Should I bother watching Angel

Have just finished watching all of Buffy the Vampire Slayer for the first time, and have been flowing this thread going at the moment, on Buffy and spin off Angel:

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1961952

I've never actually seen Angel. I watched the first few episodes, as I started season 4 of Buffy, but I only got as far as Room with a View. There were a couple of episodes I did like, especially the one with Spike, but unlike the first season of Buffy, which I expected to be rubbish but blew me away, it wasn't as fun, or particularly memorable. Now I know Joss Whedon's stuff can be slow burners sometimes, and there'll often be a few meh ones, and then a really good ep, out of the blue. Plus there are plot points occurring in Buffy which I would probably have got more if I'd stuck with Buffy, and, season 4 of Buffy wasn't that great either, but the show did improve after.

Basically, would fans say, overall, Angel is of similar quality to buffy? And does it improve? If so, what are the really good episodes, does it begin to develop in season 1? There is stuff that looks really good (I know Spike turns up again at some point), but I don't fancy wading through loads of fairly average episodes until that happens?

SO, would you recommend it? Would it be worth the bother, and where is a good place to start?

Thanks! :)
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Comments

  • zwixxxzwixxx Posts: 10,295
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    Janus_Mars wrote: »
    There is stuff that looks really good (I know Spike turns up again at some point), but I don't fancy wading through loads of fairly average episodes until that happens?

    imho sometimes it's those av. eps you 'wade' thru, that make you question your continued watching of a show, but you stick with it with the hope of a future gem, that makes the eventual gems such gemlike - that made sense, right ?!
    Kinda like watching your kid learning to walk. For the first umpteen tries they stumble but it's worth watching cos when they eventually get it right you get a fukyeah moment.
    Like Dollhouse, initial eps contained many that didn't gell but stick with it and you get an amazing finale that more than makes up for any mehness which went before.

    But back to Angel. It's been a long while since I watched it... a looooong while. But I can think of a couple of omg moments that I wouldn't dream of giving you the ep numbers cos without seeing the prev eps then you wouldn't be able to understand why that single sentence could make you crawl into a little ball and cry.

    So I'd say give it another shot :)

    ps: oh yes and start from the beginning - this show IS Angel's journey so methinks you should be there at the start so you can see where he started from.
  • NinjyBearNinjyBear Posts: 8,317
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    You should absolutely watch it, it's a fantastic show. It's more grown-up than Buffy, but I'd say the quality is fairly even. There are some things that didn't go too well, but I can't say more without spoiling it.

    Personally, I liked it right from the start, but some people say it didn't get really good until around the 17th episode once Wolfram and Hart are properly introduced.
  • SegaGamerSegaGamer Posts: 29,069
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    An absolute yes from me. I think it's a brilliant show with brilliant characters just like Buffy. I actually prefer Angel over Buffy.

    Angel finished too early for me, 5 seasons wasn't enough, i wanted more :p
  • Matt DMatt D Posts: 13,153
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    I prefer Buffy, but Angel is still definitely worth watching.

    I had a complete run-through of both last year, after never having finished either of them originally. Loved them both.
  • HelboreHelbore Posts: 16,066
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    I loved both shows, but I personally preferred Angel, so I'd definitely recommend it. It does pick in during season 1, but season 2 is absolutely amazing. Its worth getting through to that, because...well, just watch it! It goes to some good places.
  • ZoeTateZoeTate Posts: 294
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    I couldn't get into Angel back when both Angel and Buffy first aired, but I caught it in syndication years later and wound up watching all of it and enjoying most of it. I never much liked Angel the character but once they start adding in more interesting characters - which I think mostly happens in season 2 - it picks up a lot.

    I started in sort of a random place which I don't recommend, but better to skip around or skip the first part of season 1 than to get so bored that you stop altogether.
  • natalie77natalie77 Posts: 2,468
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    Back when Angel was first on air alongside Buffy I absolutely loved the show & watched it religiously & was gutted when it got cancelled but since it's ended I've found I've only got through to about season 3 on a rewatch before getting abit bored with it which is sad cos I really did love a lot about the show but there's a few things that happen in later seasons that I really didn't like :(

    But in answer to your question YES I would still totally recommend watching Angel from the beginning again :)
  • RebelScumRebelScum Posts: 16,008
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    Yes... .
  • rhynoGBrhynoGB Posts: 4,278
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    I always thought Angel was a more grown up version of Buffy. Some solid episodes and great acting performances.
    Alot more sad moments than Buffy had. I always had the feeling Angel could have gone on for another few seasons.
    Wolfram & Hart were excellent. I would have loved them to have come to Sunnydale and tried to get Buffy.

    Definitely recommend this show if you've seen Buffy
  • LMLM Posts: 63,327
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    Angel is very different than Buffy. Buffy was about growing up and having the weight of the world of your shoulders. Angel is very much about redemption. Angel also is relient on flashbacks.

