What do Doctors do once they regenerate?

ClackersClackers Posts: 628
Forum Member
✭✭
It has been bothering me since Saturday seeing Tom Baker as The Curator.

It is perfectly clear - to me at least - that he was NOT playing the Doctor, he was playing a random Curator, with a hint of fan wank which Moffat knew would appeal to you guys.

But if people are trying to include this fan wank into canon, by saying that regenerated Doctors go and live 'normal' lives and age consistently, then I have some pertinent questions:

1. Why do they always choose Earth?
2. Why do they never die?
3. How do events of The Three/Five/Two Doctors fit into this new analogy? They still have tardises, they still are timelords, they still timetravel.

I like the idea of Pertwee's regenerated Doctor, for example, living on Earth as a high-ranking official for UNIT. I am also happy that Tom Baker's Doctor became a Curator at a Museum in London.

But it is not consistent with canon in the show from previous episodes.
«1

Comments

  • saladfingers81saladfingers81 Posts: 11,301
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    It was a nice sweet moment. I would prefer to not use the term 'fanwank'. It was one for the fans, the show,itself and of course Tom. It doesn't have to make perfect sense. I don't think its saying that every incarnation of the Doctor lives out a normal life. It wasn't saying that at all. It was cheeky and self referential. Not for scientific scrutiny. For enjoying.
  • ListentomeListentome Posts: 9,804
    Forum Member
    The implication with The Curator, from the dialogue between him and 11 is that he is a future incarnation of The Doctor who has reused the face of his Fourth incarnation, not the Fourth Doctor having lived on in human form. Or like you say he is just a random human.

    As far as I can see there is no implication that each incarnation lives on after regeneration. Though of course they exist in their own time and could be visited by time travellers going into the past. Each incarnation is part of the same man, 1 regenerated into 2, so how could 1 continue to live on?
  • November_RainNovember_Rain Posts: 9,145
    Forum Member
    This is not what happens, The Doctor is not split into two persons every time he regenerates, he is still the same person, just with a new face and personality, he doesn't get replaced by somebody else (don't let Hartnell's line in The Three Doctors fool you).

    Think of it like the transformation a caterpillar makes into a butterfly, the old body is effectively killed off and replaced by a new body, but it is still the same creature. The same principle applies to The Doctor and his regenerations.

    Oh, and the implication I believe was that The Curator was a "retired" Doctor who'd modelled his appearance on his fourth incarnation.
  • CorwinCorwin Posts: 16,588
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    Former Incarnations of the Doctor don't go on living normal lives after they regenerate that's stupid.


    It's like saying an Orange I've just squeezed and turned into Orange Juice is still sitting in the Fruit Bowl.


    Those bodies are gone, every cell rewritten to form the new body.




    Tom Baker was playing a Future Incarnation of the Doctor (say the 50th Doctor) who had decided to look like a former incarnation when he first regenerated.
  • ShoppyShoppy Posts: 1,094
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    "Perhaps I was you of course .... or perhaps you are me" - The Curator

    He's blatantly a future incarnation who has retired and become the Curator just as the 11th Doctor was pondering only moments before.
    The 11th Doctor recognises the face and the Curator tells him that "In years to come..." he may find himself "...revisiting a few".

    How direct does it have to be?
  • November_RainNovember_Rain Posts: 9,145
    Forum Member
    Corwin wrote: »
    Former Incarnations of the Doctor don't go on living normal lives after they regenerate that's stupid

    Agreed. If that were the case each Doctor might as well hand over the TARDIS to somebody else. Ten would also have not been as forlorn about his impending regeneration.
  • dvirgodvirgo Posts: 400
    Forum Member
    Loved the idea of the future retired Doctor chooses some of his old faces. Just brilliant, get around the age thing doesn't it.
  • OrriOrri Posts: 9,470
    Forum Member
    Shoppy wrote: »
    "Perhaps I was you of course .... or perhaps you are me" - The Curator

    He's blatantly a future incarnation who has retired and become the Curator just as the 11th Doctor was pondering only moments before.
    The 11th Doctor recognises the face and the Curator tells him that "In years to come..." he may find himself "...revisiting a few".

