Just watched. As I have long suspected, Liam Neeson really is God Him and Ralph Fiennes turning up in a little BBC2 show is amazing, suggests they rate the show or Tom H has some pretty top notch Hollywood mates.
Tom H is apparently good friends with both of them and has worked with them before
I advise people not to read Alison Graham's piece in the new Radio Times, because it contains what seems to me to be a massive spoiler for viewers before they see next week's episode.
This is still a great, funny well-written comedy but I'm just not getting the same re-watch factor with this 3rd series as I got from the firs 2 series...which I own on DVD and never tire of.
I thought it was Jesus actually Intersting that Rev went there. I don't think Tom Hollander is religious but he plays it well.
Yes - me too. I thought it was a lovely moment - very moving. "I always be here for you Adam" So many significant references too. Personally - I would love one more series - but understand why they would leave it where it is.
Yes - me too. I thought it was a lovely moment - very moving. "I always be here for you Adam" So many significant references too.
Yes especially as Adam had just been singing lyrics from 'Lord of the Dance', which is sung in the persona of Jesus. The bit he sang was:
#I danced for the scribe and the Pharisee,
But they would not dance and they wouldn't follow me;
I danced for the fishermen, for James and John;
They came with me and the dance went on.#
The scribes and the Pharisees in this case being the hierarchy of the church of course.
This has been a brilliant series. I like that it's focussed on "issues" like gay marriage (the last scene in that caught me by surprise and made me cry, wonderful), and what do you do if the only person who can save your church financially is a convicted paedophile, how you work with such a tiny number of people who, however kind they might be (and sometimes they're extremely nasty) lack any skills whatsoever to run the church......
I spotted the Easter story from Colin's denial, and, although I thought carrying the cross all night was a bit laboured, I thought the whole very good. The calmly polite but efficiently dehumanizing bishop was chilling.
I wonder how some of the older and/or established members of these churches felt when their churches were invaded by the evangelical brigade.
It happens elsewhere too e.g. in Aberystwyth, where the (formerly high) church of St Michael's became infiltrated and got changed into a judgmental fundamentalist place.
This is where, I think, for all its faults the Catholic Church has strength. You aren't going to find such huge variations in styles of worship because the nature of Catholic liturgy doesn't allow for things to be changed dramatically between one priest/church and the next. I remember realising, in my younger, church-going days, that no matter which Catholic church we went to (e.g. on holiday in Devon, rather than at home) the Mass, everything bar the man at the front would be the same and reassuringly familiar. I knew I wasn't going to walk in the door of a strange church into a situation or 'feel' I didn't recognise.
Any Catholic congregation know what they'll get when they walk in the door in a way that perhaps, these days, Anglican congregations don't, and (according to C of E friends) that's been part of the reason for a decline in feeling 'part of' one Anglican denomination. I understand that, I wouldn't have wanted to have undertaken some kind of liturgical lottery of a Sunday, not knowing what style of service I'd find behind a strange church door, or my local one upon the installation of a new vicar! Perhaps that's why, in many cases, Catholic congregations are being swelled by new numbers who don't necessarily 'want' to be Catholic, but now - have had their Anglican options reduced in their local areas where traditional has given way to progressive?
It's funny, though, how two of the big things that seem to be drawing new, larger congregations to Christian worship are fundamentally so very different. On the one hand, there's the clearly defined structure of Catholicism (plus Pope Francis!) attracting back not only large numbers of lapsed Catholics, but also members of the Church of England who have lost the option of a 'high' Church of England vicar/church. Then, on the other hand, there's the more evangelical, almost 'anything goes to get them through the door' element under the umbrella of Anglican worship attracting huge numbers of their own. The other side of the coin, almost. And somewhere in the middle is the kind of church Adam Smallbone is trying to keep alive - dwindling congregations in areas which aren't short of people, but for whatever reason don't consider it 'their' church. A large city is full of people, but in some ways that works against a church like Rev's St. Saviours, which has always made it's more traditional congregation and style of service a key feature.
And it's a sad fact of life that huge churches are being closed down and congregations amalgamated to save money and make things more efficient, and Rev is reflecting that - it's already happened, is happening or will yet happen to most of the main Christian denominations where I live. Many church buildings have already closed down, and congregations amalgamated, but we do still have quite a lot of churches, temples, meeting halls and denominations represented, all with viable congregations!
