Do people put any of the other religions on such a ridiculous pedestal?
I don't think the book is aimed specifically at Muslims. If you agree with any of it, your more than welcome to follow its advice. So please don't feel so left out.
Thats another great post Sid. Part of my frustration as a muslim is the constant need to defend myself and my religion from some posters who seem to think the mere fact that I am a muslim means i encourage and advocate wife beating, that im homophobic etc. Inspite of the way some are posting they always come back round to that viewpoint and wonder why I feel insulted by it. "so called religion of peace" has been cited on here repeatedly in the last week by the hate mongers.
I imagine it must be very frustrating for you Pet (god I sound like a geordie).
I'm a gay guy, and ironically, the most anti-gay views I've seen posted on here haven't come from Muslim posters at all (who have been nothing but polite to me). It's actually from the some of the people who are also vehemently anti-Muslim; the hard right faction of our forum.
I imagine it must be very frustrating for you Pet (god I sound like a geordie).
I'm a gay guy, and ironically, the most anti-gay views I've seen posted on here haven't come from Muslim posters at all (who have been nothing but polite to me). It's actually from the some of the people who are also vehemently anti-Muslim; the hard right faction of our forum.
I can relate to that, it appears they are very closed minded and i like to think I can at least be open to realising my religion isnt perfect hence teaching from the iman whose main line is that everyone is human first, and we need to love our fellow man regardless of race, colour, creed, religion or sexual orientation. Hes suffered from some extremists who don't share his views irl attacking the mosque and him and his home, but that small fraction are in the minority and most moderate muslims realise education and listening to experinced moderate muslims regarding intergration for people new to the UK and respect and tolerance is the way forward.
Im trying from here on in to ignore the hate as ive given up trying to debate with them and respond and debate with a more positive and open minded group of posters.
I found your doctors example a bit odd though. Unless they have it tattooed on their foreheads, how would you know a group of doctors standing together were Muslim?
Just a hyperthetical example of how being a muslim is more of an identifier than anything else about a person, such as their job. I could have said they were gathered together in a hospital car park wearing white coats and kneeling on their prayer mats to make it more authentic I guess
The point is though, that every muslim, is in effect, a representative of their religion, and when so many representatives of any group do so many bad things, that group will be seen as a wrong 'un. Islam's reputation is well and truly sullied by the actions of some who represent it, particually when you realise that the bad things they have done are nearly all as a result of following the religious doctrine, or core element of the religion.
You see, these bad people doing bad things aren't all muslim by coincidence, it's because they are muslim that they have done the bad things in the first lace
I can relate to that, it appears they are very closed minded and i like to think I can at least be open to realising my religion isnt perfect hence teaching from the iman whose main line is that everyone is human first, and we need to love our fellow man regardless of race, colour, creed, religion or sexual orientation. Hes suffered from some extremists who don't share his views irl attacking the mosque and him and his home, but that small fraction are in the minority and most moderate muslims realise education and listening to experinced moderate muslims regarding intergration for people new to the UK and respect and tolerance is the way forward.
Im trying from here on in to ignore the hate as ive given up trying to debate with them and respond and debate with a more positive and open minded group of posters.
I've worked in schools where most of our kids were muslim (and others where the majority were sikh), as well as very mixed schools, and very white schools both catholic and RC... and it always strikes me as interesting how the people with the strongest opinions on these subjects, have probably never met a muslim in their lives.
All their views are formed from what they read in the paper. And those, in turn, are written by people who have also never met a muslim in their lives (well not knowingly, but you'll get what I mean:D)
Keep posting Pet, because you, here on the interwebz, are the nearest some of these bigots will ever get to having a reality check.
I've worked in schools where most of our kids were muslim (and others where the majority were sikh), as well as very mixed schools, and very white schools both catholic and RC... and it always strikes me as interesting how the people with the strongest opinions on these subjects, have probably never met a muslim in their lives.