    How direct does it have to be?

    That or the Doctor was daydreaming. I remember some mention of Clara asking him about his dreams.
    Perhaps the answer to your question is that the minds of his old incarnations lie in his subconcious and he can access them through meditation or dreams.
  • lordOfTimelordOfTime Posts: 22,266
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    dvirgo wrote: »
    Loved the idea of the future retired Doctor chooses some of his old faces. Just brilliant, get around the age thing doesn't it.

    It does, but does nothing to explain how. :)
  • CorwinCorwin Posts: 16,588
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    lordOfTime wrote: »
    It does, but does nothing to explain how. :)

    Practice makes Perfect.
  • sebbie3000sebbie3000 Posts: 5,188
    Forum Member
    lordOfTime wrote: »
    It does, but does nothing to explain how. :)

    Same way Romana could choose hers, most probably...
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 194
    Forum Member
    Once the Doctor regenerates into his new form, many years and parsecs away from where the regneration occured, there is a cloud of golden energy that coalesces into his old shape - beside a microphone at Big Finish studios :p
  • jpljpl Posts: 286
    Forum Member
    I don't think Baker was playing a future doctor at all. he was a curator and nods to fans. The revisiting old faces is probably a reference to Capaldi having played characters in the whoniverse before.

    The if I was you etc was simply winks to the past in that Baker was the Doctor. I don't think anything else is to be taken from it
  • lordOfTimelordOfTime Posts: 22,266
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    Corwin wrote: »
    Practice makes Perfect.
    sebbie3000 wrote: »
    Same way Romana could choose hers, most probably...

    I meant more that it doesn't explain how he has more than 13 incarnations. :)
  • tallordertallorder Posts: 975
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    Orri wrote: »
    That or the Doctor was daydreaming. I remember some mention of Clara asking him about his dreams.
    Perhaps the answer to your question is that the minds of his old incarnations lie in his subconcious and he can access them through meditation or dreams.

    I saw a nice suggestion of him being 'The Moment' over at DoctorWhoTV
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,056
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    jpl wrote: »
    I don't think Baker was playing a future doctor at all. he was a curator and nods to fans. The revisiting old faces is probably a reference to Capaldi having played characters in the whoniverse before.

    The if I was you etc was simply winks to the past in that Baker was the Doctor. I don't think anything else is to be taken from it

    I think the biggest problem people have with this explanation is that using Tom Baker, and having him say what he said, but it not meaning anything other than, "Hey we got Tom Baker in guys!" just feels too glib.

    Maybe we're kidding ourselves, maybe that's all it was meant to be, as the original poster called it - 'fan****' - not a pleasant term, but descriptive!

    I think Shoppy makes the best case for him being a future regeneration who has retired from adventuring to look after the Gallery, perhaps remembering it's significance and awaiting the arrival of his earlier selves so he could pop in and give him a little pointer... ;)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,056
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    tallorder wrote: »
    I saw a nice suggestion of him being 'The Moment' over at DoctorWhoTV

    I dunno, I think The Moment was the device and Billie Piper. I'm not sure I believe it went further than that... Or did I miss something in the show?
  • Thunder LipsThunder Lips Posts: 1,660
    Forum Member
    ✭✭✭
    I can't believe anyone could interpret it as anything other than what it was - a future, "retired" Doctor. Almost every line he says is telling you this, but still people don't get it?
  • OhWhenTheSaintsOhWhenTheSaints Posts: 12,531
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    jpl wrote: »
    I don't think Baker was playing a future doctor at all. he was a curator and nods to fans. The revisiting old faces is probably a reference to Capaldi having played characters in the whoniverse before.

    The if I was you etc was simply winks to the past in that Baker was the Doctor. I don't think anything else is to be taken from it

    Why would MS randomly say "I never forget a face" and then wink?

    I'm going to go along with Tom being a future Doctor.
  • OhWhenTheSaintsOhWhenTheSaints Posts: 12,531
    Forum Member
    ✭✭
    I can't believe anyone could interpret it as anything other than what it was - a future, "retired" Doctor. Almost every line he says is telling you this, but still people don't get it?

