It may well have been sung by slaves in the cotton plantations in America but its origins go back much further and are nothing to do with "racism", either perceived or implied..
I didn't say it was sung by the slaves just that people perceive it to be aimed at it
Oh for God's sake! Not long ago we were told that 'coloured' was the polite thing to say - now it's frowned upon, but it IS OK to say 'a person of colour'??? It's very difficult trying to keep up with the latest protestations of the perpetually-offended brigade, and we are constantly treading on eggshells just in case.
You're right! It's not easy keeping up with all this PC stuff. I worked with elderly people for many years and they had been brought up calling people "coloured" and considered it polite. They wouldn't believe in more recent years that "black" was preferred.
My own Mum is 90 now and just a couple of years ago we were in a wool shop and she asked for some ****** brown wool. I gave her a nudge and the woman serving us told her quietly that people didn't use that word anymore. She said it wasn't PC and poor old Mum didn't even know what PC meant!! She is the most friendly, non racist person you could ever meet, she's just not up to speed on all this.
I suspect it may be British people who might be more offended, given that the largest black civil rights organisation in America is called the National Association for the Advancement of Coloured People (NAACP).
He's apologized now so no big deal. He's an intelligent guy and it was clearly a mistake.
I really don't understand why people get so offended by the word "coloured", I mean it does sound ignorant and dated, but nothing to get up in arms about.
It may well have been sung by slaves in the cotton plantations in America but its origins go back much further and are nothing to do with "racism", either perceived or implied..
I didn't say it was sung by the slaves just that people perceive it to be aimed at it
The point is that people will find offence where there is none.
This rhyme is mainly about the wool trade, and in Medieval England, this was a massive part of the economy. Your wealth and status was determined by how many head of sheep you had, and thus how many fleeces you could sell. When the wool tax was introduced, a 3rd (I think, hence 3 bags full) of each sack was given to the king, the church and the rest for the farmer. People should learn more about history, and perhaps they would understand more.
There are white sheep, and there are black sheep, and there are also brown sheep. And also sheep with spots. This is a fact, and quite easy to see when you walk past a field.
Nothing to do with racism. Its only the modern PC brigade who jump on terms and point fingers at perceived racism where there is none. This rhyme pre-dates slavery, and all that comes with it.
I expected to see a thread on this in either GD or Politics.
I just searched for it, and found one in showbiz. I really didn't expect this to be in showbiz. I never look in general showbiz, and I suspect nether do other posters who tend to look at more serious topics.
Is there any way threads can be posted in multiple forums, or is there some other way this sort of difficulty can be addressed?
It seemed that most of the uproar appears to be using an old fashioned, out moded term rather than any actual offence.
How very dare he?
Perhaps I'm insensitive, but I didn't think that it was intrinsically wrong to refer to "Coloured people"? Perhaps the very term harks back to unhappier days.
We're all 'coloured'. White people are not literally 'white', and only a few Africans are properly 'black'. Perhaps we could say pink-peach, brown and yellow. Alternatively caucasian, negroid and mongoloid-although the latter, in sense of possessing typical south-east Asian features, could get confused with Down's Syndrome.
So what do you call them at school I was told off for using the term Black. They said coloured is a better term this ws 20 years ago.
When I was growing up, people used the term 'coloured' simply because they thought it was a polite alternative to the n-word, which thankfully we rarely heard. 'Black' wasn't really in vogue then where I lived. I suspect it's the same for many.
However, it's a live 'n' learn, move with the times sorta thing. If people in general feel that they want to be called black then that's cool. I do suspect Cumberbunders was probably more being sort of quaintly polite than dissing anyone. Life's a learning curve for all of us.
Aussies still happy use the rather derogatary term P*** to refer to any Pakistani cricketers.
Refering to a Pakistani as P*** is not derogatary. I know many Pakistanis who refer to themselves this way and are not offended one little bit. Its no different to calling someone from Scotland a Scot or someone from Australia an Aussie (as you used yourself).
What is / was offensive was using it as slur against anyone Asian when it started in the 70's.
As regards his fans - I've said before that some of him do him no favours, and since his engagement some of them have displayed alarming behaviour that's put me in mind of Stephen King's book, Misery!
Personally, I think he's been brought up in a bit of a bubble by slightly older than average parents, and as a result can be really "old" in his language and manner. While some people are ok with the term, over whelmingly it's now been deemed offensive, and, whilst a lot of older people may not know that a term they once thought of as polite is no longer seen that way, I'm amazed that someone of Benedict's age and intelligence didn't know.
