'Racist'? I think we should all know that one by now considering how its the default accusation for so many posters on here.
It relatively rare in fact... mind you if it was it's because it's become a default behavior of so many posters who hide behind the unmitigated outrage the mere suggestion of a hint of a possibility of an accusation of racism creates.
I wish i could but noone seems to be able to come up with the amount of people who are members of the EDL or even what constitutes being a member but that doesn't stop them labelling them all as criminals but i do know that some of our MP's have criminal convictions so everyone who is a member of their party or supports them is a thief and a liar as well, that's how it works, isn't it?
So instead of denoucing those with criminal records your justification is that everybody else is as bad? That's a pretty poor line of defence.
Depends how you carve them up. How many people affiliate to EDL? Of those, what proportion have criminal records?
Someone seems to have put together a database, according to the headline.
Supposing someone put together a criminal database relating to muslims or immigrant doctors (categories randomly chosen just for arguments sake), what would be the reaction I wonder?
About %5 of mp's claimed money for second homes in the expenses scandal that isn't including claims for other spurious things like moat cleaning or bin bags.
Lol its funny how desperately you are trying to defend people by comparing serious racially aggravated assaults with MP's expenses.
You relate to these people? Thats fine if its your thing - but if you think you can convince anyone they arent a nasty bunch of people that you wouldnt want to be stuck on a train with then your wasting your time.
So instead of denoucing those with criminal records your justification is that everybody else is as bad? That's a pretty poor line of defence.
I'm not denouncing anyone. If youu have a criminal record that doesn't mean you don't have legitimate concerns and it doesn't diminish what you say and drawing attention to your character and not the content of what you're saying is a poor line of defence.
Someone seems to have put together a database according to the headline.
Supposing someone put together a criminal database relating to muslims or immigrant doctors (categories randomly chosen just for arguments sake), what would be the reaction I wonder?
Criminal convictions are in the public domain already, so anybody can do what they like with them.
I'm not denouncing anyone. If youu have a criminal record that doesn't mean you don't have legitimate concerns and it doesn't diminish what you say and drawing attention to your character and not the content of what you're saying is a poor line of defence.
As a supporter / member of the EDL, do you think it's OK to firebomb buildings with people in them or to throw things at the police?
Lol its funny how desperately you are trying to defend people by comparing serious racially aggravated assaults with MP's expenses..
One of those "serious racially aggravated assaults" was making a remark that a group of black youths were looters after the riots, maybe there are some more serious offences in there, i just picked one at random and that was what it said. Maybe you will google some of the offences and see what they were because they're all matter of public record and not the result of some uber hacking group.
I'm not denouncing anyone. If youu have a criminal record that doesn't mean you don't have legitimate concerns and it doesn't diminish what you say and drawing attention to your character and not the content of what you're saying is a poor line of defence.
Criminal convictions are in the public domain already, so anybody can do what they like with them.
Fair enough. Do you happen to know whether anyone has gone to the trouble of constructing a data base for the random examples I chose: muslims and immigrant doctors?
There are, of course, many other categories one could choose to construct a database for.
I just wondered whether choosing to do one on the EDL was for any special reason.
So instead of denoucing those with criminal records your justification is that everybody else is as bad? That's a pretty poor line of defence.
I thought he was saying you should not selectively denounce for criminal records or infer that if a group has a higher proportion of criminals that can be read as indicative of the each individual of that group. The proportions of Muslims in prison and black people in prison is significantly higher than other groups. Do we make a judgement on all the members of each group with that fact? Would it be wrong to do so?
I never said they all were. Don't you think having that lot is more than enough?
I'm not sure what lot you are referring to.
I wish there weren't any criminals but the fact is we have them and just because they are it doesn't mean their concerns aren't genuine or should be ignored.
I wish there weren't any criminals but the fact is we have them and just because they are it doesn't mean their concerns aren't genuine or should be ignored.
But the type of convictions they have does mean their motivations should be examined.
Rather a lot of 'racially aggravated's in here for a "non-racist" organisation. Quite a few child molesters too. And explosives and fire bombers. Not a few murderers either.
Well, you can imagine my surprise.
I bet the EDL's crammed with people who've been convicted of some racial hatred crime. Robinson keeps on insisting that his organisation isn't racist but there's videos on YouTube that shows this isn't the case.
But the type of convictions they have does mean their motivations should be examined.
Not really, even if we do accept that they are racist they aren't protesting against asians, they're protesting against an extreme form of religion and were born because of the incident in wooton bassett were anjem choudarys band of cronies were inciting hatred towards our troops. I'm not denying there are racists at EDL marches but the motive behind their marches isn't racist.