All their views are formed from what they read in the paper. And those, in turn, are written by people who have also never met a muslim in their lives (well not knowingly, but you'll get what I mean:D)
Keep posting Pet, because you, here on the interwebz, are the nearest some of these bigots will ever get to having a reality check.
Thank you. I really appreciate that. I have felt a little fed up with having to constantly explain myself and my religion to a bunch of people who seem to have closed eyes. I am grateful for posters like you and others who actually listen and take on board all views not just the ones you agree with and debate I'm not sure the hate mongers realise how racist they sound but apparently i accuse everyone of being a racist who disagrees with the muslim way of life which isnt true. I feel people make racist posts because of their ignorance and that makes them appear racist to me. Disliking and attacking only muslims is racist to me when there are many crimes commited by people from other religions but the DM bigots bible isn't posting those stories, just the anti muslim rhetoric which feeds the haters hate.
If someone is saying every muslim agrees with terrorist acts or finds a poll saying 25% of young english muslims agree with the twin towers being blown up and therefore islam is a joke. i find that racist and ignorant as a poll can be made to say anything you like, take that poll outside an extremist mosque and youll get the answer you want for your article. Take the same poll outside mine or many other mosques and the response would be very different indeed.
Thank you for the tolerance, its appreciated. Sorry for the long post.
You see, these bad people doing bad things aren't all muslim by coincidence, it's because they are muslim that they have done the bad things in the first lace
What a load of rubbish.
Generally, and I know for certain you already know this, it doesn't take religion for people to be bad. Your trying to suggest these people are bad because of Islam, thats a little stupid at best and probably intentional WUMing.
I've worked in schools where most of our kids were muslim (and others where the majority were sikh), as well as very mixed schools, and very white schools both catholic and RC... and it always strikes me as interesting how the people with the strongest opinions on these subjects, have probably never met a muslim in their lives.
All their views are formed from what they read in the paper. And those, in turn, are written by people who have also never met a muslim in their lives (well not knowingly, but you'll get what I mean:D)
Keep posting Pet, because you, here on the interwebz, are the nearest some of these bigots will ever get to having a reality check.
Yet you call doctors, teachers, lawyers, etc who wear crucifixes "prats", unable to do their jobs due to being superstitious and unable to think clearly. I guess you save your bigotry for Christians.
Thank you. I really appreciate that. I have felt a little fed up with having to constantly explain myself and my religion to a bunch of people who seem to have closed eyes. I am grateful for posters like you and others who actually listen and take on board all views not just the ones you agree with and debate I'm not sure the hate mongers realise how racist they sound but apparently i accuse everyone of being a racist who disagrees with the muslim way of life which isnt true. I feel people make racist posts because of their ignorance and that makes them appear racist to me. Disliking and attacking only muslims is racist to me when there are many crimes commited by people from other religions but the DM bigots bible isn't posting those stories, just the anti muslim rhetoric which feeds the haters hate.
If someone is saying every muslim agrees with terrorist acts or finds a poll saying 25% of young english muslims agree with the twin towers being blown up and therefore islam is a joke. i find that racist and ignorant as a poll can be made to say anything you like, take that poll outside an extremist mosque and youll get the answer you want for your article. Take the same poll outside mine or many other mosques and the response would be very different indeed.
Thank you for the tolerance, its appreciated. Sorry for the long post.
I believe you may be the only person to have said that
Generally, and I know for certain you already know this, it doesn't take religion for people to be bad. Your trying to suggest these people are bad because of Islam, thats a little stupid at best and probably intentional WUMing.
Well yes, we know already that anyone can be bad, However, we are talking specificaly about bad muslims here, and most of the bad stuff they do is as a direct result of following the islamic doctrine
For example would a non-muslim self-detonate in the name of allah? Very unlikely I would have thought. But those that have self-detonated in the name of allah and caused murder and carnage have tended to be muslims
yes but there's no shortage of non-muslims planting bombs or going on killing sprees. I think the best you can draw from that is that the means of bad things might be influenced by the religion, not the carrying out of a horrrific act itself.
This is the problem with religions. You get these fractions within them that just talk out of their pooh pipes. Then this bum talk gets associated with everyone else associated with that religion.
