In reality it doesn't matter one iota what the grandparents want or what circumstances the baby will be born into (for better or for worse), the fact remains that in Ireland pregnant women have the same rights as dogs. I really hope for a positive outcome in this case but the clause needs to change - women cannot become imprisoned to their wombs the minute they become pregnant .
I was just about to post similar sentiments. Why is anyone talking about the wishes of the mother as though it would make a difference if she were alive?
Which part? I thought this was a debate, if you have something to say against my points, say them.
"fact remains that in Ireland pregnant women have the same rights as dogs" ... You do realise the Irish people voted for this in our constitution - and yes women do have a right to vote.
I was just about to post similar sentiments. Why is anyone talking about the wishes of the mother as though it would make a difference if she were alive?
Because it would. In very, very restricted circumstances she could terminate her pregnancy in Ireland, and in any circumstances she chose she could travel to another country to have an abortion.
I was just about to post similar sentiments. Why is anyone talking about the wishes of the mother as though it would make a difference if she were alive?
Of course it's different - as far as we know this child would have been born according to the wishes to its loving mother. She could also have travelled for an abortion or have the child up for adoption.
I bet the vast majority of mothers would die willingly for their baby if they had to.
Because it would. In very, very restricted circumstances she could terminate her pregnancy in Ireland, and in any circumstances she chose she could travel to another country to have an abortion.
"fact remains that in Ireland pregnant women have the same rights as dogs" ... You do realise the Irish people voted for this in our constitution - and yes women do have a right to vote.
30 years ago you mean, in 1983. There has been calls to repeal the 8th amendment which have fallen on Enda Kennys deaf ignorant ears.
Because it would. In very, very restricted circumstances she could terminate her pregnancy in Ireland, and in any circumstances she chose she could travel to another country to have an abortion.
Out of curiosity has the law in the Republic of Ireland changed on that as wasn't that illegal?
Of course it's different - as far as we know this child would have been born according to the wishes to its loving mother. She could also have travelled for an abortion or have the child up for adoption.
I bet the vast majority of mothers would die willingly for their baby if they had to.
You mean if they chose to be pregnant and wanted to carry the baby? Any other choice is basically denied by single blokes in frocks in the luxurious Vatican. No barefoot and pregnant issues for them, unlike millions of women around the world . It's loving mother may just not have wanted her parents to be subjected to a living nightmare they clearly can't cope with.
Out of curiosity has the law in the Republic of Ireland changed on that as wasn't that illegal?
The right to travel? That changed donkey's years ago, back when Albert Reynolds was Taoiseach. The right to travel is now enshrined in the constitution.
The right to travel? That changed donkey's years ago, back when Albert Reynolds was Taoiseach. The right to travel is now enshrined in the constitution.
Wow blatant hypocrisy, no surprise. No it's not good enough!
Its not good enough in my opinion either, but still not the same as pregnant women having no more rights than dogs. That's just hyperbole.
I stand by my statement, women who are forced to travel for abortions due to any number of circumstances (including rape, foetal abnormality etc.) are treated like people who are not worthy of any compassion or sympathy. I'm not just talking about abortion either, how about the symphysiotomy scandal in the 1980s which the government is barely acknowledging.
The right to travel? That changed donkey's years ago, back when Albert Reynolds was Taoiseach. The right to travel is now enshrined in the constitution.
I don't care what the people of Ireland think at this very moment. I will never agree with reproductive rights being decided by mob rule.
Is this going off topic? I can't tell.
Well it's not by mob rule, the state considers human life basically starts at conception... Men and woman have access to all necessary birth control if they want, it's not like condoms aren't freely available like years back.
I stand by my statement, women who are forced to travel for abortions due to any number of circumstances (including rape, foetal abnormality etc.) are treated like people who are not worthy of any compassion or sympathy. I'm not just talking about abortion either, how about the symphysiotomy scandal in the 1980s which the government is barely acknowledging.
I fully agree that the laws should be changed and that stupid 8th amendment should never have been put in the constitution in the first place. As for the symphysiotomy scandal, what do you expect with Michael Noonan in charge of the purse strings? Don't you remember Brigid McCole?
Catholic brainwashing and fear, from birth, helps that along nicely.
Well I'm 23, not a big fan of all things Catholic church and I don't agree with the abortion of healthy children .. Gay Marriage in churches or whatever I completely support.
Comments
I was just about to post similar sentiments. Why is anyone talking about the wishes of the mother as though it would make a difference if she were alive?
Because it would. In very, very restricted circumstances she could terminate her pregnancy in Ireland, and in any circumstances she chose she could travel to another country to have an abortion.
I bet the vast majority of mothers would die willingly for their baby if they had to.
It's not good enough, in my opinion.
I'm talking in general about the lack of reproductive rights in the ROI.
30 years ago you mean, in 1983. There has been calls to repeal the 8th amendment which have fallen on Enda Kennys deaf ignorant ears.
Out of curiosity has the law in the Republic of Ireland changed on that as wasn't that illegal?
Its not good enough in my opinion either, but still not the same as pregnant women having no more rights than dogs. That's just hyperbole.
You mean if they chose to be pregnant and wanted to carry the baby? Any other choice is basically denied by single blokes in frocks in the luxurious Vatican. No barefoot and pregnant issues for them, unlike millions of women around the world . It's loving mother may just not have wanted her parents to be subjected to a living nightmare they clearly can't cope with.
The right to travel? That changed donkey's years ago, back when Albert Reynolds was Taoiseach. The right to travel is now enshrined in the constitution.
Abortion in instances of abnormalities or rape would pass but aborting healthy children would fail by a considerable margin IMO.
Agreed.
Wow blatant hypocrisy, no surprise. No it's not good enough!
I don't care what the people of Ireland think at this very moment. I will never agree with reproductive rights being decided by mob rule.
Is this going off topic? I can't tell.
Catholic brainwashing and fear, from birth, helps that along nicely.
I stand by my statement, women who are forced to travel for abortions due to any number of circumstances (including rape, foetal abnormality etc.) are treated like people who are not worthy of any compassion or sympathy. I'm not just talking about abortion either, how about the symphysiotomy scandal in the 1980s which the government is barely acknowledging.
Wasn't too sure so thanks for that.
So it is a question of what, if any, rights the foetus has.
I fully agree that the laws should be changed and that stupid 8th amendment should never have been put in the constitution in the first place. As for the symphysiotomy scandal, what do you expect with Michael Noonan in charge of the purse strings? Don't you remember Brigid McCole?
"as far as practicable" - these 4 words in our constitution will decide everything.
It has the same rights as the mother.