Not sure how this compares to somewhere of a similar size, and demographic mix of town and countryside inhabitants in comparison to anywhere similar in the UK, but in an island of only 45 square miles, with a population of around 100,000, we have: 6 Catholic churches; about 16 C of E churches; 1 Baptist church; about 14 Methodist churches. In addition, we also have: 2 United Reformed churches; 1 Salvation Army citadel; 1 Quaker meeting house; 7 Independent Evangelical churches/meeting halls; 2 Pentecostal churches/meeting halls; 1 Church of Scotland; 1 Jewish synagogue; 1 Mormon temple; a small Muslim congregation (who meet in the town's Catholic church hall on a Friday afternoon). I may have missed a couple here and there!
To see St. Saviour's in Rev being treated more like a valuable commodity in terms of the building/land. and less like a church full of people who feel at home there, with Adam as their vicar, is being done very realistically (in Rev if St. Saviour's is de-consecrated it's being touted as a Tesco, here they're usually sold off for housing) and Adam's frustration with the slow-grinding gears and overwhelming paperwork that goes with the job is very well-depicted. The 'Good Friday' episode was very dark, but very well done - and I've always thought that if God were to appear on earth today he would look like one of us, not an old man with a long, flowing beard! (Or, alternatively, Liam Neeson!).
I haven't seen anything about what the final episode is about, but I do remember reading the interview with Tom Hollander before this series started in which he said the ending will have darker, more serious overtones, and that they want to tie it up and have a proper ending to this last series. The two possibilities that came into my head back then were either divorce or not being a vicar any more. Well, nothing's decided yet, so we'll see if either are right, or if it's something else, but hats off to the way they've not been afraid to tackle really quite serious issues without trivialising them. Not easy to do at any time, but even less easy when you're also looking at those issues through the viewpoint modern Christianity.
I spotted the Easter story from Colin's denial, and, although I thought carrying the cross all night was a bit laboured, I thought the whole very good. The calmly polite but efficiently dehumanizing bishop was chilling.
Fwiw, I thought the purpose of carry the cross all night was to invite physical exhaustion (he was already suffering mental exhaustion) which might, in turn, and make a ‘vision’ of God more palatable.
Agree, Fiennes was briliant as the Bishop. Those people are scarily ruthless.
who would have thought that the Archdeacon would end up being quite likeable? (sometimes anyway)
I think that started in the second when Adam and Nigel saw the Archdeacon and his boyfriend shopping for a new bed.
That was the episode when Nigel was applying to be a vicar and the Archdeacon was applying so to speak to be a Bishop.
He admitted to the interview panel that he was in an active gay relationship knowing full well it would put the kibosh on his hopes of ever becoming a bishop and he told Adam that he was okay with that
As an atheist, I must be getting soft in my old age (or my Christian upbringing is rising to the surface) as I was very upset by the stripping of the church at the end of the penultimate episode. That and Adam resigning his position... Such a humane series, I don't want it to end because it deals with the human condition so well, but everything has its time, I suppose.
Not sure if Im reading too much into it, but jesus was betrayed by Judas's kiss. Do we think in Rev, it's the actual kiss with Ellie or the betrayal of his "friend" nigel - he did seem more of a friend last week, putting Adam up.
Ooh, missed the kiss reference - whichever way it was meant. Well observed.
...which ties in with above comment. I LOVE the way Rev followed the crucifixion story so subtly and respectfully, and that there are still nuances to discover (thanks to DS posters!) There was also Colin denying Rev thrice.
Things don't bode well for Nigel then...
I advise people not to read Alison Graham's piece in the new Radio Times, because it contains what seems to me to be a massive spoiler for viewers before they see next week's episode.
Oh, I thought that was the last one of the series, and the 'To be continued' message at the end meant there's going to be a new series. Must steer clear of spoilers.
who would have thought that the Archdeacon would end up being quite likeable? (sometimes anyway)
Yes he's a brilliant character. They all are, full of surprises and contradictions, just like (gasp) real people. Shows how pitifully one-dimensional most TV/film characters are.
But no more Rev? Who'll lighten our darkness now? If this doesn't win every award going... there may be smiting!
This is where, I think, for all its faults the Catholic Church has strength. You aren't going to find such huge variations in styles of worship because the nature of Catholic liturgy doesn't allow for things to be changed dramatically between one priest/church and the next. I remember realising, in my younger, church-going days, that no matter which Catholic church we went to (e.g. on holiday in Devon, rather than at home) the Mass, everything bar the man at the front would be the same and reassuringly familiar. I knew I wasn't going to walk in the door of a strange church into a situation or 'feel' I didn't recognise.
