bigot, Islamophobe etc.
When did protesting against extremism become racist ?
Its double standards sadly.
muslims can say hate filled stuff to non muslims but the minute a non-muslim does it back their branded racist.
They're probably wasting their votes then. I understand that many BNP voters have switched to UKIP anyway. It would seem to make sense from their point of view. I recall something similar happened when Mrs Thatcher became head of the Conservative Party. It reduced support for the then National Front.
The EDL is a result of Islamic extremism in Luton.
It has now become acceptable to generalize the EDL as racists, of course anyone who generalizes Muslims as extremists its quickly branded bigot, Islamophobe etc.
When did protesting against extremism become racist ?
It didn't. However many EDL supporters appear to be both Islamophobic and racist. Not surprising as the group seems to attract mindless thugs.
I have mentioned the programme here, not discussed it or claimed that it represents the whole party. I've said that it makes the racism within UKIP worthy of wider discussion than than one confined to politics alone. This one's about the apparently high number of racists within UKIP.
For example, slightly upthread I've suggested that perhaps it's some supporters and party members themselves who make the party more attractive to racists, given that it doesn't have many clearly-defined policies yet. What do you think?
Because they're unable to articulate much beyond their proposed EU exit. There's been stuff floating around about the removal of employee rights but that tends to be rubbished by supporters. The MEP interviewed this morning said to wait for the manifesto for the full details of how policies were going to be funded. It isn't out yet.
Their policies are on their website, for all to see.
Comments
the only good thing i can think about is they want to limit immigration. sadly do gooder types think limiting immigration is racist.
but i don't trust ukip like i don't trust the conservatives so i will not vote them.
Not at all. Some Kippers are on record as making racist and bigoted comments that have nothing to do with immigration.
Best reason not to vote for a party, ever.
So don't complain if you get a government you don't like.
Following that, the data gathered will be inputted into software such as IBM SPSS and from that cross-tabulations and tests will be ran to find out if a true causal relationship can be found by the generation of a chi-squared score. If the chi-squared score indicates that it is statistically significant, then it is a true causal relationship that will also be found within the whole population and not a random finding found just within the sample group. If they're polling and research indicated that the findings we are discussing weren't statistically significant, there'd be very little chance they'd be published at all as they wouldn't warrant discussion.
And for what it's worth, even if you took the total number of UKIP supporters (aka the population) to be at somewhere close to 15 million, they'd still only need to survey 1067 people to have an accurate sample.
If you find that you don't consider yourself racially prejudiced then you would have come under the 42% who don't had you been a part of the sample. Simple really.
The other poster was talking about not voting for a specific party and why, rather than not voting at all.
Ok it may be last years, but if you look at the site they are not saying IMO anything racist.
All the same, as UKIP hasn't had a manifesto, or even policies as such beyond EU exit, it can't be the manifesto alone that's attracting the racists, can it? UKIP is seen pretty much across the board as a party with a load of racists in it, thanks to what some of its candidates and supporters say. That'll attract more of the same.
Do you even read this crap before you post it? Mr Rollyeyes needs to make a comeback just for this.
The EDL only formed because Muslims Against Crusades and Al-Muhajiroun were insulting British soldiers on their home coming parade. The same groups who were burning poppies.
MAC was founded by Omar Bakri Mohammed who had known Islamist groups in Luton but it was ignored by the police and local council.
Anjem Choudary is a member of Muslims Against Crusades who call non-Muslims kuufar, a racist term to describe anyone who isn't a Muslim.
The EDL marched against both and called racist.
So who is actually racist ?
I didn't say it did attract them I said they obviously didn't read it.
One thing I do like about UKIP is when they find a racist they kick them out no ifs or buts no 12 week investigation or feeble wandering around wondering how best to look good.
There are already two threads on that, why do we need a third? And that programme last night was just a few insignificant District Councillors. There are wacky and eccentric councillors in all parties, especially the Green party. Its a common trait, as the role tends to attract retired local busy bodies. So to try an justify that programme last night as being representative of the whole party and its supporters I just ridiculous and disingenuous.
just how many times do people need to be told muslims are not muslims are not a race muslims are not a race get it, anyone, race, skin colour can be a muslim.
These polls make good headlines, but without serious questioning of each individual, you cant get any accurate result.
I think you'd get the same results asking groups in any country.
At a very basic level, people like to be part of a group, and those outside it are distrusted.
As kids, we didn't like kids from the next estate, then it was kids from other schools. Then we'd be against those from the next town, then county, and then country as we get older.
Most people grow out of this tribalism, but it is everywhere at a basic level, and is not something unique to the English, who are much better at integrating than many other nations, and cultures.
You do the Kipper councillors a disservice. They were councillors in the heartland of UKIP where dear Nigel wants to be a MP. This was UKIP being given a huge chance to paint their party in a positive way and they failed spectacularly
To imply that most councillors are anything like the idiotic, bumbling bunch of Kippers we saw last night is simply wrong.
That is not true. Why would you post that?
The green party is full of hippy dippy bleeding heart types. that one uncontrolled immigration.
and ukip is total opposite.
The EDL is a result of Islamic extremism in Luton.
It has now become acceptable to generalize the EDL as racists, of course anyone who generalizes Muslims as extremists its quickly branded bigot, Islamophobe etc.
When did protesting against extremism become racist ?
How do you know this?
I have mentioned the programme here, not discussed it or claimed that it represents the whole party. I've said that it makes the racism within UKIP worthy of wider discussion than than one confined to politics alone. This one's about the apparently high number of racists within UKIP.
For example, slightly upthread I've suggested that perhaps it's some supporters and party members themselves who make the party more attractive to racists, given that it doesn't have many clearly-defined policies yet. What do you think?
Because they're unable to articulate much beyond their proposed EU exit. There's been stuff floating around about the removal of employee rights but that tends to be rubbished by supporters. The MEP interviewed this morning said to wait for the manifesto for the full details of how policies were going to be funded. It isn't out yet.
I am sure there are some racist EDL supporters, but I think they are mainly anti-Islam. As for the MAC, I am pretty sure there will be racists there too.
Its double standards sadly.
muslims can say hate filled stuff to non muslims but the minute a non-muslim does it back their branded racist.
It didn't. However many EDL supporters appear to be both Islamophobic and racist. Not surprising as the group seems to attract mindless thugs.
Their policies are on their website, for all to see.