I'm older than him, but as soon as I read his comments, I knew he was in trouble and would have to apologise ( I can remember the same happening a few years back with another public figure but can't remember who it was.)
At yet end of the day, he's made a mistake and apologised for it.
As I said earlier though, it really wouldn't do him any harm to stop the publicity trial for a while.
Just as an aside - wouldn't you think PR companies would make sure their clients were aware if what is or isn't acceptable? Might save them a lot of work in the long run!
Unlikely to happen. It's awards season so he'll be doing lots of public appearances until the Oscars are over.
The point is that people will find offence where there is none.
This rhyme is mainly about the wool trade, and in Medieval England, this was a massive part of the economy. Your wealth and status was determined by how many head of sheep you had, and thus how many fleeces you could sell. When the wool tax was introduced, a 3rd (I think, hence 3 bags full) of each sack was given to the king, the church and the rest for the farmer. People should learn more about history, and perhaps they would understand more.
There are white sheep, and there are black sheep, and there are also brown sheep. And also sheep with spots. This is a fact, and quite easy to see when you walk past a field.
Nothing to do with racism. Its only the modern PC brigade who jump on terms and point fingers at perceived racism where there is none. This rhyme pre-dates slavery, and all that comes with it.
Comments
I didn't say it was sung by the slaves just that people perceive it to be aimed at it
You're right! It's not easy keeping up with all this PC stuff. I worked with elderly people for many years and they had been brought up calling people "coloured" and considered it polite. They wouldn't believe in more recent years that "black" was preferred.
My own Mum is 90 now and just a couple of years ago we were in a wool shop and she asked for some ****** brown wool. I gave her a nudge and the woman serving us told her quietly that people didn't use that word anymore. She said it wasn't PC and poor old Mum didn't even know what PC meant!! She is the most friendly, non racist person you could ever meet, she's just not up to speed on all this.
I really don't understand why people get so offended by the word "coloured", I mean it does sound ignorant and dated, but nothing to get up in arms about.
The point is that people will find offence where there is none.
This rhyme is mainly about the wool trade, and in Medieval England, this was a massive part of the economy. Your wealth and status was determined by how many head of sheep you had, and thus how many fleeces you could sell. When the wool tax was introduced, a 3rd (I think, hence 3 bags full) of each sack was given to the king, the church and the rest for the farmer. People should learn more about history, and perhaps they would understand more.
There are white sheep, and there are black sheep, and there are also brown sheep. And also sheep with spots. This is a fact, and quite easy to see when you walk past a field.
Nothing to do with racism. Its only the modern PC brigade who jump on terms and point fingers at perceived racism where there is none. This rhyme pre-dates slavery, and all that comes with it.
On a separate note, I use this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munsell_color_system the Munsell chart to categorise soils. Perhaps the people moaning about terminology could utilise it?
There was nothing to apologise for.
I just searched for it, and found one in showbiz. I really didn't expect this to be in showbiz. I never look in general showbiz, and I suspect nether do other posters who tend to look at more serious topics.
Is there any way threads can be posted in multiple forums, or is there some other way this sort of difficulty can be addressed?
How very dare he?
Perhaps I'm insensitive, but I didn't think that it was intrinsically wrong to refer to "Coloured people"? Perhaps the very term harks back to unhappier days.
I can't even remember what I was told to use so I just tend to say "people".
When I was growing up, people used the term 'coloured' simply because they thought it was a polite alternative to the n-word, which thankfully we rarely heard. 'Black' wasn't really in vogue then where I lived. I suspect it's the same for many.
However, it's a live 'n' learn, move with the times sorta thing. If people in general feel that they want to be called black then that's cool. I do suspect Cumberbunders was probably more being sort of quaintly polite than dissing anyone. Life's a learning curve for all of us.
Yeah but discussing prejudice against black actors sounds a bit odd if you talk about the prejudice suffered by your colleagues
"Which colleagues?"
"Errrrrrr..................people":D
Agreed, "outrage" for no other reason than it fills column inches.
Refering to a Pakistani as P*** is not derogatary. I know many Pakistanis who refer to themselves this way and are not offended one little bit. Its no different to calling someone from Scotland a Scot or someone from Australia an Aussie (as you used yourself).
What is / was offensive was using it as slur against anyone Asian when it started in the 70's.
Yep. He said it, didn't realise it was the wrong term, and apologised for it.
Unlikely to happen. It's awards season so he'll be doing lots of public appearances until the Oscars are over.
I stand corrected and appreciate your input, this is undoubtably not the first thing that has been misinterpreted by the uber pc brigade