    My problems with angel were with a few things. It's story arcs were not as strong as Buffy. Buffy would have an arc carved out beautifully among 22 episodes. Angel couldn't do that without feeling you have had too much thrown at you and by mid season, you would want everything over. It's season villians were never as brilliant as Buffy's either. Angel could never produce such great villians like The Master, The Mayor, Adam, Glory or The First. I think the only decent villian Angel ever had was Darla. It is also very slow in character development and even the B plots going on with them were not strong.

    However one of the strongest parts of the shows were it's standalone episodes, which could be more darker and adult in themes or content.
  • GibsonGirlGibsonGirl Posts: 1,307
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    I'd say go for it. I have all the episodes on DVD and have watched them a couple of times. It is a more mature show, but that doesn't it is devoid of the same kind of comic relief that Buffy had. There are a few episodes that revolve around Lorne (the sadly late Andy Hallett) that are downright hilarious and the episode entitled Smile Time that is one of the funniest things I've ever seen. Some of the more serious episodes were superb as well.

    I would rate the show 10 out of 10!
  • RebelScumRebelScum Posts: 16,008
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    Angel is very different than Buffy. Buffy was about growing up and having the weight of the world of your shoulders. Angel is very much about redemption. Angel also is relient on flashbacks.

    Well, it's not quite as straight forward as saying Angel was about Redemption. Redemption was his motivation initially, but he, and the series, moved on from that quite early on (season 2). Whilst it may have been his initial motivation, it wasn't what the series was about.

    There's a thematic continuum that runs through Buffy, Angel & Firefly. The theme being how we react to the world around us as we go through life. From teenager to full adulthood. The three series all share that same theme, but each focuses on different stages of our lives.

    Buffy (teens to mid 20's). The awkwardness and anxieties of teenage years, first love, first heartbreak, fitting in, assuming responsibly...

    Angel (mid 20's to mid 30's). The next step; being out on your own, starting over, making new friends, anxieties about starting a family and bringing new life into a world where such terrible things happen. Having to deal with the realisation you aren't the unique hot shot you once thought you were...

    Firefly (mid 30's to early 40's). The stage when you've been around the block, won some and lost some, become jaded and cynical...
  • LMLM Posts: 63,327
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    RebelScum wrote: »
    Well, it's not quite as straight forward as saying Angel was about Redemption. Redemption was his motivation initially, but he, and the series, moved on from that quite early on (season 2). Whilst it may have been his initial motivation, it wasn't what the series was about.

    There's a thematic continuum that runs through Buffy, Angel & Firefly. The theme is our journey, from teenager to full adulthood, and how we react to the world around us as we go through life. Buffy, Angel & Firefly focus on three different stages of our lives.

    Buffy (teens to mid 20's). The awkwardness and anxieties of teenage years, first love, first heartbreak, fitting in, assuming responsibly...

    Angel (mid 20's to mid 30's). The next step; being out on your own, starting over, making new friends, anxieties about starting a family and bringing new life into a world where such terrible things happen. Having to deal with the realisation you aren't the unique hot shot you once thought you were...

    Firefly (mid 30's to early 40's). The stage when you've been around the block, won some and lost some and have become jaded and cynical...

    I would say it was and the redemption was never about Angel, it was on nearly all the characters. Cordelia, Fred, Gunn and Wesley all sought redemption throughout the show on changing who they were from how we see them at first to how they became by the end of the run. Even Darla as well. It's a consistent theme i picked up on throughout all 5 seasons.

    So it is straight forward for myself to say that. May not be straight forward when describing it to someone who hasn't seen it yet.
  • Inseriousity.Inseriousity. Posts: 83
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    Keep watching, it gets better even in season 1. I struggled through the pilot, it's really boring until nearer the end ("can you fly?" NOW THAT IS AWESOME) and didn't watch it again for a few years but I'm glad I watched it all. It's not perfect but there are some definite WTF moments (season 2 one is the best, everyone will know what I'm talking about here :P) and good storylines and characters.
  • RebelScumRebelScum Posts: 16,008
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    I would say it was and the redemption was never about Angel, it was on nearly all the characters. Cordelia, Fred, Gunn and Wesley all sought redemption throughout the show on changing who they were from how we see them at first to how they became by the end of the run. Even Darla as well. It's a consistent theme i picked up on throughout all 5 seasons.

    So it is straight forward for myself to say that. May not be straight forward when describing it to someone who hasn't seen it yet.

    We all interpret the world differently, and that's great. Of course, you will interpret the series as you wish. The thematic thread I described isn't merely my interpretation, it's what Whedon intended (I don't have a link to the particular instance when he commented on it unfortunately). I would suggest that watching Angel from that sole perspective of redemption is watching it out of context, which can lead to not getting the best out of it. But, like I said, if you chose to interpret your way, great.
  • LMLM Posts: 63,327
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    RebelScum wrote: »
    We all interpret the world differently, and that's great. Of course, you are entitled to interpret the series as you wish. The thematic thread I described isn't merely my interpretation, it's what Whedon intended (I don't have a link to the particular instance when he commented on it unfortunately). I would suggest that watching Angel from that sole perspective of redemption is watching it out of context, which can lead to not getting the best out of it. But, like I said, if you chose to interpret your way, great.