Any Catholic congregation know what they'll get when they walk in the door in a way that perhaps, these days, Anglican congregations don't, and (according to C of E friends) that's been part of the reason for a decline in feeling 'part of' one Anglican denomination. I understand that, I wouldn't have wanted to have undertaken some kind of liturgical lottery of a Sunday, not knowing what style of service I'd find behind a strange church door, or my local one upon the installation of a new vicar! Perhaps that's why, in many cases, Catholic congregations are being swelled by new numbers who don't necessarily 'want' to be Catholic, but now - have had their Anglican options reduced in their local areas where traditional has given way to progressive?
It's funny, though, how two of the big things that seem to be drawing new, larger congregations to Christian worship are fundamentally so very different. On the one hand, there's the clearly defined structure of Catholicism (plus Pope Francis!) attracting back not only large numbers of lapsed Catholics, but also members of the Church of England who have lost the option of a 'high' Church of England vicar/church. Then, on the other hand, there's the more evangelical, almost 'anything goes to get them through the door' element under the umbrella of Anglican worship attracting huge numbers of their own. The other side of the coin, almost. And somewhere in the middle is the kind of church Adam Smallbone is trying to keep alive - dwindling congregations in areas which aren't short of people, but for whatever reason don't consider it 'their' church. A large city is full of people, but in some ways that works against a church like Rev's St. Saviours, which has always made it's more traditional congregation and style of service a key feature.
And it's a sad fact of life that huge churches are being closed down and congregations amalgamated to save money and make things more efficient, and Rev is reflecting that - it's already happened, is happening or will yet happen to most of the main Christian denominations where I live. Many church buildings have already closed down, and congregations amalgamated, but we do still have quite a lot of churches, temples, meeting halls and denominations represented, all with viable congregations!
Not sure how this compares to somewhere of a similar size, and demographic mix of town and countryside inhabitants in comparison to anywhere similar in the UK, but in an island of only 45 square miles, with a population of around 100,000, we have: 6 Catholic churches; about 16 C of E churches; 1 Baptist church; about 14 Methodist churches. In addition, we also have: 2 United Reformed churches; 1 Salvation Army citadel; 1 Quaker meeting house; 7 Independent Evangelical churches/meeting halls; 2 Pentecostal churches/meeting halls; 1 Church of Scotland; 1 Jewish synagogue; 1 Mormon temple; a small Muslim congregation (who meet in the town's Catholic church hall on a Friday afternoon). I may have missed a couple here and there!
To see St. Saviour's in Rev being treated more like a valuable commodity in terms of the building/land. and less like a church full of people who feel at home there, with Adam as their vicar, is being done very realistically (in Rev if St. Saviour's is de-consecrated it's being touted as a Tesco, here they're usually sold off for housing) and Adam's frustration with the slow-grinding gears and overwhelming paperwork that goes with the job is very well-depicted. The 'Good Friday' episode was very dark, but very well done - and I've always thought that if God were to appear on earth today he would look like one of us, not an old man with a long, flowing beard! (Or, alternatively, Liam Neeson!).
I haven't seen anything about what the final episode is about, but I do remember reading the interview with Tom Hollander before this series started in which he said the ending will have darker, more serious overtones, and that they want to tie it up and have a proper ending to this last series. The two possibilities that came into my head back then were either divorce or not being a vicar any more. Well, nothing's decided yet, so we'll see if either are right, or if it's something else, but hats off to the way they've not been afraid to tackle really quite serious issues without trivialising them. Not easy to do at any time, but even less easy when you're also looking at those issues through the viewpoint modern Christianity.
(Sorry for writing too much )
Not at all, v informative and good to have an insider's view. Do you know if Rev is meant to be Catholic or Anglican... or an invented mix of the two? They talk about Mass and it seems quite ceremonial and all, but Rev's married. Is it meant to be High Anglican?
Any Catholic congregation know what they'll get when they walk in the door in a way that perhaps, these days, Anglican congregations don't, and (according to C of E friends) that's been part of the reason for a decline in feeling 'part of' one Anglican denomination. I understand that, I wouldn't have wanted to have undertaken some kind of liturgical lottery of a Sunday, not knowing what style of service I'd find behind a strange church door, or my local one upon the installation of a new vicar! Perhaps that's why, in many cases, Catholic congregations are being swelled by new numbers who don't necessarily 'want' to be Catholic, but now - have had their Anglican options reduced in their local areas where traditional has given way to progressive?
I'm not religious in the slightest but I have noticed that if I go out for a walk on a Sunday morning then the car park at the Catholic church is full while the CofE one just down the street it is half empty.