    Indeed.
  • Brass Drag0nBrass Drag0n Posts: 5,046
    Forum Member
    I can't believe anyone could interpret it as anything other than what it was - a future, "retired" Doctor. Almost every line he says is telling you this, but still people don't get it?

    Yeah, boggles the mind that there could be an alternative conclusion. Especially as it was clearly meant to tie in with the Doctor's earlier fear that he will "die" at Trenzalore.

    It was obviously meant as a 'don't worry son, we will get a retirement in out old age" - I'd also put good money on the curator keeping bees. ;)
  • jpljpl Posts: 286
    Forum Member
    I can't believe anyone could interpret it as anything other than what it was - a future, "retired" Doctor. Almost every line he says is telling you this, but still people don't get it?
    Why would MS randomly say "I never forget a face" and then wink?

    I'm going to go along with Tom being a future Doctor.

    The things that they are telling each other 'I never forget a face' is largely break the forth wall nods to the fans.

    Moffat has stated he will explain why the doctor in his new form looks like previous characters and I think this was part of that explanation. i.e. maybe the curator is someone he met in one of his first 3 incarnations

    It was meant to be a vague scene to allow fans to speculate what it meant, you're not supposed to get it. it was there as a vehicle to have the oldest doctor speak to the newest, the actual content other than that isn't the most important part.

    The same goes for the Capaldi scene, pure bliss and great to watch. you just ignore the fact that the doctor as Smith dies at Trenzolore, until he changes that (and he's seen his grave so wee bit of a paradox to sort) then there are no future doctors including Capaldi. none what-so-ever

    But you know what it was the 50th and it was fun and these things don't matter, we celebrated the old and the new and we all loved it
  • dvirgodvirgo Posts: 400
    Forum Member
    jpl wrote: »
    The things that they are telling each other 'I never forget a face' is largely break the forth wall nods to the fans.

    Moffat has stated he will explain why the doctor in his new form looks like previous characters and I think this was part of that explanation. i.e. maybe the curator is someone he met in one of his first 3 incarnations

    It was meant to be a vague scene to allow fans to speculate what it meant, you're not supposed to get it. it was there as a vehicle to have the oldest doctor speak to the newest, the actual content other than that isn't the most important part.

    The same goes for the Capaldi scene, pure bliss and great to watch. you just ignore the fact that the doctor as Smith dies at Trenzolore, until he changes that (and he's seen his grave so wee bit of a paradox to sort) then there are no future doctors including Capaldi. none what-so-ever

    But you know what it was the 50th and it was fun and these things don't matter, we celebrated the old and the new and we all loved it

    The thing is the curator says that he brought the painting to earth. Matt's Doctor expresses that he could be a curator and recognizes himself. he doesn't ask who he is but trusts and accepts what his furture-self tells him.

    Besides, I would imagine that Stephen Moffat would relish the change to have Tom Baker as the Doctor at the age he is now. What a clever way to do it
  • jpljpl Posts: 286
    Forum Member
    dvirgo wrote: »
    The thing is the curator says that he brought the painting to earth. Matt's Doctor expresses that he could be a curator and recognizes himself. he doesn't ask who he is but trusts and accepts what his furture-self tells him.

    Besides, I would imagine that Stephen Moffat would relish the change to have Tom Baker as the Doctor at the age he is now. What a clever way to do it

    No he just says he acquired it in remarkable circumstances. nothing about bringing it to earth
  • dvirgodvirgo Posts: 400
    Forum Member
    jpl wrote: »
    No he just says he acquired it in remarkable circumstances. nothing about bringing it to earth

    I think its all implied. I agree there was a nod to the fans but it was cleverly within the narrative. The curator is remarkably well-informed and was looking for 11 to put him on his next path.

    Anyway, Tom being the Doctor i grew up with I'm going interpret that last scene in my own way. which is that Tom Baker is the Doctor again on prime time Saturday Night. That was the gift for fans over a certain age.
Sign In or Register to comment.