It is almost akin to people on benefits getting called scroungers and idle gits because a small fraction indeed are and we all know that is not right to lable folk lik this, yeah?
Well yes, we know already that anyone can be bad, However, we are talking specificaly about bad muslims here, and most of the bad stuff they do is as a direct result of following the islamic doctrine
Are we? Is woman beating a crime, exclusive to Muslims?
Or is it illegal for non-Muslims to read this book? you may also find this book is not an 'Islamic doctrine'. Now please let's get back to reality.
Are we? Is woman beating a crime, exclusive to Muslims?
Or is it illegal for non-Muslims to read this book? you may also find this book is not an 'Islamic doctrine'. Now please let's get back to reality.
I've noticed that there are quite a few posters on here (thankfully in the minority) who will always see something wrong with 'Islam' or 'Muslims', no matter whether you tell them it's not true or extremists are saying what they say.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were members of the BNP/EDL to be honest.
Thank you. I really appreciate that. I have felt a little fed up with having to constantly explain myself and my religion to a bunch of people who seem to have closed eyes. ...
Well don't ever get disheartened, or give up posting as your input is really needed.
I've noticed that there are quite a few posters on here (thankfully in the minority) who will always see something wrong with 'Islam' or 'Muslims', no matter whether you tell them it's not true or extremists are saying what they say.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were members of the BNP/EDL to be honest.
You hear the same thing from them.
Very true. It's the same posters every time.
And when anyone speaks up or tries to point out the fallacy of their argument, they get branded a defender of terrorists etc.
The book was written over 100yrs ago, with beating only being a tiny part of the book, the UK also had archaic views the time this book was written, but hey it gave some on here a chance to have a go at Islam again.....and show themselves up again....
I haven't noticed people putting Islam on a pedestal here. That's just hyperbole. But some folk will come to the defence of Muslims when they are all lumped together - and that's a different thing altogether.
I was reading this article in the Mail yesterday and was sickened by the views of this Islamic scholar. But it was nice to see a fair number of Muslims commenting under the article condemning him and his views.
It's all too easy, lazy even, to dismiss an entire faith as unpeaceful. But it depends which of its followers you choose to focus on.
Couldn't have put it better myself.
It seems to me that some posters aren't happy unless every Muslim in Britain walks around apologising for the evil things some of the nutjobs carry out in the name of their religion.
And the question that always got avoided in the other thread on this subject, did all you Muslim haters (who say you hate the religion only because of the violence carried out in it's name) also have an inherent hatred of the Irish during the height of the troubles?. Same thing surely.
That's true. The trouble is Sid, some like to do the opposite, to make out that the entire religion of Islam is 100% peaceful. 'The religion of peace'. That IS putting it on a pedestal - and contradicts what we see worldwide carried out in Islam's name. You'd have to be a fool to think all muslims were bad, just as you'd have to be a fool to think ALL muslims were peaceful. The tiny minority is a lot bigger than some like to think.
Comments
I don't think the book is aimed specifically at Muslims. If you agree with any of it, your more than welcome to follow its advice. So please don't feel so left out.
I imagine it must be very frustrating for you Pet (god I sound like a geordie).
I'm a gay guy, and ironically, the most anti-gay views I've seen posted on here haven't come from Muslim posters at all (who have been nothing but polite to me). It's actually from the some of the people who are also vehemently anti-Muslim; the hard right faction of our forum.
I can relate to that, it appears they are very closed minded and i like to think I can at least be open to realising my religion isnt perfect hence teaching from the iman whose main line is that everyone is human first, and we need to love our fellow man regardless of race, colour, creed, religion or sexual orientation. Hes suffered from some extremists who don't share his views irl attacking the mosque and him and his home, but that small fraction are in the minority and most moderate muslims realise education and listening to experinced moderate muslims regarding intergration for people new to the UK and respect and tolerance is the way forward.
Im trying from here on in to ignore the hate as ive given up trying to debate with them and respond and debate with a more positive and open minded group of posters.