Another reason for this is that the recent way of immigration from eastern Europe, especially Poland, has brought a lot of new practising Catholics to the country.
Not at all, v informative and good to have an insider's view. Do you know if Rev is meant to be Catholic or Anglican... or an invented mix of the two? They talk about Mass and it seems quite ceremonial and all, but Rev's married. Is it meant to be High Anglican?
I'd say St Saviour's is a typical fairly high Anglican city church.
In terms of ministry there is probably an emphasis on diversity, kindness and humanitarian goodness.
This is where, I think, for all its faults the Catholic Church has strength. You aren't going to find such huge variations in styles of worship because the nature of Catholic liturgy doesn't allow for things to be changed dramatically between one priest/church and the next. I remember realising, in my younger, church-going days, that no matter which Catholic church we went to (e.g. on holiday in Devon, rather than at home) the Mass, everything bar the man at the front would be the same and reassuringly familiar. I knew I wasn't going to walk in the door of a strange church into a situation or 'feel' I didn't recognise.
<snip>
(Sorry for writing too much )
No - it was very interesting.
It comes down to authority and being fundamental. RCs believe in the fundamental authority of the Church, Evangelicals believe in the fundamental authority of scripture.
Anything inbetween (e.g. moderate Anglicanism) where people are allowed more freedom to interpret things themselves ultimately fails because there is nothing there to demand conformity and obedience.
Religion is basically about control.
Tom Hollander was interviewed on 5live this afternoon and it sounded like this series of Rev may well be the last, he didn't seem overly eager to do more. He didn't sound averse to the idea of a film however, providing they could find a decent enough storyline to sustain 90 minutes.
Tom Hollander was interviewed on 5live this afternoon and it sounded like this series of Rev may well be the last, he didn't seem overly eager to do more. He didn't sound averse to the idea of a film however, providing they could find a decent enough storyline to sustain 90 minutes.
I heard the interview and didn't think he came across very well at all. He may be a great actor but ummmed and errrred a lot throughout. I'm sure the podcast will be available soon.
Comments
Tom H is apparently good friends with both of them and has worked with them before
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/how-we-met-ralph-fiennes--tom-hollander-9083513.html
http://www.thomagination.com/Stage/Stage_Judas_London.htm
Yes - me too. I thought it was a lovely moment - very moving. "I always be here for you Adam" So many significant references too. Personally - I would love one more series - but understand why they would leave it where it is.
Yes especially as Adam had just been singing lyrics from 'Lord of the Dance', which is sung in the persona of Jesus. The bit he sang was:
#I danced for the scribe and the Pharisee,
But they would not dance and they wouldn't follow me;
I danced for the fishermen, for James and John;
They came with me and the dance went on.#
The scribes and the Pharisees in this case being the hierarchy of the church of course.
So is next week's the last ever?
who would have thought that the Archdeacon would end up being quite likeable? (sometimes anyway)
I spotted the Easter story from Colin's denial, and, although I thought carrying the cross all night was a bit laboured, I thought the whole very good. The calmly polite but efficiently dehumanizing bishop was chilling.
This is where, I think, for all its faults the Catholic Church has strength. You aren't going to find such huge variations in styles of worship because the nature of Catholic liturgy doesn't allow for things to be changed dramatically between one priest/church and the next. I remember realising, in my younger, church-going days, that no matter which Catholic church we went to (e.g. on holiday in Devon, rather than at home) the Mass, everything bar the man at the front would be the same and reassuringly familiar. I knew I wasn't going to walk in the door of a strange church into a situation or 'feel' I didn't recognise.
Any Catholic congregation know what they'll get when they walk in the door in a way that perhaps, these days, Anglican congregations don't, and (according to C of E friends) that's been part of the reason for a decline in feeling 'part of' one Anglican denomination. I understand that, I wouldn't have wanted to have undertaken some kind of liturgical lottery of a Sunday, not knowing what style of service I'd find behind a strange church door, or my local one upon the installation of a new vicar! Perhaps that's why, in many cases, Catholic congregations are being swelled by new numbers who don't necessarily 'want' to be Catholic, but now - have had their Anglican options reduced in their local areas where traditional has given way to progressive?