Not really, even if we do accept that they are racist they aren't protesting against asians, they're protesting against an extreme form of religion and were born because of the incident in wooton bassett were anjem choudarys band of cronies were inciting hatred towards our troops. I'm not denying there are racists at EDL marches but the motive behind their marches isn't racist.
Absolutely bloody hilarious, now you're a mindreader. :rolleyes::D
Absolutely bloody hilarious, now you're a mindreader. :rolleyes::D
That is quite amusing, if you are calling me a mind reader for saying their motive isn't racist considering Islam isn't a race then i assume you are a mind reader because you know they are.
That is quite amusing, if you are calling me a mind reader for saying their motive isn't racist considering Islam isn't a race then i assume you are a mind reader because you know they are.
Because of what they say perhaps? they oppose shariah law and extremist Islam not muslims.
So just because of what they say, you know they're not motivated against Islam just because the vast majority of Muslims are of a different race? My apologies, you are a mind reader.
So just because of what they say, you know they're not motivated against Islam just because the vast majority of Muslims are of a different race? My apologies, you are a mind reader.
By that definition so are you. So what is your point.
If you read the wiki page you so helpfully posted in the other thread perhaps you would have noticed this.
Comments
It relatively rare in fact... mind you if it was it's because it's become a default behavior of so many posters who hide behind the unmitigated outrage the mere suggestion of a hint of a possibility of an accusation of racism creates.
So instead of denoucing those with criminal records your justification is that everybody else is as bad? That's a pretty poor line of defence.
Someone seems to have put together a database, according to the headline.
Supposing someone put together a criminal database relating to muslims or immigrant doctors (categories randomly chosen just for arguments sake), what would be the reaction I wonder?
Lol its funny how desperately you are trying to defend people by comparing serious racially aggravated assaults with MP's expenses.
http://static0.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/a_scale_large/500-6/photos/1297005577-farright-edl-marches-through-luton_582016.jpg
http://www.voice-online.co.uk/sites/default/files/imagecache/455/EDL_1.jpg
You relate to these people? Thats fine if its your thing - but if you think you can convince anyone they arent a nasty bunch of people that you wouldnt want to be stuck on a train with then your wasting your time.
I'm not denouncing anyone. If youu have a criminal record that doesn't mean you don't have legitimate concerns and it doesn't diminish what you say and drawing attention to your character and not the content of what you're saying is a poor line of defence.
Criminal convictions are in the public domain already, so anybody can do what they like with them.
As a supporter / member of the EDL, do you think it's OK to firebomb buildings with people in them or to throw things at the police?
One of those "serious racially aggravated assaults" was making a remark that a group of black youths were looters after the riots, maybe there are some more serious offences in there, i just picked one at random and that was what it said. Maybe you will google some of the offences and see what they were because they're all matter of public record and not the result of some uber hacking group.
No, but it does mean you're a criminal.
I never said it didn't, what is your point?
In case you cant understand mine it was that just because some people in a group are it doesn't mean all of them are.
Fair enough. Do you happen to know whether anyone has gone to the trouble of constructing a data base for the random examples I chose: muslims and immigrant doctors?
There are, of course, many other categories one could choose to construct a database for.
I just wondered whether choosing to do one on the EDL was for any special reason.
I thought he was saying you should not selectively denounce for criminal records or infer that if a group has a higher proportion of criminals that can be read as indicative of the each individual of that group. The proportions of Muslims in prison and black people in prison is significantly higher than other groups. Do we make a judgement on all the members of each group with that fact? Would it be wrong to do so?
I never said they all were. Don't you think having that lot is more than enough?
No i dont but when you see the EDL throwing things at the police you never see who is behind the police antagonising and throwing things at them
I'm not sure what lot you are referring to.
I wish there weren't any criminals but the fact is we have them and just because they are it doesn't mean their concerns aren't genuine or should be ignored.
But the type of convictions they have does mean their motivations should be examined.
Am I the only one that went looking down the list to my own surname?
Not really, even if we do accept that they are racist they aren't protesting against asians, they're protesting against an extreme form of religion and were born because of the incident in wooton bassett were anjem choudarys band of cronies were inciting hatred towards our troops. I'm not denying there are racists at EDL marches but the motive behind their marches isn't racist.
Absolutely bloody hilarious, now you're a mindreader. :rolleyes::D
That is quite amusing, if you are calling me a mind reader for saying their motive isn't racist considering Islam isn't a race then i assume you are a mind reader because you know they are.
Bloody hilarious!
And you know their motivations...how exactly?
Because of what they say perhaps? they oppose shariah law and extremist Islam not muslims.
So just because of what they say, you know they're not motivated against Islam just because the vast majority of Muslims are of a different race? My apologies, you are a mind reader.
By that definition so are you. So what is your point.
If you read the wiki page you so helpfully posted in the other thread perhaps you would have noticed this.
Those darned racists, recruiting people of other races!