The point is though, that every muslim, is in effect, a representative of their religion, and when so many representatives of any group do so many bad things, that group will be seen as a wrong 'un. Islam's reputation is well and truly sullied by the actions of some who represent it, particually when you realise that the bad things they have done are nearly all as a result of following the religious doctrine, or core element of the religion.
You see, these bad people doing bad things aren't all muslim by coincidence, it's because they are muslim that they have done the bad things in the first lace
I've worked in schools where most of our kids were muslim (and others where the majority were sikh), as well as very mixed schools, and very white schools both catholic and RC... and it always strikes me as interesting how the people with the strongest opinions on these subjects, have probably never met a muslim in their lives.
All their views are formed from what they read in the paper. And those, in turn, are written by people who have also never met a muslim in their lives (well not knowingly, but you'll get what I mean:D)
Keep posting Pet, because you, here on the interwebz, are the nearest some of these bigots will ever get to having a reality check.
Thank you. I really appreciate that. I have felt a little fed up with having to constantly explain myself and my religion to a bunch of people who seem to have closed eyes. I am grateful for posters like you and others who actually listen and take on board all views not just the ones you agree with and debate I'm not sure the hate mongers realise how racist they sound but apparently i accuse everyone of being a racist who disagrees with the muslim way of life which isnt true. I feel people make racist posts because of their ignorance and that makes them appear racist to me. Disliking and attacking only muslims is racist to me when there are many crimes commited by people from other religions but the DM bigots bible isn't posting those stories, just the anti muslim rhetoric which feeds the haters hate.
If someone is saying every muslim agrees with terrorist acts or finds a poll saying 25% of young english muslims agree with the twin towers being blown up and therefore islam is a joke. i find that racist and ignorant as a poll can be made to say anything you like, take that poll outside an extremist mosque and youll get the answer you want for your article. Take the same poll outside mine or many other mosques and the response would be very different indeed.
Thank you for the tolerance, its appreciated. Sorry for the long post.
What a load of rubbish.
Generally, and I know for certain you already know this, it doesn't take religion for people to be bad. Your trying to suggest these people are bad because of Islam, thats a little stupid at best and probably intentional WUMing.
Yet you call doctors, teachers, lawyers, etc who wear crucifixes "prats", unable to do their jobs due to being superstitious and unable to think clearly. I guess you save your bigotry for Christians.
For example would a non-muslim self-detonate in the name of allah? Very unlikely I would have thought. But those that have self-detonated in the name of allah and caused murder and carnage have tended to be muslims
It is almost akin to people on benefits getting called scroungers and idle gits because a small fraction indeed are and we all know that is not right to lable folk lik this, yeah?
I agree with this.
exactly.:(
Are we? Is woman beating a crime, exclusive to Muslims?
Or is it illegal for non-Muslims to read this book? you may also find this book is not an 'Islamic doctrine'. Now please let's get back to reality.
I've noticed that there are quite a few posters on here (thankfully in the minority) who will always see something wrong with 'Islam' or 'Muslims', no matter whether you tell them it's not true or extremists are saying what they say.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were members of the BNP/EDL to be honest.
You hear the same thing from them.
Well don't ever get disheartened, or give up posting as your input is really needed.
Very true. It's the same posters every time.
And when anyone speaks up or tries to point out the fallacy of their argument, they get branded a defender of terrorists etc.
Let them say what they want. Thankfully the majority on here and elsewhere can see the idiocy and subtle racism+Islamophobia that they're spouting
Or a lefty, or an apologist, or of putting Islam on a pedestal...
Lol! - true
Couldn't have put it better myself.
It seems to me that some posters aren't happy unless every Muslim in Britain walks around apologising for the evil things some of the nutjobs carry out in the name of their religion.
And the question that always got avoided in the other thread on this subject, did all you Muslim haters (who say you hate the religion only because of the violence carried out in it's name) also have an inherent hatred of the Irish during the height of the troubles?. Same thing surely.
I haven't seen anyone say it's 100% peaceful.