It's funny, though, how two of the big things that seem to be drawing new, larger congregations to Christian worship are fundamentally so very different. On the one hand, there's the clearly defined structure of Catholicism (plus Pope Francis!) attracting back not only large numbers of lapsed Catholics, but also members of the Church of England who have lost the option of a 'high' Church of England vicar/church. Then, on the other hand, there's the more evangelical, almost 'anything goes to get them through the door' element under the umbrella of Anglican worship attracting huge numbers of their own. The other side of the coin, almost. And somewhere in the middle is the kind of church Adam Smallbone is trying to keep alive - dwindling congregations in areas which aren't short of people, but for whatever reason don't consider it 'their' church. A large city is full of people, but in some ways that works against a church like Rev's St. Saviours, which has always made it's more traditional congregation and style of service a key feature.
And it's a sad fact of life that huge churches are being closed down and congregations amalgamated to save money and make things more efficient, and Rev is reflecting that - it's already happened, is happening or will yet happen to most of the main Christian denominations where I live. Many church buildings have already closed down, and congregations amalgamated, but we do still have quite a lot of churches, temples, meeting halls and denominations represented, all with viable congregations!
Not sure how this compares to somewhere of a similar size, and demographic mix of town and countryside inhabitants in comparison to anywhere similar in the UK, but in an island of only 45 square miles, with a population of around 100,000, we have: 6 Catholic churches; about 16 C of E churches; 1 Baptist church; about 14 Methodist churches. In addition, we also have: 2 United Reformed churches; 1 Salvation Army citadel; 1 Quaker meeting house; 7 Independent Evangelical churches/meeting halls; 2 Pentecostal churches/meeting halls; 1 Church of Scotland; 1 Jewish synagogue; 1 Mormon temple; a small Muslim congregation (who meet in the town's Catholic church hall on a Friday afternoon). I may have missed a couple here and there!
To see St. Saviour's in Rev being treated more like a valuable commodity in terms of the building/land. and less like a church full of people who feel at home there, with Adam as their vicar, is being done very realistically (in Rev if St. Saviour's is de-consecrated it's being touted as a Tesco, here they're usually sold off for housing) and Adam's frustration with the slow-grinding gears and overwhelming paperwork that goes with the job is very well-depicted. The 'Good Friday' episode was very dark, but very well done - and I've always thought that if God were to appear on earth today he would look like one of us, not an old man with a long, flowing beard! (Or, alternatively, Liam Neeson!).
I haven't seen anything about what the final episode is about, but I do remember reading the interview with Tom Hollander before this series started in which he said the ending will have darker, more serious overtones, and that they want to tie it up and have a proper ending to this last series. The two possibilities that came into my head back then were either divorce or not being a vicar any more. Well, nothing's decided yet, so we'll see if either are right, or if it's something else, but hats off to the way they've not been afraid to tackle really quite serious issues without trivialising them. Not easy to do at any time, but even less easy when you're also looking at those issues through the viewpoint modern Christianity.
(Sorry for writing too much
Agree, Fiennes was briliant as the Bishop. Those people are scarily ruthless.
I think that started in the second when Adam and Nigel saw the Archdeacon and his boyfriend shopping for a new bed.
That was the episode when Nigel was applying to be a vicar and the Archdeacon was applying so to speak to be a Bishop.
He admitted to the interview panel that he was in an active gay relationship knowing full well it would put the kibosh on his hopes of ever becoming a bishop and he told Adam that he was okay with that
A cult classic...
Things don't bode well for Nigel then... Oh, I thought that was the last one of the series, and the 'To be continued' message at the end meant there's going to be a new series. Must steer clear of spoilers. Yes he's a brilliant character. They all are, full of surprises and contradictions, just like (gasp) real people. Shows how pitifully one-dimensional most TV/film characters are.
But no more Rev? Who'll lighten our darkness now? If this doesn't win every award going... there may be smiting!
I'm not religious in the slightest but I have noticed that if I go out for a walk on a Sunday morning then the car park at the Catholic church is full while the CofE one just down the street it is half empty.
Another reason for this is that the recent way of immigration from eastern Europe, especially Poland, has brought a lot of new practising Catholics to the country.
I'd say St Saviour's is a typical fairly high Anglican city church.
In terms of ministry there is probably an emphasis on diversity, kindness and humanitarian goodness.
No - it was very interesting.
It comes down to authority and being fundamental. RCs believe in the fundamental authority of the Church, Evangelicals believe in the fundamental authority of scripture.
Anything inbetween (e.g. moderate Anglicanism) where people are allowed more freedom to interpret things themselves ultimately fails because there is nothing there to demand conformity and obedience.
Religion is basically about control.
I heard the interview and didn't think he came across very well at all. He may be a great actor but ummmed and errrred a lot throughout. I'm sure the podcast will be available soon.