    I fail to see how me watching it resolves in me in not getting the best out of it or watching it out of context. It's isn't my sole view of the show or what I think is the sole theme of the show. But i believe is the main theme. It was an off cut remark i said in describing the show to a newbie. How that has caused a bit of a disagreement between us and accusing me of watching it out of context and not getting the best out of it, well, it wasn't needed and best avoided.

    I have said what I have said about the show to a potential new viewer. I will leave before my intelligence is further questioned and insulted.
  • zwixxxzwixxx Posts: 10,295
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    you MUST watch it, or I'll take away your bucket.
  • RebelScumRebelScum Posts: 16,008
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    I fail to see how me watching it resolves in me in not getting the best out of it or watching it out of context. It's isn't my sole view of the show or what I think is the sole theme of the show. But i believe is the main theme. It was an off cut remark i said in describing the show to a newbie. How that has caused a bit of a disagreement between us and accusing me of watching it out of context and not getting the best out of it, well, it wasn't needed and best avoided.

    I have said what I have said about the show to a potential new viewer. I will leave before my intelligence is further questioned and insulted.

    Nice over-reaction. How many people are you going to go into a sulk with today? I'm the second so far.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 242
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    Well, does seem to be a bit of a consensus on here, which is good I guess. Was thinking of rewatching Buffy, so if I do I may give Angel another go at the same time as well... Thanks for all the advice anyway!:)
  • StressMonkeyStressMonkey Posts: 13,347
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    Angel is a bit of a roller coaster quality wise, but when it is good it is very, very good. And when its bad it's still watchable.

    I really am not a fan of Alexis Denisof and I am frequently astounded he gets work and how bad an actor he really is. I groan with disappointment every time I see he is going to be in a show I like - such as Grimm and will generally try to avoid anything he is in. I say all this to point out that Angel was mostly so good that I forgave its continual employment of Denisof. :D
  • WoodbineWoodbine Posts: 14,186
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    I didn't like Alexis Denisof in Buffy, but he was good in Angel and got better in each season. As an actor I think he is good.

    I loved both Buffy and Angel, I wouldn't miss an episode when it was on.
  • StressMonkeyStressMonkey Posts: 13,347
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    Woodbine wrote: »
    I didn't like Alexis Denisof in Buffy, but he was good in Angel and got better in each season. As an actor I think he is good.

    I loved both Buffy and Angel, I wouldn't miss an episode when it was on.

    I will concede that Angel brought out the best in him. :D

    I personally don't find his best all that good, but he certainly was at his best in Angel.

    He was at his comedy panto villain worst in Grimm though :D
  • codename_47codename_47 Posts: 9,682
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    Angel is a bit of a roller coaster quality wise, but when it is good it is very, very good. And when its bad it's still watchable.

    I really am not a fan of Alexis Denisof and I am frequently astounded he gets work and how bad an actor he really is. I groan with disappointment every time I see he is going to be in a show I like - such as Grimm and will generally try to avoid anything he is in. I say all this to point out that Angel was mostly so good that I forgave its continual employment of Denisof. :D

    This from a series that has David Boreanez as its lead? :D

    It shows that acting is a subjective thing like anything else because I've always found Alexis a very powerful actor, especially during *spoilers* in series 3 and also *spoilers* in series 5.
    (Hope people are able to crack the code :D )

    And on that point, it's funny looking back at early buffy and noticing just how bad an actor Boreanez was in series 1/2.
    Before he took the lead in his own series though its like he loosened up a huge amount and became a lot more versatile.
    If you see him on Bones now he's taken it further still, complete night and day change.
    (Well, a night and day that's spread out over 10 years anyway :p )

    Good on him for never settling and continuing to work at it.

    Back to the OP, yes. YES!

    I do feel the Buffyverse, more than most franchises is like one large overall story that the series Buffy and Angel are just 2 chapters of.
    If you're watching Buffy, particularly from season 4 onwards, without watching the corresponding Angel episode side by side, some of the time you're only getting half of the story.
    It's a lot more rewarding even if you're just a Buffy fan, put it that way.
    Pretty sure by the end of it you'll rate Angel equally if not the superior series tbh.

    But do it right and avoid spoilers. ;)
  • circlebro2019circlebro2019 Posts: 17,560
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    yes

    just as good as buffy if not better imo.
  • bingbongbingbong Posts: 2,439
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    GibsonGirl wrote: »
    I'd say go for it. I have all the episodes on DVD and have watched them a couple of times. It is a more mature show, but that doesn't it is devoid of the same kind of comic relief that Buffy had. There are a few episodes that revolve around Lorne (the sadly late Andy Hallett) that are downright hilarious and the episode entitled Smile Time that is one of the funniest things I've ever seen. Some of the more serious episodes were superb as well.

    I would rate the show 10 out of 10!

    Its the comic relief that made Buffy stand out for me. Different performers in Angel but that only partially explains why Angel is so humorless. Angel is like Buffy with all the fun sucked out of it.
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